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20 year post death discussion remembering Dan Duchaine

alfresco

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I have posted some of his before . . .

Dan was a very interesting contributor. I thing I read about everything
we wrote strong views, a kind of iconoclastic person. He was into
recumbent biking if memory serves me. He may have tried much on
himself but he had not have physique to show for it from the pictures
I remember seeing. He may have published a steroid book that was very
popular, perhaps the only one at theme.

I remember following all this 'infighting Kneller and Arnold (one went to jail
also contributed regularly. on the old usenet rec.fitness.weights which was
before Google. I never posted, it was way over my head as as most the
postings here.

Again, Dan was very entertaining, as where a lot of them. And then there was
Robert Schuh (RIP . . . https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/drum-and-drummer-6431057
very knowledgeable but a real shit disturber but who I used to email. He really
thought Deca should be part of hrt the last time I wrote him.

He got out of bodybuilding, a fine physique, but he developed lots of medical
problems which many blamed on steroids (which he adamantly said no to)
but returned to another of his passion which was drumming. He was very
very good.

Hopefully some of the older members can chime in here who remember this special
time in history.
 

KillerStack

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I DO WISH ULTIMATE ORANGE WAS STILL AROUND . THAT STUFF WORKED TASTED LIKE SHIT BUT IT WORKED. I WOULD LOVE TO REFORMULATE IT FORGET WHAT THE GOVERNMENT SAYS ABOUT THIS OR THAT IN IT IS BAD. I MEAN COME ON CIGGARETTES ALCOHOL IS A MILLION TIMES WORSE. WHERE THERE IS A WILL THERE IS A WAY.

If it was just ephedra then what was so special about it? Just take ephedra or ephedrine. The active never disappeared so what was lost? Sure, people are often partial to whatever first experience they had with a certain compound so they are nostalgic.
I often wonder why people prefer all these PWOs over ephedrine, IMO no PWO has beat plain old ephedrine. Only prescription stims are "better". I bet Mike Arnold's stims are quite nice since I have experience with some of the compounds but these are not OTC products really.
 

Elvia1023

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If it was just ephedra then what was so special about it? Just take ephedra or ephedrine. The active never disappeared so what was lost? Sure, people are often partial to whatever first experience they had with a certain compound so they are nostalgic.
I often wonder why people prefer all these PWOs over ephedrine, IMO no PWO has beat plain old ephedrine. Only prescription stims are "better". I bet Mike Arnold's stims are quite nice since I have experience with some of the compounds but these are not OTC products really.

It was before my time so I can't comment how effective it was but I 100% agree with your post. Nostalgia hits hard when many guys go on about when they used certain drugs early on. It's the same with steroids and stimulants. With both the effects decrease over time but even more so with steroids when you weigh 50 pounds more and have used them for many years. Stimulants will always hit hard after a long break no matter how many times they are used over the years. Although nothing will ever be that first time you used something and the proceeding weeks. I could say the same about the adrol's, dbol's and preworkouts I used years ago. Although stimulant preworkouts have definitely generally worsened because of all the banning of the strongest ingredients. You can still get the ingredients on the black market and there are some companies that have put out crazy preworkouts in recent years which would rival any of the old ones. Ephedrine will hit a newbie very hard but I was never much of a fan of it. I even tried some pharm grade amps from an Hungarian pharmacy last year and I didn't think they were anything special. The probably would of blew my head off if I had taken them at 23 when I was super sensitive to stimulants.
 

KillerStack

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It was before my time so I can't comment how effective it was but I 100% agree with your post. Nostalgia hits hard when many guys go on about when they used certain drugs early on. It's the same with steroids and stimulants. With both the effects decrease over time but even more so with steroids when you weigh 50 pounds more and have used them for many years. Stimulants will always hit hard after a long break no matter how many times they are used over the years. Although nothing will ever be that first time you used something and the proceeding weeks. I could say the same about the adrol's, dbol's and preworkouts I used years ago. Although stimulant preworkouts have definitely generally worsened because of all the banning of the strongest ingredients. You can still get the ingredients on the black market and there are some companies that have put out crazy preworkouts in recent years which would rival any of the old ones. Ephedrine will hit a newbie very hard but I was never much of a fan of it. I even tried some pharm grade amps from an Hungarian pharmacy last year and I didn't think they were anything special. The probably would of blew my head off if I had taken them at 23 when I was super sensitive to stimulants.

I don't know if it's strange or that unusual but ephedrine never stopped working for me. I think a sort of reverse tolerance to stims has been described here and there. I used ephedrine for 15 years almost daily and my dosages got lower over time. The easy availability of good ephedrine stopped here so now I haven't used it for many years. I always loved it, better than DMAA and whatever was in the original Craze etc.
Are there any specific stims you think are really good, what black market ingredients are you thinking of?
 

USMuscle9403

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I don't know if it's strange or that unusual but ephedrine never stopped working for me. I think a sort of reverse tolerance to stims has been described here and there. I used ephedrine for 15 years almost daily and my dosages got lower over time. The easy availability of good ephedrine stopped here so now I haven't used it for many years. I always loved it, better than DMAA and whatever was in the original Craze etc.
Are there any specific stims you think are really good, what black market ingredients are you thinking of?

The appetite suppressant and stimulant effects wear off quickly for me, which is why I just prefer to not use it or use it very short periods, but studies are now showing that the metabolic effects don't decrease over time, even with extended use.
 

USMuscle9403

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Would be awesome to hear more stories, love it.

Totally dumb question, but...did Dan ever take anything himself? Or did he just test his theories and experiment with guys (giggity)?
 

USMuscle9403

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Here's another one from about a year ago, Palumbo, Aceto and Romano

Interesting that they say Dan was a proponent of fasting. Would love to hear those protocols

 

xpoc

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That Underground Steroid Handbook was out WAY before the internet. Back in the mid-late 80's there were Xerox copies of that thing floating around my gym. It was the holy grail for wanna be meatheads. Nobody ever knew who the author was until years later. I never took anabolics, but I did take Ultimate Orange and YES that shxt was the real deal. I don't know if it was because it was the first real preworkout, but in my mind it was still the best I ever used. Perhaps if it were around today it would be just another PWO, but at the time that stuff was absolutely mandatory for anyone serious about training.
 

hawkmoon

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I still have a copy of USHII somewhere in a box in my mother's basement :p
 

Elvia1023

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I don't know if it's strange or that unusual but ephedrine never stopped working for me. I think a sort of reverse tolerance to stims has been described here and there. I used ephedrine for 15 years almost daily and my dosages got lower over time. The easy availability of good ephedrine stopped here so now I haven't used it for many years. I always loved it, better than DMAA and whatever was in the original Craze etc.
Are there any specific stims you think are really good, what black market ingredients are you thinking of?

If you're not counting psychostimulants it's more a combination of things but there have been a few good ones such as amp citrate, kigelia africana, hordenine, synephrine and the various forms of caffeine. I haven't actually used ephedrine that much so I will give it another go sometime this year. I was never really a fan of DMMA either but as you know that is fantastic for most people into stimulants. Have you tried Excelsior yet?
 

Dens228

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If you're not counting psychostimulants it's more a combination of things but there have been a few good ones such as amp citrate, kigelia africana, hordenine, synephrine and the various forms of caffeine. I haven't actually used ephedrine that much so I will give it another go sometime this year. I was never really a fan of DMMA either but as you know that is fantastic for most people into stimulants. Have you tried Excelsior yet?
Real ephedrine kicks ass. The ephedrine/caffeine/aspirin stack peeled fat off of me with little effort.
Fucking meth heads fucked that up...........lol
 

xpoc

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Back in the 80s I just a kid in the gym trying to emulate the Road Warriors pro rasslin tag team. Little did I know I was surrounded by steroid gurus of the time. One guy, Curt Wenzlaff used to train at a gym I worked at in Fountain Valley. He was a regular dude, but would do crazy stuff in the gym like bench press with 2x45 plates on one side of the bar and 1x45 on the other. 25 years later I read a book about steroids and baseball and learned he was behind the McGwire/Canseco bash brother era
OTL: Curt Wenzlaff, a convicted steroids dealer, says Mark McGwire's steroid combination was meant to build power (espn.com)

Then in another gym in the same area, there was a nutty professor type guy who hung out there. He looked like the professor in Back to the Future. No muscle, messy hair, wore jeans and button down shirts to the gym and never seemed to workout. But he turned out to be a huge roid chemist who got busted by the Feds. I think he even later was a writer for Flex or one of the big magazines. Jeff Feliciano was his name. He used to profess 100 rep sets and would duct tape guys hands to the bar so they would not let go. Rumor was, he would hit them with a cattle prod if they quit. I never saw that...but he was in the same crowd with Wenzlaff
Body-Building Guru Sits Under Cloud of Steroid Inquiry - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)

Duchane was not an OC guy, but he was talked about in the same breath with these guys. Like I said, his UG Steroid Handbook was the Holy Grail back then. These guys today have no idea how hard it was to get info back then.
 

MR. BMJ

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Ultimate Orange was legendary and very good....but pricey at the time! If I wasn't a broke teenager at the time )High School and Junior College), i'd have kept buying it, but I instead bought the old Mini-Thins Ephedrine HCL from the gas stations, which were WAY cheaper, along with Walmart generic caffeine tabs. You have to remember too that while you could order off the internet back during this time (90's), most people still drove over to their local supplement store(s), who would have varying prices on it.
 

lookslikesausage

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I used Ultimate Orange when i was in high school. good product and worked as advertised. After high school i got very into Ephedrine for a few years and would not train without it. Sometimes 1 or 2am workouts, with plenty of help from Ephedrine. After that I tried an excellent supplement called Hyde. They got into trouble and had to change the formulation and i don't know if it was as good as the original, but man was that stuff potent.
 

Dens228

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Ultimate Orange was legendary and very good....but pricey at the time! If I wasn't a broke teenager at the time )High School and Junior College), i'd have kept buying it, but I instead bought the old Mini-Thins Ephedrine HCL from the gas stations, which were WAY cheaper, along with Walmart generic caffeine tabs. You have to remember too that while you could order off the internet back during this time (90's), most people still drove over to their local supplement store(s), who would have varying prices on it.
You could buy those bottles of 25 mg ephedrine for like $5-10! Lasted forever.......
 

Bandy0974

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Seems like he single handedly brought trent back on the scene by explaining how to use the cattle pellets to be purified of fillers and mixed with dmso. The trenbolone could be absorbed through the skin. That info kind of brought tren back to the mainstream in bodybuilding.
 

alfresco

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Would be awesome to hear more stories, love it.

Totally dumb question, but...did Dan ever take anything himself? Or did he just test his theories and experiment with guys (giggity)?

USM,

From what I recollect and from the way he looked, I don't think he was his own lab rat.
Or if he is did it was small doses but I don't remember him ever writing about it.
But now that I think about it, he may have in the past and then or slowly quickly realized
his potential was less than stellar. But this is going back some 20+(?) odd years.
He did not look like he worked out if that means anything. I don't recall him
mentioning any bodybuilders names. And how he came about all this information, I have
no clue. I don't recall him 'fighting' with anybody (harsh words) in a completely uncensored
forum. He seemed like a real nice guy. I used to log into Usenet every morning at work.
Good times. A lot of drug talk which I had and have about zero interest but it was still
good reading because of training info, the people and subjects. It was like this forum
except on steroids . . . . hahaha.

Maybe that forum is archived in the Wayback Machine?
 

alfresco

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I intended to refer to the Usenet archive, now www.

or
or

Can't believe they are not archived somewhere. Might take some sleuthing.
Too valuable, too much info.
 

goback2013

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That Underground Steroid Handbook was out WAY before the internet. Back in the mid-late 80's there were Xerox copies of that thing floating around my gym. It was the holy grail for wanna be meatheads. Nobody ever knew who the author was until years later. I never took anabolics, but I did take Ultimate Orange and YES that shxt was the real deal. I don't know if it was because it was the first real preworkout, but in my mind it was still the best I ever used. Perhaps if it were around today it would be just another PWO, but at the time that stuff was absolutely mandatory for anyone serious about training.
I was playing college basketball back then
I remember just making my own from ephedra pills, guarana caps, and white willow bark.
First time I tried this stack in practice I noticed endless energy and the ability to jump and run much faster. Everyone commented on my improved play and much leaner physique.
This was the start of my journey into PEDs
I remember going into Mexico to pick up boxes of halo for my pro am games at Balboa Park and PB rec
 

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