Need over-training advice on cycle

[driven]

Hello, I am a newbie to this forum and am very excited to become a part of the community. Let me first give you some stats:

35
5’7”
195 lbs
13% body fat (based on measurements given at **broken link removed** - I got this site from a discussion on alinboard)

Currently I am on the 6th week of my second cycle:
Test Cyp: 500mg/wk
Anavar: 40mg/day

Additionally I am taking liv.52 and have Clomid and Nolva lined up for PCT.

Starting a week back, I started to feel overtrained and have finally decided to take at least 5 days off lifting. For example, today on incline bench, the weights felt very heavy even during my warm up and I was only able to rep 285 lbs twice – whereas last week I was able to do this 4 times.
I have spent quite some time looking at many of the overtraining discussions on this board and I haven’t been able to answer these two questions:

1. Should I continue taking anavar regularly at the original dose or should I reduce or discontinue while I am not training? My gut tells me to stay on since I would be introducing a negative hormonal shift.

2. Is there any training I can do during my time off (e.g., calves, forearms, abs, cardio) or will that further impair my CNS recovery?

Any knowledgeable advice will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,
-driven

 

[tenny]

so why do you think your overtraining????

i dont get what your trying to say

lots of other factors involved

and 2 reps down on any givin movement is peanuts
and means nothing at all

your questions are pretty meaningless
if your on cycle.....your on cycle, why would you stop???
and
how do you know your CNS is fried???

 

[driven]

so why do you think your overtraining????

i dont get what your trying to say

lots of other factors involved

and 2 reps down on any givin movement is peanuts
and means nothing at all

your questions are pretty meaningless
if your on cycle.....your on cycle, why would you stop???
and
how do you know your CNS is fried???

Thank you for the quick response tenny. All good points. I have been training for about 16 years and though I am not that familiar with cycles, I have become quite familiar with my body's response to over training. Usually a series of bad workouts with reduced strength and endurance, coupled with significant fatigue and some partial tendon/joint pain signals to me that I need to step away for a while and let my body recover.

I see your point about being on cycle - that was my gut feeling too.

Again, thank you for responding!

 

[Quad-smack]

What is your sleep schedule like?
Most underestimate the value of sleep in the recuperation process...

 

[driven]

What is your sleep schedule like?
Most underestimate the value of sleep in the recuperation process...

I sleep between 8-9 hrs a night and sometimes get an hour nap in during the day.

 

[mgnz]

I know if I don't get enough sleep or eat enough protein/calories my workouts suffer the following days. Could be part psychological too....knowing that I haven't slept enough and eaten enough tends to make me think I'm gonna have a shi**y workout.

 

[PsyT]

give us diet (macros) and training routine. Sounds like you got recovery down from quadsmack's inquiry.

You could probably increase your protein though since you're on about 3/4 of a gram of AAS a week! This drastically increases your body's ability to synthesize protein. You're souping up your engine but not feeding it gas!

 

[driven]

I know if I don't get enough sleep or eat enough protein/calories my workouts suffer the following days. Could be part psychological too....knowing that I haven't slept enough and eaten enough tends to make me think I'm gonna have a shi**y workout.

give us diet (macros) and training routine. Sounds like you got recovery down from quadsmack's inquiry.

You could probably increase your protein though since you're on about 3/4 of a gram of AAS a week! This drastically increases your body's ability to synthesize protein. You're souping up your engine but not feeding it gas!

Taking the average from my livestrong.com account for the past week: I eat 2,800 calories per day. Approx 260 gms protein per day. My macro breakdown is 32:28:40. The 40 in fats is primarily from raw walnuts, pecans and almonds. I also consume about 20-30 gms of EAAs/BCAAs per day.

My training is as follows:
Day 1: chest: bb incline, incline pec flys, pullovers, bb decline
Day 2: back: deadlifts, bent-over rows, one arm rows, close grip t-bar, close grip pull downs
Day 3: shoulders: behind the head military press, anterior/side/posterior raises, shrugs
Day 4: biceps: bb curls, hammer curls
Day 5: triceps: close grip bench, skull crushers
Day 6: legs: squats, leg extensions, leg curls
Day 7: rest

That's the ideal setting; however, I push some things out, for example, if I DL and am fatigued, I will either put off the rest of my back workout till the evening or the next day.

Also, I will add a rest day in there if I feel it's necessary - which I do every week.

 

[tenny]

your training 6 days in a row???!!!

how long are your smaller muscle group workouts????

ex. bis and tris???

i would suggest training bis with back
and tris with delts and see what happens

chest
back bis
off
delts tris
off
legs
off
repeat

or any other variation that suits you

 

[driven]

your training 6 days in a row???!!!

how long are your smaller muscle group workouts????

ex. bis and tris???

i would suggest training bis with back
and tris with delts and see what happens

chest
back bis
off
delts tris
off
legs
off
repeat

or any other variation that suits you

tenny, I guess I wasn't very clear, I don't workout 6 days in a row, I take a day off in the middle (sometimes between back and shoulders, sometimes between shoulders and arms, etc). It's just not set in stone which day because I have a heavy DL week and a "maintenance" week.

I use to work my arms the same day as the corresponding larger muscle group, but I found that my arms couldn't lift as heavy that day; but more importantly, I found that my arms developed far better when I gave them their own day - especially because I am doing close grip bench for tris which puts some pressure on my anterior delts as well as tris - which I am blowing doing military presses (tris) and anterior raises.

Also, putting arms between my shoulder and leg days gave my core a great deal of rest allowing to maximize my squat potential.

I don't know though - I'm intrigued by your recommendation.

 

[driven]

how long are your smaller muscle group workouts????

ex. bis and tris???

My arm workouts are very quick - no more than 9 or 10 sets - most warm ups to lube up the joints and bring blood into the muscle.

I'm usually out in 45 mins.

 

[tenny]

well i constantly changing mine

this week was

mon. off
tues. chest bis
weds. legs
thrus. off
fri. delts tris
sat. off
sun. back

last week was

mon. chest, delts
tues. arms bis, tris
wed. off
thurs. legs....best ever
fri. off
sat. off
sun. back, bis

 

[driven]

well i constantly changing mine

this week was

mon. off
tues. chest bis
weds. legs
thrus. off
fri. delts tris
sat. off
sun. back

last week was

mon. chest, delts
tues. arms bis, tris
wed. off
thurs. legs....best ever
fri. off
sat. off
sun. back, bis

How do you decide? Do you look at a muscle group and think, "I want to bring that up."? I'd really like to work on my delts at the start of the week, but I fear it would cash me out for everything else.

btw, congrats on your leg day! You look excellent

 

[tenny]

well my schedual decides for me....haha

and i train very very instinctively

 

[driven]

tenny, since I'm over-trained, do you think I could get away with doing elliptical, stairs or something else while I'm sitting out of the weight room?

It seems a waste to be on cycle and do nothing for 5 days.

Also, what are your thoughts on my protein intake? Does that seem enough or should I turn it up a notch?

I really appreciate your advice

 

[tenny]

well around 260 is good

i go more towards 360
but 260 is fine

as far as staying out of the gym
if thats your whole idea, then
STAY OUT!!!

its not gonna kill you

but i will say 5 days is a bit extreme
when 2 or 3 would do just fine

 

[PsyT]

I feel great on 300-350g pro a day and 100g fat and I am far from being a big guy around here. The carbs are consumed by instinct to keep muscles full and fat gain minimal/none. I would try to up your fats. Good sources - EV coconut oil, EV olive oil, primrose oil, grass fed beef/dairy.

I also only train three days in 6 days.

Like this:
day1: back/bi's
day2: legs/abs
day3: off
day4: chest/shoulders
day5: off
day6: off

repeat.


short story:
I would say you are training too many days and not eating enough calories for growth.

 

[driven]

I feel great on 300-350g pro a day and 100g fat and I am far from being a big guy around here. The carbs are consumed by instinct to keep muscles full and fat gain minimal/none. I would try to up your fats. Good sources - EV coconut oil, EV olive oil, primrose oil, grass fed beef/dairy.

PsyT, I average about 155g of fat per day (mostly from walnuts, pecans and almonds) - I'm not sure about upping that -- it's already 150% of what you're intaking!

well around 260 is good

i go more towards 360
but 260 is fine

as far as staying out of the gym
if thats your whole idea, then
STAY OUT!!!

its not gonna kill you

but i will say 5 days is a bit extreme
when 2 or 3 would do just fine

I will see after 2 days how I feel - I'm getting cabin fever sitting around! Also, I am going to up the protein to 300g - I'd rather slightly overshoot it than come up short.

 

[Replicator]

Taking the average from my livestrong.com account for the past week: I eat 2,800 calories per day. Approx 260 gms protein per day. My macro breakdown is 32:28:40. The 40 in fats is primarily from raw walnuts, pecans and almonds. I also consume about 20-30 gms of EAAs/BCAAs per day.

My training is as follows:
Day 1: chest: bb incline, incline pec flys, pullovers, bb decline
Day 2: back: deadlifts, bent-over rows, one arm rows, close grip t-bar, close grip pull downs
Day 3: shoulders: behind the head military press, anterior/side/posterior raises, shrugs
Day 4: biceps: bb curls, hammer curls
Day 5: triceps: close grip bench, skull crushers
Day 6: legs: squats, leg extensions, leg curls
Day 7: rest

That's the ideal setting; however, I push some things out, for example, if I DL and am fatigued, I will either put off the rest of my back workout till the evening or the next day.

Also, I will add a rest day in there if I feel it's necessary - which I do every week.

Rest is every bit as important as the training ...build a routine around 3-4 days a week no longer that an hour and give yourself time to recover or you will get nowhere.
After 16 years of training you would think you would have worked this one out by now LOL
REP

 

[driven]

Rest is every bit as important as the training ...build a routine around 3-4 days a week no longer that an hour and give yourself time to recover or you will get nowhere.
After 16 years of training you would think you would have worked this one out by now LOL
REP

Maybe,.. I use to be a long distance runner and covered 12 miles per day - every day for about 5 years in my mid to late 20s.

I might be wrong, but everyone's recovery rate is different - mine allowed me to train more frequently and continue to experience significant gains both as a runner and now in bodybuilding.

You recommended I build a routine around 4 days a week -- I have one that's 5 days a week -- which seems in line with my body's more rapid rate of recovory -- I'm confused Replicator.. what should I have "worked out"??