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Lowering/pull testosterone vs. letrozole pre contest

@Parabolic33, what is your end game goal here anyways? I ask since you’ve hinted at wanting to be the big boy on the block. 230, 240, 250, 260, +280lbs? Worrying about having striated glutes ~200lbs isn’t gonna get you there is where I’m going with this…

Why not end the cut now and start making a large push? I don’t mean letting go completely and letting your BF% get too high, but staying around 8-10% and methodically increase the calories by 500.

Once you stall or notice too much fat gains then you can increase the dose of AAS if your diet is still clean.

Cage
 
Also this obsession with weight will fuck you up man, it’s all about the mirror. I’ve done shows as a MW where I was better in some of my SHW shows. Always under 5% bf been there over 20-25 times and it’s always different. I’ve won an overall on the 7th and the 14th got beat by the guy I beat the 7th. I’ll tell you the worst I ever looked was my first time as a super I was worried about coming in as heavy as possible while still lean and it’s the worst showing I’ve had minus my very first shoes I did natty with just the Arnold Enclyopedia of Bodybuilding for my guide. This sport will grind you mentally like nothing else, the closer to game time the weaker you are physically and mentally and you gotta shelve that shit and be honest with yourself and only let a small honest few get in your ear. Every other sport guys come in fed, rested, refueled before battle we go at it dehydrated, underfed, sleep deprived, and mentally exhausted that’s why there are so few true bodybuilders

Do you have 1 single picture from any of these shows ?

Crop out your face or whatever you need to do
 
I’m not on primo, already off the test. I’ve been on wisntrol the last 10, and halo 20mg since 11/11.

I was actually thinking to drop the winstrol and halo, and use SuperDrol 10 or 20 mg daily depending on look for the carb up window.

So that’s a good idea, but you do think I should drop the halo and winny ?

I feel like at this point it’s redundant to keep the halo/winny in only to add SuperDrol right ? Maybe not, but I think the unique cosmetic effect to my skin I got from winny has kind of built up and manifested already. I don’t think removing the winny would be noticeable at this point.

The halo, I actually am nearly out of anyways.

I’m not on primo, but am on masteron and EQ which I’ll be keeping in
Your messages on here are so dang long. Lol

All I’ll say is if you think dropping halo while not on test for superdrol is a good idea… it’s not.

Carry on.
 
Parabolic are you competing btw ?
Just practicing getting to low single digits peaking protocols etc.

However the main reason for cutting like this is to get a very long runway to grow in an off-season bulk and to get rebound gains.
 
Your messages on here are so dang long. Lol

All I’ll say is if you think dropping halo while not on test for superdrol is a good idea… it’s not.

Carry on.
Ok thanks.

Last thing. Is it normal to be heavier after a stretch of training days in a row compared to rest days?

Without fail, my high weigh in is Wednesday night. I train Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday.
My low is always on Saturday morning right before starting the training block.

It’s independent of being in a surplus or a deficit. Even if the deficit is larger on training days compared to rest days, I will still be heavier at the end of a few training days.

It’s not like I’m able to hydrate more either. On off days, If I drink
More and more I’ll just pee it all out and stay at the same lower weight.

I’ve also noticed that if I do a refeed after a series of rest days, i won’t fill out at much compared to times I refeed at the end of a block of training days.
 
Ok thanks.

Last thing. Is it normal to be heavier after a stretch of training days in a row compared to rest days?

Without fail, my high weigh in is Wednesday night. I train Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday.
My low is always on Saturday morning right before starting the training block.

It’s independent of being in a surplus or a deficit. Even if the deficit is larger on training days compared to rest days, I will still be heavier at the end of a few training days.

It’s not like I’m able to hydrate more either. On off days, If I drink
More and more I’ll just pee it all out and stay at the same lower weight.

I’ve also noticed that if I do a refeed after a series of rest days, i won’t fill out at much compared to times I refeed at the end of a block of training days.
Training can increase inflammation, hence why people take it light before the stage.

Also, why didn’t you ever go into your training and nutrition when I asked? What do those look like?
 
Training can increase inflammation, hence why people take it light before the stage.

Also, why didn’t you ever go into your training and nutrition when I asked? What do those look like?
Training will definitely flush out detail close to a show especially in the legs but weighing more after a stretch of training than a stretch of rest days is imo not normal, the key word being a stretch. One day should change nothing but in general training and sweating especially if you’re doing cardio will make most guys drop am weigh in every subsequent day, same with rest and weight going up to say 3-4 days off then unless your diet changes it should simply plateau for a few days.
 
Training can increase inflammation, hence why people take it light before the stage.

Also, why didn’t you ever go into your training and nutrition when I asked? What do those look like?
@Parabolic33 what he said here. 👆🏻

Without knowing your diet, fluid intake and sodium it’s hard to accurately answer that.

One obvious thing I’ll point out that I know is that you’re using insulin on training days. And if you’re smart you are not, or are using less on your off days. The influx of carbs, sodium, and insulin on workout days should have you weighing more. Especially with lifting to pull glycogen and fluid into the cells along with inflammation from the workout.

And obvious, but your calories in general should be higher on training days than off days.

Again, this is why everyone is giving you so much crap on here- you’re playing mad scientist with gear, drawing blood work almost weekly and haven’t even mastered the basics of nutrition.

The last piece of advice I’ll give you is to stop playing with so many harsh compounds and flipping stuff if your goal is to use this cut to maximize the rebound. All you’re doing is crashing your systems and burning your body out.

A successful rebound is built off of food, digestion, foundational hormones, not orals and recovery.

All this talk about hating on coaches and how you can’t learn anything from them… 🤣 if that’s the case, why are you on here asking all of these elementary questions?

I mean this as nicely as I can say it- stop being so cocky and cheap and pay someone for their time. Shelby, Viz, Dom, or any of the top coaches on this board have not chimed in to help you. That’s because their time is worth its weight in Gold.

Best of luck and have no more advice to offer.
 
One day should change nothing but in general training and sweating especially if you’re doing cardio will make most guys drop am weigh in every subsequent day
Well after I, and most people who are intelligent, train and sweat they properly rehydrate. I do recall on the low vs high sodium thread you are against sodium being higher

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...ium-why-diffrent-opinions.173319/post-3154715

While also drinking 2-3 gallons of water daily year round

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...ium-why-diffrent-opinions.173319/post-3154784

And plain water, especially that much, is not going to rehydrate you. It can even do the opposite. So that may be your issue.

Also, when someone says rest day I assume they mean from training and that he is still performing cardio on these days.
 
Training can increase inflammation, hence why people take it light before the stage.

Also, why didn’t you ever go into your training and nutrition when I asked? What do those look like?
Oh sorry idk how I missed that.

So my training has a few different changing points with me trying to get extra groups in at home to hit specific things more than 2 times per week like arms shoulders calves I try to hit 3x weekly.

But the base structure is this because I only have Sunday- Wednesday as 4 days in a row where I can train. And to hit everything twice; this is the only way to do it

Sunday- chest, triceps, back( high to low movement), biceps

Monday-fasted cardio 9-10am
Training 3-5:20pm side/ rear delt, calves, quads, hamstrings, adductors, abs

Tuesday- fasted cardio 9-10am
Training 3-4:45 chest, triceps, back (low to high movements) biceps

Wednesday- side/ rear delt, calves, quads, hamstrings, adductors, abs

Off days are Thursday, Friday, Saturday where I get between 17k-20k steps = to about 8-10miles of walking since I work in a mall in sales, I get to walk around intermittently through my whole work day 10am-7pm. I commute 1hr 30 each way, and I seem to require more sleep to feel normal, 8-9hours sleep per night ( just did a sleep study last week awaiting results any day now) so with the drive I don’t always have time to train on these days. However I have been trying to utilize a 30 minute block to do an arm or shoulder workout at home on these days. Particularly these last 4 weeks or so when I’m really trying to generate more of a defecit.

Diet: I eat 40-60g protein every 2hr 20-3hr 45. After the gym block, this block I’m going close to 4 hours without a meal because of the long 2hr + training sessions. So I sip a Gatorade alongside my water an Eaas.
Fats stay below 70g daily year round. Only eating boneless skinless chicken breast, or sometimes egg whites with 1 whole egg, or sometimes 93% lean burgers that I make at home to assemble on a low fat method. On cutting I’ve been closer to 45-50g fat daily. Jasmine rice is my primary carb source during cut and bulk, cutting its more cauliflower/peas etc, bulking it’s more like I’m subbing out diet soda/sparkling water for full sugar ginger ale, or Gatorade with meals to get in extra carbs when I’m really pushing.

Over the day I supplement with Mag, sodium and potassium to achieve about 7-9g total sodium daily and 6-7g total K. Magnesium I just supplement 400mg mag bisglycinate with meals 3x daily.

I supplement with the other lacking nutrients that are missing from my diet according to my logs in cronometer. Usually vitamin c, vitamin k, magnesium, copper sometimes, vitamin D.

I always supplement Vitamin D, K, C, magnesium, sodium, potassium, pure encapsulations b complex, creatine,alpha gpc, ubiqinol,NAC, tudca, fishoil, citrus bergamont and others im not recalling off the top of my head.

If I wasn’t limited by my work schedule/sleep I would ideally like to do 8-10 gym sessions per week for weights. I miss when I had no job and was able to train as much as or whenever I wanted 7 days a week.

My goal is the same though which is to hit groups more often and try to space my volume out.
Quads, chest, back can be hit twice a week
Hamstrings/flutes I can only hit hard once every 5 days I find
Calves, biceps, triceps, delts I can hit every other day, so I try to hit them as often as possible year round and adjusts my trainifk
Blocks according to schedule to train according to that philosophy

I’m not sure how much detail you wanted me to go in. But I’ve def not been able to hit on everything. But this was the shortest I could get it to actually try an cover every Base somewhat.

With training choosing between higher raw stimulus exercises vs higher stimulus to fatigue exercises depends on which phase of muscle growth or fat loss im in, if im Prioritizing specific body parts, my schedule and other factors.

I’m general I’m always on the diet, I only break off when my girlfriend and I decide to get take out/go to eat somewhere maybe a couple dozen times a year or so.
 
Training can increase inflammation, hence why people take it light before the stage.

Also, why didn’t you ever go into your training and nutrition when I asked? What do those look like?
So you think this is almost always a negative then for looks ?

You don’t ever think that training and the inflammation leading to weight increase with same subQ water/ thickness isn’t ever advantageous?

I’m going to play around with this this week. I just carbed up during my 2 off days. I’m on day 2 of my training block today and I’m going to evaluate how I look carbed up and tested vs carbed up and pushing it in the gym
 
Oh sorry idk how I missed that.

So my training has a few different changing points with me trying to get extra groups in at home to hit specific things more than 2 times per week like arms shoulders calves I try to hit 3x weekly.

But the base structure is this because I only have Sunday- Wednesday as 4 days in a row where I can train. And to hit everything twice; this is the only way to do it

Sunday- chest, triceps, back( high to low movement), biceps

Monday-fasted cardio 9-10am
Training 3-5:20pm side/ rear delt, calves, quads, hamstrings, adductors, abs

Tuesday- fasted cardio 9-10am
Training 3-4:45 chest, triceps, back (low to high movements) biceps

Wednesday- side/ rear delt, calves, quads, hamstrings, adductors, abs

Off days are Thursday, Friday, Saturday where I get between 17k-20k steps = to about 8-10miles of walking since I work in a mall in sales, I get to walk around intermittently through my whole work day 10am-7pm. I commute 1hr 30 each way, and I seem to require more sleep to feel normal, 8-9hours sleep per night ( just did a sleep study last week awaiting results any day now) so with the drive I don’t always have time to train on these days. However I have been trying to utilize a 30 minute block to do an arm or shoulder workout at home on these days. Particularly these last 4 weeks or so when I’m really trying to generate more of a defecit.

Diet: I eat 40-60g protein every 2hr 20-3hr 45. After the gym block, this block I’m going close to 4 hours without a meal because of the long 2hr + training sessions. So I sip a Gatorade alongside my water an Eaas.
Fats stay below 70g daily year round. Only eating boneless skinless chicken breast, or sometimes egg whites with 1 whole egg, or sometimes 93% lean burgers that I make at home to assemble on a low fat method. On cutting I’ve been closer to 45-50g fat daily. Jasmine rice is my primary carb source during cut and bulk, cutting its more cauliflower/peas etc, bulking it’s more like I’m subbing out diet soda/sparkling water for full sugar ginger ale, or Gatorade with meals to get in extra carbs when I’m really pushing.

Over the day I supplement with Mag, sodium and potassium to achieve about 7-9g total sodium daily and 6-7g total K. Magnesium I just supplement 400mg mag bisglycinate with meals 3x daily.

I supplement with the other lacking nutrients that are missing from my diet according to my logs in cronometer. Usually vitamin c, vitamin k, magnesium, copper sometimes, vitamin D.

I always supplement Vitamin D, K, C, magnesium, sodium, potassium, pure encapsulations b complex, creatine,alpha gpc, ubiqinol,NAC, tudca, fishoil, citrus bergamont and others im not recalling off the top of my head.

If I wasn’t limited by my work schedule/sleep I would ideally like to do 8-10 gym sessions per week for weights. I miss when I had no job and was able to train as much as or whenever I wanted 7 days a week.

My goal is the same though which is to hit groups more often and try to space my volume out.
Quads, chest, back can be hit twice a week
Hamstrings/flutes I can only hit hard once every 5 days I find
Calves, biceps, triceps, delts I can hit every other day, so I try to hit them as often as possible year round and adjusts my trainifk
Blocks according to schedule to train according to that philosophy

I’m not sure how much detail you wanted me to go in. But I’ve def not been able to hit on everything. But this was the shortest I could get it to actually try an cover every Base somewhat.

With training choosing between higher raw stimulus exercises vs higher stimulus to fatigue exercises depends on which phase of muscle growth or fat loss im in, if im Prioritizing specific body parts, my schedule and other factors.

I’m general I’m always on the diet, I only break off when my girlfriend and I decide to get take out/go to eat somewhere maybe a couple dozen times a year or so.
This is a damn novel so give me some time to read, a bit busy with work today so I’ll check back in when I can.
 
@Parabolic33 what he said here. 👆🏻

Without knowing your diet, fluid intake and sodium it’s hard to accurately answer that.

One obvious thing I’ll point out that I know is that you’re using insulin on training days. And if you’re smart you are not, or are using less on your off days. The influx of carbs, sodium, and insulin on workout days should have you weighing more. Especially with lifting to pull glycogen and fluid into the cells along with inflammation from the workout.

And obvious, but your calories in general should be higher on training days than off days.

Again, this is why everyone is giving you so much crap on here- you’re playing mad scientist with gear, drawing blood work almost weekly and haven’t even mastered the basics of nutrition.

The last piece of advice I’ll give you is to stop playing with so many harsh compounds and flipping stuff if your goal is to use this cut to maximize the rebound. All you’re doing is crashing your systems and burning your body out.

A successful rebound is built off of food, digestion, foundational hormones, not orals and recovery.

All this talk about hating on coaches and how you can’t learn anything from them… 🤣 if that’s the case, why are you on here asking all of these elementary questions?

I mean this as nicely as I can say it- stop being so cocky and cheap and pay someone for their time. Shelby, Viz, Dom, or any of the top coaches on this board have not chimed in to help you. That’s because their time is worth its weight in Gold.

Best of luck and have no more advice to offer.
Well the reason I’m not asking about those things regarding diet training and electrolytes is because I’ve finally felt like I’ve got all those things straightened out. With the different methods of peaking and the various drugs associated that’s where I’m still green around the gills.

With regard to the weight, I hear some guys say they weigh less after a stretch of training and others me and you who we weigh more from having more Carbs etc.
I’ve just found that even in a defecit, even when keeping the defecit the same by adjusting calories, it doesn’t matter my weight peak will still be higher on the training days. Mass phase or cut phase
The low weights will actually drop sometimes during consecutive training days, because I’m peeing more of that water that I built up during the day. But this isn’t as consistent and predictable of a trend I see as the high weigh ins.

Also with this granular level of detail, it seems like not everybody does things the same exact way and thus the day of the week they experience a high or a low seems to vary for some guys.

I just wasn’t sure if this could be leveraged to our advantage, and that idk if this extra ability to pull in weight through training could be advantageous to a peaking protocol. The area where i know least about as somebody who’s not yet a competitor, that’s why I’m trying to get some practice.

The consensus seems to be is that this inflammation is negative and can obscure detail on stage.
 
This is a damn novel so give me some time to read, a bit busy with work today so I’ll check back in when I can.
Sorry man, you asked about diet AND training lol. so i wasn’t sure how much detail to go into. My bad.
 
@Parabolic33 what he said here. 👆🏻

Without knowing your diet, fluid intake and sodium it’s hard to accurately answer that.

One obvious thing I’ll point out that I know is that you’re using insulin on training days. And if you’re smart you are not, or are using less on your off days. The influx of carbs, sodium, and insulin on workout days should have you weighing more. Especially with lifting to pull glycogen and fluid into the cells along with inflammation from the workout.

And obvious, but your calories in general should be higher on training days than off days.

Again, this is why everyone is giving you so much crap on here- you’re playing mad scientist with gear, drawing blood work almost weekly and haven’t even mastered the basics of nutrition.

The last piece of advice I’ll give you is to stop playing with so many harsh compounds and flipping stuff if your goal is to use this cut to maximize the rebound. All you’re doing is crashing your systems and burning your body out.

A successful rebound is built off of food, digestion, foundational hormones, not orals and recovery.

All this talk about hating on coaches and how you can’t learn anything from them… 🤣 if that’s the case, why are you on here asking all of these elementary questions?

I mean this as nicely as I can say it- stop being so cocky and cheap and pay someone for their time. Shelby, Viz, Dom, or any of the top coaches on this board have not chimed in to help you. That’s because their time is worth its weight in Gold.

Best of luck and have no more advice to offer.
Nope I think you’re right here.
I could stand to benefit massively with regard to peaking by hiring a coach.

Fat loss or muscle growth are actually pretty direct things.I can do that. But getting an athlete peaked for a stage is art and it seems there are so many different paint brushes and artists. Also there is a lot of different opinions here and much less consensus agreement.

It’s not like muscle growth where everyone knows it’s food, sleep, training.

Oh well there is always next year lol
 
Sorry man, you asked about diet AND training lol. so i wasn’t sure how much detail to go into. My bad.
I appreciate more detail than less, no worries. Just don’t wanna give a short shitty response so going to come back later.
 
@aHarness man you have seriously disappointed me 😔
I thought you were smarter than this 😔
 

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