SYNTHETINE

[garcia]

I don't think such a small amount will have a significant impact.

My AM routine the last 8 weeks of my contest prep was...

- 5:00 AM... 3-4iu Humulin R
- 5:15 AM... 5ml Synthetine
- 5:30 AM... HIIT session (duration varied...started at 5 minutes warmup, 15 intervals, 5 cool down and finished around 30 intervals)
- 6:15/6:30... Breakfast (Started at 6 whole eggs with 1/4 cup whites, ended at 2 eggs, 1 1/2 cup whites...coconut oil was used as well, in varied amounts)

As stated, this was my AM protocol for prep and my condition was the best I've ever achieved, so I see no issue with this small amount of insulin that far ahead of a fat meal.

I have been using it with my pwo shake that has 40 mg simple carbs. I don't think I could use insulin again, BC the first time I used it pwo I went severely hypo. I am prone to hypo since childhood.
Have been using synthetine pre wo for 45 days or so. Have dropped three inches on my waist. So it still must work somehow. Or it is the placebo effect and just watching what I eat and more frequent workouts.

 

[Aikman56]

I have been using it with my pwo shake that has 40 mg simple carbs. I don't think I could use insulin again, BC the first time I used it pwo I went severely hypo. I am prone to hypo since childhood.
Have been using synthetine pre wo for 45 days or so. Have dropped three inches on my waist. So it still must work somehow. Or it is the placebo effect and just watching what I eat and more frequent workouts.

Two points I would make in response...

-How many iu insulin made you go hypo? If you are that insulin sensitive (not a bad thing!), perhaps 1-2 iu will do the job for you?

-I have no doubt it worked, but I was careful to use the word 'optimally'. My goal with anything I use is to find the optimal method for usage. I used Synthetine in the past without insulin and with insufficient carbs and DID get results, but nothing close to when I either used it with insulin or (prior to having to drop the carbs) with 90g total Pre- and Intra-workout carbs, no insulin.)

Just my thoughts. I'm not a pro and I only consider my physique a bit above average, so I can only speak from personal experience.

 

[garcia]

Two points I would make in response...

-How many iu insulin made you go hypo? If you are that insulin sensitive (not a bad thing!), perhaps 1-2 iu will do the job for you?

-I have no doubt it worked, but I was careful to use the word 'optimally'. My goal with anything I use is to find the optimal method for usage. I used Synthetine in the past without insulin and with insufficient carbs and DID get results, but nothing close to when I either used it with insulin or (prior to having to drop the carbs) with 90g total Pre- and Intra-workout carbs, no insulin.)

Just my thoughts. I'm not a pro and I only consider my physique a bit above average, so I can only speak from personal experience.

Good question. It was either 1-2 iu I went hypo on. I remember I was cautious BC of my history with hypo. I had to leave the gym early and ate 3 choc chip cookies before I felt better. I don't think I can ever do that again. It was humulin-r.

 

[Elvia1023]

Good question. It was either 1-2 iu I went hypo on. I remember I was cautious BC of my history with hypo. I had to leave the gym early and ate 3 choc chip cookies before I felt better. I don't think I can ever do that again. It was humulin-r.

I recommend the first time you ever take slin to stay at home. I took 2iu novolog and went hypo bad and I ate loads of carbs. I sometimes go hypo from just food alone and can be really bad even with just GDA's. But trust me even if you are super sensitive if you do things correctly 3IU humulin-r is fine once you get over that initial fear and get used to it. It was the first time you have ever used slin and you are sensitive so no surprises you reacted bad. Plus the fact you had to eat chocolate chip cookies to feel better shows me things were exactly planned carefully. I am not saying it is needed with synthetine but as Aikman highlights there are great ways and then there is the optimal one. Synthetine will work no matter what but if you can use 3IU humulin-r with it that's only a good thing.

 

[Elvia1023]

I need to add as it's been discussed before but many may have missed it. Some guys don't want to take slin ever and that's fine and I don't blame them. You may also be on a low carb diet. This is not the optimal setting but for those people I recommend high dosing amino acids (leucine for example) as that can give you a good insulin response that will help matters. Again it is not optimal but it's making the best out of the tools you have available. So literally 10 grams of leucine and take your synthetine soon after.

 

[garcia]

I need to add as it's been discussed before but many may have missed it. Some guys don't want to take slin ever and that's fine and I don't blame them. You may also be on a low carb diet. This is not the optimal setting but for those people I recommend high dosing amino acids (leucine for example) as that can give you a good insulin response that will help matters. Again it is not optimal but it's making the best out of the tools you have available. So literally 10 grams of leucine and take your synthetine soon after.

I have liquid carnitine suspended in glycogen from vitamin shoppe. I will just chug 3 oz of that with the Synthetine and my preworkout shake. That will hopefully provide the nessary insulin spike I need. I'm not shy of saying that my experience with insulin REALLY frightened me and I never want to go back there again. Thanks for your help, guys. Much appreciate the advice. Maybe I will eat some pasta, as well to get closer to the 700 g carbs that the study said I need to load. I have bcaa's but no 10 g of leucine. I will have to get on that with TN. Thanks again guys

 

[Elvia1023]

I have liquid carnitine suspended in glycogen from vitamin shoppe. I will just chug 3 oz of that with the Synthetine and my preworkout shake. That will hopefully provide the nessary insulin spike I need. I'm not shy of saying that my experience with insulin REALLY frightened me and I never want to go back there again. Thanks for your help, guys. Much appreciate the advice. Maybe I will eat some pasta, as well to get closer to the 700 g carbs that the study said I need to load. I have bcaa's but no 10 g of leucine. I will have to get on that with TN. Thanks again guys

Even BCAA's will do as I imagine they are mainly made up of leucine. 10 grams was just a number but 5 grams would be fine too. 10 grams of your BCAA powder would be good though.

If you are having carbs in your diet that makes things very easy. Even something like honey or coconut sugar would be great when dosed with synthetine pre workout. For an insulin spike you need fast carbs and I would probably put natural honey as one of the best in that regard. Obviously if fat loss is your number 1 concern then go with just the aminos.

 

[garcia]

Even BCAA's will do as I imagine they are mainly made up of leucine. 10 grams was just a number but 5 grams would be fine too. 10 grams of your BCAA powder would be good though.

If you are having carbs in your diet that makes things very easy. Even something like honey or coconut sugar would be great when dosed with synthetine pre workout. For an insulin spike you need fast carbs and I would probably put natural honey as one of the best in that regard. Obviously if fat loss is your number 1 concern then go with just the aminos.

Thanks, Elvia. I will do the Amino's and/or honey.

 

[Aikman56]

I need to add as it's been discussed before but many may have missed it. Some guys don't want to take slin ever and that's fine and I don't blame them. You may also be on a low carb diet. This is not the optimal setting but for those people I recommend high dosing amino acids (leucine for example) as that can give you a good insulin response that will help matters. Again it is not optimal but it's making the best out of the tools you have available. So literally 10 grams of leucine and take your synthetine soon after.

Fantastic point that I neglected to mention!

 

[Big A]

Good question. It was either 1-2 iu I went hypo on. I remember I was cautious BC of my history with hypo. I had to leave the gym early and ate 3 choc chip cookies before I felt better. I don't think I can ever do that again. It was humulin-r.

Are you sure you didn't confuse the 1 and 2 markers on the insulin syringe with 1 and 2IU? The 1 and 2 markers mean 10IU and 20IU.

1 or 2IU or hum-r should be unnoticeable. You shouldn't feel anything. People take 3IU hum-r every 4 hours just to get into ketosis with no sides.

 

[Aikman56]

Are you sure you didn't confuse the 1 and 2 markers on the insulin syringe with 1 and 2IU? The 1 and 2 markers mean 10IU and 20IU.

1 or 2IU or hum-r should be unnoticeable. You shouldn't feel anything. People take 3IU hum-r every 4 hours just to get into ketosis with no sides.

I had that thought... Never seen anyone go hypo with 3-4 iu, that would be incredible insulin sensitivity.

 

[garcia]

Are you sure you didn't confuse the 1 and 2 markers on the insulin syringe with 1 and 2IU? The 1 and 2 markers mean 10IU and 20IU.

1 or 2IU or hum-r should be unnoticeable. You shouldn't feel anything. People take 3IU hum-r every 4 hours just to get into ketosis with no sides.

Yes. I'm sure, Big A. I had done gh many times before that. So I knew what was up. Actually, that only happened like 5 years ago, lol.

I understand what ur saying. I can't explain what happened. Maybe it was the placebo effect. I have a long history of hypoglycemia from early childhood, so I knew the feeling immediately.

 

[rockstar3000]

Yes. I'm sure, Big A. I had done gh many times before that. So I knew what was up. Actually, that only happened like 5 years ago, lol.

I understand what ur saying. I can't explain what happened. Maybe it was the placebo effect. I have a long history of hypoglycemia from early childhood, so I knew the feeling immediately.

This has been the same case with me man I used 4 novilin r and wen hypo ..scary stuff never touched it again...maybe im sensitive like u and im running the sythetine at 5ml a day I really wanna throw some insulin in but I'm seriously afraid plus I'm dieting for me wrdding so carba are really low. Idk still might make a run to Walmart and grab some lol

 

[Elvia1023]

This has been the same case with me man I used 4 novilin r and wen hypo ..scary stuff never touched it again...maybe im sensitive like u and im running the sythetine at 5ml a day I really wanna throw some insulin in but I'm seriously afraid plus I'm dieting for me wrdding so carba are really low. Idk still might make a run to Walmart and grab some lol

If you do then for peace of mind and just as you get used to it use it at home. Honestly it will be more the fact you are worrying so much about going hypo that will create some issues. But it is a very real possibilty for someone who is extremely slin sensitive. That's why you just have to let your body and mind adapt to adding it in. As Big A stated though 3IU humulin/novolin r are literally nothing due to their release. 3IU humalog/novolog are much different. As long as you have some carbs you will be fine. Then over time you could even do the 3IU humulin/novolin r fasted with no issdes at all.

To start just have something like a sweet potatoe or small amount of oats with your pre workout meal. Intra training some intra md or some aminos with a small amount of honey, coconut sugar, dextrose or a combo of 2. Postworkout a small amount of rice (or even rice cakes for ease) with lean protein. That's just to cover all bases and over a few days you could get rid of one of the carbs meals if low carbs is the diet you want to follow. Then after a few more days get rid of another meal and so on until you have very little or no carbs with your 3-4IU slin dose. Always carry some sweets and a sugary drink in your gym bag at all times just to be safe (not that they will ever be needed with such a small amount).

 

[ill gotten gains]

I recommend the first time you ever take slin to stay at home. I took 2iu novolog and went hypo bad and I ate loads of carbs. I sometimes go hypo from just food alone and can be really bad even with just GDA's. But trust me even if you are super sensitive if you do things correctly 3IU humulin-r is fine once you get over that initial fear and get used to it. It was the first time you have ever used slin and you are sensitive so no surprises you reacted bad. Plus the fact you had to eat chocolate chip cookies to feel better shows me things were exactly planned carefully. I am not saying it is needed with synthetine but as Aikman highlights there are great ways and then there is the optimal one. Synthetine will work no matter what but if you can use 3IU humulin-r with it that's only a good thing.

Elvia, after eating a preworkout meal, how long after should I wait to pin the 3 iu insulin and synthetine? If anyone else has input, it would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jtcraig3]

I need to add as it's been discussed before but many may have missed it. Some guys don't want to take slin ever and that's fine and I don't blame them. You may also be on a low carb diet. This is not the optimal setting but for those people I recommend high dosing amino acids (leucine for example) as that can give you a good insulin response that will help matters. Again it is not optimal but it's making the best out of the tools you have available. So literally 10 grams of leucine and take your synthetine soon after.

Could you recommend a good leucine supplement?

I've been taking Synthetine with Syntheselen for quite some time. I don't want to take insulin because quite frankly I have a very elementary understanding of how and why Synthetine works optimal in conjunction with slin...and it makes me a little nervous.

Thanks in advance.

 

[jtcraig3]

I need to add as it's been discussed before but many may have missed it. Some guys don't want to take slin ever and that's fine and I don't blame them. You may also be on a low carb diet. This is not the optimal setting but for those people I recommend high dosing amino acids (leucine for example) as that can give you a good insulin response that will help matters. Again it is not optimal but it's making the best out of the tools you have available. So literally 10 grams of leucine and take your synthetine soon after.

Also, I've read the article in its entirety. I'll admit, science has never been my strong point...always was my worst subject in school, lol. I think I have a general understanding of how Synthetine works. Specifically as it relates to insulin, do you think you could explain in layman's terms why insulin is so effective when working in conjunction with Synthetine? If you don't have the time I totally understand. Thanks

 

[Elvia1023]

Elvia, after eating a preworkout meal, how long after should I wait to pin the 3 iu insulin and synthetine? If anyone else has input, it would be greatly appreciated.

It doesn't realy matter too much but timing coud change due to various reasons. What are your goals? What is your diet (macros) like? How many carbs each day? Have you used slin before? What is your usual pre workout meal? What type of slin are you using?

The answer could be very simple but all the above can effect things and how you would go about starting. But generally I would simply state enough time for you to feel ready for training. Meaning you don't want to start training feeling bloated and need to give your body some time to start digesting that meal. Your pre workout meal of choice is the biggest factor. Let me know the details and I will give you my opinion. Thanks

 

[Elvia1023]

Also, I've read the article in its entirety. I'll admit, science has never been my strong point...always was my worst subject in school, lol. I think I have a general understanding of how Synthetine works. Specifically as it relates to insulin, do you think you could explain in layman's terms why insulin is so effective when working in conjunction with Synthetine? If you don't have the time I totally understand. Thanks

Think of insulin as a transporter of nutrients into muscle cells. Insulin is simply used to get the synthetine into the muscle cell to allow it to do it's job. In theory it should increase it's effectiveness and that has been noticed by most who have used the combination.

I don't live in the US so my suppliers are different. I would use MyProtein Leucine powder. I am not sure if they deliver to you. You could try truenutrition or go on ebay and get NOW Foods Leucine powder. Allmax and Prime Nutrition do leucine powders too. I think all of them should be gtg for you. I am a fan of NOW Foods and Prime products as I haven't used the other brands. I actually have 2 tubs of Prime Nutrition EAA's on their way to me now

 

[warlock]

Think of insulin as a transporter of nutrients into muscle cells. Insulin is simply used to get the synthetine into the muscle cell to allow it to do it's job. In theory it should increase it's effectiveness and that has been noticed by most who have used the combination.

I don't live in the US so my suppliers are different. I would use MyProtein Leucine powder. I am not sure if they deliver to you. You could try truenutrition or go on ebay and get NOW Foods Leucine powder. Allmax and Prime Nutrition do leucine powders too. I think all of them should be gtg for you. I am a fan of NOW Foods and Prime products as I haven't used the other brands. I actually have 2 tubs of Prime Nutrition EAA's on their way to me now

Elvia,

Do you think for those not using slin or eating carbs with the injectable carnitine, taking leucine would be the way to go to make it work better?