Friends please be careful...

[LATS]

I actually disagree with my previous statement, because the danger of tren or any other drug is in the dosage.

But most people like to abuse compounds until it becomes too counterproductive, tren is famous for being effective but too uncomfortable.

I don't understand what you mean by evidence, boards like this one are full of users reporting more or less serious problems associated with this drug.

Yes.. the poison is in the dosage.. I simply can't use tren.. even at low dose.. after a few weeks I just start to feel " off".. I know a few that can tolerate " ok" even at higher doses.. like stated in this post all gear has a tradeoff.. so pick your poison ..

 

[SouthernMuscle]

I actually disagree with my previous statement, because the danger of tren or any other drug is in the dosage.

But most people like to abuse compounds until it becomes too counterproductive, tren is famous for being effective but too uncomfortable.

I don't understand what you mean by evidence, boards like this one are full of users reporting more or less serious problems associated with this drug.

Do you consider unconfirmed/unverified reports from anonymous people on the internet “evidence”?

 

[Eguz22]

Well…. While I agree that Tren DEFINITELY has horrible Side effects for a large majority of people that use AAS. I am one of those that does hate to hear that Tren is only suitable for competitive bodybuilders. I don’t compete but I have tried Tren and the side effects on my mental health were too much (so I don’t use it anymore) . I will say though Who am I to tell the next man he shouldn’t take Tren unless he is a serious competitive bodybuilder ? What makes it more suitable for a guy who stands on a stage in a posing suit once or twice a year vs a guy who wants to look his best for summer time on the beach ? At the end of the day most of us know NONE of the compounds we take are good for us but we still use them right ?

I understand what you are saying but there is also an educational component about appropriate use for each individual, their circumstances and their goals.

The goal is to achieve the desired results at the lowest possible cost, both in health and money.

 

[JoeyDHB]

I almost died and have AKD and had rhabdomylosis in 2022 summer. I dont think I did tren for probably 8 months after. they also said i would be on dialysis and need to begin. I never did. my bloodwork came back great at the ER last week I was impressed and shocked. not on tren right now just hrt dose test and proviron and ai

let me save your kidneys
5g astragulus + 5g taurine +250mg tudca per day

I almost died and have AKD and had rhabdomylosis in 2022 summer. I dont think I did tren for probably 8 months after. they also said i would be on dialysis and need to begin. I never did. my bloodwork came back great at the ER last week I was impressed and shocked. not on tren right now just hrt dose test and proviron and ai

let me save your kidneys
5g astragulus + 5g taurine +250mg tudca per day

Thank you very much. I already have the
TUDCA, but not the others so I will add them.

 

[Eguz22]

Do you consider unconfirmed/unverified reports from anonymous people on the internet “evidence”?

In the absence of serious and controlled studies, this is all we have.

I repeat, the problem may not be tren, it is that people use high amounts of the compound or for a long time.

It's a bit like with DNP, luckily more and more people have adopted more sensible approaches thanks to the publications of Elvia and other users who don't do hell weeks anymore and still get great results.

If we saw that paradigm change in tren users we could see if the drug is useful or effective at lower and healthier doses.

 

[luki7788]

I honestly don't know what this whole fight is about...

No one is forcing or forbidding anyone to take trenbolone, whether in small or large doses - everyone has their own mind and makes choices in their lives and no one should moralize anyone or tell them what to do

 

[SouthernMuscle]

In the absence of serious and controlled studies, this is all we have.

Doesn’t mean it’s evidence. At all

I repeat, the problem may not be tren, it is that people use high amounts of the compound or for a long time.

It's a bit like with DNP, luckily more and more people have adopted more sensible approaches thanks to the publications of Elvia and other users who don't do hell weeks anymore and still get great results.

If we saw that paradigm change in tren users we could see if the drug is useful or effective at lower and healthier doses.

But hey thanks for trying to act like a grown up and responding lol

 

[JoeyDHB]

You have convinced me

I’ll be selling off my tren e then

Future fleezy thanks you

It’s just not Tren!!! Any steroids that raise the BP can cause kidney issues. High doses of test only cycles will do it

 

[JoeyDHB]

Can anyone recommend a good blood pressure device for at home use. I bought one from Costco but it’s reading so much different every time that I’m returning it thinking about getting one from Amazon that just goes on your wrist and you hold it towards your heart, just looking for something that’s accurate since this is important.

 

[Fleezy]

It’s just not Tren!!! Any steroids that raise the BP can cause kidney issues. High doses of test only cycles will do it

Blood pressure is the least of my concerns

Between my Lisinopril, amlodipine, cialis, beet root, and high doses of citrulline, I don’t really ever think about it

More concerned regarding cardiac and hepatic effects

 

[Type-IIx]

I actually disagree with my previous statement, because the danger of tren or any other drug is in the dosage.

But most people like to abuse compounds until it becomes too counterproductive, tren is famous for being effective but too uncomfortable.

I don't understand what you mean by evidence, boards like this one are full of users reporting more or less serious problems associated with this drug.

Your initial position is totally defensible, and I would even agree with your prior statement that the drug effect of trenbolone per se, rather than a dose effect, is largely controlling. I say this having used a low dose of 100 mg q.w. trenbolone enanthate and still experiencing potent night sweats, etc.

Sorry, by evidence I mean published data in the literature (authoritative evidence) that has been subjected to rigorous statistical & probabilistic methods in order to distinguish cause/effect from random chance (i.e., detect statistical significance). The problem with relying on anecdotes from boards like this one is that self-reports about negative side effects/intolerability are overrepresented because they come from those who felt compelled to complain, whereas those who experienced nothing significant in the way of negative side effects/good tolerability are underrepresented because they don't feel so compelled to report that everything went just fine for them. Basically, there is a sampling bias due to self-selection.

Disagreement is healthy bro. From my perspective, the risk is often worth the reward due to the remarkably efficacy of trenbolone. While it is particularly intolerable, this is not a universal experience; and its potency for increased muscle mass & decreased fat mass are legendary for a reason.

 

[Type-IIx]

Kinda unexpected the E7D administration of Test E (and Tren E as well).
Care to share the rationale underlying this approach? Did you want a higher serum concentration in certain days of the week (probably not, I guess you would have used base hormones without an ester)?
Thanks

Sure, the rationale is the half-life of enanthate. It's not necessary to pin it more than weekly, just look at the graph plotting release mg/d & the area-under-the-curve.

I've written before about frequent administration, and its resulting pharmacokinetics & reduced tolerability:

Frequent administration... does not cause any "smoothness" or stability, but rather results in more "spiking" meaning a greater # of "peaks" or Cmax # (Css # after 4 t1/2s) & therefore decreased Tmax (time to Cmax). A low Tmax is inherently related to side effects including erythrocytosis/polycythymia, and of course more frequent pinning is associated with greater swelling & pain at the injection site. It does however increase AUC of the free/bioactive fraction of administered AAS (fAUC), meaning more anabolism.

I have discussed this in depth with respect to daily administration of 50 mg q.d. i.m. acetate versus 350 mg enanthate q.w. (q.7.d.) here: [link]

Basically, I am trading-off anabolic potency (AUC as nmol h/L) for improved tolerability, including blood profile, pain/swelling at the injection site, and just a basic tiredness with pinning, it gets fucking old.

 

[Type-IIx]

the high Aromasin dosage stands out to me.
But i assume you had this dialed in via bloodwork?

Yes, and it's just a matter of practicality I use pharma exemestane & it's impracticable to split it into more than 1/2 tablet without irritation. I also don't have any fear (never rational) of AI, especially exemestane, I know its side effects.

 

[LATS]

Everyone's response is different.. I hate test over 300mg or 400mg.. my e2 skyrockets.. Ill take .5 of arimidex twice a week and get god awful joint pain even when e2 is in normal or slightly above range. . Numerous studies show the pain is not due to only estrogen reduction but mineral absorption hindrance.. so its hard tobtrain when you can barely raise your arms enough to brush your hair lol..

So what about deca or npp..? Love the results .. but its not worth my pecker issues..even at lower doses for joint relief it will eventually start a issue.. mast or proviron can help but what's the point.. I like my little Irishman more. .

Eq I have decent luck with but, like all gear, their is a study or two that shows kidney issues etc

Now I like primo and mast.. are they 100 percent safe ? Nope .. no such thing.. but after years and years of being on primo and mast alternating my kidneys are fine.. BUN 17.. CREATININE. 088.. GLOMERULAR FIL at 95.. lipids all decent except hdl which stays mid to late 30s.. so im not suffering much with those compounds..

It took decades but I've learned what I can tolerate and not tolerate.. too each their own..

But the key is knowing the dosage and the compound that is causing the issue... if lowering the dose doesn't remedy the issue then throwing other potions at it to make it " safer" isnt the idea thing to do.. toss it in the bin and use something else..

If you are one of those fortunate few that can use quite a bit and still be healthy and in range then so be it.. I envy you.. I wish I could. . Of course my diet is shit so what's the point

 

[Smokey3]

Probably a good idea for some bodybuilders to do a BP med like Losartan, a statin, and a med to keep your
A1C and FBG down if needed. This will cover aspects of metabolic syndrome, prophylactically and treatment.

I'm taking Losartan, Crestor and just added low dose Sema in lieu of the Metformin.

 

[aHarness]

Thank you very much. I already have the
TUDCA, but not the others so I will add them.

Are you ever gonna answer about the supplements or just ignore that

 

[SouthernMuscle]

Are you ever gonna answer about the supplements or just ignore that

He responded to me. No drugs just supplements

 

[qbkilla]

Surprised people now days view 700mg as a high dosage..I remember on the gh 15 forums lol...many were taking 1g, 1400mg, even 2100 or 3cc Ed. Looking back, insane. I think my last run was 200 prop 200 tren, if I run it again will probably be 20mg Ed or 140ew. Seems like with all the trt clinics popping up the trends are people using less AAS than the old days at least my observations on various forums.

 

[aHarness]

He responded to me. No drugs just supplements

Yeah, I asked what those supplments consisted of out if curiosity

 

[Smokey3]

I'm also experimenting with injectable Glutathione.