At what point does abuse get its name?

[jay o.]

I think this will vary from person to person obviously...but what are your thoughts on abuse? When do you think its too much or its starting to be abuse instead of use. Interested to read what you guys have to say.

 

[chairmankitteh]

I think it becomes abuse when it takes priority over your every day life. For example if you find yourself spending money you or your family needs to make rent/mortgage to get an order in, you are probably abusing a tool.
I think if you are doing things you wouldn't normally do to get an order you need to take a break or a step down. I also knew a guy who was was trying to make some sort of jacked synthol injections at home out of fish oil and almost died, he would fall into the abuse category IMO
I think normal abuse patterns don't necessarily apply to people who are performers or competitors who have a professional responsibility to maintain a look.

 

[tmuscle]

drug abuse

Definition
Compulsive, excessive, and self-damaging use of habit forming drugs or substances, leading to addiction or dependence, serious physiological injury (such as damage to kidneys, liver, heart) and/or psychological harm (such as dysfunctional behavior patterns, hallucinations, memory loss), or death. Also called substance abuse.


imo if you are putting your health in risk that is when you can call it abuse.

 

[jay o.]

Im also aiming to see what people think dosage-wise as well. Nice post btw

 

[Bio]

I think jay o is looking to get an answer more along the lines of "what dosage" would be considered abuse. This question has been asked time and time again and you will never be able to get a cohesive answer on this...There are too many variables! At what stage of AAS use are we talking about? Another related question is, "what constitutes a cycle?"...8 weeks? 10 weeks? 12 weeks? More?? What if somebody used 2 to 4 grams for two weeks on with four weeks off? Is that abuse or does the short duration eliminate the chance of severe side effects? Are we talking about a Pro BB or somebody taking Testosterone for the first time? Like I said, there are too many variables!!

 

[saps]

I thought this was going to be a Penn State Syracuse type abuse thread
When it comes to the AAS game the abuse line is usually crossed when there is an intentional disregard for health and safety. If you can run 2G a week but are fine and healthy so be it. If you get massive problems on 500mg a week than there you go

 

[Gaintrain]

Im also aiming to see what people think dosage-wise as well. Nice post btw

that question I dont think you will find an answer to..... a dose for a ifbb pro might be abuse to a newbie but to the pro that is what his fitness level requires.....and I agree it all comes down to what level your at....

 

[tmuscle]

Im also aiming to see what people think dosage-wise as well. Nice post btw

ah i see what you mean

well that is dependent on the person as well.

i think it's all dependent on your bloodwork. some guys can run 2g of quality gear but keep the test at sane dosages (like 250-500mg) to maintain sane hdl/ldl rbc, but run higher quantities of other things like tren at 500mg/w with masteron and equipose at 700mg/week and their bloodwork can actually turn out ok. once they ramp up the dosages so high that their bloodwork shows negative health effects i would consider that abuse. but i think there is a point where everyone has that "cutoff" where a certain amount will cause ur health to go in the shitter or decrease your total life longevity, that to me is considered abuse

i used to believe that there was like a certain "cutoff" for what is considered abuse when i was a low dose champion and i thought 1g of total gear was crazy. when i was a natural i thought that any gear was considered abuse and that people who even run 250mg of test were huge and jacked and cheaters...when you open pandoras box u kind of laugh at ur own thoughts u once had about geared users when u were a natty

some guys take 500mg and their bloodwork goes crazy, that can also be considered abuse for them

if ur considering how much is a good amount to be using without having it be considered abuse, just look at your blood profile. that is a good starting point to know when u are pushing the envelope

if someone says they are running 2g of total gear, don't look down on them and consider that as abuse. because it could very well be that his gear is underdosed or doesn't really respond to gear all that well compared to his friend who blows up on 1g, as long as his health is fine.

everyone is different

 

[ROCKEDUP]

you could argue that any dose about therapeutic levels is abuse. ALL pros abuse PERIOD, some to a greater extent than others.

This is based on the definition of "abuse" and is coming from a guy who's opinion means very little.

 

[thatbloke]

abuse doses IMO is using anything approx over 1000-15000mgs of steroids a week

id say thats abuse considering its pretty hard to argue its not doing any damage to you at all, and if you cant grow off those kinds of doses then id say ur at a level in bodybuilding where your level of muscle is putting some strain sort strain on your body

but it really is a matter of opinion, some guys would say 500mgs is still abusing while others say 3000mgs is where abuse starts

everyones entitled to there opinion, but considering this is pro muscle, id say most peoples opinions are a little biased towards higher doses considering wed all probably are higher dose users, so whats considered in reality abuse doses might be a little lower then wat most people on here think

but as i said i still think 1000-1500mgs a week is abuse, coz if ya go docs and say ur using 500mgs of testosterone a week hed probably accept it and help look after your health,
but if you went docs and told him ur injecting 1000-1500mgs a week then he probably get abit of a shock and wont be to helpful, but more critical

just my thoughts

 

[Cito33189]

This is a good topic!

I think I abuse anabolics... I mean I havent gone over 500mgs. of test in a while and I keep my dosages rather low. But I rarely come off cruise/blast type of deal. I know it's not the healthiest thing in the world; so I am ignoring the fact that using anabolics is not the healthiest thing to be doing. I think that could be considered abuse.

 

[TNH]

It depends on your perspective.
In the medical community, anything that puts you over the high end of normal would be considered abuse.

As someone that uses AAS at well above HRT doses, my idea of abuse is quite different. As others touched on, it is dependent on your bloodwork. If your blood work shows you are good (and you don't have a clotting issue like some of our unfortunate members have had), I feel you are not abusing.

I feel that anything my body can recover from without any permanent damage is abuse. Unfortunately, as Phil and some others mentioned in posts a while back, bloodwork sometimes isn't enough to tell if you have a kidney issue or not. Scarring of the kidneys can happen without any other values being abnormal on your blood panel and urinalysis.

I personally made a set point for total gear use, and that was 6-700mg of total gear per week. I pulled the number out of my ass, although knowing the highest testing done on humans in medical studies was 600mg influenced my decision.
I just recently bumped my dose up to quite a bit higher than that, I am getting married in a tropical place next month and wanted to be as big and lean as I could for the big day, shallow, I know, lol. So right now I feel I am abusing myself, but just based on my agreement I made with myself, not health issues or anything like that. I am scheduled for blood work next week, so I'll be a better judge of whether or not I am abusing myself shortly.

 

[Dancho]

when the sides get way too much to deal with in your everyday life and your health is at great danger. mgs or ius doesnot matter, its person specific, you might be on 3-4grams of aas and not abuse it more than the next guy who is on 500mg.

 

[Ataraxia]

It depends on your perspective.
In the medical community, anything that puts you over the high end of normal would be considered abuse.

As someone that uses AAS at well above HRT doses, my idea of abuse is quite different. As others touched on, it is dependent on your bloodwork. If your blood work shows you are good (and you don't have a clotting issue like some of our unfortunate members have had), I feel you are not abusing.

I feel that anything my body can recover from without any permanent damage is abuse. Unfortunately, as Phil and some others mentioned in posts a while back, bloodwork sometimes isn't enough to tell if you have a kidney issue or not. Scarring of the kidneys can happen without any other values being abnormal on your blood panel and urinalysis.

I personally made a set point for total gear use, and that was 6-700mg of total gear per week. I pulled the number out of my ass, although knowing the highest testing done on humans in medical studies was 600mg influenced my decision.
I just recently bumped my dose up to quite a bit higher than that, I am getting married in a tropical place next month and wanted to be as big and lean as I could for the big day, shallow, I know, lol. So right now I feel I am abusing myself, but just based on my agreement I made with myself, not health issues or anything like that. I am scheduled for blood work next week, so I'll be a better judge of whether or not I am abusing myself shortly.

Congrats on getting married!!! hell ya you want to look lean and jacked on your wedding day just make sure you don't get your clothes tailored until just before the wedding, or else they may not fit!!

 

[swolegasm]

I think that its abuse when mentally you aren't prepared. You need to assess yourself before and prepare. Prepare can mean peaking naturally......