Long Time Juicer...decided its time to take a full year off...

[bigtasty25]

Well..since my last show 3.5 yrs ago i got overzealous with my training and steroid use since i was high off winning the overall at that show...my time off was more like 500mgs of different substances (test/deca). I was just off recently for 3 months...1 month being off my total test was only 33...after the 3 months, with hcg/hmg, and PP's TRS track, im thinking it came more back to normal although im not 100% sure cuz right after 12 weeks i jumped back on...
Im 28 and have been doing juice on n off for 8 yrs now..longest brake 3 months...

Anywhoo...ive been on 1 month now and have gotten really mediocre, to nada results from the juice im on...and i know its good...endosyn test, infar sust from sandra...these are top notch sources and i know they have the best stuff out there...so i think it might just be time for a break...i feel like im anemic now and im tired all the time, with possible adrenal fatigue syndrome... even on the juice while dieting..it's like my bodys telling me to "STOPP what youre doing...or im going to really make you life hell" it's like gods telling me it's time for a nice long break...

Anywhoo i plan on coming off once the test enanth clears out in 2 weeks..my question is..should i wait...prob 2-3 months until my normal test comes back to normal be4 i start dieting naturally? When i say naturally..i plan on taking 6-8iu's of red tops wit 25mcgs t3...with possibly EPO..im going to research this stuff rigorously since i know it can be just as deadly as insulin.

Any thoughts? Input? Coming off for a year was a really hard decision to make..but my health and my future career, family, relationships... mean alot more to me than just getting slightly bigger muscles after tons and tons of effort...

 

[HUMALOG]

you used the term "naturally" then proceeded to list 3 compounds you will be using. why does the song "runnin with the devil" from van halen pop into my head.



then................


you go on and state how important your health, family, and career are to you. maybe go back and reread your own post cause your talking in circles and contradicting yourself.

 

[Thick1]

I do sense the addictive mind playing here if you are going to go clean then make it clean, no HGH, no T-3 and no EPO.

Ala Naturale aka clean is NO DRUGS.

You can do it, watch your diet, train hard and get your rest.

 

[Chipper Jones78]

you used the term "naturally" then proceeded to list 3 compounds you will be using. why does the song "runnin with the devil" from van halen pop into my head.



then................


you go on and state how important your health, family, and career are to you. maybe go back and reread your own post cause your talking in circles and contradicting yourself.

What he said.

 

[maldorf]

I agree with all of the above posters. Why the hell are you wanting to take EPO? Are you just tempting fate here? Mess with that and youll end up like me with a heart attack or stroke. If you are indeed anemic then you need to get help from a medical doctor, probably a hematologist, and not self medicate with EPO. That stuff can be deadly.
You are starting to get a whole host of health problems yet still insist on taking substances such as GH and epo. Keep it up and we will see another one of those sad posts on here about how you have passed on.

 

[MrCyp]

Is epo really that dangerous? I know guys that take 1000iu ED for 20days then take 6months off and repeat. They are all athletes.

 

[Steel4u]

Bro take your break and do it totally natural. Eat right, keep training, and doing cardio. Stay away from all substances for awhile. That time will go by fast and you will come back better than ever. You are still a young man. Take care of your health first. Go natural bro.

 

[Obnoxious123]

just go natural for a while until you are in good health. don't cure your problems from being off with other drugs.

 

[617ricky]

Any thoughts? Input?

That was already covered in your other thread when it was recommended that you stop the drugs immediately and go see a doctor.. The fact you're mentioning how you wanna sell all this juice, and go buy a bunch of other shit, which will be for "dieting natural" is just ridiculous.. After you being on shit nonstop for years, the drugs have become a real addiction it seems - you gotta face that and realize you're probably gonna need some help.

 

[dabeast75]

Go clean

Hey bro, please just read your own post again since therein lies your answer. Your body is telling you to stop. So stop. You dont need us to tell you that. You been on for a long time and your body needs to recover. Dont push your luck. A smart man knows when enough is enough.

Just train naturally. And for what its worth, I bet you will still be huge after a year of being clean.

Best of luck.

 

[MrCyp]

Its gonna be more unhealthy for you to stay natural if your test is low, which more than likely is permanently low due to 8yrs of aas. You need bloodwork to see if you recover. If not just stick to hrt. around 150mg/test wk and a few iu's of GH. thats far healthier than being natural imo.

 

[LATS]

i have to agree with mrcyp.. have bloodwork done to see what your test levels are at.. then take proper action.. but if test levels are in the toilet it is not healthy to just let them "cruise" and hope it adjusts..

 

[machola]

if your test is low, which more than likely is permanently low due to 8yrs of aas.

i disagree. i think most people can recover normal levels if they wait long enough.

i posted a study here a while ago showing HPTA recovery times after a long suppression.
here's a copy of the post:

**broken link removed**

Individual variation of hormonal recovery after cessation of luteinizing hormone-releasing hormone agonist therapy in men receiving long-term medical castration for prostate cancer

Author:
Kobayashi T, Nishizawa K and Mitsumori K.

10 August 2006

The main purpose of intermittent or interrupted androgen deprivation therapy in patients with prostate cancer is temporal androgen recovery in order to delay the hormone independence of tumour cells and to improve the patient’s quality of life. However, it has been reported that in some patients who have received long-term LHRHa therapy, serum testosterone does not recover.

This study (n=10) investigated the discontinuation of long-term LHRHa (goserelin or leuprorelin) therapy (median 39 months – 30 – 56 months), on serum testosterone, luteinizing hormone (LH), follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH) and PSA. Measurements were taken before cessation of therapy and then every 4 weeks until the total testosterone level recovered to >50 ng/dl.



Scand J of Urol and Nephrol 2006; 40: 198 – 203.

The main purpose of intermittent or interrupted androgen deprivation therapy in patients with prostate cancer is temporal androgen recovery in order to delay the hormone independence of tumour cells and to improve the patient’s quality of life. However, it has been reported that in some patients who have received long-term LHRHa therapy, serum testosterone does not recover.

This study (n=10) investigated the discontinuation of long-term LHRHa (goserelin or leuprorelin) therapy (median 39 months – 30 – 56 months), on serum testosterone, luteinizing hormone (LH), follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH) and PSA. Measurements were taken before cessation of therapy and then every 4 weeks until the total testosterone level recovered to >50 ng/dl.

All patients showed recovery of serum testosterone to >50 ng/ml within 26 – 327 days (median 98 days) after LHRHa cessation. LH recovery to >1.1 mIU/ml was observed within 26 – 98 days (median 53 days) and the interval between LH and testosterone recovery in each patient ranged from 0 – 274 days (median 32.5 days). FSH recovery to >10 mIU/ml paralleled the LH recovery. An increase in PSA to twice the baseline value was observed in 9 patients within 26 – 288 days (median 90 days). The total testosterone level at which the PSA increase occurred was < 20 ng/dl in one patient, 20 – 50 ng/dl in two and >50ng/dl in four. In all nine patients, with increased PSA, the PSA level returned to baseline after the resumption of LHRHa therapy.

The variable recovery of LH and FSH following long-term LHRHa therapy suggests that this results from disuse of the gonadotrophin producing cells of the pituitary gland which for individual patients require varying times to recover. Similarly the variable recovery of testosterone strongly suggests that the testicular Leydig cells require time to recover and this again varies from patient to patient. The results also identify that the variation in time from LH and FSH recovery to testosterone recovery, greatly affects the interval between cessation of LHRHa and testosterone recovery. Non-parallel recovery of PSA and testosterone add a further degree of variability to this confusing situation.

Whilst recognising that this study involved only a small number of patients the authors identify that the results suggest that the time of androgen exposure during LHRHa off-therapy period is likely to be highly variable and much shorter than expected. In fact in some patients there may only be a very small amount of androgen exposure. The authors suggest that if intermittent therapy is used to delay the acquirement of androgen independence by temporal androgen exposure, it is important that recovery of testosterone as well as PSA should be used to determine the period of “off-therapy”.

i understand this isn't a perfect study, in that they used LHRHa to suppress LH/FSH and not AS but the overall effect(suppression) is similar. here's something interesting: LH and FSH recover quickly but testosterone takes longer to recover. even after the hypothalamus/pituitary recover it takes a while for the testes to produce testosterone normally. i think this is why people who use hCG have easier recoveries. because when you take hCG the testes never shutdown. only the hypothalamus/pituitary shutdown and they recover quickly.

 

[bigtasty25]

Its gonna be more unhealthy for you to stay natural if your test is low, which more than likely is permanently low due to 8yrs of aas. You need bloodwork to see if you recover. If not just stick to hrt. around 150mg/test wk and a few iu's of GH. thats far healthier than being natural imo.

Hmm I may have to end up doing that...if it doesnt come back within 3 months ill probably just use trt 150mg/week from the doc...i think ill stay away from the epo though and just stick with the growth only...i have a tendency to gain weight easily so i think itd be to my advantage...coming off the juice though is the main thing i need to do i think...i might need to see a psychologist in the coming months to talk to her about it...im sure it'll probably affect my mind after awhile..

Im still waiting on bloodwork i got done the other day so ill let you all know how it comes out...

 

[thethe]

Hmm I may have to end up doing that...if it doesnt come back within 3 months ill probably just use trt 150mg/week from the doc...i think ill stay away from the epo though and just stick with the growth only...i have a tendency to gain weight easily so i think itd be to my advantage...coming off the juice though is the main thing i need to do i think...i might need to see a psychologist in the coming months to talk to her about it...im sure it'll probably affect my mind after awhile..

Im still waiting on bloodwork i got done the other day so ill let you all know how it comes out...

You will be fine. And if i were you i would take more then 3 months to see if thigs come back fully. Really its not that big of a deal. suck it up and take your PCT stuff. Hell I did it a long time ago with nothing and within 3 months i was getting good pumps and everything was working fine. Dont let your mind beat you!

 

[dabeast75]

...i might need to see a psychologist in the coming months to talk to her about it...im sure it'll probably affect my mind after awhile..

dont mean to hijack this thread, but do all the stuff you said but dont see a freakin shrink. Yes it is popular these days to see one and even better to "have one" lol But everybody i know who has been to a shrink said it was a waste of time. Plus shrinks are everywhere these days from pre-school all the way through to college (they are even members of church boards, go figure that one out) and I dont see society any better today than it was 50 years ago. More the contrary. Just my honest opinion. Peace bro.

 

[phatkid77]

well, i was clean for 3 or 4 yrs, and i either

A. had low test levels to begin with, or

B. didnt recover, as im on HRT now...started at 30yr, was 27 when i found out low

phats

 

[VNV]

Plain and simple, you're an addict. Specifically, a drug addict. That may sound harsh but it's true, and what everyone is trying to tell you may be the case (and in fact is the case) even if they're not saying it.

If you can't be clean from gear completely, you should start seeing a Narcotics Anonymous group or similar. You likely need professional treatment.

 

[MrCyp]

You will be fine. And if i were you i would take more then 3 months to see if thigs come back fully. Really its not that big of a deal. suck it up and take your PCT stuff. Hell I did it a long time ago with nothing and within 3 months i was getting good pumps and everything was working fine. Dont let your mind beat you!

Agreed, its gonna take longer than 6months. If you truely wanna deal with recovery you may have to end up waiting 6mon to a year. I know I could have probably recovered but there was no way I was gonna wait 6mo+ and lose all my gains just to recover natty test when I can take one shot per week which i'd end up having to do in another 10yrs anyway.

 

[mule]

Plain and simple, you're an addict. Specifically, a drug addict. That may sound harsh but it's true, and what everyone is trying to tell you may be the case (and in fact is the case) even if they're not saying it.

If you can't be clean from gear completely, you should start seeing a Narcotics Anonymous group or similar. You likely need professional treatment.

from seeing bigtasty around the board for 10 years what your saying is true, people have tried giving him sound advice for as long as i can remember ,the guy will not listen to reason ever