Cycle help and advise.

[jr]

As my second cycle i was considering using Test-E,EQ,and anavar tabs together would this be a good stack???????

 

[Big A]

Well, anything could be said is a good stack, depending on what your goals are.
But generally speaking a cycle where you have a test, an anabolic and an oral is how it should be.

 

[healthfreak79]

As my second cycle i was considering using Test-E,EQ,and anavar tabs together would this be a good stack???????

That is a good stack

 

[jr]

Thanks for the comments,one more question though.

I was talkin to the person who suggested this stack for me and this is how he said it should be taken,remember this is my second cycle.

WEEK 1
Test-E- 1.5cc a week
EQ-1cc a week
Anavar- 2 tabs daily

WEEK 2
STAY THE SAME

WEEK 3
Test-E-2cc a week
EQ-1.5cc a week
Anavar-3 tabs daily

WEEK 4-12(DOUBLE UP)
Test-E-2cc every third day
EQ-1.5 twice a week
Anavar-3 tabs daily.

is this too much for me i'm 5'5 198lbs. 10%bf

 

[IronMike]

...

For a first cycle, just do your doses straight up ie do not complicate things by altering doses week by week. I'm not sure what the doses on your test e and Eq are, but if it is your first cycle - and judging by your stats you are fine with training and diet - do something like 500mg test e per week, 500mg eq (some would say 400mg but I find eq better at that level) and anavar for first four weeks, say. IronMike

 

[jr]

Thanks man,appreciate the advice.

How many anavar tabs a week would you recommend?

 

[healthfreak79]

I was talkin to the person who suggested this stack for me and this is how he said it should be taken,remember this is my second cycle.

WEEK 1
Test-E- 1.5cc a week
EQ-1cc a week
Anavar- 2 tabs daily

WEEK 2
STAY THE SAME

WEEK 3
Test-E-2cc a week
EQ-1.5cc a week
Anavar-3 tabs daily



WEEK 4-12(DOUBLE UP)
Test-E-2cc every third day
EQ-1.5 twice a week
Anavar-3 tabs daily.

is this too much for me i'm 5'5 198lbs. 10%bf

Ok first we all need to know what mg/ml your gear is to help set your doses. What is it 250 300 that makes a difference. I dont see a reason to keep upping the doses, but what i do is about 1/2 to 3/4 through my cycle then ill up the test a little. I would keep it at the same dose till it builds up in your system. The way to figure out how much product your taking is this....
test enth is 250mg/ml and your shotting 2 cc every 4 days so it goes like this
250 x 2 = 500 divide that by 4 and x that # by 7 for the days in the week and you get 875. This goes for any product so now you can figure out your own doses. Start your cycle at 500 a week then jump to 600 half way through. Keep eq at 400 to 500 id say 400 if itsd your first time. Run var at 40mg per day with as much as you have. Last this i hope your over 22 to be using gear if not i dont suggest you use it. Have extra nolva on hand and arimidex for bloat and gyno. Also set up a pct very important

 

[jr]

cool

well i'm only 21 ,another question is what is a pct and how do you take it ?????????????

 

[healthfreak79]

Well first i have to say this your to young to be using gear, and my advise is just hear say. A pct is post cycle theropy, i suggest you run some searches on it and anything else you put in your body. Make sure you know what your doing before you do it. A pct will contain nolvadex and clomid most will say for a month. It helps just start your natural test back into action after your injectables have cleared your system. You should also be using arimidex or aromasin to help control bloat and gyno sides. Always have extra nolva hanging around if any problems pop up. My last pct looked lioke this everything is taken daily
clomid at 100mg for 2 weeks
nolva at 40mg for 2 weeks
clomid at 50 for 2 weeks
nolva at 20 for 2 weeks. total of 4 weeks

Hang out on the site and learn as much as you can about what your doing. The search button is a great thing here. Hope this help and if your going to do it mite as well have your health in mind and do it right. Always do a pct with every cycle you do no matter what it is

 

[basskiller]

I've never been a big fan of ramping up gear. By the time you get the hormone at a steady level in your blood, it's the end of your cycle.
Start with a set amount and stick with it throughout.

PCT = Post cycle therapy


I''l post just a few articles that I have on the subject.. You really should read alot more before starting gear usage

 

[basskiller]

Pheedno's PCT

My post cycle therapy is a three compound administration which is designed so that there is a primary and secondary LH stimulator which both are maximizing potential early in the duration; with the primary being phased out in extended protocol. With the addition of an AI, which makes the above possible, the individual will also endure less of an increase in SHBG, which allows free testosterone levels to reach base line
at a much quicker pace. The individual will also see less of a problem in most cases with sexual libido as the bounding SHBG is controlled(to an extent). Below you will find my suggested bare minimum, as well as a sample of an extended protocol. Extended PCT protcol is cycle length dependant so the below is not the standard for all cycles


PCT for cycles 8-16wks:
Day 1-30- .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva

Extended protocol sample for a 12+ month cycle:
Day 1-15_ .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 16-45_.25mg L-dex + 75mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 46-65_.25mg L-dex + 20mg Nolva
Day 66-80_.25mg L-dex

Now, IMO clomid is selective to the suprapituitary, while Nolva is selective to breast, bone, and liver ERs. I've come to this conclusion based on the comparison of studies on both SERMs. In every study showing benefit to HPTA from tamoxifin, the duration of the administration is 3-12months(This includes studies cited by William Llewellyn in his Nolva vs Clomid article). In studies showing levels of LH, FSH, and Testosterone checked after short durations of tamox, they were either insignificant, or their was an actual drop. I believe this is because tamox selectively works at the mammery(as well as bone and liver), thus taking longer for LH stimulation to occur.
With clomid, benefit to gonadotphin concentrations, LH, FSH, and serum testosterone can be seen in short periods of 2-6wks. Because of the apparent selective nature of the two, and given our usual PCT duration, clomid is by far superior at LH stimulation than Nolva. Now both is the wise choice for a couple of reasons:

1. Nolva acts as the preventive measure to the estrogen flux
occured PC while clomid is the primary LH stimulator(Even more so in the case an AI is not used).
2. If your running a longer PCT, clomid needs to be discontinued after a while as it has been shown to desensitize GnRH, this due, IMO, to it's selective nature to the suprapituitary. In the longer forms of PCT, the clomid will be phased out, leaving Nolva and L-dex

Arimidex(or L-dex)
Estrogen is the main inhibitence of restoring HPTA, and AI administration has been shown to increase gonadotrophin concentrations and serum Testosterone by up to 50%. In addition, by adding L-dex, the inhibitence of excess estrogen allows Tamox to work greater at LH stimulation in the begining stages of PCT, since the need to prevent binding in the mammery is lessened by the reduction in estrogen biosynthesis

 

[basskiller]

Clomid: Frequently Asked Questions

by IronGame

Something I put together that may help some of the new comers out there as well as some of the more experienced.

Question: What is Clomid?

Answer: Clomid is a synthetic estrogen and is generally prescribed by doctors to trigger ovulation in females.

Question: Why Should Bodybuilders use Clomid?

Answer: Almost all anabolic androgenic steroids will cause an inhibition of the bodies own testosterone production. When he comes off the steroids he has no natural test production and no more steroids. The body is left in a state of catabolism (catabolic hormones are high and anabolic hormones are low) and as a result much of the muscle tissue that was gained on the cycle is now going to be lost. Clomid stimulates the hypophysis to release more gonadotropin so that a faster and higher release of follicle stimulating hormone aud luteinizing hormone occurs. This results in an increase of the body's own testosterone production.

Question: Does Clomid also work as an anti estrogen?

Answer: Clomid is a synthetic estrogen, however it does also work as an anti-estrogen. How does it work? Because it is a weak synthetic estrogen, it will bind to the estrogen receptor (ER) and not cause any problems. At the same time the increase in estrogen from steroids are blocked from attaching to the ER.

Question: How effective is Clomid as an anti-estrogen?

Answer: It is very weak and should not be relied upon if you are going to be using steroids that aromatise at any rapid rate, or if you are pre disposed to gyno. Arimidex, Proviron and Nolvadex will all make better choices for this purpose.

Question: Some say Clomid during a cycle is a waste, is this true?

Answer: Lets first examine what happens when someone is using anabolic androgenic steroids. When the level of androgens in the body get too high, the androgen receptor becomes more highly activated, and the hypothalamus stops sending a signal to the pituitary. In short the signal tells our body to stop producing testosterone. During a cycle the body has higher levels than normal of androgens and as long as this level is high enough clomid will not help to keep natural test production up. It will be almost all but completely shut off. The only purpose of clomid during a cycle is as an anti-estrogen.

Question: When do I start Clomid? Some say 2 weeks others 3.

Answer: When you start using your clomid all depends on what steroids you were using during your cycle. Different steroids have different half lifes and you should adjust your clomid intake accordingly. As we have seen above, if we take clomid when the androgen levels in our body is still high it will be a waste. We need to wait for androgen levels to fall before implementing our clomid therapy. However if we take it too late we could possibly lose gains. Look at the list below to determine when you should start clomid therapy. By selecting from the list all the steroids you used in your cycle and which ever one has the latest starting point then go with that. For example if I cycled dbol, sustanon and winstrol I would use sustanon as it remains active in the body for the longest period of time.

Anadrol/Anapolan: 8 - 12 hours after last administration
Deca: 3 weeks after last injection and clomid for 4 weeks
Dianabol: 4 – 8 hours after last administration
Equipoise: 3 weeks after last injection
Fina: 3 days after last injection
Primobolan depot: 10 – 14 days after last injection
Sustanon: 3 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Cypionate: 2 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Enanthate: 2 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Propionate: 3 days after last injection
Testosterone Suspension: 4 – 8 hours after last administration
Winstrol: 8 – 12 hours after last administration

Question: What is the most effective way for Clomid therapy.

Answer: Clomid has a long half life and as such there is no need to split up doses throughout the day. I read some where that it was 5 days (any feedback on this). Now if we used sustanon and we start using clomid 3 weeks after our last injection we anticipate that androgen levels are low enough to start sending the correct signals. If androgen levels are still a little high then the normal 50mgs/day of clomid for 1 week is not going to be effective. We need to start at a high enough amount that will work or help even if androgen levels are still a little high.

300mgs on day 1. I know I said don’t split it up due to its long half life but try and split this up 2 tabs 3 times a day. After we have finished this first day we seek to use 100mgs for 10 days and then followed by 50mgs for 10 days.


300mgs day1
100mgs next 10 days
50mgs next 10 days

Question: Do I need to use Clomid for 3 weeks?

Answer: Why don’t you want too? It is very cheap, very effective and can mean the difference between maintaining gains and losing them.

Question: How cheap is Clomid?

Answer: Clomid normally comes in 50mg tablets but also comes in capsule form of 25mgs. A 50mg tablet can be anywhere between 25 cents and $2.50. (15 pence and 75 pence in England).

Question: Do all steroids cause shut down of the hpta.

Answer: Not all steroids do. Everyone is different and you must also take into account how long you have been using a certain steroid and at what dose in order to determine if you need clomid or not. However as the price is so cheap, why risk not using it.

 

[basskiller]

Nolva vs. Clomid for Post Cycle Therapy

written by BigCat



While practically similar compounds in structure, few people ever really consider Clomid and Nolva to be similar. Its not just a common myth in steroid circles, but even in the medical community. This misconception originates from their completely different uses. Nolvadex is most commonly used for the treatment of breast cancer in women, while clomid is generally considered a fertility aid. In bodybuilding circles, from day one, clomid has generally been used as post-cycle therapy and Nolvadex as an anti-estrogen.

But as I intend to demonstrate this is in essence the same. I believe the myth to have originated because Nolva is clearly a more powerful anti-estrogen, and the people selling clomid needed another angle to sell the stuff, so it was mostly used as a post-cycle aid. But few users really understand how clomid (and also Nolvadex, logically) works to bring back natural testosterone in the body after the conclusion of a cycle of androgenic anabolic steroids. After a cycle is over, the level of androgens in the body drop drastically. The body compensates with an overproduction of estrogen to keep steroid levels up. Estrogen as well inhibits the production of natural testosterone, and in the period between the return of natural testosterone and the end of a cycle, a lot of mass is lost. So its in everybody's best interest to bring back natural test as soon as humanly possible. Clomid and Nolvadex will reduce the post-cycle estrogen, so that a steroid deficiency is constated and the hypothalamus is stimulated to regenerate natural testosterone production in the body. That's basically how the mechanism works, nothing more, nothing less.

Both compounds are structurally alike, classified as triphenylethylenes. Nolvadex is clearly the stronger component of the two as it can achieve better results in decreasing overall estrogen with 20-40 mg a day, than clomid can in doses of 100-150 mg a day. A noteworthy difference. Triphenylethylenes are very mild estrogens that do not exert a lot, if any activity at the estrogen receptor, but are still highly attracted to it. As such they will occupy the receptor and keep it from binding estrogens. This means they do not actively work to reduce estrogen in the body like Proviron, Viratase or arimidex would (by competing for the aromatase enzyme), but that it blocks the receptor so that any estrogen in the body is basically inert, because it has no receptor to bind to.

This has advantages and disadvantages. The disadvantage is that when use is discontinued, the estrogen level is still the same and new problems will develop much sooner. The advantage is that it works much faster and has results sooner than with an aromatase blocker like Proviron or arimidex. Therefor, when problems such as gynocomastia occur during a cycle of steroids one will usually start 20 mg/day of Nolva or 100 mg/day of clomid straight away, in conjunction with some Proviron or arimidex. The proviron or arimidex will actively reduce estrogen while the clomid or Nolvadex will solve your ongoing problem straight away. This way, when use is discontinued there is no immediate rebound.

So which one should you use? Well personally, I'd have to say Nolvadex. Both as an on-cycle anti-estrogen and a post-cycle therapy. As an anti-estrogen its simply much stronger, demonstrated by the fact that better results are obtained with 20-40 mg than with 100-150 mg of clomid. For post-cycle, this plays a key role as well. It deactivates rebound estrogen much faster and more effective. But most importantly, Nolvadex has a direct influence on bringing back natural testosterone, where as clomid may actually have a slight negative influence. The reason being that Tamoxifen (as in Nolvadex) seems to increase the responsiveness of LH (luteinizing hormone) to GnRH (gonadtropin releasing hormone), whereas clomid seems to decrease the responsiveness a bit1.

Another noteworthy fact about Nolvadex is that it acts more potently as an estrogen in the liver. As you remember, I mentioned that clomiphene and tamoxifen are basically weak estrogens. Well, tamoxifen is apparently still quite potent in the liver. This offers us the positive benefits of this hormone in the liver, while avoiding its negative effects elsewhere in the body. As such Nolvadex can have a very positive impact on negative cholesterol levels2 in the body, and therefore too should be considered a better choice than clomid. It will not solve the problem of bad cholesterol levels during Steroid use, but will help to contain the problem to a larger degree.

Another reason why I promote the use of Nolvadex over Clomid post-cycle (as if being 3-4 times stronger and having more of a direct effect on restoring natural test wasn't enough) is because it's a lot safer. Not just because it improves lipid profiles, but also because it simply doesn't have the intrinsic side-effects that Clomid has. Clomid causes more acne for sure, but that's mainly because you need to use a 3-4 times higher dose. But Clomid seems to also affect the eyesight. Long-term clomid therapy causes irreversible changes in eyesight3 in users. Irreversible. For me that alone is reason enough to prefer Nolvadex.

Lastly, one should be aware that use of these compounds can reduce the gains made on steroids. Nolvadex more so than clomid, simply because it is stronger. Estrogen is responsible for a number of anabolic factors such as increasing growth hormone output, upgrading the androgen receptor and improving glucose utilization. This is why aromatizing steroids like testosterone are still best suited for maximum muscle gain. When reducing the estrogen levels, we therefore reduce the potential gains being made. For this reason one may opt to try clomid during a cycle instead of Nolvadex. Although I would imagine that the problem that needed solved would be of more concern, in which case Nolva remains the weapon of choice. It's a plain fact that there is a high correlation between gains and side-effects. Either you go for maximum gains and tolerate the side-effects, or you reduce the side-effects, and with it the gains. That's life, nothing is free.

Stacking and Use:

If problems of Gynocomastia or other estrogen related symptoms tend to pop up during a cycle the use of 20-30 mg of Nolvadex or 100 mg of Clomid daily should easily contain the problem, and be used until a few days after the problem subsides. For best results and the least amount of problems upon cessation it is best stacked with Proviron (50 mg) or arimidex (0.5 mg) for this duration as well. Its not advised that these products be ran concomitantly with the steroid for the entire duration of the stack, as this will reduce your gains. Instead cease the usage of anti-estrogens once the problem is contained, and should the problem resurface, simply recommence the use of the products in the same manner as described above.

Once a cycle of steroids is concluded one should always initiate a post-cycle therapy to help bring back natural testosterone as soon as possible. This will help you to retain the mass you gained. How this is done depends highly on the type of steroid used. If only orals were used, therapy should start immediately, even the last day of the stack. If short-acting esters or water-based injectables were used, therapy should commence within 4-7 days after last injection, and if long-acting esters were used then it should commence 1.5 to 2 weeks after the last injection was given. The length of the therapy will vary as well, from 3-5 weeks. The longer acting the product was, the longer therapy should be continued to make sure all suppressive factors are cleared before use of Clomid/Nolvadex is discontinued.

For best results, it is best stacked with HCG (Human Chorionic gonadotrophin), which functions as an LH analog and can help bring testicle size back up. HCG use starts the last week of a cycle, and on from there every 5-6 days (usually 1500-3000 IU) and discontinued 1.5 to weeks prior to the cessation of Nolvadex/clomid. The reason being that HCG itself is also suppressive of natural testosterone and should be out of the body before therapy is over, or it will inhibit natural testicle function. But I can not stress enough that HCG possibly plays a more important role in post-cycle therapy than clomid/Nolvadex. For Clomid and Nolvadex, doses are usually tapered down. Its best to start with 40-50 mg of Nolvadex or 150 mg of Clomid for the first week or the first two weeks, and then finish the program with 20-25 mg of Nolvadex or 100 mg of Clomid for an additional two weeks.

References

1 Vermeulen A., Comhaire F., Hormonal effects of an anti-estrogen, tamoxifen, in normal and oligospermic men, Fertil. Ster. 29 (1978) 320-27

2 Bruning PF, Bronfer JMG, Hart AAM, Jong-Bakker M, tamoxifen, serum lipoproteins and cardiovascular risk, Br. J. Cancer 1988 Oct, 58 (4) 497-9

 

[jr]

Thanks for all your help....

do you get clomid,nolvadex,hcg,and arimidex where you get the rest of your gear from??????

also for my first cycle a month ago i started using tribulus and zma as i was coming off because someone told me this would drop my testes back and start up my own testosterone production.everything went well.....cold it have gone better though?????

 

[xcelbeyond]

do you get clomid,nolvadex,hcg,and arimidex where you get the rest of your gear from??????

Don't ask for sources (read the Board Rules)

Have you checked out the board sponsors?

 

[Pittbull™]

Have you checked out the board sponsors?

 

[jr]

NOT ASKIN FOR SOURCES......

JUST WANNA KNOW IF ITS LEGAL OR NOT SO I KNOW WHERE TO GO.

 

[xcelbeyond]

Not sure what you mean here

JUST WANNA KNOW IF ITS LEGAL OR NOT SO I KNOW WHERE TO GO.

If it's illegal, you won't use it

This stuff definately require a prescrption to purchase. Technically, if you're caught with it in your possession and do not have a prescription for it, they can arrest you. So - - it's considered "gray-market" goods. Law enforcement probably won't waste their time persuing you for possession.