IGF1 SERUM of 415!!!

[Boudha]

I thought the general consensus was 4-5mg DAC per week is the max?

The studies goes up to 25mg

 

[cauthen96]

I thought the general consensus was 4-5mg DAC per week is the max?

Yeah the clinical trials went to 25mg..

On DAC I say take as much as you can afford because it def dose dependent..

If you goal is anti aging 2-4mg should be great with some anabolic effect..


If sheer size is what you are going for then 6+.... I might try a few weeks at 10+ and Mk daily to see how high I can get it..

 

[need4tren]

i would like to see an igf lr3 test
but that is awesome numbers

 

[bigdog123]

I`ve been using 4-5mg per week and find its pretty good. Feels similar to about 4iu GH daily.

Whats the advantage of running MK? Is it similar to GHRP?

 

[cauthen96]

I`ve been using 4-5mg per week and find its pretty good. Feels similar to about 4iu GH daily.

Whats the advantage of running MK? Is it similar to GHRP?

I like the fact its once daily dosing.. and yes it kicks your pulses up

 

[juggy38]

I got a question, I usually pin ghrp-2 and mod grf pre cardio to get a GH anti catabolic shield and liberate some fatty acids. If I'm doing the dac and mk-677 I guess I can't make a pulse pre cardio? Should I lower my fasted cardio intensity? I usually do 135-145bpm. Or should I just switch to some HIt afternoon cardio?



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[cauthen96]

Based on my labs I would save them juggy and just ride the Mk and dac

 

[bigdog123]

Anyone can vouch for whether running 8-10mg per week is a lot better than 4mg per week?

Logically you`d say yes it is but in the real world?

 

[cauthen96]

Anyone can vouch for whether running 8-10mg per week is a lot better than 4mg per week?

Logically you`d say yes it is but in the real world?

I posted some links in my cjc log a few pages back..

Dac was tested up to 25mg a week and dose dependent increases in GH and IGF1 were seen all the way up to 25mg..

It really depends on what you goals are.. anti aging or anabolic beast mode

 

[sammy555]

I got a question, I usually pin ghrp-2 and mod grf pre cardio to get a GH anti catabolic shield and liberate some fatty acids. If I'm doing the dac and mk-677 I guess I can't make a pulse pre cardio? Should I lower my fasted cardio intensity? I usually do 135-145bpm. Or should I just switch to some HIt afternoon cardio?



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If your on gear I wouldn't worry in the slightest. I'd imagine they're be plenty of ffa floating around from the many pulses any way. Tbh even without gear I wouldn't be concerned. The cardio will increse muscle insulin sensitivity anyway so there will be a small anabolic rebound post cardio when you got your carbs and orotein that will make up for any miniscule amount lost while doing cardio.

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[G.I.Bro]

Reading just a bit about MK-677 over at Dat's forum, its viewed with the same negativity that CJC DAC is. That "camp" or ideology over there has never really been fans of DAC or the resulting GH "bleed" you get from a MK-677/DAC stack.

Here are just a few things I believe Dat and his MODs would probably have to say (and have said) about such a stack and or DAC/MK-677. It's hard to argue with the serum results though, right? However, I would keep these things in mind as they (and Dat) certainly believe any approach which can lead to a GH bleed is inferior and gives less results. There is not much talk or hype about DAC/MK-677 stacks or even MK-677 alone over there. I believe the tried and true GHRP/GHRH "saturation dose" stack is still their gold standard.

Conwict - "The profile from mk677 is undesirable for the same reasons as CJC1295....by definition a long elevation (such as mk677 - as opposed to say rHGH @ 9-12 hrs) is a "bleed." But the reason this is undesirable is not just desensitization; the acute efficacy is reduced, too.

I don't believe MK677 creates pulses, rather it elevates the overall gh release, but seems to take time for the release levels to rise. I've not delved too far into it, but from what I have read in the past it sounds similar to CJC1295 and I'd be cautious of the 'gh bleed' - at least that's something that comes to mind for me, it may or may not be true, I'd have to do further research to confirm whether thats true or not. One study I read a while ago took 6 months for substantial increases in GH levels to be achieved, it had an additive effect over time.

Dat on Ghrp3 -
Actually there are many GHRP structures. The problem is there is only so much GH to be released at any given time. What you'll find when I write more on it is that the mandate here and in the bodysculpting community is to get the GH release profile spot on... to not desentisitize, to pay attention to troughs and pulse duration... a pulse that lasts too long is an elevation. GHRP-3 would be an elevation. But most importantly and the entire reseason you have research in this area is that they want to make an oral GH releaser. GHRP-2 is about 1% orally active. So swallowing 100x 100mcg would equal a saturation dose (there are other reasons that would require it to be 2.5 x above even that). Thats what they are trying to do with other compounds... turn them onto an oral pill. A pill that requires only 5 grams instead of 10 grams is more economical.

In his post, Dat states:

"Based on the effectiveness of GHRPs smaller non-peptide molecules were created in an effort to mimic the GH releasing effects of GHRPs with the desire to develop a compound with high oral bioavailability. As a result MK-0677 was eventually created as a non-peptide compound with sustained GH release and higher oral bioavailability. Unfortunately desensitization was found to occur fairly rapidly (my emphasis)."

This was posted nine months after he posted on AnabolicMinds his discussion of the "Effects of an Oral Ghrelin Mimetic (MK-677) on Body Composition and Clinical Outcomes in Healthy Older Adults" study

Effects of an Oral Ghrelin Mimetic on Body Composition and Clinical Outcomes in Healthy Older Adults: A Randomized, Controlled Trial

in which he observed:

"It took six months to build up but in the end GH and IGF-1 were elevated and remained so for the remainder of the year of continued use..." "There was no demonstrated desensitization in this study."

So desensitization (and resulting efficacy) is the main concern cited from a GH bleed but this study did not demonstrate such desensitization. Food for thought...

 

[cauthen96]

Reading just a bit about MK-677 over at Dat's forum, its viewed with the same negativity that CJC DAC is. That "camp" or ideology over there has never really been fans of DAC or the resulting GH "bleed" you get from a MK-677/DAC stack.

Here are just a few things I believe Dat and his MODs would probably have to say (and have said) about such a stack and or DAC/MK-677. It's hard to argue with the serum results though, right? However, I would keep these things in mind as they (and Dat) certainly believe any approach which can lead to a GH bleed is inferior and gives less results. There is not much talk or hype about DAC/MK-677 stacks or even MK-677 alone over there. I believe the tried and true GHRP/GHRH "saturation dose" stack is still their gold standard.

So desensitization (and resulting efficacy) is the main concern cited from a GH bleed but this study did not demonstrate such desensitization. Food for thought...

Def some food for thought.. Why is he so anti- gh bleed? Im not a vet nor guru nor biochemist and i simply go by how i feel, how i look, and the labs..


and i guess with future labs we shall see.. im doing labs again on sept 22 with 15mg dac and 50mg mk.. curious to see where the igf1 comes in at..

 

[ajdos]

Reading just a bit about MK-677 over at Dat's forum, its viewed with the same negativity that CJC DAC is. That "camp" or ideology over there has never really been fans of DAC or the resulting GH "bleed" you get from a MK-677/DAC stack.

Here are just a few things I believe Dat and his MODs would probably have to say (and have said) about such a stack and or DAC/MK-677. It's hard to argue with the serum results though, right? However, I would keep these things in mind as they (and Dat) certainly believe any approach which can lead to a GH bleed is inferior and gives less results. There is not much talk or hype about DAC/MK-677 stacks or even MK-677 alone over there. I believe the tried and true GHRP/GHRH "saturation dose" stack is still their gold standard.

So desensitization (and resulting efficacy) is the main concern cited from a GH bleed but this study did not demonstrate such desensitization. Food for thought...

Dat and his posts are why I have stuck to the ghrp plus mod(1-29) however guys are getting good results with bleeds.
Like a lot of the science with peps, its not exact and there isn't truly a hardline protocol with them.
Still, look forward to C's next blood draw I have a feeling thats gonna tell us a lot.

 

[G.I.Bro]

Def some food for thought.. Why is he so anti- gh bleed? Im not a vet nor guru nor biochemist and i simply go by how i feel, how i look, and the labs..


and i guess with future labs we shall see.. im doing labs again on sept 22 with 15mg dac and 50mg mk.. curious to see where the igf1 comes in at..

Your labs are really informational and interesting. It's a real service to the forum. Much appreciated by all. Just keep it legit, honest and unbiased. You'd be a huge resource to us seeing these newer compounds in action. I'm admittedly interested in the DAC/MK-677 stack now.

 

[juggy38]

If your on gear I wouldn't worry in the slightest. I'd imagine they're be plenty of ffa floating around from the many pulses any way. Tbh even without gear I wouldn't be concerned. The cardio will increse muscle insulin sensitivity anyway so there will be a small anabolic rebound post cardio when you got your carbs and orotein that will make up for any miniscule amount lost while doing cardio.

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I love you. No homo lol


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[cauthen96]

Your labs are really informational and interesting. It's a real service to the forum. Much appreciated by all. Just keep it legit, honest and unbiased. You'd be a huge resource to us seeing these newer compounds in action. I'm admittedly interested in the DAC/MK-677 stack now.

I will definitely keep it honest bro.. and like i said before i will give my private md labs login to any mod at any time..

and hell i posted my 3.5 gh serum.. not flattering in the least.. but it is what it is and i put it out there..

Im doing these tests because I WANT TO KNOW.. if it helps the board and helps progen sell peps then good deal..

so many people bring so much to this board and im just happy to carry my weight!

 

[G.I.Bro]

I will definitely keep it honest bro.. and like i said before i will give my private md labs login to any mod at any time..

and hell i posted my 3.5 gh serum.. not flattering in the least.. but it is what it is and i put it out there..

Im doing these tests because I WANT TO KNOW.. if it helps the board and helps progen sell peps then good deal..

so many people bring so much to this board and im just happy to carry my weight!

As long as it's good for "business as usual" around here it's all good. But if you infringe on business interests too much or promote certain sponsors you may find yourself heavily moderated or banned. I don't want to see that so tread carefully and keep it coming!

 

[cauthen96]

As long as it's good for "business as usual" around here it's all good. But if you infringe on business interests too much or promote certain sponsors you may find yourself heavily moderated or banned. I don't want to see that so tread carefully and keep it coming!

Im not really sure I understand.. so if someone is a paying sponsor and labs show there product is of excellent quality and produces lab confirmed results the reps cant promote that? I see it all the time with the various brands of gh.. i got a 23! my gh got a 29! yada yada etc.. Just trying to clarify as you have been around here alot longer than I have..

 

[G.I.Bro]

Im not really sure I understand.. so if someone is a paying sponsor and labs show there product is of excellent quality and produces lab confirmed results the reps cant promote that? I see it all the time with the various brands of gh.. i got a 23! my gh got a 29! yada yada etc.. Just trying to clarify as you have been around here alot longer than I have..

I've just seen it happen before where someone providing such a great resource to us was basically run out of here (Alpha). Just don't want to see that. You're doing nothing wrong that I see thus far, imo!

Interested to see your next Labs!

 

[cauthen96]

I've just seen it happen before where someone providing such a great resource to us was basically run out of here (Alpha). Just don't want to see that. You're doing nothing wrong that I see thus far, imo!

Interested to see your next Labs!

Yeah I kinda wondered what happened to him.. and good looking out