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Lump behind left nipple

Jugghead

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OK so I've been on my "summer" cycle of a Tren/Prop/Mast blend & winny that I had posted about for 33 days now. I started feeling itchy nips after 1 wk & my left nip started swelling by day 10. I started liquid arimidex at 0.5mg/day (Bangor Labs) on day 10 to prevent it from getting bigger & also I felt alot of bloating in my upper abdomen. After a wk with no improvement, I increased dose to .75mg/day, still nothing. I had also started bromocryptine at 2.5mg twice daily about day 20 thinking maybe the lump was from the Tren, that hasn't helped. So about 10 days ago I started nolva 10mg before bed. This helped mildy, maybe 25% reduction in size. Unless some or all of these are fake I don't know what else to try. The nolva looks legit, came in foil packs of ten, box looks legit. Bromo came in little bottles of 20 pills each, labeling looks authentic, came from a source in pakistan. And the arimidex is from one of the sponsors. So, what else if anything should I try???

p.s.-I had started at 1ml/EOD of the "blend" (100/100/100) but after 21/2 wks of feeling like i had the "flu" constantly I reduced the dose to .7ml/EOD, feel much better at this dose.
 
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Jello

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Just hasn't been deleted yet. I'm sure it wont take long.
 

Birus

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tren and nolva...horrible idea


i tried the bangor orals...the winny was straight garbage...tested my piss for it and it came back negative
 

Jugghead

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tren and nolva...horrible idea

never knew this, so I'll drop it. What else should I try? This freakn lump is not only annoying/sensitive but it's very noticeable when I raise my arm. Gotta get rid of it quick!!!
 
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mike1107

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tren and nolva...horrible idea

never knew this, so I'll drop it. What else should I try? This freakn lump is not only annoying/sensitive but it's very noticeable when I raise my arm. Gotta get rid of it quick!!!
use aromasin, stronger than arimidex bro


if it doesnt change, you can

1) stop roids
2) get surgery if gyno is too noticeable, it will never come back

I would go with number 2
 

h8tr3d

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nolvadex and cabaser. It sounds like it could be from the tren. Have you used test alone before? If so, and you never got a lump, then its from the tren. It happened to me, and i used the 2 mentioned above, and it greatly reduced the lump, to where its not noticeable, and i can live with it. Try it. You'll be pleased with the results.

Also, I would try to stay away from liquid products. They never seem to work as good.
 

PsyT

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Nolva is the worst thing when taking deca/nolva!!
I sure hope you are not parroting what you have read on internet message boards because this one has been tossed around by a lot of people who have no idea where the idea came from. The (your) reasoning is surely something along these lines: nolvadex binds to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and because of activation of estrogen receptor upregulates progesterone receptors in breast tissue which the deca/tren binds to and aggravates gyno further.

Am I right about your reasoning?

Now, here's why you are wrong: nolvadex is a mixed (selective) estrogen agonist/antagonist. Some estrogen receptors it will agonize (ie "activate") and other estrogen receptors nolvadex will antagonize (ie "block"). In breast tissue nolvadex is an ANTAGONIST (this is why nolvadex is incidentally referred to as an anti-estrogen), meaning it will block the estrogen receptor from being activated by estrogen or other estrogen analogues, thereby stopping any cascade effects to the PGR receptor (ie upregulation worry you cited in your post).

Nolvadex will help block PGR induced gyno from being aggravated since estrogen is a necessary step for PGR gyno.

The use of an AI (aromatase inhibitor) concurrently with the nolvadex is recommended since there is a reason why the estrogen/PGR gyno started in the first place (elevated estrogen). I recommend aromasin since it will not negatively affect lipid levels and also will positively affect IGF levels (ie increase).

The "bro-lore" about nolvadex being dangerous to use with progestins started based on somebody citing studies how nolvadex upregulates PGR receptors. The fatal flaw with the argument as applied to our purposes was that the studies were looking at endometrial (uterus) tissue where the drug is an agonist. Remember the drug is a mixed agonist/antagonist so in the uterus the drug is activating the receptor much like estrogen does (thus the upregulation). We are using the drug for its antagonist properties in breast tissue, where it has a completely different action.
 
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Jugghead

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Nolvadex will help block PGR induced gyno from being aggravated since estrogen is a necessary step for PGR gyno.

The use of an AI (aromatase inhibitor) concurrently with the nolvadex is recommended since there is a reason why the estrogen/PGR gyno started in the first place (elevated estrogen). I recommend aromasin since it will not negatively affect lipid levels and also will positively affect IGF levels (ie increase).

Ok, so continue the Nolvadex & add aromasin? (btw, I've been using 20mg not 10mg). How much aromasin? Do I continue the Bromo?
Today was my last shot of this blend with Tren, so I'll see if the lump diminishes in size after a couple weeks off the tren.
I'll be using Prop only for 6 wks
 

PsyT

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try aromasin at 25mg everyday for 2 weeks then get bloodwork to determine where your E2 is at. If you cant do bloodwork then try the aromasin at that level and then in 1-2 weeks assess whether your joints are hurting or your sex drive tanked (a sign that your estrogen is too low).

Keep doing the nolvadex at 20mg everyday until the lump decreases and then drop to 10mg everyday.

Run the nolva and aromasin through your PCT.

stay safe bro...I think dropping your androgen dosage is going to do a lot to help you out. Some people just cant do a lot of androgens without having surgery to remove their mammory glands (like Mike mentioned earlier in the thread)>
 

J_Diggs

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I sure hope you are not parroting what you have read on internet message boards because this one has been tossed around by a lot of people who have no idea where the idea came from. The (your) reasoning is surely something along these lines: nolvadex binds to the estrogen receptor in breast tissue and because of activation of estrogen receptor upregulates progesterone receptors in breast tissue which the deca/tren binds to and aggravates gyno further.

Am I right about your reasoning?

Now, here's why you are wrong: nolvadex is a mixed (selective) estrogen agonist/antagonist. Some estrogen receptors it will agonize (ie "activate") and other estrogen receptors nolvadex will antagonize (ie "block"). In breast tissue nolvadex is an ANTAGONIST (this is why nolvadex is incidentally referred to as an anti-estrogen), meaning it will block the estrogen receptor from being activated by estrogen or other estrogen analogues, thereby stopping any cascade effects to the PGR receptor (ie upregulation worry you cited in your post).

Nolvadex will help block PGR induced gyno from being aggravated since estrogen is a necessary step for PGR gyno.

The use of an AI (aromatase inhibitor) concurrently with the nolvadex is recommended since there is a reason why the estrogen/PGR gyno started in the first place (elevated estrogen). I recommend aromasin since it will not negatively affect lipid levels and also will positively affect IGF levels (ie increase).

The "bro-lore" about nolvadex being dangerous to use with progestins started based on somebody citing studies how nolvadex upregulates PGR receptors. The fatal flaw with the argument as applied to our purposes was that the studies were looking at endometrial (uterus) tissue where the drug is an agonist. Remember the drug is a mixed agonist/antagonist so in the uterus the drug is activating the receptor much like estrogen does (thus the upregulation). We are using the drug for its antagonist properties in breast tissue, where it has a completely different action.
So are you saying that Nolvadex is ok with Tren as well, because you gave me this feedback in my thread a few days back...

Using nolvadex with trenbolone will upregulate PGR receptors which trenbolone binds to. This will result in breast tissue development that nolvadex will be useless in defending against. ONE PROBLEM WITH YOUR SHIT CYCLES.
So, now I'm a bit confused. Many of us are trying to learn as much as possible on these boards but conflicting information such as this make it difficult. Maybe you're only referring to the Deca in your above statement and not the Tren. Could you please clarify.

Also, to the gent with the lump. The only thing I found that quickly and nearly completely reduced the lump in mine was letro (used a research liquid). It took a few weeks but it basically reduced to nothing. Fair warning with Letro though since it blocks ~98% of estrogen so extended use and/or high amounts could negatively impact your immune system, congnition and joints. Good luck.
 

PsyT

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hey man it is for tren and deca. I was wrong the other day. I just learned this a few days ago after researching it myself. Take a look at the studies that have been used to verify the theory that nolvadex upregulates PGR receptors. They are all looking at uterus linings not breast tissue. Tamoxifen (nolvadex) is an antagonist in breast tissue.

I do think that nolvadex shouldnt be used for a steroid cycle though unless you are beginning to notice gyno or are prone because nolvadex reduces IGF which will hinder growth and increase fat-gain.

For personal experience, I'm currently on 10mg nolvadex and 200mg deca and test and doing great.
 

Hyper_Cell

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hey man it is for tren and deca. I was wrong the other day. I just learned this a few days ago after researching it myself. Take a look at the studies that have been used to verify the theory that nolvadex upregulates PGR receptors. They are all looking at uterus linings not breast tissue. Tamoxifen (nolvadex) is an antagonist in breast tissue.

I do think that nolvadex shouldnt be used for a steroid cycle though unless you are beginning to notice gyno or are prone because nolvadex reduces IGF which will hinder growth and increase fat-gain.

For personal experience, I'm currently on 10mg nolvadex and 200mg deca and test and doing great.
So why start spouting all this BS without even properly researching it yourself? A uterus is a bit different to a breast? Wouldn't you say?
 

PsyT

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Yes, thus the correction in this thread, Mr Hypercell.

You appear to still be misunderstanding, in that case goddess bless you son I hope things work out well for you.
 

Jugghead

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Thanks for all feedback. I'll continue nolva 20mg/day until I get the aromasin or letro. I think i'm sensitive to the tren. Never had a prob with gyno/lumps while using Test. I'll be getting some bloodwork in a few weeks.
 

J_Diggs

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hey man it is for tren and deca. I was wrong the other day. I just learned this a few days ago after researching it myself. Take a look at the studies that have been used to verify the theory that nolvadex upregulates PGR receptors. They are all looking at uterus linings not breast tissue. Tamoxifen (nolvadex) is an antagonist in breast tissue.

I do think that nolvadex shouldnt be used for a steroid cycle though unless you are beginning to notice gyno or are prone because nolvadex reduces IGF which will hinder growth and increase fat-gain.

For personal experience, I'm currently on 10mg nolvadex and 200mg deca and test and doing great.
Thanks for the clarification sir. I do realize new research corrects prior analyses so I guess the lesson for me here is that I can only make the best decisions possible based on the current available data and even then the most accurate test is on my own body since everyone reacts differently to different substances. Baby steps into usage/dosages seems logical. I am prone to gyno so having the right meds on hand to combat an onset is of primary concern.
 

Dado5

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I had lumps behind both nipples, first i didnt care but it became much bigger. I used Pramipexole and lumps got at least 70% smaller and they dont bother me anymore.
 

PsyT

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Thanks for the clarification sir. I do realize new research corrects prior analyses so I guess the lesson for me here is that I can only make the best decisions possible based on the current available data and even then the most accurate test is on my own body since everyone reacts differently to different substances. Baby steps into usage/dosages seems logical. I am prone to gyno so having the right meds on hand to combat an onset is of primary concern.
I never had a reason to doubt the "bro-lore" surrounding deca/tren and nolvadex until my first deca cycle a few weeks ago. I developed a small lump on my right nipple and then became very serious about looking at what could combat it. Obviously an AI to not get the lump any worse but I needed a blocker too but ran up against hundreds of posts on message boards talking about the PGR issue. I researched it more and found my answers (that the PGR upregulation issue is a myth based on misinterpretation). I started using nolvadex with my deca/test and immediately the lump receded. I'm semi-embarrassed that during my research I actually contributed to the "bro-lore" and told you not to run nolva with tren a while ago. Lesson learned...from now on I am thinking for myself with science and first-hand experience.

My personal plan is to stay on nolva for the forseeable future to keep the lump down (its very small now) and then re-assess whether I need surgery (which costs about 2 grand to remove mammory glands).
 

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