How does this routine look?

[Jake LaMotta]

I asked my good buddy muscle96ss what he thinks of this routine but I wanted to see what you guys think as well:

Mon.

1. Seated cable rows 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
2. One arm rear delt dumbbell rows (as seen here: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/DeltoidPosterior/DBRearDeltRow.html )12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
3. Close grip lat pulldowns 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
4. Wide grip lat pulldowns to the front 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
5. Rear dumbbell lateral raises (as seen here: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/DeltoidPosterior/DBRearLateralRaise.html ) 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
6. Lying dumbbell external rotations 3x12 (keep the same weight each set)
7. Seated dumbbell curls 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)

Tues.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Day 2 Weds.

1. Squats 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
2. Leg extensions 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
3. Lying leg curls 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
4. Standing calve raises 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
5. Ab crunch machine 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
6. 4 way neck machine 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)

Thurs.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Day 3 Fri.

1. Flat dumbbell bench press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
2. Incline dumbbell bench press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
3. Seated overhead dumbbell press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
4. Seated dumbbell lateral raises 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
5. Tricep pushdowns 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
6. Seated dumbbell shrugs (with straps when needed) 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set) (Can also be done on Day 1)
7. Lying dumbbell external rotations 3x12 (keep the same weight each set)

Sat.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Sun.

OFF

A few questions:

1. How does this routine look? How do the exercises, sets, and reps look?

2. For variety can I sometimes switch it up and do upright external rotations using a shoulder horn (as seen here: **broken link removed** ) instead of lying dumbbell external rotations? Are upright external rotations good for working the infraspinatus and teres minor?

3. Should I add hammer curls and dumbbell front raises to the mix or are they not necessary?

 

[shawnkarbabacz]

I would add a true back mass builder, like deads or bent BB rows personally.

How long have you been at it? That is gonna have alot to do with peoples responses i think...

 

[Bio]

Well for back I would start out with wide grip pull ups...They've always been a staple exercise for me.

 

[GrowingPains]

i think you would be better off if you did this for back.

1. Bent over rows.
2. pullups medium to wide grip over or underhand. i like to mix it up randomly.
3. dumbell rows or throw in ONE of the exercises you mentioned.

 

[SacToSD]

I always do 4 sets. Arnold talks about this in his encyclopedia of modern bodybuilding... you really need 4 sets, in my opinion. Especially for squats.

 

[concreteguy]

wouldn't do crunshes ESPECIALLY on a machine for abs. just need to do leg raise type movements. maybe some planks.

neck moves are pointless or maybe not a good idea? i think its un-needed. my neck has grown an inch for nearly every inch my arms have grown. i NEVER work out my neck. just get BIG and your neck and things like forearms usually get big with the rest of ya. IMO and experience

i don't think the shrugs are necassary either. but they might make a difference. seems my traps just grow with my back/neck on its own.
.

Wow steele, just goes to show how differant we all are. If I didnt do shrugs and the neck machine there would be alot less of me.

 

[concreteguy]

yes, everyone is SO different.
my neck is 19 inches at my biggest offseason. never work out my neck.
my forearms ar a pretty good size too and i don't train them at all.
my calves are bigger than my arms and i rarely train them at all as well.

basic heavy moves seems to make me grow all over. -STEELE

Good for you steele! Man it just seams like I gotta work for everything I can get. Your avatar looks great dude. What ever your doing is obviously working well.

 

[NovaZ]

Your routine is weak.

Too much fluff and not enough of the primary compound movements (Deadlifts, heavy rows).

From what Im assuming your level/experience seems to be, Id recommend something like a Bill Starr's 5x5 or Wendlers 5/3/1. Keeping it simple with the heavy, important moves.

 

[pesty4077]

I asked my good buddy muscle96ss what he thinks of this routine but I wanted to see what you guys think as well:

Mon.

1. Seated cable rows 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
2. One arm rear delt dumbbell rows (as seen here: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/DeltoidPosterior/DBRearDeltRow.html )12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
3. Close grip lat pulldowns 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
4. Wide grip lat pulldowns to the front 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
5. Rear dumbbell lateral raises (as seen here: http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/DeltoidPosterior/DBRearLateralRaise.html ) 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
6. Lying dumbbell external rotations 3x12 (keep the same weight each set)
7. Seated dumbbell curls 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)

Tues.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Day 2 Weds.

1. Squats 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
2. Leg extensions 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
3. Lying leg curls 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
4. Standing calve raises 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
5. Ab crunch machine 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
6. 4 way neck machine 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)

Thurs.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Day 3 Fri.

1. Flat dumbbell bench press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
2. Incline dumbbell bench press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
3. Seated overhead dumbbell press 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
4. Seated dumbbell lateral raises 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set)
5. Tricep pushdowns 12,10,8 (usually add 10 lbs. every set)
6. Seated dumbbell shrugs (with straps when needed) 12,10,8 (usually add 5 lbs. every set) (Can also be done on Day 1)
7. Lying dumbbell external rotations 3x12 (keep the same weight each set)

Sat.

30 minutes of cardio including: Walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline, than run for 20 minutes at 7.5 mph on a 0 incline, than walk for 5 minutes at 3.5 mph on a 0 incline

Sun.

OFF

A few questions:

1. How does this routine look? How do the exercises, sets, and reps look?

2. For variety can I sometimes switch it up and do upright external rotations using a shoulder horn (as seen here: **broken link removed** ) instead of lying dumbbell external rotations? Are upright external rotations good for working the infraspinatus and teres minor?

3. Should I add hammer curls and dumbbell front raises to the mix or are they not necessary?

Jack, It looks like a solid routine, however, without knowing your goals, stats, maybe seeing some pictures, years of training, what training has been working for you, it is hard to say, if that is for you specifically.

 

[SacToSD]

whats so magic about "4"
if Arnold said it then it must be true?
i think training has evolved just a little bit since then.
all depends on your training program i suppose.
i am of the opinion 1 set is better than 4 sets if you go ALL OUT on that 1 set. -STEELE

:;leeping- Anyways, this is what Arnold says in his book:
1. You need to do at least 4 sets in order to have the volume of training necessary to fully stimulate all the available muscle fiber.
2. Doing 12-20 sets per body part allows you to do a sufficient variety of exercises to work all areas of a body part -- upper and lower back, for example, the outside sweep of the lats, and the inner back.
3. The experience of five decades of bodybuilders has proved that the maximum amount of weight that you can handle that allows you to just make it through 4 sets of an exercise will stimulate the muscles and make them grow.

Personally, I used to do 3 sets, and it didn't do a lot for me. I wouldn't want to see this guy make the same mistake.

 

[NovaZ]

:;leeping- Anyways, this is what Arnold says in his book:
1. You need to do at least 4 sets in order to have the volume of training necessary to fully stimulate all the available muscle fiber.
2. Doing 12-20 sets per body part allows you to do a sufficient variety of exercises to work all areas of a body part -- upper and lower back, for example, the outside sweep of the lats, and the inner back.
3. The experience of five decades of bodybuilders has proved that the maximum amount of weight that you can handle that allows you to just make it through 4 sets of an exercise will stimulate the muscles and make them grow.

Personally, I used to do 3 sets, and it didn't do a lot for me. I wouldn't want to see this guy make the same mistake.

If your two posts are serious (and I go back and forth on whether you are trying to be funny/sarcastic in this thread), you probably shouldnt be giving the average person advice on how to lift.

 

[SacToSD]

If your two posts are serious (and I go back and forth on whether you are trying to be funny/sarcastic in this thread), you probably shouldnt be giving the average person advice on how to lift.

What makes you an authority on the subject? I'm talking about legitimate, published info and discussing what has and hasn't worked for me. Do you have a problem with that?

 

[VTliftVT]

What makes you an authority on the subject? I'm talking about legitimate, published info and discussing what has and hasn't worked for me. Do you have a problem with that?

If it's just your opinion then I would state: IMO....[insert bs here]

where as you wrote "You really need 4 sets, especially in squats." Which is really funny bc until DC training I was like you and followed a 4 set style of lifting with things and never made any great strides in growth...just a little here and little there. Then I started DC training (heavy set of 6 followed by a 20 rep widow) and my squat went from 315 to 500+ for 6 reps and my legs have never grown faster.

regardless, stating a certain range for optimal growth is IMPOSSIBLE as everyone is different and it sickens me to see it on here everyday. those that are truly successful in this sport are those that can grow doing any workout (ie bboy for ex stated he grows on every routine he's done) but also those that have figured out what to do for them to grow the most effectively and efficiently. I assure you that none of these guys said oh ok...Sac said to do 4 sets so ill do 4 sets forever and ill grow the best on those for sets compared to 3 sets compared to 2 sets or drop sets, or RP sets etc.

 

[NovaZ]

What makes you an authority on the subject? I'm talking about legitimate, published info and discussing what has and hasn't worked for me. Do you have a problem with that?

Authority?

The only specific advice I gave in this thread was that you shouldnt be giving advice if you are advocating what you have been in this thread.

Well said, VTLiftVT.

 

[BigJB]

Well...

:;leeping- Anyways, this is what Arnold says in his book:
1. You need to do at least 4 sets in order to have the volume of training necessary to fully stimulate all the available muscle fiber.
2. Doing 12-20 sets per body part allows you to do a sufficient variety of exercises to work all areas of a body part -- upper and lower back, for example, the outside sweep of the lats, and the inner back.
3. The experience of five decades of bodybuilders has proved that the maximum amount of weight that you can handle that allows you to just make it through 4 sets of an exercise will stimulate the muscles and make them grow.

Personally, I used to do 3 sets, and it didn't do a lot for me. I wouldn't want to see this guy make the same mistake.

I personally train DC style and couldnt see doing more than 2 -3 warm ups and one all out work set. It takes everything ive got to get through one slag heavy workset. It just seems if it takes a person 4 work sets to feel worked they arent fully focused on the task at hand. Arnolds advice, while advanced at the time, is obsolete now. And you must not forget that he had "elite" genetics, he did about what he wanted and his diet wasnt very clean and he still dominated. The last thing I want anyone to do is overtrain or think they have to do a pre determined number of sets to reach "full fiber activation." ITS ALL ABOUT INTENSITY AND GIVING IT EVERYTHING YOU HAVE! Not how many sets and reps you get up.

 

[pesty4077]

I personally train DC style and couldnt see doing more than 2 -3 warm ups and one all out work set. It takes everything ive got to get through one slag heavy workset. It just seems if it takes a person 4 work sets to feel worked they arent fully focused on the task at hand. Arnolds advice, while advanced at the time, is obsolete now. And you must not forget that he had "elite" genetics, he did about what he wanted and his diet wasnt very clean and he still dominated. The last thing I want anyone to do is overtrain or think they have to do a pre determined number of sets to reach "full fiber activation." ITS ALL ABOUT INTENSITY AND GIVING IT EVERYTHING YOU HAVE! Not how many sets and reps you get up.

Well, if you are older, you would want to do more sets for warming up that muscle. Since muscles are in 3D, I like doing 3 different exercices, 2 warm ups, 2 work sets, When getting lean I do more. By the way, Arnold wasn't the only one growing off that routine, Alot of old school BB's were and some new BB's still are. One routine doesn't work for everybody. Intensity is nice if done in a smart manner.

 

[Pericles]

Well, if you are older, you would want to do more sets for warming up that muscle. Since muscles are in 3D, I like doing 3 different exercices, 2 warm ups, 2 work sets, When getting lean I do more. By the way, Arnold wasn't the only one growing off that routine, Alot of old school BB's were and some new BB's still are. One routine doesn't work for everybody. Intensity is nice if done in a smart manner.

so what is your split?

 

[pesty4077]

so what is your split?

5 on 2 off, M-chest, abs, T-shoulders, W-back, traps, abs TH-legs, calves, F-arms, abs. SA, SU off. Cardio 4 times a week.

 

[BigJB]

....

Well, if you are older, you would want to do more sets for warming up that muscle. Since muscles are in 3D, I like doing 3 different exercices, 2 warm ups, 2 work sets, When getting lean I do more. By the way, Arnold wasn't the only one growing off that routine, Alot of old school BB's were and some new BB's still are. One routine doesn't work for everybody. Intensity is nice if done in a smart manner.

I'm not trying to say DC is the best for everyone, as its known as an advanced technique However, the emphasis on NOT overtraining is the point im trying to make. I.M.O. its best to minimize sets and maximize muscular work by Heavy weight and compound exercises. But again thats just me offering my .02 cents. Dont want an argument.

 

[pesty4077]

I'm not trying to say DC is the best for everyone, as its known as an advanced technique However, the emphasis on NOT overtraining is the point im trying to make. I.M.O. its best to minimize sets and maximize muscular work by Heavy weight and compound exercises. But again thats just me offering my .02 cents. Dont want an argument.

No, don't take me wrong, I think that DC works, I heard alot of good things about it and I am planning after my show to try it, or a variation. IMO, There is alot of routines that work, as long as you have the rest and proper nutrition. Being self employed, I can rest a little more than the average guy, or take a day off for recuperation and I don't do physical or manuel work. All these come into factor when overtraining. The guys I use to train with ate 6000-8000 calories a day, to train like that. So, nothing is a cookie cuter routine, it all depends on your goals. I am sorry if I came off the wrong way.