stuck

[Nike22]

Yeah man, after reading this thread it honestly sounds to me like this person needs to break his habit of getting fast food. You take someone that heavy and put them on that restrictive of a diet and I'm pretty sure he's not just "holding water". The first 2-3 wks... maybe but after that for sure, no. He needs a complete lifestyle change that's on an addiction level. As a former heavy drinker I can guarantee you lying about something you're embarrased about comes like second nature.

So, I don't think he is being honest with you.

At the same time, I totally respect not giving up on a friend. I vote for upping the cardio. Get him to do 20 min on the treadmill, or whatever he's comfortable with that will get his heart rate up in the target zone after every workout, 2 wks later 25 min after every workout, 2 wks later 30, etc.

Try and see if you can get him to use his bike to get to work. Tell him to use the stairs instead of the elevator. Anything for more cardio. Challenge him to leave his house in the morning with no cash, no bank or credit cards so he can't cheat.
Driver's license and the lunch he made only.

 

[Flex500]

A good friend has decided to get in shape after 35 years of never eating healthy. He is 35... 6'1' and weighs 312Lbs ... over 50%+BF.

His diet: TOTAL FOR THE DAY 326gr protein 163gr carbs 55gr fats : 2562 calories daily
Cycle: 200mg of TE M and Th
Cardio x 2 week (understand he has never done any sort of cardio ever - gotta gradually add more.

I am training him at the gym and not taking it easy on him. First two week I had him concentrate on his form. This week we have intensified by a factor of 5. He is learning.

I have been competing since I was 16. I am in my late 50's. Not a newbie to the game. Have trained multiple athletes. Yet, I am humbled to say that I don't understand how he is not losing weight, but seems to be putting on weight. I spoke to a good friend (no names - please) who had two athletes at the Olympia last year. His conclusion is that he is cheating. I am not an easy guy to get along with as I expect perfection especially when I am doing this free of charge. I hate wasting my time even when I got paid.

He tell me that he is not cheating. Yet at 2,500 calories a day. I am killing him in the gym and doing cardio twice a week. I am dumbfounded.

I am asking if anyone who are prepping or have prepped athletes in the past have ever experience anything of this sort. Or is he lying to me. Which is swears he is not.

Let's keep it positive.

Thanks for any or all responses.

Your friend is correct. He is cheating. I don't care if he is building muscle at an astonishing rate, if he is working out and over 50% bf 300+lbs, he will be shedding weight like crazy.

You are in a tough spot because he is a good friend. I don't mean to be flippant about it, because it is a serious matter...but you will likely either have to just sever it so it doesn't come between your friendship...or channel your inner Dr. Now. Over and over and over "all I ate was a salad" and it's just not physically possible to gain or not lose faster, even if you are acquiring muscle. There are a lot of topics in bodybuilding where there is some gray areas of understanding or debate but I really don't think this is one.

The flip side is this is very hard. If he has never done it, it is so easy to cheat. an extra 1-2K calories is nothing. I totally sabotaged my diet multiple times this week by eating a handful of almonds randomly (extra 400 calories a day), random pieces of cheese (extra 210 calories a day) and like 2-3 tasty pastries randomly each day (400-600 extra a day). I mean as far as food volume that is nothing and I've put down an extra 8,000 calories in the last week. If I wasn't "in tune" I'd definitely tell people "oh I ate light and stayed on my diet" and I honestly wouldn't feel like I was lying.

joking aside the first segment in this clip probably rings true here. "I eat a third of what I used to"..."what are you talking about, you are overeating"

 

[Nike22]

DUDE!!! THANK YOU @Flex500 The first person in that video shows EXACTLY what I was talking about when you have an addict that will try to lie and deflect their way out of everything.

 

[Flex500]

DUDE!!! THANK YOU @Flex500 The first person in that video shows EXACTLY what I was talking about when you have an addict that will try to lie and deflect their way out of everything.

for sure man...hell I have been doing this 20 years and had to look at myself and ask why did I not progress the last 10ish days when I thought "I ate well"...well half a can of almonds a day, 2-3 pieces of cheese, and 2-3 protein bars A DAY extra...and I gained weight. I even told my wife "dang I dieted hard the last 8-10 days".

Now think about if you had been eating anything and everything for 20 years how delusional you'd be. You just lose touch with reality when hunger is involved.

 

[pesty4077]

I wouldn't follow a 2500 calorie either at 312 pounds and 50% bf. You are immediately starving him and he will quit most likely. You should have weaned him off junk slowly too. You think he got that big and fat in a few months? He needs more calories initially and not a drastic change to stick with it. Like you said, you been doing this for years, he hasn't. It is suppose to be a life change and that means doing something that will make him stick with it for life.

 

[b-boy]

There are only two reasons he isn't losing weight on those calories

1. He is cheating on the diet (he is lying)
2. He isn't properly weighing or tracking his food intake (he just doesn't know)

End of story!

 

[iwantmass]

I find it often the case that people will track what they eat, but not what they drink. They completely omit the 3 liters of mountain dew a day

 

[Fleezy]

2. He isn't properly weighing or tracking his food intake (he just doesn't know)

indeed

its not a lie if he doesnt know what the truth is

deception requires intent

 

[stackdizzy]

I have been doing this for a very long time. He got himself on test. His test levels were non existent. Please understand my friend has been obese all his life. Gear, he went to one a HRT clinic. One of his client he installed cameras and alarm system. The PA (Physician Assistant) who is a bodybuilder as well put him on the test. So, before you all believe this was my doing, not at all. I come in with diet and training. I have a 2,400st. gym at home. As I have explained I have been lifting since I was 14 and did my first show at 16. I have 23 shows under my belt. Have competed at the USA. Why I posted on this matter, is he is losing confidence as many who find themselves in the situation he is in. I have had him on a diet for two months, the first month he lost 16lbs. The HRT guy upped his dose to 400mg from 200mg a week. I was against it, but it is what it is. Everyone places all their cookies with someone who wears a white coat. I have a hard time accepting anything anyone tells me because I know my body better than anyone.

Yes, I had him do bloods. It was the firs thing I had him do. Quite interesting is the PA did not have him do bloods. Yet assume he he low test. His Panel came back looking like they belong to someone who is obese has been on a Fast Food diet all their lives.

My part: Started him on cardio twice a week. 45 minutes - going for a walk. As I have explained further up. the lifting has intensified, but intensified from doing 20lb dumbbell presses to 35lb after three week. I wanted to teach him form as we all know that 90+% of people in gyms have terrible form. With form and time I can increase little by little. He says he fits into shorts he was not able to wear for years.

Yet, he has been stagnant since the onset of the test or increase to 400mg's a week.

His diet was individualized to him. I did a BMR/TDEE and his maintenance caloric intake is 4,300 calories. So, I restricted his calories to 2,561 a day. It's simple 2 + 2 = 4 I dropped over a 1,000 calories and he is not moving. Actually he has gone up in weight. I feel that with gear and all he should be dropping due to the restrictive calories. Why I am upset is that if he took the leap to take gear against my advise and is cheating, this is a complete joke and I am spending my time training him in the gym and advising him on his diet daily and how he needs to stick to it.

Hopefully you all get a better picture now and I know he must be cheating and I am close to calling it quits. I am letting him read all of this. So he understands that gear was not necessary or maybe just a TRT dose.

I want to thank you all for the great posts.when everythnig

I am kinda confused as to the timeline of the events. Did diet,cardio,weights, test all start at the sametime? Ive read two weeks and tewo months can you go into more detail when everything happened?

 

[Virtuous]

It’s probably a lot of cognitive dissonance tbh.

Most people have such shitty diets their entire lives. I mean if you eat only meat, veggies, rice/potatoes, and fruit people think you’re a weird ass monk or something, but that’s a totally healthy diet.

He’s probably so conditioned (at his weight) to think that a soda and candy bar at the gas station is “just what you do.” - stuff like that.

Maybe have him get an app or notebook and say he can eat whatever, but if he eats it, he just has to write it down. Anything that passes his lips goes in the book. Then after a week, do the math for him and show him how he’s fucking up.

 

[Fleezy]

It’s probably a lot of cognitive dissonance tbh.

Most people have such shitty diets their entire lives. I mean if you eat only meat, veggies, rice/potatoes, and fruit people think you’re a weird ass monk or something, but that’s a totally healthy diet.

He’s probably so conditioned (at his weight) to think that a soda and candy bar at the gas station is “just what you do.” - stuff like that.

Maybe have him get an app or notebook and say he can eat whatever, but if he eats it, he just has to write it down. Anything that passes his lips goes in the book. Then after a week, do the math for him and show him how he’s fucking up.

you'd be surprised by what i call 'fat logic'

the amount of 'that candy bar didnt count...doesnt count if no one saw me eat it'


the only exercise fatties get is mental acrobatics

 

[SouthernMuscle]

you'd be surprised by what i call 'fat logic'

the amount of 'that candy bar didnt count...doesnt count if no one saw me eat it'


the only exercise fatties get is mental acrobatics

my FAVE by far is “but its ”NATURAL SUGAR” as if your bodys insulin greets natural state sugar as something that won’t cause type 2
i can‘t even recount the number of times i’ve heard that

 

[Fleezy]

my FAVE by far is “but its ”NATURAL SUGAR” as if your bodys insulin greets natural state sugar as something that won’t cause type 2
i can‘t even recount the number of times i’ve heard that

But it’s honey!

But it’s agave nectar!

Lol

 

[SouthernMuscle]

But it’s honey!

But it’s agave nectar!

Lol

I mean honey has it’s place but i’m not putting that shit on everything, little goes a long way, i think anyways

and agave nectar is hilarious to me because it has a higher percentage of fructose than high fructose corn syrup lol

 

[Fleezy]

I mean honey has it’s place but i’m not putting that shit on everything, little goes a long way, i think anyways

and agave nectar is hilarious to me because it has a higher percentage of fructose than high fructose corn syrup lol

My father would have breakfast every morning that consisted of oatmeal with brown sugar, honey, and loads of bananas and frozen fruit

No protein at all

And he thought this was healthy… while simultaneously making him fat.

I changed his diet around and he lost like 50lbs in a few months just from the changes

It always gets me when fat people say they don’t have time to go to the gym

I’m like, that’s fine.. some of the skinniest people I know have never seen the inside of a weight room, they just don’t overeat

- like it’s some sort of voodoo magical equation

 

[SouthernMuscle]

My father would have breakfast every morning that consisted of oatmeal with brown sugar, honey, and loads of bananas and frozen fruit

No protein at all

And he thought this was healthy… while simultaneously making him fat.

I changed his diet around and he lost like 50lbs in a few months just from the changes

It always gets me when fat people say they don’t have time to go to the gym

I’m like, that’s fine.. some of the skinniest people I know have never seen the inside of a weight room, they just don’t overeat

- like it’s some sort of voodoo magical equation

Had a guy w one of those perfectly round pregnant looking guts approach me in costco the other day

”big man! Whats the best exercise for ya stomach?” As he’s patting his bulbous gut

Me: “stop eating”

 

[pesty4077]

Had a guy w one of those perfectly round pregnant looking guts approach me in costco the other day

”big man! Whats the best exercise for ya stomach?” As he’s patting his bulbous gut

Me: “stop eating”

When they ask me how I get so lean, I always point to my mouth. I tell them it is what I put in it food wise.

 

[Tomgrass]

The habits which took him to this weights are the habits which stopping him.

 

[Performance Based]

A huge hat off to you for trying to help him get his life turned around - fully understand your qualifications mate and respect them fully.

I hate to say it by this might be a cut your losses and move on project. You obviously give a shit - and it isn’t being reciprocated with his effort.

Just unwelcome and unnecessary stress mate.

I imagine he’s aromatizing like crazy but shouldn’t be gaining weight like that. Bottom line is he is cheating on his diet either on purpose or not realizing it.

 

[Fleezy]

You obviously give a shit - and it isn’t being reciprocated with his effort.

Just unwelcome and unnecessary stress mate.

yep

caring about people more than they care about themselves is emotional suicide