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HGH - Generics 191aa? or 192aa

dros

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Are most generics now 191aa?

Seeing how technology has been rapidly improved just the last decade and the immense growth (no pun intended) and availability of generic HGH, are there still many Generics out there that are 192aa?


How do we know unless there are tests?


Discuss
 

NEMSZ

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Are most generics now 191aa?

Seeing how technology has been rapidly improved just the last decade and the immense growth (no pun intended) and availability of generic HGH, are there still many Generics out there that are 192aa?


How do we know unless there are tests?


Discuss
There have been a few threads here and on Anasci that have had random testing on blood GH Serum, blood IGF and Mass Spec on various Generic GH brands/sources and I’m not aware of any having been 192aa... Sure some had less GH, more Dimer, some were less pure and more pure, some gave people higher IGF levels and lower, even weird results like Pharma GH giving low IGF numbers on blood test and very low dose Generic giving extremely high IGF levels on blood tests... Some probably contained no or very little GH... But again, not aware of any that were tested to be 192aa
 

FrancisK

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I had a batch of kefeis that gave me big tender red welts no matter where or how I used it. All my research pointed to be it being bad GH and quite possibly 192 as it could have been my body developing anti bodies to GH.....pretty scary. Multiple people had the same issue with that batch, wish I had it tested but I was new to the game then and really it wouldn’t have mattered as it got buried real fast and blown off by the sponsor when I inquired about it.

Anyway, my point being that in my frantic research trying to figure it out there was very little concrete info on the subject.
 

Pissbrain259

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Are most generics now 191aa?

Seeing how technology has been rapidly improved just the last decade and the immense growth (no pun intended) and availability of generic HGH, are there still many Generics out there that are 192aa?


How do we know unless there are tests?


Discuss
Hmmm...should we open Pandora's box of peptides? Ah, why the hell not?
 

Kaladryn

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With current technology, I don't think it's any easier to make 192aa than 191 so I doubt there is even any in circulation, as far as I know 192aa gh hasn't been a thing for 15-20 years.
 

Pissbrain259

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I'll try my best to simplify. The "gold standard" hGH synthesized by the human anterior pituitary gland is initially a polypeptide chain consisting of 217 AA's. This 217 AA polypeptide chain undergoes various changes in shape, phosphorylation, splicing, bond formation, length, blah blah blah. After all that "post-translational modification" crap, we are left with the famous & mature 191 AA hGH Isoform 1.

Just to complicate existence, the human body decided to fuck us by producing at least FIVE different hGH Isoforms which have been discovered and studied. Isoform 2 has 202 AA's, Isoform 3 has 179 AA's. Isoform 4 has 171 AA's, and Isoform 5 has 177 AA's. Don't even get me started on the differences in the AA sequence of each isoform or the SIX other computationally mapped potential isoforms.

Fuckin' aye, right?
 

Pissbrain259

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Also note that I only mentioned hGH and not GH from other species. For those wondering, non-homo sapien GH is cheaper to obtain. :cautious:
 

Ironman 580

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I had some welts from kefeis also and I got nothing out of them and I ran a few kits- I believe they were junk - I ran some hgh from another source and got good gains so I’m not a probie
 

dros

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There have been a few threads here and on Anasci that have had random testing on blood GH Serum, blood IGF and Mass Spec on various Generic GH brands/sources and I’m not aware of any having been 192aa... Sure some had less GH, more Dimer, some were less pure and more pure, some gave people higher IGF levels and lower, even weird results like Pharma GH giving low IGF numbers on blood test and very low dose Generic giving extremely high IGF levels on blood tests... Some probably contained no or very little GH... But again, not aware of any that were tested to be 192aa
So, its safe to say most Generic HGH out there is good, given the purity is high 96%+ is pharma standard i believe.

Some give more water retention than others, this is because of fillers correct?

So, when you get off Generic should have more or less the same effect as pharma at 1/3, 1/4 of the price
 

NEMSZ

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So, its safe to say most Generic HGH out there is good, given the purity is high 96%+ is pharma standard i believe.

Some give more water retention than others, this is because of fillers correct?

So, when you get off Generic should have more or less the same effect as pharma at 1/3, 1/4 of the price
I don’t think water retention has much to do with fillers as it does the individual, I mean, some have tested to have zero fillers (all of them actually, define fillers?) and very low Dimer.. With 97-99% purity.. I know some people have used TP’s black tops for example and got a lot of water retention, I got absolutely zero water retention/bloat even going straight to 4-6iu without tapering up.. Just depends on the person I guess..

Also there are several people on here, IFBB Pros included that have used both Pharma and Generics and say the results are the same. None of that 6iu of Generic = 3iu Pharma crap either.. 1IU is 1IU... That’s all mental.

People think that because GH is super expensive in the US that it must be super expensive to make so generics can’t be legit. That’s horse shit. The US pharmaceutical industry are just thieves. Why does an Epi Pen cost over $1,000 dollars in the US but in Canada and other countries it costs like $50 or something like that? Same with virtually all other medications..
 

dros

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I don’t think water retention has much to do with fillers as it does the individual, I mean, some have tested to have zero fillers (all of them actually, define fillers?) and very low Dimer.. With 97-99% purity.. I know some people have used TP’s black tops for example and got a lot of water retention, I got absolutely zero water retention/bloat even going straight to 4-6iu without tapering up.. Just depends on the person I guess..

Also there are several people on here, IFBB Pros included that have used both Pharma and Generics and say the results are the same. None of that 6iu of Generic = 3iu Pharma crap either.. 1IU is 1IU... That’s all mental.

People think that because GH is super expensive in the US that it must be super expensive to make so generics can’t be legit. That’s horse shit. The US pharmaceutical industry are just thieves. Why does an Epi Pen cost over $1,000 dollars in the US but in Canada and other countries it costs like $50 or something like that? Same with virtually all other medications..
I also did not get much if any water rentention from TP´s blacks. So going by this, if another sponsor has the same purity rate and low dimer it should more or less give the same effects?

Yeah, I never bought into that 6 iu generic = 3 iu pharma. But HGH are not all created equally. They have different manufacturing process / protein expression. This migh explain why some people swear by this and this HGH. The effects however will all be 95% the same more or less.


Norditropin: Omnitropin:
Histidine 1 mg poloxamer#188 3mgs
poloxamer #188 4.5mgs glycine 28mgs
phenol 2.5mgs mannitol 52.5mgs
mannitol 60mgs phenol 2.5mgs
benzyl alcohol 30.5mgs
D-sodiumhydrophosphatehepathhydrate 1.5mgs
Sodium D-hydrophosphatedhydrate 1.6mgs





Genotropin: Humatrope:
glycine 2.2mgs glycine 5mgs
mannitol 46.8mgs m-cresol 0.3mg
m-cresol 3.4mgs glycerin 1.7mgs
sodium Dhydrophosphate Ahydrous .32mg mannitol 25mgs
disodium dydrophosphate ahydrous .31mg dibasicsodiumphosphate 1.13mgs



Nutropin: Serono Serostim:
glycine 3.4mgs sucrose 34.2mgs
dibasicsodiumphosphate 2.6mgs phosphoric acid 1.2mgs
monobasic sodiumphosphate 0.8mg
mannitol 45mgs
benzyl alcohol 0.9mgs
sodiumphosphate 3.4mgs Serono SAIZEN:
sodium chloride 17.4mgs
phenol 5mgs
polysorbate#20 4mgs
sodium citrate 10mgs
(2AEP)aminoethyl phosphoric acid 5mgs
 

Pissbrain259

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So, its safe to say most Generic HGH out there is good, given the purity is high 96%+ is pharma standard i believe.

Some give more water retention than others, this is because of fillers correct?

So, when you get off Generic should have more or less the same effect as pharma at 1/3, 1/4 of the price
Based on extensive knowledge and firsthand experience with the FDA guidelines/rules/regulations involved in approving generic drugs for manufacturing and retail in the U.S., the quality level/potency of ANY generic drug can vary anywhere between good to highly questionable.
 

dros

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Based on extensive knowledge and firsthand experience with the FDA guidelines/rules/regulations involved in approving generic drugs for manufacturing and retail in the U.S., the quality level/potency of ANY generic drug can vary anywhere between good to highly questionable.
This is not a problem for us if there are indepedent testing showing purity results.

Most if not all generic HGH sold under sponsors are 95%+ purity which is pharmaceutical standard.
 

Pissbrain259

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Are most generics now 191aa?

Seeing how technology has been rapidly improved just the last decade and the immense growth (no pun intended) and availability of generic HGH, are there still many Generics out there that are 192aa?


How do we know unless there are tests?


Discuss
By FDA and EMA mandate, approved generic hGH SHOULD be the 191 AA recombinant form. Companies that acquire the rights to manufacture and sell recombinant hGH must go through a lengthy and tedious process to prove that they are fully able to synthesize the 191 AA recombinant hGH via safe and accepted standard biochemical procedures which are reproducible. Each company must then prove via an intense series of highly sensitive and specific testing that the finished product is indeed the 191 AA rHGH. The entire process is expensive and lengthy so it only makes business sense for a pharma company to bring their A game to synthesize the generic drug in question. Once approval is granted, ask yourself how many pharma companies indefinitely continue their A game in manufacturing the generic drug? Sure, the FDA/EMA checks/reviews the companies on a relatively infrequent basis but unless there is a MAJOR issue discovered or reported, most pharma companies just get a thumbs up to resume business as usual.
 

Pissbrain259

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This is not a problem for us if there are indepedent testing showing purity results.

Most if not all generic HGH sold under sponsors are 95%+ purity which is pharmaceutical standard.
You would be correct provided that testing is done using USP grade (or equivalent) reference materials with standard molecular biochemistry practices and procedures which involves access to insanely expensive lab equipment/machines. Is all of this possible for someone or some company to perform? Sure. Is it financially feasible? Maybe for a company already heavily invested in manufacturing pharmaceutical products which require quality control testing.
 

dros

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You would be correct provided that testing is done using USP grade (or equivalent) reference materials with standard molecular biochemistry practices and procedures which involves access to insanely expensive lab equipment/machines. Is all of this possible for someone or some company to perform? Sure. Is it financially feasible? Maybe for a company already heavily invested in manufacturing pharmaceutical products which require quality control testing.
It is ok to then say confidently most generics provided with testing showing high purity rate are just as good as “fda approved HGH”?


Thanks for all the replies. Some good informative posts here.
 

KillerStack

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Based on extensive knowledge and firsthand experience with the FDA guidelines/rules/regulations involved in approving generic drugs for manufacturing and retail in the U.S., the quality level/potency of ANY generic drug can vary anywhere between good to highly questionable.
Sometimes for fun I've asked pharmacists about commonly reported subjective differences between generics and brand name drugs. Even something as "simple" and cheap as diklofenac tabs don't work the same/have the same sides according to friends. At first they will always say there is no difference. When pressed further they might admit that there could be differences in tablet binders or whatever that might affect results. I usually pick generics for all drugs as they might be a third of the price and haven't had problems.

I have seen many mentions here of Anavar being one drug where the "powders" out of China just aren't "real". Yeah but there have been many pharma Anavars, which one is the real real Anavar? :D Same with the Ciba Dianabol that was the only real Dianabol. Or Negma Tren, the only real tren, supposedly at least 3 times as potent as any other tren.:D
Some guys still say it was basically impossible to take more than 2 or 3 a week, and guys today claiming to take 1 gram showed it wasn't tren at all. I remember when Craig Titus said the pellet tren simply wasn't tren, there had only ever been one real tren and it was the Negma:D
Who the hell knows.

I have spoken to one old guy who used Ciba Dianabol who said he wasn't impressed, the UGL of today are better. Go figure:D
 

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