Mountain dog training coaches since John’s passing

[Deleted member 226465]

Hi guys,

Maybe a stupid question but I’ve not long got into proper bodybuilding I’ve been reading up on JM’s programmes a lot recently but as we all know nothing beats the personal touch

Is there anyone that worked closely with John that continued his work with coaching using his training principles etc?

Failing that are there any still using them on here?

I’m from the UK and the general consensus over here is that top set back off set Jordan peters style PPL progressive weight overload is the only way to train and anything else is just being a pussy

But I truly believe there’s more than one way to grow maximal size

Interested to hear from you guys

For reference I’d say I’m probably an intermediate lifter maaaaybe advanced at a push

 

[danieltx]

There are multiple coaches at Meadows' company carrying on his work. I believe Andrew Berry is one of them.

There is no one-size-fits-all way to train, period. Great physiques have been built with all sorts of conventional and unonventional methods. There's definitely more than one way to grow maximal size.

Meadows' training ideas formed a good part of my training philosophy - start by pumping the muscle, then heavy work, then stretch work etc. The rest is mostly Dantre Trudel, some Jordan Peters, and then random stuff I've figured out myself.

 

[Deleted member 226465]

So for where I’m at is a bit of a crossroads in terms of I’ve predominantly always used a lower volume, higher intensity, higher frequency (JP,PPL,DC) type system as I’ve always been lead to believe that volume training is great but only for the genetic elite and for anyone else wanting to put on maximal size the above is the best way

is there a happy medium? Is that even true? Where does the mountain dog stuff fit in there?

 

[danieltx]

So for where I’m at is a bit of a crossroads in terms of I’ve predominantly always used a lower volume, higher intensity, higher frequency (JP,PPL,DC) type system as I’ve always been lead to believe that volume training is great but only for the genetic elite and for anyone else wanting to put on maximal size the above is the best way

is there a happy medium? Is that even true? Where does the mountain dog stuff fit in there?

You're overcomplicating this. I just told you there's no one-size-fits-all way.

What you've done has brought you to this point. If progress has stalled you probably shouldn't keep doing it. You can try something new and it might ignite new growth. And if it doesn't you can go back to what you've always done or try something else.

If you want a 'happy medium' then do moderate volume, moderate intensity, moderate frequency. Again, don't overcomplicate things.

 

[Deleted member 226465]

You're overcomplicating this. I just told you there's no one-size-fits-all way.

What you've done has brought you to this point. If progress has stalled you probably shouldn't keep doing it. You can try something new and it might ignite new growth. And if it doesn't you can go back to what you've always done or try something else.

If you want a 'happy medium' then do moderate volume, moderate intensity, moderate frequency. Again, don't overcomplicate things.

The issue I find myself with the DC style stuff is stalling due to injuries like tendinitis etc as opposed to not adding size

 

[AllOkJumpmaster]

Andrew Berry was his protege, and is still coaching, but unsure of his client load and whether he is taking on new folks at this time. that said, all of John's programs are very in-depth and one would not need a coach per see, to effectively apply his training methodology. Another program or training style you could consider is Fortitude Training. I do not believe Scott is currently training clients, but you also do not need a coach to apply and grow from his methodologies. Scott will comment here and or on his own message board to help you answer questions and refine your setup to your goals. Both are very different than how JP program.

 

[bbxtreme]

Hi guys,

Maybe a stupid question but I’ve not long got into proper bodybuilding I’ve been reading up on JM’s programmes a lot recently but as we all know nothing beats the personal touch

Is there anyone that worked closely with John that continued his work with coaching using his training principles etc?

Failing that are there any still using them on here?

I’m from the UK and the general consensus over here is that top set back off set Jordan peters style PPL progressive weight overload is the only way to train and anything else is just being a pussy

But I truly believe there’s more than one way to grow maximal size

Interested to hear from you guys

For reference I’d say I’m probably an intermediate lifter maaaaybe advanced at a push

Andrew Berry.

But I can tell you from experience that most top coaches don’t dabble in training as that’s something most should have figured out before working with a top coach.

They will guide you or give you a template, but it’s really on you to dial it in as you’re the one in the gym everyday. Coaches primarily dial in diet, supplements and give gear suggestions based on past cycles.

I agree 100% with @danieltx that you need to stick with what has gotten you to where you are now. This is where 99% of guys mess it up- they think they’re missing the secret once they get to a point of great progress and start changing everything up.

I cautioned you before doing creeping death 2 that it was John’s most intense program in terms of volume. Gamma Bomb or the original program would likely be a much better program to start with IMO. But in the end they’re templates and starting points for you to dial in. There is no one size fits all program. Stick with what’s worked for you.

Just as a reference point Andrew Berry does not start most guys off on any of the programs I’ve mentioned here. They’re way too much for even many advanced guys.

 

[GreenTLB6]

Andrew Berry is my coach. He advises me in training and helps here and there but does not write my programming for me. He does my nutrition, supplementation, gear, and cardio protocols. Tbh I couldn’t speak more highly of him as a coach and I have worked with a few other highly regarded coaches. He’s been my favorite to work with for multiple reasons.

 

[tren_plz]

Andrew Berry is my coach. He advises me in training and helps here and there but does not write my programming for me. He does my nutrition, supplementation, gear, and cardio protocols. Tbh I couldn’t speak more highly of him as a coach and I have worked with a few other highly regarded coaches. He’s been my favorite to work with for multiple reasons.

Thats great to hear. You looked killer from his posts...what makes him stand out from pasts coaches? Anything specifically?

 

[aHarness]

I’ve always been lead to believe that volume training is great but only for the genetic elite and for anyone else wanting to put on maximal size the above is the best way

What makes you think this?

I am of the belief that honestly, as long as execution and intensity are there then just about any style of training will work as long as you are consistent.

 

[bbxtreme]

Thats great to hear. You looked killer from his posts...what makes him stand out from pasts coaches? Anything specifically?

I’ll speak from my experience working with him in the past. Andrew walks the walk and practices what he preaches. One hell of a coach.

He is also highly vested in his clients and communicative. He doesn’t just look at photos and change calories- he dives into your health, blood work and wants to make sure all aspects are covered.

He also has trained under guys like Meadow’s and Dante and is a wealth of knowledge which is invaluable.

 

[AllOkJumpmaster]

John was a very nice man, who gave me help and guidance for free, and I was and am a literal nobody. He benefited in no way shape or form from talking to me. I will always love and cherish those conversations, and I do miss him, and his genuine contributions to the training and bodybuilding world.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Meadows is deeply missed, how can he not be

Such a great human being.

 

[g.r.o.w.t.h.]

As others have said, Andrew Berry. I worked with him for over a year and prepped for a show under his guidance. 10/10 experience without a single negative to say.

 

[Deleted member 226465]

So a lot of playing around I have adapted a new programme utilising many of the discussed principles but making recovery easier (the arms and delts days)

M- Upper no arms
T - Arms delts (side rear)
W - Legs
T - Upper no arms
F - Arms delts (side rear)
S - Legs
S - Off

 

[Deleted member 226465]

Option of taking an arm day off if extra recovery is needed

 

[Flex500]

Honestly man...I think you are way overthinking this. Mechanical tension is what is needed....how you get that and how much, as DanielTX said...well, you can do it a million different ways.

I mean look at how all these topics even get crisscrossed. I do one set to failure, but I guarantee my time under serious load (a productive set with high mechanical tension) is higher than many that do volume training. So am I a DC guy or a volume guy?

They only thing I'd say is a total fiddle f*ck is when you just circle jerking in the gym all day. Kind of a funny video but if you watch the "tren twins", all their workouts are basically a couple high intensity sets (sometimes literally 0-2 total) and basically super low intensity nonsense sets. But drugs and food will still keep you building muscle, it's just a time waste more than anything and incredibly inefficient. I guarantee the time I'm under a significant load creating significant mechanical tension is far higher than theirs but I do low volume and they do high volume. If you think of volume as time under enough mechanical tension, it's pretty wild how all of the sudden the low volume guys are sometimes doing higher volume and vice versa.

The only other nugget I'd give you is for DC or JP type of work you have to change how you do the reps. That sort of training will either kill your joints or should take quite a load off. If you do the reps in a manner where all momentum is gone it really should relieve a lot of it. This is especially true for the eccentric/concentric transitions.

 

[Deleted member 226465]

Honestly man...I think you are way overthinking this. Mechanical tension is what is needed....how you get that and how much, as DanielTX said...well, you can do it a million different ways.

I mean look at how all these topics even get crisscrossed. I do one set to failure, but I guarantee my time under serious load (a productive set with high mechanical tension) is higher than many that do volume training. So am I a DC guy or a volume guy?

They only thing I'd say is a total fiddle f*ck is when you just circle jerking in the gym all day. Kind of a funny video but if you watch the "tren twins", all their workouts are basically a couple high intensity sets (sometimes literally 0-2 total) and basically super low intensity nonsense sets. But drugs and food will still keep you building muscle, it's just a time waste more than anything and incredibly inefficient. I guarantee the time I'm under a significant load creating significant mechanical tension is far higher than theirs but I do low volume and they do high volume. If you think of volume as time under enough mechanical tension, it's pretty wild how all of the sudden the low volume guys are sometimes doing higher volume and vice versa.

The only other nugget I'd give you is for DC or JP type of work you have to change how you do the reps. That sort of training will either kill your joints or should take quite a load off. If you do the reps in a manner where all momentum is gone it really should relieve a lot of it. This is especially true for the eccentric/concentric transitions.

Thanks mate appreciate that and tbf I kinda agree

Do a bro split once a week hitting chest for 20 sets
Or
Twice per week 10 each session

As long as equal intensity and all other variables are the same probably not a whole load of difference over the course of a year

 

[Flex500]

Thanks mate appreciate that and tbf I kinda agree

Do a bro split once a week hitting chest for 20 sets
Or
Twice per week 10 each session

As long as equal intensity and all other variables are the same probably not a whole load of difference over the course of a year

I think so as well. I also don't think you are going to go wrong with any of those old Meadows programs. It's easy to get caught up in the "perfect plan". I remember jumping from program to program with John and he was like "dude...stop. Just go and work hard and unless you are doing anything insane it will all work out".

You obviously know what you are doing so I'd find a rationale program you enjoy and apply the needed intensity.

As a side note, Andrew Berry is legit. Great reviews and was John's "guy".

 

[juggy38]

So a lot of playing around I have adapted a new programme utilising many of the discussed principles but making recovery easier (the arms and delts days)

M- Upper no arms
T - Arms delts (side rear)
W - Legs
T - Upper no arms
F - Arms delts (side rear)
S - Legs
S - Off

Chest/back
Legs
Arms
Off
Repeat