This stuff makes me hard! Anti-aging pioneer David Sinclair on Joe Rogan!

NEMSZ · Jan 30, 2019

Knight9 said:
Absolutely have read over some stuff about that.

@ around the 1h45m mark in the podcast, he mentions a NMN being used in conjunction with a molecule(developmental drug) named MIB-626 that is being tested on older people. Metrobiotech is the company making it.

It is projected to come to market in about 3 yrs if things go well.

Mice treated with NMN broke the treadmill in his lab because they kept running for 3km. Mice had never run that far and the software shut the treadmill off. These mice were equivalent to a 65 yr old human.

Is NMN readily available as a supplement from anyone/company trustworthy?

Also how bioavailable is oral Resveratrol? Sorry if it was answered but I saw someone doubt it but not answered..

Looking to start taking supplements so I’m really uneducated on the subject. I see lots of guys on here taking lots of things but would like to keep a simple list like the Doc here.. I’m figuring;

Resveratrol
NMN (if available from anyone reliable)
Curcumin
Metformin (took this on and off last year)
Citrus Bergamot
Vit D and K2 (I have a supp mix there but can anyone comment on the truth/myth of K2 and blood clotting etc?) think I heard/read that somewhere..

And I’m open to any other suggestions but think this is quite a list for me already lol I sometimes miss TRT injections so I’m definitely going to have to write this down in a daily journal to remind myself lol

Serotonin · Jan 30, 2019

Its been so long since I dabbled with the "anti-aging" supps

But is it really a good idea to take metformin if you don't even need it???!

I'm all in 100% on being as healthy as possible...But there comes a point imo when people over supplement and they're actually doing more harm than good.

Not saying metformin is bad, was just an example of people using pharm drugs for off label purposes or even non pharmacuetical compounds for example taking high levels of Idebenone is bad because of over-oxidization I believe.

Balance and moderation seem to be important factors when consuming supplements. And I also believe we need the real, fresh stuff in real, fresh, organic foods. And we can mainly get everything we need in those foods without the needs of massive supplementation.

He talks about how our bodies already have things prewired to work for the most part, i.e. fasting to get that adaptation response and initiate the anti-aging effect....Also Telomere extension through exercise and Resveratrol usage.

Wouldn't grapes grown in a harsh environment be enough resveratrol for us? Or not?

Really just allot of speculation going on here to be honest. I need to catch up on all of this...I read allot 5 years ago on this subject, I even remember David and how he created that Pharm drug similar to resveratrol no?

Only 20 min in but I agree, this stuff is very exciting!

nothuman · Jan 30, 2019

NEMSZ said:
Is NMN readily available as a supplement from anyone/company trustworthy?

Also how bioavailable is oral Resveratrol? Sorry if it was answered but I saw someone doubt it but not answered..

Looking to start taking supplements so I’m really uneducated on the subject. I see lots of guys on here taking lots of things but would like to keep a simple list like the Doc here.. I’m figuring;

Resveratrol
NMN (if available from anyone reliable)
Curcumin
Metformin (took this on and off last year)
Citrus Bergamot
Vit D and K2 (I have a supp mix there but can anyone comment on the truth/myth of K2 and blood clotting etc?) think I heard/read that somewhere..

And I’m open to any other suggestions but think this is quite a list for me already lol I sometimes miss TRT injections so I’m definitely going to have to write this down in a daily journal to remind myself lol

Here is a pretty good article from selfhacked, which is a very good site for this purpose

https://selfhacked.com/blog/23-longevity-boosting-supplements-drugs-increase-lifespan/

It's a few years old already and more info constantly come out, but it's all evidence based with zero bias. For instance, it's not recent enough to have all the info about Rapamycin.

I use or have used about half of these at some point. Right now I'm still using lithium, curcumin, rhodiola, melatonin, and metformin from this list. The question we don't know is whether it's counterproductive to use too many things and whether these things overlap. More may not be better, which is why I've cut down my supplement list.

LK3 · Jan 30, 2019

Knight9 said:
He's been taking 1gram before bed for years. I wonder if its an XR version.

NMN
Resveratrol
D3 and K2
Vegetables

(he's very anti iron supplementation)--He says it does not look good when he looks at the tissue with high iron levels.

This is what his full list of what he subscribes to. Or at least, what he's willing to publicly admit to millions.

have you been using res/ptero from... same as us. lol
curc?

Killer.7 · Jan 30, 2019

IN on this fking thread. super interesting

aphextwin · Jan 30, 2019

I use ptero instead of res. Res has a shitty bioavailability. If I were to take it, I’d take it with bioperene and fats. I would prefer to inject it but don’t have that option....honestly last time I did inject it hurt like hell.

aphextwin · Jan 30, 2019

Anti-Aging

I know this is a BB/drug related forum, but sure would love to see more of this type of stuff popping up. I love the whole anti-aging thing.

This is where the future is heading

NEMSZ · Jan 31, 2019

nothuman said:
Here is a pretty good article from selfhacked, which is a very good site for this purpose

https://selfhacked.com/blog/23-longevity-boosting-supplements-drugs-increase-lifespan/

It's a few years old already and more info constantly come out, but it's all evidence based with zero bias. For instance, it's not recent enough to have all the info about Rapamycin.

I use or have used about half of these at some point. Right now I'm still using lithium, curcumin, rhodiola, melatonin, and metformin from this list. The question we don't know is whether it's counterproductive to use too many things and whether these things overlap. More may not be better, which is why I've cut down my supplement list.

Thanks for that, good read.. Still not sure on the bioavailability on some of these things.. Mainly the Resveratrol, don’t want to waste money on something that won’t do anything but the doc in OP post seems to have tests on himself that it works...

And I always had that question too; is too many supps counterproductive? There’s a few I wanted to add like Coq10 and Astragulus and possibly the Rhodiola but that’s like 10 supps

Stewie · Jan 31, 2019

To increase the bioavailability of resveratrol, one can make a dry powder mixture of a 1:1 of Beta Cyclodextrin:resveratrol and take it transbuccal (between cheek and gum) a couple of times per day.

This will eliminate the degradation in the GI tract and first pass metabolism.

Stewie · Jan 31, 2019

Or just buy a combination of piperine with resveratrol.

thethinker48 · Jan 31, 2019

I'm not through the whole thing yet. A few things I noted.

1. Metformin

A lot of really smart people in the field of anti-aging and longevity research (Peter Attia, Dr Sinclair, Navdeep Chandel, Nir Barzilai; this is one of the few people who studied Metformin in the 80s before it ever went through trial) always bring it up in matters of anti aging. AMPK's role (pokes at mitochondrial complex 1, then ampk which then also inhibits MTor), maintaining blood glucose, changing of the gut microbiome; all of this makes it a very interesting drug.

Dr. Barzilai podcast with Peter Attia which came out a few weeks ago was brilliant on Metformin and IGF (one of the biggest takeaways being that IGF's effects on women for longevity were more antithetical compared men; females didn't get the same benefit of IGF, these were Dr Attia's thoughts as well. And we all know the inverse relationship between IGF and longevity so for women to sit even lower on that curve is rather interesting.

You're getting anti diabetic, anti inflammatory, anti-cancer effects from one drug. Dr Sinclair talking about taking it himself when he's not diabetic tells you something; but I do have my own personal thoughts on the entire picture which for bodybuilders might be different.

2. Disposable Soma Theory of Aging. Kirkwood's theory on how tradeoff for a large organism (or one that develops faster) is death essentially, because the resources used for DNA repair in a smaller developing organisms are allocated more towards growth and reproduction leading to a shorter overall lifespan. Notice how bodybuilding fits into this. We turn EVERYTHING up to it's fullest potential in hopes of accruing muscle mass. MTOR, IGF, Insulin Levels, Oxidation; everything to do with cellular aging sits in the realm of muscle growth.

While no long term study is available or even viable to study aging in bodybuilders, it's safe to say that DNA damage and the rate of repair can't possibly be kept up to par in a bodybuilder's body.

3. I DO NOT want to look like these guys. A lot of these guys who have spent their lives studying these topics (people have NO idea how complex metabolism is) are absolutely brilliant; you're talking a lifetime of commitment to something that might change the way human beings progress biologically.

But they aren't bodybuilders. And I don't want to be a meat allergic guy who runs 2x a week on a treadmill steadily, and does some circuit work with bands on the weekend (I know, I'm generalizing). So our lifestyle is obviously going to differ from the things that are the primary focus of people trying to live the longest. But I think mitigating risks, understanding risk factors, introducing elements that will help slow the process of aging (both cellularly, and chronic diseases that kill us) can help us be as big and healthy for as long as physiologically possible.

Just my thoughts on this stuff; which I personally believe is such a fascinating topic

nothuman · Jan 31, 2019

thethinker48 said:
I'm not through the whole thing yet. A few things I noted.

1. Metformin A lot of really smart people in the field of anti-aging and longevity research (Peter Attia, Dr Sinclair, Navdeep Chandel, Nir Barzilai; this is one of the few people who studied Metformin in the 80s before it ever went through trial) always bring it up in matters of anti aging. AMPK's role (pokes at mitochondrial complex 1, then ampk which then also inhibits MTor), maintaining blood glucose, changing of the gut microbiome; all of this makes it a very interesting drug.

Dr. Barzilai podcast with Peter Attia which came out a few weeks ago was brilliant on Metformin and IGF (one of the biggest takeaways being that IGF's effects on women for longevity were more antithetical compared men; females didn't get the same benefit of IGF, these were Dr Attia's thoughts as well. And we all know the inverse relationship between IGF and longevity so for women to sit even lower on that curve is rather interesting.

You're getting anti diabetic, anti inflammatory, anti-cancer effects from one drug. Dr Sinclair talking about taking it himself when he's not diabetic tells you something; but I do have my own personal thoughts on the entire picture which for bodybuilders might be different.

2. Disposable Soma Theory of Aging. Kirkwood's theory on how tradeoff for a large organism (or one that develops faster) is death essentially, because the resources used for DNA repair in a smaller developing organisms are allocated more towards growth and reproduction leading to a shorter overall lifespan. Notice how bodybuilding fits into this. We turn EVERYTHING up to it's fullest potential in hopes of accruing muscle mass. MTOR, IGF, Insulin Levels, Oxidation; everything to do with cellular aging sits in the realm of muscle growth.

While no long term study is available or even viable to study aging in bodybuilders, it's safe to say that DNA damage and the rate of repair can't possibly be kept up to par in a bodybuilder's body.

3. I DO NOT want to look like these guys. A lot of these guys who have spent their lives studying these topics (people have NO idea how complex metabolism is) are absolutely brilliant; you're talking a lifetime of commitment to something that might change the way human beings progress biologically.

But they aren't bodybuilders. And I don't want to be a meat allergic guy who runs 2x a week on a treadmill steadily, and does some circuit work with bands on the weekend (I know, I'm generalizing). So our lifestyle is obviously going to differ from the things that are the primary focus of people trying to live the longest. But I think mitigating risks, understanding risk factors, introducing elements that will help slow the process of aging (both cellularly, and chronic diseases that kill us) can help us be as big and healthy for as long as physiologically possible.

Just my thoughts on this stuff; which I personally believe is such a fascinating topic

Great post and lots of good insight here. I want to add to the part about DNA damage. Olive Leaf has been shown to significantly reduce that (along with reduce BP and oxidized LDL).

https://examine.com/supplements/olive-leaf-extract/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15333722

"An increase in glutathione peroxidase (9.8%) and HDL levels (7.7%) were observed alongside reductions in MDA (biomarker of lipid peroxidation) and 8-oxo-dG in DNA (biomarker of DNA oxidation; 49.2-51.67% reduction) and LDL oxidation (−25.2%) "

aphextwin · Jan 31, 2019

Stewie said:
Or just buy a combination of piperine with resveratrol.

Stewie,

Do you believe there's any additional benefits to taking resv if one if already using Pterostibene?

aphextwin · Jan 31, 2019

I thought it was funny that Rogan had never heard of Metformin

nozeryder · Jan 31, 2019

Great podcast and lots of good info on this thread. Love learning about this topic.

"hit'em where they ain't"

Knight9 · Jan 31, 2019

https://podcastnotes.org/2019/01/30/sinclair/

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

Zarati · Jan 31, 2019

Has anyone reversed insulin sensitivity with metformin?

Knight9 · Jan 31, 2019

Zarati said:
Has anyone reversed insulin sensitivity with metformin?

You mean improved insulin sensitivity and corrected insulin resistance? Plenty have.

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LK3 · Jan 31, 2019

aphextwin said:
Stewie,

Do you believe there's any additional benefits to taking resv if one if already using Pterostibene?

if you tried sterile res and are interested in this sort of thing i would strongly recommend trying ptero.

ptero is much more user friendly aka pain free and its a nice smooth admin.

i havent used ptero in a number of years, i keep meaning to revisit it but have been unable. when i first tried it i pushed the dose fast and hard and ended up with really strange side effects. like cns over stimulation.

at low/moderate dose it was almost like i had increased conectivity with cns/mind/muscle sort of thing. hard to explain but as if i could feel muscle conractions harder, quite intense.

as i raised the dose this became counterproductive to the point of overexcitation and making me weaker, like gassed from warm up sets but feeling like i did a massive workout. resulted in injury. this dose wass quite high 700-1000mg wk.

res in the 300-500wk range is doable if one can handle the admins.

the first times i used res it made me genuinely sick. lol
i could only do admin once a week and only in delts, there were very sore and very swollen until the next admin.

a few hrs after admin i would get severe fever and chills, put on several layers of clothes and go to be, to wake up sweating perfusely hrs later. this lasted several months. after that i could go higher and not have ill effect.

the sides generally went away too.

occasionally side would come back though not to the degree as the initial trials. sides would include, fever/chills and visual distortions.

the combo of res and curc results in extreme improvements to cardio type performance. EXTREME

i began using res in i think 09 and basically stayed with it until...the past year or two.

curc similar time period.

i have never seen the results i speak of with any sort of oral version. the non oral versions are often not very user friendly especially at first. they do change as you stay with them, and i feel as though they do have long term effects.

the few that i know have stuck with the dosing/admin largely report similar results.

that said very few stick with it.

if, and its a BIG "IF" you can "stick" with it ( lol )
they really are quite interesting compounds that provide very real results.

the newer versions are bit more user friendly though you do need to be a little masocistic to live with it for the time necesary.