Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
M4B Store Banner
intex
Riptropin Store banner
Generation X Bodybuilding Forum
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
Mysupps Store Banner
IP Gear Store Banner
PM-Ace-Labs
Ganabol Store Banner
Spend $100 and get bonus needles free at sterile syringes
Professional Muscle Store open now
sunrise2
PHARMAHGH1
kinglab
ganabol2
Professional Muscle Store open now
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
azteca
granabolic1
napsgear-210x65
esquel
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
ashp210
UGFREAK-banner-PM
1-SWEDISH-PEPTIDE-CO
YMSApril21065
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
advertise1
tjk
advertise1
advertise1
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store
over 5000 supplements on sale at professional muscle store

Buy or Lease?

Leasing an M3?

Coopie said:
The downside to leasing is usage. If you exceed the allotted mileage, be prepared to pay through the ass. I returned a 2000 BMW M3 in 2003 after a 39 month lease (15k miles/year) and I had 80,000 miles on the car. I had to pay thousands to return the car. I would have bought it but it was in an accident (while parked) 1 week before lease was due.

Hey, I was surprised you were able to lease an M3, that is what I wanted when I went to the dealer, but brand new, you are looking at like 55,000-60,000. They didn't offer leases on them either, which I can understand, if you want one of those beasts, you have to pony up some flow or be ready to get raped on the APR financing.
 
callgolf said:
THe lease term is 36 months. The one drawback is the 325i is a car, you can't carry stuff or move as the car is small in comparison to an SUV or truck. But I find that it saves me alot of money on fuel costs, I get 22/31 fuel economy. On insurance, cars, especially safe cars with like 4 air bag systems are alot cheaper to insure than an SUV or truck. Also, BMW offers free maintenance and free everything for 4 years, 50,000 miles, I don't have to pay for oil changes or any small problems that might come up between now and then. I even get a brand new set of low profile/high performance tires at 35,000 miles. That is what the car came with. Also, these cars are very reliable, one of the most reliable vehicles you can buy. Even more so than a Mercedes or Lexus, so that is why I like the BMW. Some people may hate them because they are really expensive, but I think this a situation where "you get what you pay for". If you look at the "real" cost, those who are economists know what I mean, driving these 3 series is surprisingly affordable. I love driving that car, it is quick and nimble.

The down payment was 2,999. So three grand, little steep, but I just made a bunch of money in petroleum futures, so I could justify the expense.


Based upon going prices of 3 year old 325Is with over 13K per year compared to the selling price of a 2002, I think your 20 - 22K figure is a little high. But even so if you can get that you are basically paying $3,300 a year for the use od a 325I. I just sold my Viper after owning it for 3 years and it cost me less than 3 K a year.

To me on paper leases just don't make sense unless it is for a corp. Think of it this way the auto industry came up with leases for what reason? To get people into more expensive cars so they can make more money.

Just my 2 cents.


CROWLER
 
Last edited:
Southern Comfort said:
Just to give a little back ground info on my financial standings I am 20 years old, I am a full time student, and I have two part time jobs. Right now I am driving a 2004 Chevrolet Z71. At the time I bought it I wasnt thinking about the $480 per month payments. I was thinking... hell yeah Im gonna be pulling chicks hard core now, and well, I was right. But like anything, it wears off. The newness has definitely worn off, and the payments are getting OLD FAST. I CAN afford them, I just think it would be more realistic to get into some smaller payments, even if I have to sacrifice the "image" of a brand new truck. Im thinking of leasing, nothing extravagant, maybe like a 2005 4 door F-150. Reason Im thinking of leasing is becuase Ive never owned a vehicle for more than 1.5 years any how. Ive been in 6 different vehicles since I was 16. The way its looking Im going to be making car payments for the rest of my life, which really doesnt bother me, BUT, If Im going to be making payments I want it to be on something brand new. If there are any car salesmen on here feel free to chime in. I drive about 20k miles per year. A lot of leases wont go that high. What do I do?

I am going to stike again on this thread and this time I am going to hit with thunder. I hear so many people say, " Don't buy new". It depreciates 10-30% the minute you leave the lot". Ok, how do they fuckin know? That is a trademark slogan brought up by nearly every pre-owned dealer in the country to try and reel you in to buy pre-owned cars. Some of the worlds smartest investors buy brand new cars. If it was such a bad investment why would they do so?

Lets say for instance you did buy a brand new car, ok big deal. You paid $40k for it. You paid cash, and you just put 500 miles on the car. Ok, your neighbor likes it. Lets say sticker is $45,000, but neighbor don't know you talked the salesman down to $40,000 right? Ok, so your not that good, you didn't talk the salesman down to $40,000, their was a $3500 incentive, but you worked the salesman for $1,500. DEAL. But thy neighbor doesn't know that. So the salesman gave you $3500, you worked him for $1500 to get it were you wanted it. The neighbor knows you have a $45,000 car. Is his dumbass going to say, " It drove off the lot, I will give you $36,000 for it because it just depreciated 20% ($9,000) for driving it off the lot"? Fuck no, his dumbass isn't going to say that. Because anyone that can afford something like that has sense, and anyone that has sense knows the other party isn't going to be that stupid. Get my drift so far. If anything you could sell it to that neighbor between the $44,000-42,000 range. Get my drift? The neighbor doesn't have to know your business about the salesman giving you that incentive. Of course most people are smart enough to know the salesman will give you a break. So even if you make $500 on the car you got your money back and made $500 plus the 500 additional miles. So who is to say a New car depreciates that much?

This is just an example of what really goes on. Its a story. But a story to show you that buying a car isn't so bad as long as you pay cash. That is the biggest factor. Some people can write a check for it, others need special financing. When the dealer has to give you that special financing......uh....your fucked. When your OWN bank can cut a check to the dealer then your in the clear. Your bank finances you the money at a decent interest rate, and the check you give the dealer is like cash, so they drop the price lower. But if you have bad credit your not getting a deal with your bank, nor are you getting a deal with the dealer. If you have bad credit and the dealer finances you, chances are you will not get your "dream" car, and even if you do it won't be worth the price you pay for it. You will usually pay 3 times what it is worth after you pay 125% retail and a 20% interest rate over the course of 72 months. And yes, when you have bad credit, banks get to charge 15-35% over retail. Hell, your a risk. You don't have great credit. Makes since huh?
 
So far I have killed the New car myth, lets look into the leasing myth. Well actually I am not going to say Leasing is bad or good. I think its both. Or is it? I think if you want to own the vehicle then don't lease it. If you are planning to own a car then leasing is not for you. If you would wish to own a car then read my post above. Leasing is not for owning, but is owning what you really want? And is your lifestyle fit for leasing or owning? Did those same people that said Leasing was a sorry ass investment take in consideration the different types of people out there? Did they study into everyone and their differnt lifestyles? Of course not.

Lets look at the Chevy Silverado Pickup C1500 P/UP V-8 Sportside Ext cab.

In the year 2000 brand new it sold for $35,000.

Lets say you leased it for a 4 year term. The payment was $350 a month (about the normal lease)

You are allowed to put on 15,000 miles a year.

In 4 years, you have put on 60,000 miles exactly. You did good that year, you didn't go over your limit. Plus you kept the truck clean, great.

Whats it worth:

According to N.A.D.A. (which is what every bank in the southeast, and I am 100% sure the whole country, uses for retail< not no bullshit Kelly blue book)
Retail, w/ the 60,000 mileage hit is $18,825. And that is if the truck is in great shape. So if you leased it, its still worth what it would be right now, only difference is, you don't have to pay out that other money you owe to own it. Your in the clear my friend. Plus about this time is also when the warranty is up. Your looking into putting money in the truck as soon as something simple like the alternator or a few "simple" sensors go bad. Simple, yes, costly? Of course. Add that back to your balance on the truck, haha.

Ok, so what does that mean? It means your good to go. After 4 years your tired of it. You can give it back, its no longer a problem. Remember, you don't own it. After 4 years things start happening, remember your warranty is up by then as well. But the great thing is you get to stay up with the times. You get to go right back up to the dealer and Lease a brand new one. That is the great thing about leasing.................................

OR OR OR OR OR

You would have been smart them 4 years and saved up enough money and bought something for cash, Something brand new for cash, its all about the warranty remember?. Ok, now do you see where the plot thickens????????? HAHAHAHA

When you buy something for cash and only put so many miles on it per year you can always add $2-4,000 cash with it and buy the new version every 1-2 years, right? But wait, why have to add that kind of money? Now your gettting smart. Now your starting to see it. Lets review.

When you buy a car for cash you have no payment therefore you avoid interest plus a bump in full retail.

When you lease, you don't own the car, but you don't own all the problems that might come with that car down the line, nor do you pay full retail. Also you are driving something brand new once again.

Lets say you bought the 2000 truck. Lets say you paid it out in 2006. Of course everyone knows the payments are $100-150 more for purchases then leases. Of course depending on the situation, but your a fool for giving the dealer $3-4000 down on a lease. But anyway, you pay the truck out, and over the last two years you have had to do 3-4000 worth of work to it, not at once, but at one time. So that just set you back what you had in it. Now when you get ready to trade it in, the truck is only worth hardly nothing because you have so many miles on it now. Oh and lets don't forget the thousands in finance charges over the last couple of years you had to pay.
So do you really come out? Hell no.

So after taking REAL LIFE in to consideration, is it better to lease or buy? I say go with Lease all day long. When you buy, you have so many years and such a high payment to make on the vehicle you will neve come out in the end.

This is the smart thing to do. Think about renting an apartment and buying a house. Remember when you was just getting started? Your credit was limited and your funds were weak. So therefore, you rented. But after 3-4 years of living in an apartment you could eventually buy a house? Remember those days? Ok a car is the same thing, except a little different. Out of all of the examples I laid out above the best one was paying cash. That is were your going to get the best deal. If you can write a check to the dealer for the amount of the car then your going to save $5-9000, depending on the sale and the car, possiblly even more in some situations.

But when you lease you have all the time to save up. That is for when you can not afford it at the time, but your credit will allow you. Go with the lease.

WHy does no one complain like this, "Oh I shitted $950 a month down the drain on an apartment for 4 year, now I live in this house and I am happy". They don't. See what I am saying? Lease a car long enough for you to save up $20,000-30,000 or more, depending on your style, then trade it in every year or two. If $20,000-30,000 is to extreme, or if you have better places for it to go, then just do $7,000-10,000 and since you have better credit now, the payment is less and your closer to owning it.

No matter what, a car is going to cost you somewhere here and there. I would rather have one paid for in the long run and add a thousand or two to keep getting new ones year after year then be stuck with the same thing, plus have to do work to it, for 6-7 years. Get my drift?

In my opinion the best thing to do is Lease, save, and pay cash, then trade year or every 2 years and pay the diference which should only be a couple of thousand.

Peace,
VG
 
Last edited:
The point I was trying to make was more related to "value" than lease vs buy.

In your example, you're willing to pay $16,800 to borrow a vehicle. I just bought a 2004 car with 13k on it for $11,000 and it will be paid for in 2 years. It will get up to 34 mpg, which is probably double the mileage of that truck.

My main point is that too many people go outta ther way to impress someone with what they drive. My definition of impress is "pay more than is reasonable within 'their' budget."

I thought most american cars only came with a 36k warranty anymore? Your 60k lease example leaves you prone to expensive repairs that would not be covered by warranty. I believe this is a moot point as most vehicles should go at least 100k without ANY major repair. Hell - they don't even recommend changing the spark plugs until 100k in many vehicles :)

My point isn't that I'm against owning a nice vehicle. I'll buy an Escalade when I have the means to pay for it within 2 years. When a person is at "this point," they should have other financial matters in order like: a house, rental property/business investments, retirement, etc. If not, IMHO your priorities are all mixed up.
 
vanilla gorilla said:
So far I have killed the New car myth, lets look into the leasing myth.
Peace,
VG


LOL In what way shape or form have you killed the new car myth??? By posting a made up story about a stupid neighbor??? :D


Fact is if you buy a new car you lose more per year than if you buy used. Hey if you can afford to buy new then go ahead just don't say that it is cheaper to buy a new car than a used car because it is NOT true.


CROWLER
 
New Math?

Crowler said:
Based upon going prices of 3 year old 325Is with over 13K per year compared to the selling price of a 2002, I think your 20 - 22K figure is a little high. But even so if you can get that you are basically paying $3,300 a year for the use od a 325I. I just sold my Viper after owning it for 3 years and it cost me less than 3 K a year.

To me on paper leases just don't make sense unless it is for a corp. Think of it this way the auto industry came up with leases for what reason? To get people into more expensive cars so they can make more money.

Just my 2 cents.


CROWLER
Not sure where you are but going prices on 3 year old 325i's with sport/premium package are 25,000-26,000. About the Viper, yeah, if they are such affordable vehicles, why are there are so few of them around. I cringe when I hear the details of that vehicle, first of all made by Chrysler, secondly, high-performance, large engine, usually means lots of maintenance and repairs are required to upkeep. High price vehicles depreciate the quickest. I call bullshit on the 3,000 dollars a year figure, maybe you made a mistake in your acounting.
 
Crowler said:
LOL In what way shape or form have you killed the new car myth??? By posting a made up story about a stupid neighbor??? :D


Hey, it sounded good at the moment, lol.
 
callgolf said:
Not sure where you are but going prices on 3 year old 325i's with sport/premium package are 25,000-26,000. About the Viper, yeah, if they are such affordable vehicles, why are there are so few of them around. I cringe when I hear the details of that vehicle, first of all made by Chrysler, secondly, high-performance, large engine, usually means lots of maintenance and repairs are required to upkeep. High price vehicles depreciate the quickest. I call bullshit on the 3,000 dollars a year figure, maybe you made a mistake in your acounting.

Don't call bullshit on what I said ASSHOLE I told you it was 3K a year on my car and it was.


CROWLER.
 
Look at it this way...

Here's my final say on this matter, because this debate can rage on for years...

I earn a nice living, my wife does as well. We have plenty in savings, so our excess capital goes into investments. By nature, investments return a much higher rate than savings do - either in dividends, or capital gains, or cash flow.

So, now let's say I need new car. In fact let's say I want a Benz E55 AMG for $70,000. I have the cash in the bank to purchase, but my $ in the bank is earning 2.5% I can liquidate investments, but they are earning approx. 12 - 15%. So what do I do - do I lose future capital so I can say "I own a car"? Or, do I let the leasing company use their capital so I can drive "their" car for 3 years?

It's not hard to see why leasing makes sense using a real-world example. I leased the car above, and I'm paying 46% of the price of the car for 3 years.

My cost to lease (all inclusive) for 3 years = $34,300
My cost to own (if I would have gone that route) = $76,700*
*Including loss of interest if $ was taken from bank to pay for car

For me, having my money working for me is more important than worrying about some bullship money-factor that's built into my payments.

If your $ is under your mattress and not working for you, then buy a car - if your money is earning more money for you, then lease.
 
I lied - one more thought...

The reason many businesses continue to lease and not buy cars is the exact same reason many businesses lease their durable equipment instead of buying them - it makes no sense to own a liability.

There is no favorable tax treatment for leases as opposed to purchases of vehicles (in most cases), it's that business people think in a more "balance sheet" fashion than others do.

Think about it this way - in life wouldn't you prefer to just pay for what you use, and not have to pay for 100% when you just use a fraction of 100%?

A quick lesson in finance:
There are 3 things that you always want to minimize:
Interest
Taxes
Amortization (depreciation)

[If you ever watch CNBC and it's earnings season you'll hear the announcer state the earning and then they'll say "EBITA". That stands for Earnings Before Interest, Taxes, Amortization. Those three reduce the earnings for businesses and for individuals too. The goal is always to minimize those three items]

With a lease you basically cut each of these three in half. It's basic stuff. But to each his own... :cool:
 

Staff online

  • K1
    Blue-Eyed Devil
  • Big A
    IFBB PRO/NPC JUDGE/Administrator

Forum statistics

Total page views
559,703,212
Threads
136,132
Messages
2,780,596
Members
160,448
Latest member
Jim311
NapsGear
HGH Power Store email banner
your-raws
Prowrist straps store banner
infinity
FLASHING-BOTTOM-BANNER-210x131
raws
Savage Labs Store email
Syntherol Site Enhancing Oil Synthol
aqpharma
YMSApril210131
hulabs
ezgif-com-resize-2-1
MA Research Chem store banner
MA Supps Store Banner
volartek
Keytech banner
musclechem
Godbullraw-bottom-banner
Injection Instructions for beginners
Knight Labs store email banner
3
ashp131
YMS-210x131-V02
Back
Top