Macro choices when dieting

[Ocean cool]

I never actually thought of this and would like your input experience on macro when dieting.

BODYBUILDER 1
Protein = 200g
Carbs = 50g
Fats = 110g

TOTAL CALORIES = 1990

BODYBUILDER 2
Protein = 200g
Carbs = 250g
Fats = 20g

TOTAL CALORIES = 1980

My question is, does the type of macro counts considering both bodybuilders are eating the same amount of calories and (lets say) in a deficit of 500 calories a day during dieting.

The only difference is, bodybuilder 2 is taking in 4x more carbs (brown rice, oats, potatoes) more than bodybuilders 1.

Insulin a side, calories is a calories as long as u're in a deficit. What are your input on this?

Thanks guys.

 

[275bills]

Why not do both, does that blow your mind?

 

[Goobs]

Cycling this diet works great

 

[killerphysique]

I agree. Cycling keto diet is the way to go for leaning out. I go 3 days diet one, one day diet two, cycle when i'm leaning out

 

[Pharm_Fed]

IME calories don't have to be as low if you keep carbs low. I've actually dropped bodyfat while technically in a caloric surplus, but carbs were very low, protein was moderate, fats were high. There is no right answer.

 

[sma]

IME calories don't have to be as low if you keep carbs low. I've actually dropped bodyfat while technically in a caloric surplus, but carbs were very low, protein was moderate, fats were high. There is no right answer.

Good insight man ... I'll put that in the memory vault

 

[Jizzmo]

IME calories don't have to be as low if you keep carbs low. I've actually dropped bodyfat while technically in a caloric surplus, but carbs were very low, protein was moderate, fats were high. There is no right answer.

i dont think so. maybe you lost weight quickly, yeah, but that was most likely glycogen and water. in fact you probably lost weight but gained bodyfat at the same time because you ate in a surplus. you just emptied your glycogen stores and lost lots of water while gaining some body fat. mind-blowing, huh?

 

[NGL34]

endo or endo meso will respond and look best on diet 1 since their body types are usually insulin resistant.

ecto or meso will do better with diet 2 since insulin sensitive is good.


Both should lose on either diet, but endo/endo meso will get much faster results keeping carbs to a minimum.

 

[Pharm_Fed]

i dont think so. maybe you lost weight quickly, yeah, but that was most likely glycogen and water. in fact you probably lost weight but gained bodyfat at the same time because you ate in a surplus. you just emptied your glycogen stores and lost lots of water while gaining some body fat. mind-blowing, huh?

Lol. I'm 100% sure you're wrong but believe what you want.

I never said I lost weight, I said I lost body fat. Scale stayed the same for the most part. Andy carbs were enough to keep glycogen topped off, wasn't keto. And I'm pretty sure I can tell when I leaner than when I started. But you obviously know my body better than me.

Calories > macros for bulking
Macros > calories for leaning out.

 

[Jizzmo]

Lol. I'm 100% sure you're wrong but believe what you want.

I never said I lost weight, I said I lost body fat. Scale stayed the same for the most part. Andy carbs were enough to keep glycogen topped off, wasn't keto. And I'm pretty sure I can tell when I leaner than when I started. But you obviously know my body better than me.

Calories > macros for bulking
Macros > calories for leaning out.

well okay, if you kept glycogen stores filled then thats probably true. i dont know, im flat as hell after a week on low carbs (low being 200-300g a day for me basically) and i usually lose 6-10 lbs within the first week on low carbs.
and for me this also happens when i eat insane amounts of fat and protein, ive basically done a couple days of 4000 or more calories but strictly keto, it was basically 200g protein and 350g or so of fat. still dropped weight like crazy, but of course didnt lose bodyfat (well, i guess i didnt, otherwise i would diet like that all day long lol).

there are just many people who believe you can eat anything and everything as long as its "keto", just because they lose a few lbs of water weight in the beginning. wanted to clear that up

 

[Pharm_Fed]

well okay, if you kept glycogen stores filled then thats probably true. i dont know, im flat as hell after a week on low carbs (low being 200-300g a day for me basically) and i usually lose 6-10 lbs within the first week on low carbs.
and for me this also happens when i eat insane amounts of fat and protein, ive basically done a couple days of 4000 or more calories but strictly keto, it was basically 200g protein and 350g or so of fat. still dropped weight like crazy, but of course didnt lose bodyfat (well, i guess i didnt, otherwise i would diet like that all day long lol).

there are just many people who believe you can eat anything and everything as long as its "keto", just because they lose a few lbs of water weight in the beginning. wanted to clear that up

I'm no newb, I know how glycogen and water weight works

Here's another one to wrap your head around. I did one month IF and lost 20lbs scale weight, but increased PR in several lifts and actually put size on my arms and chest. I even have a thread on here about that with pictures. That was all done in a caloric deficit. And without chemical enhancement. It's quite interesting the hormonal pathways, and metabolic effects that can be manipulated with nutrition.

IMHO, the whole calories in calories out theory is like comparing HP numbers to see which car is fast. It doesn't take into consideration torque, drag, gearing, area under the curve, etc. Of course it's true if you eat less calories than you burn you will lose 'scale weight'. But to improve your physique, lose body fat while maintaining muscle, it's not that simple. Otherwise everyone would be huge and shredded.

 

[Jizzmo]

I'm no newb, I know how glycogen and water weight works

Here's another one to wrap your head around. I did one month IF and lost 20lbs scale weight, but increased PR in several lifts and actually put size on my arms and chest. I even have a thread on here about that with pictures. That was all done in a caloric deficit. And without chemical enhancement. It's quite interesting the hormonal pathways, and metabolic effects that can be manipulated with nutrition.

IMHO, the whole calories in calories out theory is like comparing HP numbers to see which car is fast. It doesn't take into consideration torque, drag, gearing, area under the curve, etc. Of course it's true if you eat less calories than you burn you will lose 'scale weight'. But to improve your physique, lose body fat while maintaining muscle, it's not that simple. Otherwise everyone would be huge and shredded.

i guess youre right. i also rate meal/nutrient timing extremely high in terms of body composition...
had some of the best recomping results back when i was natural on a carb backloading regime. its probably one of the best diets ive ever tried.
i was able to eat a LOT more carbs and calories than i would have normally and lost body fat quicker and built muscle quicker depending on how high i pushed my off day calories or the amount of carbs for the backload.

nothing beats being able to eat 2 or 3 lbs of icecream a few times per week after a workout while losing bodyfat like crazy... just via the correct meal timing. macro / meal timing manipulation is awesome.
yeah, its not exactly healthy, but every once in a while it feels damn good

 

[Pharm_Fed]

i guess youre right. i also rate meal/nutrient timing extremely high in terms of body composition...

had some of the best recomping results back when i was natural on a carb backloading regime. its probably one of the best diets ive ever tried.

i was able to eat a LOT more carbs and calories than i would have normally and lost body fat quicker and built muscle quicker depending on how high i pushed my off day calories or the amount of carbs for the backload.



nothing beats being able to eat 2 or 3 lbs of icecream a few times per week after a workout while losing bodyfat like crazy... just via the correct meal timing. macro / meal timing manipulation is awesome.

yeah, its not exactly healthy, but every once in a while it feels damn good

Now it sounds like we are on the same page.

 

[Ocean cool]

Correct me if i'm wrong guys. But since the whole calorie in calorie out theory (as long as u eat below your maintenance i.e. <500) you will lose BF (not water) if its lower carbs or lower fat.

If this is the case, i rather eat higher carbs and lower fat (as long as its a deficit of <500). I feel it more sustainable, good mood, and more energy.

I believe low carbs are good but it can make u weak, tired, and death.

 

[Pharm_Fed]

Correct me if i'm wrong guys. But since the whole calorie in calorie out theory (as long as u eat below your maintenance i.e. <500) you will lose BF (not water) if its lower carbs or lower fat.

If this is the case, i rather eat higher carbs and lower fat (as long as its a deficit of <500). I feel it more sustainable, good mood, and more energy.

I believe low carbs are good but it can make u weak, tired, and death.

I felt 100x better eating high fat low carb than any other macro arrangement I've ever tried. Better mood, better energy, better skin, better sleep, etc.

Dieting isn't just about lowering calories, it's also about manipulating insulin, glucagon, leptin, ghrelin etc to achieve the body composition you are after, not just moving the scale.

 

[NGL34]

I felt 100x better eating high fat low carb than any other macro arrangement I've ever tried. Better mood, better energy, better skin, better sleep, etc.

Dieting isn't just about lowering calories, it's also about manipulating insulin, glucagon, leptin, ghrelin etc to achieve the body composition you are after, not just moving the scale.

Amen...lot of science here. The more you know the easier it is to tweak and tailor your diet accordingly.

 

[sammy555]

endo or endo meso will respond and look best on diet 1 since their body types are usually insulin resistant.

ecto or meso will do better with diet 2 since insulin sensitive is good.


Both should lose on either diet, but endo/endo meso will get much faster results keeping carbs to a minimum.

This about sums it up. It's all about insulin sensitivity. I lose body fat a lot quicker with more carbs as low carb seems to shut down my metabolism and make me feel like shit and carbs seem to ramp it up. Curiously I seem to lean up on insulin if diet is good too. For some the complete reverse is true and they feel great on low carb and shed fat quick.

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[sammy555]

I felt 100x better eating high fat low carb than any other macro arrangement I've ever tried. Better mood, better energy, better skin, better sleep, etc.

This is most important in my eyes. I'm complete opposite and feel the above benefits on high carb. If you feel like shit on a diet you won't stick it out so gotta go with whichever makes life more enjoyable.


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[tr]

I never actually thought of this and would like your input experience on macro when dieting.

BODYBUILDER 1
Protein = 200g
Carbs = 50g
Fats = 110g

TOTAL CALORIES = 1990

BODYBUILDER 2
Protein = 200g
Carbs = 250g
Fats = 20g

TOTAL CALORIES = 1980

My question is, does the type of macro counts considering both bodybuilders are eating the same amount of calories and (lets say) in a deficit of 500 calories a day during dieting.

The only difference is, bodybuilder 2 is taking in 4x more carbs (brown rice, oats, potatoes) more than bodybuilders 1.

Insulin a side, calories is a calories as long as u're in a deficit. What are your input on this?

Thanks guys.

It is very simple...
To lose bf you need to be in calorie deficit, everyone needs to be in calorie deficit to lose bf...
Carbs are anabolic and anticatabolic carbs spikes insulin so its fattening too...the fatter the person the less % of carbs he needs to eat in his daily diet = the less carbs he eats the less anabolic and the more catabolic state he is in...while the leaner person could eat more % of carbs in his daily diet while still losing bf and staying anabolic ie gaining muscle and losing bf
If you are fat start with lower carbs, when you get lean - increase carb %, if you are lean you can eat a lot of carbs but you need to be in calorie deficit anyway if you want to lose bf

 

[Ocean cool]

I know low carbs are the way to go to lose fat which it works fine.

But i hate the feeling and don't think its sustainable.

I just wish i could eat high carbs as long as my total calories are below maintenance.

My BF% is between 7-8%.