When Lean Bulking, Do you feel you must consume dirty meals just to grow?

[Ocean cool]

Bulking can be a challenging task. Especially when one is aiming for quality mass. Not fat nor bloat.

Do you feel it is necessary to incorporate dirty meals just to grow? For example, 4k from purely clean calories VS 4k from a mixture of 70% clean, 30% dirty.

Although, both are the same total calorie. But do you find one works better than the other?

Share your experiences so we could all learn from PM.

 

[little slice]

I think that most people eat more than they need.



I certainly did.. my metabolism is nowhere near as fast as I thought it was.



having said that, I feel that most people should be able to gain size by eating clean..



I feel that eating junk food is for the lazy (sure, there are some outliers, but they are outliers).

 

[sammy555]

If you can eat 4000 clean do it. If appitite is shit you may need to improvise. Chocolate milk is a good easy top up for me and a few boiled eggs between meals can help. I compleatly agree with little slice though. Most over eat then lose muscle dieting of. My appitite been shit this blast but I've grown great and leaned up a lot doing it. Some days have probably been as low as 3000 calories and 200g protein. Strenght gone up just as fast recomping as full on bulking and look much better

 

[Kevinhy]

Not necessary at all, but I've found keeping some empty calories in the diet makes the transition to Prep easier. I eat around 4k cals offseason, and it's very easy for me to get that all from clean sources. But by keeping 500 or so calories from empty sources (like fruit juice, carb powders, etc) I can eliminate those first when I start prep and it kicks things into gear quicker. I don't lose any of my food volume and the diet feels identical to offseason, but it starts the pace for a solid precontest phase.

 

[FutureFreak7]

A lot of people have different perspectives on "clean meals"

Me being from South Texas backwoods country, eating a meal like brisket, baked beans, green beans, scalloped cheese taters and cornbread would still be considered clean in my house.

Some people consider fast food as the not clean food.

Some consider chicken, rice, mixed veggies clean.. This I consider get super shredded type meal..

Me personally, I cannot get big eating just clean, I simply can't, my genetics are too be shredded naturally because of my metabolism. Others are the exact opposite. My friend garret, if he ate pizza hed freak out and actually notice the bloated fat gains. He's a super clean water and I believe it's held him back..

Honestly I believe there's a time and place for it all but you have to choose what time and place you wanna be in.. I spent an entire year FORCING, TRYING to deliberately get FAT! Result-- I got big as fuck.. Gained some fat, but 3months later lost a lot of fat and had gained about 30-40lbs of muscle.. It's all how your body responds and all what your willing to be okay with. If your okay with losing your abs for awhile I think you can make some big gains in a shorter period of time, if you don't want to ever get above 11-12% bf you can make slow steady gains but it will take longer, the latter isn't as hard. I just had a friend I was helping completely stop everything cause he couldn't take eating all the food I had him eating. He couldn't function. He gained 23lbs in 4weeks on food alone and his bf% went up about 1-2%... He could have went from 200-240 in 3months then gone down to 227-230 10-12%bf ... He couldn't handle what I had him do and it made him miserable. So now he's doing it slow and steady... This is an example, getting huge quick isn't always good cause you can be miserable the entire time and who wants that you know?

But find what clean foods you respond well too, find what dirty foods you respond well too and try to find a healthy balance that suits your goals. Don't go off eating Doritos chips an shit, that's a waste of chewing. If it's gonna be dirty, let that dirt have something that will stick to your ribs.


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[tweezor]

But find what clean foods you respond well too, find what dirty foods you respond well too and try to find a healthy balance that suits your goals. Don't go off eating Doritos chips an shit, that's a waste of chewing. If it's gonna be dirty, let that dirt have something that will stick to your ribs.

I really agree with that one and think its key, you can actually respond well to "dirty" food, there is dirty food that sits better in my stomach then clean which is the reason probably 10% of my diet would be considered "dirty"

 

[mytreefiddy]

For me being the stick that I am.... yes

 

[sammy555]

Not necessary at all, but I've found keeping some empty calories in the diet makes the transition to Prep easier. I eat around 4k cals offseason, and it's very easy for me to get that all from clean sources. But by keeping 500 or so calories from empty sources (like fruit juice, carb powders, etc) I can eliminate those first when I start prep and it kicks things into gear quicker. I don't lose any of my food volume and the diet feels identical to offseason, but it starts the pace for a solid precontest phase.

This is so true. I drop my chocolate milk i lose 1000 calories straight away. Add in a lille clen and cardio when I stall and I'll get damn lean while still almost force feeding.

A lot of people have different perspectives on "clean meals"

Me being from South Texas backwoods country, eating a meal like brisket, baked beans, green beans, scalloped cheese taters and cornbread would still be considered clean in my house.

Some people consider fast food as the not clean food.

Some consider chicken, rice, mixed veggies clean.. This I consider get super shredded type meal..

Me personally, I cannot get big eating just clean, I simply can't, my genetics are too be shredded naturally because of my metabolism. Others are the exact opposite. My friend garret, if he ate pizza hed freak out and actually notice the bloated fat gains. He's a super clean water and I believe it's held him back..

Honestly I believe there's a time and place for it all but you have to choose what time and place you wanna be in.. I spent an entire year FORCING, TRYING to deliberately get FAT! Result-- I got big as fuck.. Gained some fat, but 3months later lost a lot of fat and had gained about 30-40lbs of muscle.. It's all how your body responds and all what your willing to be okay with. If your okay with losing your abs for awhile I think you can make some big gains in a shorter period of time, if you don't want to ever get above 11-12% bf you can make slow steady gains but it will take longer, the latter isn't as hard. I just had a friend I was helping completely stop everything cause he couldn't take eating all the food I had him eating. He couldn't function. He gained 23lbs in 4weeks on food alone and his bf% went up about 1-2%... He could have went from 200-240 in 3months then gone down to 227-230 10-12%bf ... He couldn't handle what I had him do and it made him miserable. So now he's doing it slow and steady... This is an example, getting huge quick isn't always good cause you can be miserable the entire time and who wants that you know?

But find what clean foods you respond well too, find what dirty foods you respond well too and try to find a healthy balance that suits your goals. Don't go off eating Doritos chips an shit, that's a waste of chewing. If it's gonna be dirty, let that dirt have something that will stick to your ribs.


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This is a good a point to. I often pick up a "health living " egg and salad sandwich if im in the supermarket or have tin of rice pudding for carbs. Yea its bread and there's sugar in the rice pudding but it's not greasy fast food or dounuts and shit either. Sort of middle ground. I have a lot of backed potatoes and chicken breast and tuna too though so a lot of clean stuff aswell. I Just don't feel guilty about a few sandwiches or bit of rice pudding either though. At the moment I'm eatung too the point of almost feeling sick, holding bodyweight and getting stronger and leaner with this approach. No cardio, just sex at weekends. Also add yoy say, if it's gonna be dirty make it count. A double whopper with cheese i think is something like 800 calories and 6g protein. Doritos all I see is empty bullshit calories and as you say a waste of chewing and stomach space

 

[Ocean cool]

Thank guys. i've been reading that some guys have been increasing their calories 5-700 above their maintenance from clean food and don't grow.

but when they increase 5-700 from a dirty meal (i.e. ice cream, cookies,cakes, fried chicken), they start to grow.

Makes me wonder, do they grow fat?

 

[ljp]

Thank guys. i've been reading that some guys have been increasing their calories 5-700 above their maintenance from clean food and don't grow.

but when they increase 5-700 from a dirty meal (i.e. ice cream, cookies,cakes, fried chicken), they start to grow.

Makes me wonder, do they grow fat?

They probably start to gain weight because they underestimate the calories in those "dirty" meals.

I don't think you would gain more fat from those dirty (for me this means processed shit) meals if the calories are same.

 

[sammy555]

Thank guys. i've been reading that some guys have been increasing their calories 5-700 above their maintenance from clean food and don't grow.

but when they increase 5-700 from a dirty meal (i.e. ice cream, cookies,cakes, fried chicken), they start to grow.

Makes me wonder, do they grow fat?

Probably increasing cals more than they think or just increased bloating. Mabey incresed insulin out v put from the higher gi carbs. Id Rather Eat Clean and Use Slin though if that's the case

 

[nothuman]

NO! You never HAVE TO eat dirty to grow. It's just an excuse not to add high calorie whey/oat/nut butter shakes, which is an easy way to consume tons of calories. Not wise to raise your blood pressure when you can avoid it.

 

[FutureFreak7]

NO! You never HAVE TO eat dirty to grow. It's just an excuse not to add high calorie whey/oat/nut butter shakes, which is an easy way to consume tons of calories. Not wise to raise your blood pressure when you can avoid it.

That is a good shake for extra calories shit drink that with a banana and some activia


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[ZOFO1973]

NO! You never HAVE TO eat dirty to grow. It's just an excuse not to add high calorie whey/oat/nut butter shakes, which is an easy way to consume tons of calories. Not wise to raise your blood pressure when you can avoid it.

X2. Eating clean with the right "supplements" is all one should need. Why take in empty crappy cals? BP, cholesterol and a hose of other helth issues to consider. Time those carbs, maybe add some slin and GH. Cant grow off that?
One or two cheats a week is fine for sanity purposes, IMO; anymore than that is an excuse for gluttony.

 

[NattyNuts]

1 Cheat meal every two weeks is all i need

 

[Allday]

Think it depends on the person and their metabolism/appetite. I've never had an issue with appetite and have a slower metabolism so I can easily get in all the calories I need with clean food.

Best success I've had was lifting on a 4 day a week schedule and consuming 4200-4500 cals on those days (250-300 protein, 600-700 carbs, and 50-65 fat) and 3 off days doing cardio and core work eating around 3k (250 pro, 350 carb, 50 fat). Keep my metabolism and appetite running nicely for the days I was lifting.

But I have a close friend who I do his diet for. He's a natty and has really good muscle bellies and a blazing metabolism to go along with a poor appetite. He struggles to get above 3500 cals. He gets in all the protein he needs, so he fits in skittles around his workout, ice cream at night and adds in a poptart to a meal or two, just to get the cals higher.

It wouldn't work for me, and I'd never need the junk to hit my calories (will lower my fats and carbs from other meals if I eat junk during the day), but some people need it.

 

[concreteguy]

I'm at 6000 calories a day and not gaining any scale weight. I have been at this for over a month. Zero changes. We are know trying a dirty cheat meal after every training session.
Everyone is a different case and diet.


CG

 

[ifbbpro_npr]

I eat 5 clean meals and one junk meal a day. Now when I say junk it's usually 3 cookies at night. I competed at 190 in August and I'm 234 now. I don't think you can stay super lean and make improvements.

 

[concreteguy]

I eat 5 clean meals and one junk meal a day. Now when I say junk it's usually 3 cookies at night. I competed at 190 in August and I'm 234 now. I don't think you can stay super lean and make improvements.

I have read over and over that being lean your body metabolizes nutrient much better. I'm currently around 7%. Could you explain why you feel the need to put on so much fat? Not an attack friend. Just interested in your point of view.

CG

 

[ljp]

Personally I enjoy eating bodybuilding foods with a couple of cheat meals per week, but for some people this is just too restrictive. If your mind needs a break from clean foods and you're happy with your health and bodyfat levels then why not just eat what you want? They don't give trophies for clean eating...