Ideas for next cycle(s)? What compounds to try?

[Landmonster]

So, I've almost completed 2 cycles

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Here is the first one, I based if off of a traditional Test/Deca/Dbol cycle for mass, using conservative doses.

Blast #1)
12 weeks of Test Cyp @ 500mg
10 weeks of Deca @ 300mg
6 weeks of 30mg Dbol
12 weeks of Mod-GRF + GHRP-2 (5x daily)

This cycle was very productive! My strength shot up across the board dramatically, body weight and lean mass increased, my arms and shoulders got huge, I felt good, etc. Sex drive was very high, almost unbearable at times.

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There was less good news about my 2nd cycle. Thinking that more must be better, I uppped the Test slightly, and doubled the Deca. I replaced peptides with hGH. I dropped the oral, thinking it was unhealthy.

Blast #2)


14 weeks of Test E @ 700mg
14 weeks of Deca @ 600mg
14 weeks of Rip hGH @ 3.5ius

This cycle I have gotten very bloated, lethargic, and tired all the time! I think I have somehow developed sleep apnea too... It sucks... I have to force myself to train, which feels wrong. I never have a desire to go kill the gym. My sex drive is much, much lower too.

I blame my bloatedness and lethargy on either the Deca or hGH.... and I guess i have to blamed the decreased sex drive on the Deca. Even though they are supposed to be good and mild drugs, one or both of them is not leaving me well.

I also miss the D-bol.... that drug seemed like the most potent addition to my first cycle! It produced the most obvious strength and mass gains and feelings. I kept nearly all of my Dbol strength, contrary to what people say.


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Cycle #3) ?? ??

Based on what you have heard so far..... what would you recommend for me?

D-bol seems to agree with me... I was thinking of using that again, but using it in 2 4-week bursts. The entire 1st 6 weeks that I was on Dbol I was making almost daily gains! I kept nearly all of them too.
I want to leave either Test Cyp or Test E as a base, and add something with it.

First of all, if I run Deca again, I'm not going to run it at 600mg... it seems like too much. I think 300mg or possibly 450mg seems like a better dose for me. I guess I am a pussy?

Secondly, I am either dropping GH altogether, or just going back to GH peptides instead of hGH. I know that may sound like blasphemy, but the damn hGH is way too expensive, and just leaves me a bloated mess. I haven't noticed any miracle gains from it. I'm not convinced it's doing anything more than peptides were, either.


Third, if I drop Deca, what would I use instead? Should I try Equipose? Maybe Tren?

 

[Johnny Smiles]

sounds like you are a candidate to try npp
do the 450mg or so like you mentioned but do it in npp rather than deca.
you are on your own with the peps.
-JS

 

[anarchocapitalist]

20 weeks
1250mg test/wk
1mg adex mon-wed-fri

when you are new to steroids its fun to try and play around and experiment with what you like. i know there are a lot of guys out there who like to play guru and try all sorts of different shit. but in the end testosterone cycles stay around.

 

[Mega me]

It's not the total volume of deca, but the test:deca ratio that caused the sexual dysfunction in the 2nd cycle. A ratio of 2:1 is ideal for this issue. Your first cycle was close to this ratio, the second was closer to 1:1.

I used to hate deca, but since following this rule, sex drive has been G2G.

 

[Landmonster]

Two things I have definitely learned so far:

1) Upping the dose doesn't necessarily produce magical results.
(I think we need to look for synergy between compounds, rather than just mega-dosing specific compounds. 300mg Deca plus 30mg dbol was producing much better gains than 600mg Deca... for me, anyway.)

2) Higher doses are not replacements for hard work in the gym.
(I have actually lost some strength on certain lifts on this cycle compared to the my first cycle, just due to not working them as hard as I did on the first cycle )

 

[Landmonster]

It's not the total volume of deca, but the test:deca ratio that caused the sexual dysfunction in the 2nd cycle. A ratio of 2:1 is ideal for this issue. Your first cycle was close to this ratio, the second was closer to 1:1.

I used to hate deca, but since following this rule, sex drive has been G2G.

Interesting. Have you verified this, with something like 1200 Test, 600 Deca?

 

[Mega me]

Interesting. Have you verified this, with something like 1200 Test, 600 Deca?

That's a god question. I suppose there might be an absolute threshold above no amount of T will offset the sexual side effects of deca. But honestly, I've never gone higher than 800mg T, so I don't know what it is. (In my opinion, the post above about the error of mega-dosing is spot on.)

 

[Landmonster]

Since my first cycle was so good, maybe I will do it again, with slightly higher doses.

1-14 @ 800mg Test
1-14 @ 450 Deca
3-6 and 11-14 @ 40mg Dbol

 

[mphbclipse]

Sounds like you respond to nandralone well........... I would run 20 weeks.... 750 cyp weekly wks1-20, npp 200mgs m,w,f wks 1-12, anavar 80mgs ed wks 12-20............................ That's a quality cycle my friend... I personally would run .5adex ed......just mho.

 

[Bwakelights]

Since my first cycle was so good, maybe I will do it again, with slightly higher doses.

1-14 @ 800mg Test
1-14 @ 450 Deca
3-6 and 11-14 @ 40mg Dbol

That's almost identical to my next blast. 700-350 test to deca though. You can get away with running test for a week or two longer than the deca.

 

[saps]

It's not the total volume of deca, but the test:deca ratio that caused the sexual dysfunction in the 2nd cycle. A ratio of 2:1 is ideal for this issue. Your first cycle was close to this ratio, the second was closer to 1:1.

I used to hate deca, but since following this rule, sex drive has been G2G.

There is no greater myth in the anabolic game than this. Please stop spreading this falsehood. Problems guys run into when running a nandrolone are never caused by a lack of test and thus will never be solved or cured by simply adding more test into the equation.
Its usually guys who have read this myth that continue to purport it. Those of us who have actually ran say 200mg of test a week with say a gram of a nandrolone know there is no sexual dysfunction. Its not now, has been, will never be about some magical ratio of test to nandrolone.
Sadly this widespread myth has paralyzed a lot of guys into fearing to try a low test high nandrolone cycle.
Fortunately the word began to get out a little with respect to the other 19nor and now more and more are seeing the truth and not letting ignorance guide their anabolic compound decisions.
I suppose it will just take time to disspell myths like this and the 6 weeks oral max for instance. One thing at a time I suppose.


Also for Landmonster, in this thread you have an specifically articulated the goal for your upcoming cycle. After defining your objectives you can then select the compounds best suited for that purpose. Much more effective than picking your compounds first and then trying to fit them into a certain type of objective.

 

[Mega me]

There is no greater myth in the anabolic game than this. Please stop spreading this falsehood. Problems guys run into when running a nandrolone are never caused by a lack of test and thus will never be solved or cured by simply adding more test into the equation.

Its usually guys who have read this myth that continue to purport it. Those of us who have actually ran say 200mg of test a week with say a gram of a nandrolone know there is no sexual dysfunction. Its not now, has been, will never be about some magical ratio of test to nandrolone.

Sadly this widespread myth has paralyzed a lot of guys into fearing to try a low test high nandrolone cycle.

Fortunately the word began to get out a little with respect to the other 19nor and now more and more are seeing the truth and not letting ignorance guide their anabolic compound decisions.

I suppose it will just take time to disspell myths like this and the 6 weeks oral max for instance. One thing at a time I suppose.





Also for Landmonster, in this thread you have an specifically articulated the goal for your upcoming cycle. After defining your objectives you can then select the compounds best suited for that purpose. Much more effective than picking your compounds first and then trying to fit them into a certain type of objective.

Just because your experience is different doesn't make this a "myth". The reality is not everyone experiences sexual side effects from deca or at the same doses. So, for someone like you, a gram of deca and no test might be just fine. And for others who do have this issue, no amount of test will help. But for many, many people like the OP--who was fine on cycle 1, but has problems on cycle 2--this protocol works. I can tell you from personal experience, that I had issues, and as soon as I added test in this ratio, they went away. Please stop assuming your personal experience is universal.

 

[kubes]

Since my first cycle was so good, maybe I will do it again, with slightly higher doses.

1-14 @ 800mg Test
1-14 @ 450 Deca
3-6 and 11-14 @ 40mg Dbol

Since your first cycle was so good why not run the same cycle and see if you make gains. Adjust your nutrition. Sometimes more isn't better and you still will probably make gains without changing the doses or compounds. If you want to try something different you might like the npp in place of deca

 

[sma]

Eq 600
Adrol 50 pre w/o
Sust 250 week

 

[sma]

Eq 600
Adrol 50 pre w/o
Sust 250 week (1shot)

Or
Test susp .4ml day (280mg week) take it pre w/o on train days
Eq 600 (1 shot week)
Npp 450-600 (2-3 shot)

Or
Db 100mg day (pre w-o on train days)
Eq 600 (1shot week)