Phil Heath “over 10g of oils in a week”

[Eguz22]

But the claim that I was addressing was that he turned PRO as a natural

Passing drug test is not the same as being natural, we all know this.

Ronnie transformed more than anyone else of his time from his amateur stage until he reached his peak, but it took him more years than the rest. Levrone, Francois, Dillet or Flex reached the top quickly, in 2 years or less.

What this suggests is that he wasn't using everything the other guys were using when he was trying to become a pro.

It also takes balls to want to compete by passing drug tests when it's not mandatory and you have other options.

Kai competed in natural feds in the 90's, then turned pro and needed 4 years to get his name out there. Like Ronnie, he became a monster gradually.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

We're talkng about Ronnie Coleman, one of the most genetically gifted and hard working bodybuilders to ever live, and you cant believe he placed 14th at the mr usa natural? He didnt win, didnt get second, he was 14th.

Dude you are not wrong. A long time ago on this board I told people Ronnie Coleman was natural when he got his pro card and his first pro shows and caught so much shit it wasnt even worth it anymore to argue about it because it pissed so many people off. I knew i was right though because of the network i had a the time and people who truly knew. Now pretty much everyone knows that he was clean when he won his pro card ( i deserve some apologies to be honest ) and in his first pro shows, from trainers and friends of his to his fellow competitors to the very guys who were his close buds that introduced him to gear.

You are not wrong Yousef and its been reported 50 ways around the block the same story time and time again by Ronnie himself, his friends and everyone else. You dont go from 218-220 onstage (pro card) to 303 onstage (grand prix shows) by just increasing the dose you (supposedly) used at 220. I said it back then and ill say it now "i would expect one of the guys with some of the best genetics in the world to look pretty awesome natural at 220lbs onstage or so" and he did.

Flex at 45 seconds in

Levrone at 9 minutes in

There is more evidence out there left and right over the years but people can believe what they want to believe.

 

[Muay Thai]

Dude you are not wrong. A long time ago on this board I told people Ronnie Coleman was natural when he got his pro card and his first pro shows and caught so much shit it wasnt even worth it anymore to argue about it because it pissed so many people off. I knew i was right though because of the network i had a the time and people who truly knew. Now pretty much everyone knows that he was clean when he won his pro card ( i deserve some apologies to be honest ) and in his first pro shows, from trainers and friends of his to his fellow competitors to the very guys who were his close buds that introduced him to gear.

You are not wrong Yousef and its been reported 50 ways around the block the same story time and time again by Ronnie himself, his friends and everyone else. You dont go from 218-220 onstage (pro card) to 303 onstage (grand prix shows) by just increasing the dose you (supposedly) used at 220. I said it back then and ill say it now "i would expect one of the guys with some of the best genetics in the world to look pretty awesome natural at 220lbs onstage or so" and he did.

Flex at 45 seconds in

Levrone at 9 minutes in

There is more evidence out there left and right over the years but people can believe what they want to believe.

wow. thank you for sharing those clips OG

 

[Isovet]

ronnie might be the most genetically gifted bodybuilder ever but can we at least admit how levrone could actually grow into dieting. going from 180 afterbeing off for year into 260 shredded? how do you bulk and cut at the same time...? yet he did it.. more than once i might add. just incredible what he was able to do... god he was robbed in 2001...

 

[b-boy]

ronnie might be the most genetically gifted bodybuilder ever but can we at least admit how levrone could actually grow into dieting. going from 180 afterbeing off for year into 260 shredded? how do you bulk and cut at the same time...? yet he did it.. more than once i might add. just incredible what he was able to do... god he was robbed in 2001...

Kevin's transformations were crazy as hell!

 

[bbxtreme]

ronnie might be the most genetically gifted bodybuilder ever but can we at least admit how levrone could actually grow into dieting. going from 180 afterbeing off for year into 260 shredded? how do you bulk and cut at the same time...? yet he did it.. more than once i might add. just incredible what he was able to do... god he was robbed in 2001...

When I worked with Milos he no doubt thought Ronnie was King, but he always talked about Levrone and how impressive he was for being able to transform and grow into a show.

From what I was told he was very basic as well on cycles- using high amounts of anadrol and would start Test Cyp at the beginning of prep and run it straight through the show.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Yea, I still can't wrap my head around the fact that somebody so genetically gifted like Levrone (and Flex to a degree) never won 1 Olympia. It's mind-boggling to be honest, he (they) was that good.

The aged old question will always remain with guys like him, Flex and Dillet et al.....if they would have taken it as serious as Dorian did 365 days out of the year with training and nutrition, how the hell would they have placed, or how many Olympias would they have accumulated? Dorian has stated the same thing, so it makes you wonder. DY straight outhustled their asses in every way. If they would have started with the same hunger in the early 90's that DY did, then maybe they could have stolen some of the first ones from Ronnie as well. Anyway...what if what if, lol. The 90's and early 2000's were so effin' fun!

 

[NorwegianMuscle]

In my experience, it's not the gear it's the growth. The higher the dosages the more of a monster you become. I actually would lower my test because my HGH was making me grow. When I was doing 10/10 splits on a daily basis is when my entire body down to my feet grew larger. I don't know about 10g per week. I've been around IFBB pros for years including working the Olympia and Arnold Classic and even had a great friend compete in the Olympia that helped me with my cycles. I never heard anything about bodybuilders doing 10g a week of anything. I just don't believe it or I would have heard something eventually.

 

[AlexDavis43]

In my experience, it's not the gear it's the growth. The higher the dosages the more of a monster you become. I actually would lower my test because my HGH was making me grow. When I was doing 10/10 splits on a daily basis is when my entire body down to my feet grew larger. I don't know about 10g per week. I've been around IFBB pros for years including working the Olympia and Arnold Classic and even had a great friend compete in the Olympia that helped me with my cycles. I never heard anything about bodybuilders doing 10g a week of anything. I just don't believe it or I would have heard something eventually.

We've heard about guys doing 3.5 grams a week. I think there's a threshold where more isn't better, and kinda think it's <3.5 g/wk. If you're an experienced bodybuilder and making gains on 3.5 g/wk I suspect you got other things going on.

 

[nothuman]

For those who didn’t watch Phil Heath’s interview about his dosages a while back, he said 1300mg was high highest testosterone dose. He tried 1500mg for a couple weeks and it just made him more watery so he stuck with 1300mg. Test and deca are what he used to grow, and eventually added HGH (I think 8iu he said). Forgot his tren dosages for contest prep but it wasn’t that much. He said he never touched insulin before and is willing to take a lie detector for anyone who doesn’t believe him.

 

[nothuman]

Just for the hell of it, Dorian Yates’ cycles to compare

 

[TheOtherOne55]

I feel like there is a size threshold, and when you hit that...you suddenly LOOK like a BBer at whatever height/weight you are. And for some, it comes quicker than others. But the dosage...in order to hit that is allll over the place. Some guys hit that size threshold (where you go from, "wow, he's a muscular guy" to "that's a fuckin BBer") at like 1-2g. I would say that is genetic elite. So when we hear of the GOAT doing it WITHOUT gear. It's crazy to us. Like If you can LOOK like a legit national level BBer running something like 750 test and 700 deca, you are a freak. For other guys its fuckin 5g. Hell, for some...there's NO amount of gear that can make it click.

The crazy thing is that its progressive. You cannot just take a newbie and give him 3g and expect him to make those gains in 1/2 the time. Its stilll a long process. 1.5g might help you gain 15lbs of true tissue. But 3g isnt going to double it. You kind of have to chip away and see how the cards fall. If you havent fully transformed in 5+ years, you most likely dont have the genetics to be doing this competitively.

 

[BigNJ]

A factor that almost gets forgotten.

I’ve heard many times from guys who were already really good push dosages up to the slightly more questionable amount and their physiques started going backwards because the sides just outweigh the benefits

Of course this is another genetic component but I think the “ceiling” for almost all is faaaar below the 10g mark

You think? You're assuming and that's it.

Very few will tell you how much they take, and I don't care how many close people you know, they will not tell you the truth. I've always said that if you want to know what a certain dosage will do for you then try it yourself. That's why there are so many people in gyms who look the same year after year and keep wondering what the secret is.

Don't rely on anyone to tell you what they take or how much you should take. Most don't want you to know. If you're not growing anymore, eat more, take more AAS and find out for yourself. That's the only way to know what works for you. Bodybuilders, whether competitors or your average gym goer, are compulsive liars when it comes about their AAS dosages. They want to be the "big man know it all" in the gym. They don't want you to succeed so you don't look better than they do.

 

[Eguz22]

When I worked with Milos he no doubt thought Ronnie was King, but he always talked about Levrone and how impressive he was for being able to transform and grow into a show.

Milos has talked about Flex how in 3 or 4 weeks he went from looking like crap to looking amazing.

Then there is the rumor from Mike Morris how at a show in Hungary in 2003, he said Milos was backstage but it looked like he wasn't going to compete, but he started doing protocols and it ballooned in a few hours. I tried to find pictures of that contest wihtout luck

 

[MR. BMJ]

I feel like there is a size threshold, and when you hit that...you suddenly LOOK like a BBer at whatever height/weight you are. And for some, it comes quicker than others. But the dosage...in order to hit that is allll over the place. Some guys hit that size threshold (where you go from, "wow, he's a muscular guy" to "that's a fuckin BBer") at like 1-2g. I would say that is genetic elite. So when we hear of the GOAT doing it WITHOUT gear. It's crazy to us. Like If you can LOOK like a legit national level BBer running something like 750 test and 700 deca, you are a freak. For other guys its fuckin 5g. Hell, for some...there's NO amount of gear that can make it click.

The crazy thing is that its progressive. You cannot just take a newbie and give him 3g and expect him to make those gains in 1/2 the time. Its stilll a long process. 1.5g might help you gain 15lbs of true tissue. But 3g isnt going to double it. You kind of have to chip away and see how the cards fall. If you havent fully transformed in 5+ years, you most likely dont have the genetics to be doing this competitively.

YES!

 

[traininsane11]

If you use a lot of gear and are in a position of influence (pro/social media etc) just always state your daily dosage and let people assume it’s your weekly dosage

 

[totalrecomp]

Milos has talked about Flex how in 3 or 4 weeks he went from looking like crap to looking amazing.

Then there is the rumor from Mike Morris how at a show in Hungary in 2003, he said Milos was backstage but it looked like he wasn't going to compete, but he started doing protocols and it ballooned in a few hours. I tried to find pictures of that contest wihtout luck

https://www.facebook.com/Milos.Sarcev.Official.Page/photos/a.415136531895133/2302746039800830

 

[Muay Thai]

You think? You're assuming and that's it.

Very few will tell you how much they take, and I don't care how many close people you know, they will not tell you the truth. I've always said that if you want to know what a certain dosage will do for you then try it yourself. That's why there are so many people in gyms who look the same year after year and keep wondering what the secret is.

Don't rely on anyone to tell you what they take or how much you should take. Most don't want you to know. If you're not growing anymore, eat more, take more AAS and find out for yourself. That's the only way to know what works for you. Bodybuilders, whether competitors or your average gym goer, are compulsive liars when it comes about their AAS dosages. They want to be the "big man know it all" in the gym. They don't want you to succeed so you don't look better than they do.

i have a close homey in real life who lies about his doses and always mentions them, I'm in way better shape, he's been juicing longer, has short man complex, and insists he's only taking this and that lol, but when we first me he told me his true cyles so I just think its repulsive that he has to make it a point and tell me his current cycle weekly when I NEVER HAVE EVER MENTIONED mine lol

nobody is going to entire expose their "perceived" Achilles heel to anyone. its a disservice and people will find a way to use it against you, just like they find ways to use your stated low doses aginst you somehow someway given the opportunity.

 

[SouthernMuscle]

You think? You're assuming and that's it.

Very few will tell you how much they take, and I don't care how many close people you know, they will not tell you the truth. I've always said that if you want to know what a certain dosage will do for you then try it yourself. That's why there are so many people in gyms who look the same year after year and keep wondering what the secret is.

Don't rely on anyone to tell you what they take or how much you should take. Most don't want you to know. If you're not growing anymore, eat more, take more AAS and find out for yourself. That's the only way to know what works for you. Bodybuilders, whether competitors or your average gym goer, are compulsive liars when it comes about their AAS dosages. They want to be the "big man know it all" in the gym. They don't want you to succeed so you don't look better than they do.

Sounds like someone doesn’t like bodybuilders……

 

[NorwegianMuscle]

I feel like there is a size threshold, and when you hit that...you suddenly LOOK like a BBer at whatever height/weight you are. And for some, it comes quicker than others. But the dosage...in order to hit that is allll over the place. Some guys hit that size threshold (where you go from, "wow, he's a muscular guy" to "that's a fuckin BBer") at like 1-2g. I would say that is genetic elite. So when we hear of the GOAT doing it WITHOUT gear. It's crazy to us. Like If you can LOOK like a legit national level BBer running something like 750 test and 700 deca, you are a freak. For other guys its fuckin 5g. Hell, for some...there's NO amount of gear that can make it click.

The crazy thing is that its progressive. You cannot just take a newbie and give him 3g and expect him to make those gains in 1/2 the time. Its stilll a long process. 1.5g might help you gain 15lbs of true tissue. But 3g isnt going to double it. You kind of have to chip away and see how the cards fall. If you havent fully transformed in 5+ years, you most likely dont have the genetics to be doing this competitively.

Yes I so agree! I ran a fitness center for a number of years when I moved to Florida. The kids always came to me for training, diet, and cycle advice because I competed. I can not begin to tell you how many of those damn kids got it in there heads they were going to start a cycle with 1 gram of test a week out of the gate. It's an internet thing. They read this and think yes that's how I will look like Arnold in 3 months. I would tell them you can NOT start out that way. You have to gradually increase your cycles as you grow or your cycle works against you.