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I AM GIVING A LECTURE HERE

Fathead

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OK I took my break and I am back posting more frequent and I have been seeing a few posts about a certain way to train, eat, and take your supps a certain way and that's it, THE END ALL BE ALL WAY. This kinda peeves me a little because it just aint that way.

I am going to pick on HIT here only because it's been a topic of late. If anyone really remembers right towards the end of the symmetrical HANEY days there were guys like, Dorian, PHIL, Francois, Nasser popping up on stage but getting no shows as they were too big for that time. A year later Dorian came back and won and hence the era of the freaks started and every lay person and fan of the sport wondered how are these guys doing it and out the books and tapes came and the retard MENTZER came out of a 20 yr retirement and said HIT was the only way to go but he was not the only one, there were a gaggle of go heavy train less gurus that jumped on the money band wagon of this type theory. I know some of these guys never even heard of training this way they just saw dollar signs.

Now the thing with HIT was the main Front man Dorian was saying train like me and be big like me and don't forget buy my "TAPE", that is ok it's the American way. The thing is that the most educated person and fan does not really understand on any board or chat room seems to know is the levels of GH, TEST, the ungodly amount of orals and almost going into insulin shock it takes to be ripped 300 lbs.
The cycles we see everyday posted and someone says damn man that’s a lot of shit is nothing, I know a guy right now that is a pro in CALI that uses 5K a month in GH and that's not counting all the androgens he takes, this is pretty common nowadays by the big boys believe it or not.

So the big guy you see before you on stage did not get there by HIT he got there by $$$$ , gear, 500 grams of protein, 300 grams of carbs no sugars, beer, and no life. I bet anyone on this board if I were 26 again and using VOLUME training or periodization and using the amount of GH and insulin and gear these guys do I'd be a ripped 300lber.

MY point is if there is one is know yourself , if your 21 yrs old and see me and say wow you got big quads and then see me go squat 500lbs you think you can just go do that and have big quads.
If I tell you I use 500 grams of test and 200 grams of deca to get 300lbs is it going to work for you? SHIT NO!

IF I tell you the main stay of my protein diet is a SHIT sandwich are you going to dip into a toilet and put one of your turds on a piece of wheat bread.

There are two reasons for this post #1 a young man sent me a diet and supplement plan from a supposed guru of the boards ( You all know him) and it was the worst I'd ever seen, the worst combo of supps, diet, and workout and I swear this is a guy people look to constantly to for advice.

The other reason is people are stupid just because I have a headset on does not mean it is on. I heard someone say in the gym while my back was turned "If that guy used HIT he'd be a monster" I have been using it and I am bigger than ever, when I turned and looked it was a guy maybe 25 yrs old and about 185lbs. I did not even need to know why he said that either, some bigger guy somewhere told him this was the way to workout and now he knows the secret.

BASICALLY all I am saying to the young fellas on the boards "TO THINE ON SELF BE TRUE" us old guys have no secrets for you we can only tell you what we would do and if it don't work go to something else especially if you want to compete because nothing works 100% all the time for 100% of all the people.

:eek:
 

xcelbeyond

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If it were as "simple and straightforward" as many are led to believe, we'd all be monsters like Dorian, Coleman, Gunter, st the VERY LEAST like Arnold!

I still believe the "basis/groundwork" is nutrition (see my sig) and how many people are so focused on getting the right cycle or workout program, yet shine-on nutrition?!?!

And . . . welcome home bro!

xcel
 

xcelbeyond

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Forgot - meant to add this in one of the other posts on training where you described your method of working out. I do almost exactly the same type of workout. When I do my teardowns, the only rest I take is the amount of time it takes (and I try to do it very quickly) to tear off weights. I call this type of workout "high intensity" but it's definately not as prescribed by Mentzer.

xcel
 

Crowler

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xcelbeyond said:
If it were as "simple and straightforward" as many are led to believe, we'd all be monsters like Dorian, Coleman, Gunter, st the VERY LEAST like Arnold!

I still believe the "basis/groundwork" is nutrition (see my sig) and how many people are so focused on getting the right cycle or workout program, yet shine-on nutrition?!?!

And . . . welcome home bro!

xcel
I agree the easy part is the workout. The eating properly every day is the tough part.
 

crackerjack414

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I couldnt agrea more, im still very young and frankly its a bitch learning what works for you. Every one is so quick to hop on the band wagon. I view body building as a puzzle, I listen to just about every one within reason try new things all the time if it works for me I keep it if not I lose it. The pros have simply found what works for them, yes there are universals such as a high protein intake and high doseages of test but they found what works for them.
 

anabolic_hippie

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yah i totally agree i am a rookie but the biggest thing i have learned is that no one can tell you how to get big, there is no written in stone way, you gotta play around with deit, different ways to train, and different gear to see how your body responds, listen everyone out, but at the same time dont assume there way is the only way. everyones bodies are so dofferent it is ridiculas to assume they will react the same.
 

doug1

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i tend to agree with you fathead...but big A's experiment on himself while keeping all variables the same except for the training and him gaining some 40 lbs is hard to argue with. i love experiments like that because it is controlled. it's kind of hard to know when gear use goes through the roof, calories/protein go through the roof and the training changes also to know what exactly is the real cause of growth. i tend to lean to the factor of change since everyone has grown some degree or another on all the various training programs(the mainstream ones at least).
 

Fathead

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I am going to do a experiment

I will start my cycle in Febuary until then I will stay with my version of HIGH INTENSITY TRAINING after that just to prove a point I am going to switch to volume training just to see how my body responds. You have to remember Doug1 that BIG A and I are a little different he has had the size and the pro physique so when he was ready his body sucked up that 40 lbs he lost with no problem. I am the same way in a sense that I have trained so long that volume probably will not affect me in any negative way if anything the switch might just fire me up again and pull out some hidden muscle. I'll let you know the difference.
 

bigheinz

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I start training high intensity training since 1994 when i learn Heavy Duty from Mike Mentzer. In 2000 i was in Venice , Cal. and a friend teach me the HIT variation of Dr. Ken leistner and Rob Spector. In October 2002 a friend (certifiqued in Super low by Ken Hutchkins) teach me the Super Slow variation of HIT and changes came inmediatly again.
BUT I WAS 2 TIMES NATIONAL VENEZUELAN CHAMPION TRAINING WITH VOLUME TRAINING IN 1992 AND 1994.

Like A_h saids and we are all agree there is no written in stone but i believe we have to train with cientific basement to get the "Freaky Bodyes" and i belive the only way to get it is fallowing your instints and do what you need and you realy believe to get your goals, but instinct training was the way to get a big body, no a freaky body like Dorian, Coleman, Gunter or Ruhl, and if you have your goal i have my goal too and i want a FREAKY BODY and i want it now and the fastest way to get it is any good variation of HIT.
For example Shawn Ray was a true fallower of volume training for about 20 years and now he is training high intensity trainig.

I focus my life in be a good family leader, make money, get big and if i dont get my pro card i want to be reconized by my effort to be the best in my country and a good teacher to my people and a good leader to next generations
Peace!!!!

And remember......
The world is to little for the littles.
Bigheinz
 

JustWannaBeHuge

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Fathead said:


the main stay of my protein diet is a SHIT sandwich
dude, how many do i have to eat a day? i tried one, but it was hard to get down as I kept throwing up. j/k hehe


I personally have to agree with most guys here, the nutrition is the hardest for me to get down. I love the workouts I do, i love the amount of gear i do and it gives me great gains, but the nutrition, yuck, just trying to eat so much everyday, and always trying to hit that right amount of protein gets on my damn nerves.


JW
 

doug1

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i'm not familiar with big a's gains being from an extensive layoff and basically just getting back the muscle that atrophied. if that was the case then your point is more valid than originally. i personally enjoy training so i like volume training. but with a full time job, a wife, and two kids the time is not always there.
one of the things that i have never quite understood is hit guys say that volume training leads to overtraining. it's my understanding that overtraining is the nervous system being unable to recover, well hit taxes the nervous system much more than volume training. so i'm a bit confused on this argument. i think it's much easier to overtrain on hit than volume...
 

BALDNAZI

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overtraining

Doug your right its alot easier to overtrain with HIT because its freaking painful and if done right you are SPENT.But the difference is the rest factor.Your workouts are so brief and your training days are maybe 3 days a week tops,that your body gets enough rest to support recovery and new growth quickly.I like HIT and have used it for a few months now.My HIT went from a strict Mentzer version to Fatheads one giant set,with drops and little rest between drops. Both work as I get stronger week to week on every exercise.Volume works,and I may switch to it for a change from time to time,but HIT works faster.Again your version of HIT may be different then another guys,but the same basic principle should apply.Short,mind bendingly painful,and alot of rest until the next time you train that bodypart.Works for me,and it can work for you, order now for just $19.95.......hehe
 

Crowler

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I personally like a HIT style routine like Big A, Big Heinze and Dogg Crapp does.
 

raybravo

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Crowler said:


I agree the easy part is the workout. The eating properly every day is the tough part.
yeah its hard, its got easier now though for me cos ive been getting like 230-250 grams from liquids .... whey and milk . :) . getting another 150 isnt very hard :) .
 

stackdizzy

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[I know a guy right now that is a pro in CALI that uses 5K a month in GH and that's not counting all the androgens he takes, this is pretty common nowadays by the big boys believe it or not.

I am going to try this hit style of training as I have never done it! You have made some very valid points in your post. I see tons of kids that believe marketing hype to no end wether it be in a magazine or crap they have heard from some 170lb dude who knows a guy who does it this way and it makes me wanna luagh! Its like with gear everyone wnts this or that if they hear it works and I say they all work great just mix em up! What really comes to mind though is this one local guy that was telling everyone that 1iu of growth was more than enough and that only pro's use 5 or 6 a day! It made me laugh but for some reason alot of people believed him! Anyway I think bb should sell there blood to old men and woman for alot of cash becuase that shit could make old crippled people get up and walk again!!
 

Jungle Girl

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For women it's even harder to put on and keep quality muscle.
That being said though, after diet, AS, training and recovery are all addressed, genetic potential still plays a large role for men AND women in what can be achieved.
 

JETHRO TULL

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JUNGLE GIRL....I AGREE.

YOU CAN SPOT POTENTIALLY GREAT PHYSIQUES OUT THERE ALL THE TIME. YOU MAY SEE THEM AT A HIGH SCHOOL BASKET-BALL GAME OR WALKING AROUND TOWN. GENETICS IS A HUGE PART OF THE WHOLE DEAL. WHEN I WAS A FRESHMAN IN HIGH SCHOOL I WRESTLED 119LBS AND WAS 5'4. WHEN I WAS A JUNIOR IN HIGH SCHOOL [154LBS] WE GOT OUR FIRST FREE WEIGHTS AND A FOOTBALL COACH WHO THOUGHT LIFTING WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA. WE ALL LIFTED...MAINLY ABOUT 6 KIDS REALLY TRIED BUT I WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO GAINED 23LBS THAT YEAR. I REMEMBER ONE OF THE GUYS NAMED MIKE BERTAGNOLLI WAS PISSED OFF AND WOULD ALWAYS GIVE ME SHIT IN FRONT OF EVERYONE.....SAYING, " HE ISN'T DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENT THAN WE ARE AND HE JUST KEEPS GETTING BIGGER".....AND THE THING WAS, HE WAS 100% CORRECT. I HAVE A FREIND WHO IS 5'6 AND CURRENTLY WEIGHS 234LBS ON 1 ICN AMP A WEEK....HE BEAT AARON MADDRON AT THE EMERALD CUP IN WASHINGTON. I KID YOU NOT............NO MATTER WHAT STYLE OF LIFTING HE DOES...HE GETS BIG AND LOOKS GREAT. I REALIZE I COULD DO ALL THE DRUGS AND TRY ALL THE ROUTINES AND I'D NEVER HAVE THE ABILITY IN BODYBUILDING THAT HE DOES. SO YES, GENETICS ARE VERY IMPORTANT.
[INCIDENTLY I DO MUCH BETTER WHEN I DO LESS EXERCISES AS WELL] I CAN'T RECOVER NEARLY AS QUICKLY FROM INTENSE TRAINING AS MY FRIEND CAN. IF I COULD DO AS MUCH WORK AS HE CAN AND STILL GROW......I SURE AS HELL WOULD! I LOVE LIFTING.:)
 

Big A

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Actually, that gain wasn't after a layoff - it was over 8 years ago.
I went from 182lb to 233lb in 4 months. Only change was HIT. I was 21 years old, had been using gear since 17.
Haven't trained with anything different than HIT (what I call HIT) since then, apart from comp prep time.
 

LATS

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IN THE MID 80'S CASEY VIATOR WAS GIVING A SEMINAR. a youing man raised his hand and asked casey the question "what is the best way to train to get big?" casey got kind of a disgusted look on his face and responded " look...none of us no what the fuck we are doing. just lift heavy and eat like a pig. next question?" that pretty much sums up the argument. if ya grow from a hit program then do it. if you love high volume then do that. as long as you look forward to your workouts and are consistent in the eating and the workouts you are doing all you can do. if ya hate hit then do not do it. no matter waht someones says. and vise versa in terms of volume. train in the way you will do consistently.:D
 

MAINEVENT

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Amen LATS

The more I spend on the boards the more f..king confused I get. To actually try all methods of training, dieting, etc. would take years and a consice journal of everything.

You just summed it up best and took a load of my mind. I started to think I was doing it all wrong after 16 years.
 

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