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johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Cycle help for newbie
Im thinking about this cycle as my first
500mg Equipose/week for 10 weeks
400mg test enth/week for 10 weeks
Naposims 35mg/day for 4 weeks
Is this to strong for a first cycle considering I am only 17?
Do you guys think I should run arimidex during the cycle or just have nolva ready incase I get gyno signs(Im not going to mind the bloat because I want to feel how its like to be huge and strong and bloated as fuck)?
Is ala and maby Liv-52 enough liver protection(and do I need to continue the liver protection supplements after I am done with the d-bol?)??
I realy like the sound of syntergine but I dont want to poke myself twice a day with that stuff, but If i have to I sure will,
Is there any reliable cheap blood presure equipment I can get?? Because of my age I cant go to a doc and check bp(I might wait until I turn 18 because of this, I realy would like to go to a doc and get myself checked during this cycle, but I think bp is the only thing I need to check because the chanses of fucking upp my kidneys or liver isnt big for a first timer, I drink very seldomly and dont touch any other drug).
And no unnecesary flames about my age plz, I have reseached this for like 8 months now and taken a educated decision.
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04-20-2002 05:47 PM
CRnkITuP71
Junior Member
Registered: Mar 2002
Location: SOUTH
Posts: 23
Not flaming u Bro, but if u are dead set on doing a cycle at your age, I would seriously stay away from any Test whatsoever. Do Deca, anavar, etc... to avoid fucking up your own Test production. At 17 you've still got ton's of T, not like us old timers(hehe), and a shit load of growing to do on your own. Build the foundation than build on it.
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04-20-2002 07:01 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
I se what you are saying. But I have not yet seen any evidence att all that its easier to fuck upp the endocrin(sp?) system when using steroids at a young age.
IMO thats only a blown upp myth.
If I do 10 weeks of deca only I assume that my test production will be almost completely stoped so adding testosterone wont do any more harm and result in better gain.
Is that a incorrect assumption??
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04-20-2002 07:51 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
bump
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04-21-2002 06:55 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
bump again.
come on realy need help with this, especialy about the home bp equipment.
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04-23-2002 05:30 PM
Mass Myth
Junior Member
Registered: Mar 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
dude no one is going to help ya, your too young, wait 3 more years.
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04-24-2002 11:27 AM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Mass myth no offense but many of the guys here started my age. I mainly ask on this board because I though it is a no bullshit board where you help everyone that has enough comon sense to research and is mature enough to ask resonable questions.
What I want to know the most is if there is any reliable(and not to awfully expensive) bp equipment that I can buy?
Someone must check their own bp at home???
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04-24-2002 08:11 PM
Tadger
Junior Member
Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by CRnkITuP71
Do Deca, anavar, etc... to avoid fucking up your own Test production.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm gonna have to disagree with ya there. Deca would be an even worse than test. Deca is arguably the most suppressive AAS to the HPTA that's out there. A number of studies have shown that even a single200mg injection can completely shut down the HPTA. The other bad thing is the metabolites of nandrolone can also bind to the AR but won't cause any gene expression/protein synthesis. These metabolites also have some affinity to the PR as well... causing all kinds of sexual sides as well as screwing with your mood quite a bit. The metabolites stay in your system for quite a while as well... that's why deca has such a huge detection time.
Anyway...
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At 17 you've still got ton's of T, not like us old timers(hehe), and a shit load of growing to do on your own. Build the foundation than build on it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I totally agree there. At your age you have more than enough test produced naturally. Hell, most kids your age will see some gyno just because natural test levels are so high... I know that I ended up with the sore nips a few times. Not to mention that your IGF, hGH and T3 levels are also way high. If you put in the time and training and eat properly (extremely important... most kids your age have a shitty ass diet and don't eat nearly enough)you'll see gains easily comparable to what the older guys will on a pretty hefty cycle. If you're not making some serious gains already... then you need to step back and take a serious look at your diet and training. Something is obviously wrong if you're not already growing like a weed.
All that aside... if you start the AAS at your age you'll risk prematurely closing the epiphysial growth plates, stunting your growth, vision problems, and since your HPTA is still developing you'll risk low test levels later in life making it that much harder to gain naturally. Your risk of hypercalcemia and kidney stones is also much higher as AAS will increase serum calcium levels which can lead to all kinds of other problems as well. There are many many risks or problems associated with AAS use at a young age... and most here will tell you that you should wait. Do you think all these guys are wrong? They've been the ones on the gear for years... and they're here to help. Do you think that they have any reason to lead you astray? Come on now... be realistic. Wait until you're 21 at least... 24 would be even better.
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04-24-2002 10:58 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you put in the time and training and eat properly (extremely important... most kids your age have a shitty ass diet and don't eat nearly enough)you'll see gains easily comparable to what the older guys will on a pretty hefty cycle. If you're not making some serious gains already... then you need to step back and take a serious look at your diet and training. Something is obviously wrong if you're not already growing like a weed.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am gaining like hell right now and I eat exactly what I need to. I can assure you that I know sufficient about nutrition to know what and when to eat and how much. I am also cursed with a VERY slow metabolism that forces me to go down to as little as 1800 kcal/day when Im cutting(on keto diet right now and eating clen)to lose weight and still i weight a bit over 190 pounds and when I started cutting I weighted 220.
I know how many kcal I need to gain, lose or hold my weight and I know how to cycle protein intake to get the most out of it.
My knowledge about nutrition is easily the best in the town I live in(its a small town ), but Im not saying that I know it all, Im just saying that I am pretty damn sure I know how to handel my diet to get the most out of it.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All that aside... if you start the AAS at your age you'll risk prematurely closing the epiphysial growth plates, stunting your growth
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I havent grown a bit since 8th grade so Im pretty sure I wont grow anymore lenght wise, and I like my current height, I wouldnt want to be any taller even if I could.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
vision problems
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats a new one, do you mean the possible vision problems that can arise from using clomid??
And do you have any proof or can you link me to any study that proves that this risk is higher for me then for a adult.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
and since your HPTA is still developing you'll risk low test levels later in life making it that much harder to gain naturally
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Once again prove it or link me to a study that proves it. I have never ever seen any kind of proff(sp?) of this, just peoples assumptions.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your risk of hypercalcemia and kidney stones is also much higher as AAS will increase serum calcium levels which can lead to all kinds of other problems as well
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Is this risk any greater for me then for a adult?? And if you say yes plz link me to a study or prove it.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are many many risks or problems associated with AAS use at a young age... and most here will tell you that you should wait. Do you think all these guys are wrong? They've been the ones on the gear for years... and they're here to help. Do you think that they have any reason to lead you astray? Come on now... be realistic. Wait until you're 21 at least... 24 would be even better.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All I know is that I have talked to many people that started when they where in their late teens, and none of them have had any problems from it if they handle it responsibly(but I have also heard the horror stories about late teens fucking themself upp when using aas without knowledge, but I have heard a equal if not greater amount of horror storis about adults fucking themself upp with aas).
I dont think they try to lead me astray but I do think that they advice me not to do it just to be on the safe side, because most people assume that it is more dangerous for a teen(and I aggre it is IF the teen doesnt know what he is doing or isnt mature enough for it), but I dont settle with asumptions , I want prof(sp?) and I am sure you would also want prof if you where in my shoes.
But I dont want to do this discusion again, I have done it on every board that I have posted on so far, and most people have aggred that its probably okay for a late teen to do steroids IF they know what they are doing.
The bottom line is that I want to get the best results possible from my hard work in the gym and I want to be the absoult best bodybuilder I can be. Starting now can give me the head start I need to win that simple. And I dont feel or think that it will risk my health any more then it would if I where to begin when I am 21 or 24 for that matter.
No dissrespect for you or any one else that try to convince me not to do roids, I know you are just loking out for me, but in this case I wont be convinced if I dont get to see hard undisputable evidence, and even then I might not be convinced because I have talked to and heard about to many people that have done it when 17-19 and still havent suffered any more sides then adults.
So does anyone know anything about my question on blood pressure equipment that I asked
That was the question I need answered the most and I dont think you should ignore that question because it will only help me in the end.
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04-25-2002 02:30 AM
Tadger
Junior Member
Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
You can buy cheap blood pressure monitoring stuff online. Just take a look around. I can't think of any sites off the top of my head, but it's not hard... believe me.
Anyway... if you want proof, then just head on over to you local university and do a few searches on medline or synergy. There's tons of stuff there. You may have to do some digging... but I'm not gonna just hand it to ya. If you want evidence... go look for it. Convince me that I'm wrong. Your first concern should be for your own health and safety... and you should have people trying to convince you that something is safe. Always assume that what you're putting into your body is gonna cause problems unless it can be proven unequivocally that it won't. You have heart... and determination. I can see that. Seems your priorities are a bit backwards though. You should be asking people to prove to you why it's safe... not why it isn't.
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04-25-2002 05:23 AM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Damn good point I have to say, never thought about it that way.
Unfortunaly there is no university for 300-400 kilometers away from where I live, but I continue to dig around anyway. I have several months before I will begin my first cycle and I am learning everything I can, hehe maby Il even change my mind
About the bp equipment, I have always heard that home bp equipment most usualy sux because they are to small to messure bp accuratly or something alone those line.
But il ask you guys if you think its any good if I find anyting promising.
thanks for the help.
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Cycle help for newbie
Im thinking about this cycle as my first
500mg Equipose/week for 10 weeks
400mg test enth/week for 10 weeks
Naposims 35mg/day for 4 weeks
Is this to strong for a first cycle considering I am only 17?
Do you guys think I should run arimidex during the cycle or just have nolva ready incase I get gyno signs(Im not going to mind the bloat because I want to feel how its like to be huge and strong and bloated as fuck)?
Is ala and maby Liv-52 enough liver protection(and do I need to continue the liver protection supplements after I am done with the d-bol?)??
I realy like the sound of syntergine but I dont want to poke myself twice a day with that stuff, but If i have to I sure will,
Is there any reliable cheap blood presure equipment I can get?? Because of my age I cant go to a doc and check bp(I might wait until I turn 18 because of this, I realy would like to go to a doc and get myself checked during this cycle, but I think bp is the only thing I need to check because the chanses of fucking upp my kidneys or liver isnt big for a first timer, I drink very seldomly and dont touch any other drug).
And no unnecesary flames about my age plz, I have reseached this for like 8 months now and taken a educated decision.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-20-2002 05:47 PM
CRnkITuP71
Junior Member
Registered: Mar 2002
Location: SOUTH
Posts: 23
Not flaming u Bro, but if u are dead set on doing a cycle at your age, I would seriously stay away from any Test whatsoever. Do Deca, anavar, etc... to avoid fucking up your own Test production. At 17 you've still got ton's of T, not like us old timers(hehe), and a shit load of growing to do on your own. Build the foundation than build on it.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-20-2002 07:01 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
I se what you are saying. But I have not yet seen any evidence att all that its easier to fuck upp the endocrin(sp?) system when using steroids at a young age.
IMO thats only a blown upp myth.
If I do 10 weeks of deca only I assume that my test production will be almost completely stoped so adding testosterone wont do any more harm and result in better gain.
Is that a incorrect assumption??
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-20-2002 07:51 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
bump
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-21-2002 06:55 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
bump again.
come on realy need help with this, especialy about the home bp equipment.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-23-2002 05:30 PM
Mass Myth
Junior Member
Registered: Mar 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
dude no one is going to help ya, your too young, wait 3 more years.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-24-2002 11:27 AM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Mass myth no offense but many of the guys here started my age. I mainly ask on this board because I though it is a no bullshit board where you help everyone that has enough comon sense to research and is mature enough to ask resonable questions.
What I want to know the most is if there is any reliable(and not to awfully expensive) bp equipment that I can buy?
Someone must check their own bp at home???
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-24-2002 08:11 PM
Tadger
Junior Member
Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by CRnkITuP71
Do Deca, anavar, etc... to avoid fucking up your own Test production.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm gonna have to disagree with ya there. Deca would be an even worse than test. Deca is arguably the most suppressive AAS to the HPTA that's out there. A number of studies have shown that even a single200mg injection can completely shut down the HPTA. The other bad thing is the metabolites of nandrolone can also bind to the AR but won't cause any gene expression/protein synthesis. These metabolites also have some affinity to the PR as well... causing all kinds of sexual sides as well as screwing with your mood quite a bit. The metabolites stay in your system for quite a while as well... that's why deca has such a huge detection time.
Anyway...
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At 17 you've still got ton's of T, not like us old timers(hehe), and a shit load of growing to do on your own. Build the foundation than build on it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I totally agree there. At your age you have more than enough test produced naturally. Hell, most kids your age will see some gyno just because natural test levels are so high... I know that I ended up with the sore nips a few times. Not to mention that your IGF, hGH and T3 levels are also way high. If you put in the time and training and eat properly (extremely important... most kids your age have a shitty ass diet and don't eat nearly enough)you'll see gains easily comparable to what the older guys will on a pretty hefty cycle. If you're not making some serious gains already... then you need to step back and take a serious look at your diet and training. Something is obviously wrong if you're not already growing like a weed.
All that aside... if you start the AAS at your age you'll risk prematurely closing the epiphysial growth plates, stunting your growth, vision problems, and since your HPTA is still developing you'll risk low test levels later in life making it that much harder to gain naturally. Your risk of hypercalcemia and kidney stones is also much higher as AAS will increase serum calcium levels which can lead to all kinds of other problems as well. There are many many risks or problems associated with AAS use at a young age... and most here will tell you that you should wait. Do you think all these guys are wrong? They've been the ones on the gear for years... and they're here to help. Do you think that they have any reason to lead you astray? Come on now... be realistic. Wait until you're 21 at least... 24 would be even better.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-24-2002 10:58 PM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you put in the time and training and eat properly (extremely important... most kids your age have a shitty ass diet and don't eat nearly enough)you'll see gains easily comparable to what the older guys will on a pretty hefty cycle. If you're not making some serious gains already... then you need to step back and take a serious look at your diet and training. Something is obviously wrong if you're not already growing like a weed.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am gaining like hell right now and I eat exactly what I need to. I can assure you that I know sufficient about nutrition to know what and when to eat and how much. I am also cursed with a VERY slow metabolism that forces me to go down to as little as 1800 kcal/day when Im cutting(on keto diet right now and eating clen)to lose weight and still i weight a bit over 190 pounds and when I started cutting I weighted 220.
I know how many kcal I need to gain, lose or hold my weight and I know how to cycle protein intake to get the most out of it.
My knowledge about nutrition is easily the best in the town I live in(its a small town ), but Im not saying that I know it all, Im just saying that I am pretty damn sure I know how to handel my diet to get the most out of it.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All that aside... if you start the AAS at your age you'll risk prematurely closing the epiphysial growth plates, stunting your growth
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I havent grown a bit since 8th grade so Im pretty sure I wont grow anymore lenght wise, and I like my current height, I wouldnt want to be any taller even if I could.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
vision problems
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats a new one, do you mean the possible vision problems that can arise from using clomid??
And do you have any proof or can you link me to any study that proves that this risk is higher for me then for a adult.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
and since your HPTA is still developing you'll risk low test levels later in life making it that much harder to gain naturally
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Once again prove it or link me to a study that proves it. I have never ever seen any kind of proff(sp?) of this, just peoples assumptions.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your risk of hypercalcemia and kidney stones is also much higher as AAS will increase serum calcium levels which can lead to all kinds of other problems as well
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Is this risk any greater for me then for a adult?? And if you say yes plz link me to a study or prove it.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are many many risks or problems associated with AAS use at a young age... and most here will tell you that you should wait. Do you think all these guys are wrong? They've been the ones on the gear for years... and they're here to help. Do you think that they have any reason to lead you astray? Come on now... be realistic. Wait until you're 21 at least... 24 would be even better.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All I know is that I have talked to many people that started when they where in their late teens, and none of them have had any problems from it if they handle it responsibly(but I have also heard the horror stories about late teens fucking themself upp when using aas without knowledge, but I have heard a equal if not greater amount of horror storis about adults fucking themself upp with aas).
I dont think they try to lead me astray but I do think that they advice me not to do it just to be on the safe side, because most people assume that it is more dangerous for a teen(and I aggre it is IF the teen doesnt know what he is doing or isnt mature enough for it), but I dont settle with asumptions , I want prof(sp?) and I am sure you would also want prof if you where in my shoes.
But I dont want to do this discusion again, I have done it on every board that I have posted on so far, and most people have aggred that its probably okay for a late teen to do steroids IF they know what they are doing.
The bottom line is that I want to get the best results possible from my hard work in the gym and I want to be the absoult best bodybuilder I can be. Starting now can give me the head start I need to win that simple. And I dont feel or think that it will risk my health any more then it would if I where to begin when I am 21 or 24 for that matter.
No dissrespect for you or any one else that try to convince me not to do roids, I know you are just loking out for me, but in this case I wont be convinced if I dont get to see hard undisputable evidence, and even then I might not be convinced because I have talked to and heard about to many people that have done it when 17-19 and still havent suffered any more sides then adults.
So does anyone know anything about my question on blood pressure equipment that I asked
That was the question I need answered the most and I dont think you should ignore that question because it will only help me in the end.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-25-2002 02:30 AM
Tadger
Junior Member
Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 7
You can buy cheap blood pressure monitoring stuff online. Just take a look around. I can't think of any sites off the top of my head, but it's not hard... believe me.
Anyway... if you want proof, then just head on over to you local university and do a few searches on medline or synergy. There's tons of stuff there. You may have to do some digging... but I'm not gonna just hand it to ya. If you want evidence... go look for it. Convince me that I'm wrong. Your first concern should be for your own health and safety... and you should have people trying to convince you that something is safe. Always assume that what you're putting into your body is gonna cause problems unless it can be proven unequivocally that it won't. You have heart... and determination. I can see that. Seems your priorities are a bit backwards though. You should be asking people to prove to you why it's safe... not why it isn't.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
04-25-2002 05:23 AM
johan
Member
Registered: Jan 2002
Location:
Posts: 77
Damn good point I have to say, never thought about it that way.
Unfortunaly there is no university for 300-400 kilometers away from where I live, but I continue to dig around anyway. I have several months before I will begin my first cycle and I am learning everything I can, hehe maby Il even change my mind
About the bp equipment, I have always heard that home bp equipment most usualy sux because they are to small to messure bp accuratly or something alone those line.
But il ask you guys if you think its any good if I find anyting promising.
thanks for the help.
