Physician Assistant/exercise science

[androstallone-6-cpt]

First off I'm finally a member after lurking in the shadows as a reader for the past year. I was curious if anyone had any knowledge on the physician assistant career. Im currently 1 year out from completeing my exercise science BS and am considering going to grad school to become a PA as it seems like an interesting/fullfilling high paying career and I dont see any real concrete lucrative oppertunities with just my BS degree.

 

[Jarconis]

you better have an amazing gpa and extras, its very competitive

 

[Steak Helmet]

I agree the market is getting overwhelmed with PA's, nurses, and other health care related careers.

Keep your grades up, and start making connections now.

even volunteer in an office...see about shadowing someone, and even talk to as many people in the field as you can.

 

[drwost]

I think it would be an ideal time to enter the PA program. Who knows how health care reform is going to affect the supply of MD's in this country. and with costs, why pay an MD mega bucks when they can pay a PA or Nurse Practitioner less to do the same thing. I say go for it!

 

[BOOMSHAKER]

If you have the time to put in. I would move into a CRNP program. right now all across the U.S. there is a great shortage of CRNP Nurses. Most hospitals especially in the Philly area are paying big sign on bonuses. E.R. nurse are always in demand. NICU and ICU nurses make a good bit of money and never suffer any layoffs. PA's are in these days anyway a dime a dozen. Some will disagree but it's true. I have a PA in my hospital that is now a CPC, CPC-H and does Clinical Quality Management. Times are changing. Don't get me wrong, a PA is still in demand but you have to be in the right market area and may need to relocate to find the better pay.


p.s. there are some hospitals (like mine) that offer regular employees around 1k-3k if they bring in a Nurse that signs on for a minimum of 3 years. The employee gets his/her money yearly as the new hire progresses.

P.S.S. ever thing of becoming a Sports Physician? Many of these guys can find easy work with most Othro depts in any hospital. And some go on to work with Pro and Semi Pro teams.

 

[androstallone-6-cpt]

thank you for your responses, boomshaker i did actually look into CRNA but found that its pre req's would keep me from enrolling by next fall as well as in most cases not having quite as good of a salary as PA's (in general). I also looked into sports physician and the legnth of schooling and requirement of the MCAT show that its not for me. I dislike school very much but I have a decent level of intelligence and a steel work ethic (2 things a bodybuilder cant be without ) that I think could get me through. I by no means grew up poor but money was often an issue/worry in my house and I never want to live like that when im older. I feel like theres no way to tell what the future holds in terms of oppertunity, so I figure pursuing a high paying career that has many different concentrations is a good start.


As a PA I could work in the drug rehab type field which is appealing to me because I like to motivate people and being a personal trainer through college has taught me some about dealing with difficult people, anyone have experience working in drug rehabilitation???

 

[kid1dakota]

When I was in Chiropractic school I had 3 PA's in my class.They all basically had bad experiences being talked down to and ran ragged by Doctors they had worked for.
But on the other hand I have an uncle who has been a PA for years and loves it.
My suggestion to you and anyone is spend some time with and around some people doing the job your interested in first. really really really know that is what you want to do before jumping into it and going to school and getting in debt and spending all that time.I made a huge mistake going into something I didn't know enough about and ended up hating it. Good luck

 

[drwost]

When I was in Chiropractic school I had 3 PA's in my class.They all basically had bad experiences being talked down to and ran ragged by Doctors they had worked for.

Don't MD's do this to everyone?

 

[xmoo]

a PA always has to work under a doctors supervision and license. ur a permanent intern of sorts. a nurse practitioner can open a practice, has their own DEA #, can bill Insurance companies etc. iow, ur not beholden to anyone -- and a crna makes WAY more than a NP or PA at least in the NE (check salary.com or bls.gov)

 

[witefall]

Forgive me for asking the obvious question, but why not set your sights a bit higher on med school?

I mean, if you want to be a bear, might as well be a grizzly.

It's only a few extra years of school, but the financial payoff and lifestyle is very nice. You can choose your specialty to fit your personal lifestyle goals. Not ALL MDs are overworked or have "god complex." JMO.

 

[mitochondria]

idk could be wrong, but a degree in exercise science, isnt that completly diff courese than the route for a PA, have yuo even looked at the classes or are you just doing that for peet sake

 

[witefall]

One other thought. And this is to anyone reading this post that may be in that the same stage of life. Let me give you some serious fucking advice and think about this long and hard.

Do you want to be happy? Do you want to enjoy your work? Do you want to make a nice income? Your answer of course should be yes to all questions.

Next, think through EVERY possible education track, degree, non-degree career you can think of, and don't immediately dismiss anything without thinking it through. Try to narrow it down to a list of 5-10 careers and then go VOLUNTEER in those areas to see if the reality of the job is close to your perceived reality.

Then, forget about how many years of training it may take, forget about how high the school loans may be, forget about all that stuff. I promise you as you get older, time just melts away and the years blend. Just find what you want to do and then commit to it. Don't worry about how long it takes.
Don't be afraid to succeed!

Otherwise, you will be 40 years old and facing a mid-life crisis b/c you hate your job, your lifestyle and now looking to go back to school.

I was lucky to have this explained to me when I was 18. And it stuck with me. I'm almost 40, and happy as can be, and if I ever run into the guy that gave me this advice, I swear I'm going to repay him ten-fold for that wonderful nugget of advice.

Sorry if this is a rant. But just hoping some 18-24 y/o reads this and takes it as the truth. Don't be in a hurry to finish the race. Just be in a hurry to enter the correct race.

 

[androstallone-6-cpt]

thanks for the input everyone, to answer a couple of your questions...Entrance into the program only requires four additional courses that are outside my Exercise Science BS. Being a doctor would be nice however I have to be realistic enough to realize I am not genetically gifted with enough intelligence to cut it in med school, much the same way Ill never be able to step on stage w/ Ronnie and Jay, plus I really dont want to spend my prime physical years 25-30 broke sitting in a classroom, the "work now play later" mentality is the only thing thats got me through thus far (and of course bodybuilding to keep my sanity). I am planning out my courses for next semester to get on track for the PA program.

"Don't be in a hurry to finish the race. Just be in a hurry to enter the correct race."

-This speaks volumes about finding balance in life,,, I feel like I've finally found the right race and I'm ready to sprint for the finish.

 

[myosin]

One other thought. And this is to anyone reading this post that may be in that the same stage of life. Let me give you some serious fucking advice and think about this long and hard.

Do you want to be happy? Do you want to enjoy your work? Do you want to make a nice income? Your answer of course should be yes to all questions.

Next, think through EVERY possible education track, degree, non-degree career you can think of, and don't immediately dismiss anything without thinking it through. Try to narrow it down to a list of 5-10 careers and then go VOLUNTEER in those areas to see if the reality of the job is close to your perceived reality.

Then, forget about how many years of training it may take, forget about how high the school loans may be, forget about all that stuff. I promise you as you get older, time just melts away and the years blend. Just find what you want to do and then commit to it. Don't worry about how long it takes.
Don't be afraid to succeed!

Otherwise, you will be 40 years old and facing a mid-life crisis b/c you hate your job, your lifestyle and now looking to go back to school.

I was lucky to have this explained to me when I was 18. And it stuck with me. I'm almost 40, and happy as can be, and if I ever run into the guy that gave me this advice, I swear I'm going to repay him ten-fold for that wonderful nugget of advice.

Sorry if this is a rant. But just hoping some 18-24 y/o reads this and takes it as the truth. Don't be in a hurry to finish the race. Just be in a hurry to enter the correct race.

I like this alot.

If you do volunteer/interview somewhere though- you may need to go to a couple different places/people... you might find a bitter person that could give you the wrong picture of things (they may have some valid points but d/t other issues in their life, their general psyche, etc they could just completely skew everything).

 

[xmoo]

you are incorrect... a simple google search would have found the following:

Physician assistant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

what exactly is incorrect? here I'll do the same: "your statement that I'm incorrect is incorrect".


but treating your post seriously, here is the pertinent part of your "simple goggle search":

"A physician assistant (PA) is a healthcare professional licensed to practice medicine with supervision of a licensed physician.... Physician assistants exercise autonomy in medical decision making as determined by their supervising physician.



and even more clearly from **broken link removed**

"Role of a PA

The scope of practice of Physician Assistants is determined by their supervising physician and state legislation. ......The physician does not need to be physically present when the PA provides these and other services, but the PA always works with the supervision of the physician, who maintains the overall responsibility for the patient's care. "



whats not clear?

/

 

[witefall]

thanks for the input everyone, to answer a couple of your questions...Entrance into the program only requires four additional courses that are outside my Exercise Science BS. Being a doctor would be nice however I have to be realistic enough to realize I am not genetically gifted with enough intelligence to cut it in med school, much the same way Ill never be able to step on stage w/ Ronnie and Jay, plus I really dont want to spend my prime physical years 25-30 broke sitting in a classroom, the "work now play later" mentality is the only thing thats got me through thus far (and of course bodybuilding to keep my sanity). I am planning out my courses for next semester to get on track for the PA program.

"Don't be in a hurry to finish the race. Just be in a hurry to enter the correct race."

-This speaks volumes about finding balance in life,,, I feel like I've finally found the right race and I'm ready to sprint for the finish.

Good luck to you. But I PROMISE you that making it through med school is only 5% intellegence and 95% dedication to reading and studying. The only real difference b/w PA school and med school is the AMOUNT of reading and studying, not the difficulty level.

Also, if you decide med school is not what you want, maybe think about this. Look into anesthesia assistant programs over physician assistant programs. Much better money, much better life/hours, and the anesthesia docs love their assistants. Emory in ATL GA has a fantastic website about their program. Good luck to you.

 

[The Booger]

CRNA's make damn good money. Most programs do not allow you to work while going through the program (I've looked into it a lot, and know 3 people in the program, 1 graduating this year, and another going in this year). They say it is impossible to do so and not fail out. Too many clinical hours, too much reading, etc.

The one graduating will be roughly $150k in debt when all is said and done. But he's already got a job lined up at $125k a year. Take $25k a year for loans to pay back......you're out of student loans in 6-7 years while still making $100k+. He paid for his gas, house payments, etc all through student loans.

That's the #1 program I am looking at when I am ready to move on. #2 choice is In Flight NP. Big pay cut, but more exciting (about $60k a year).

And let me remind you, that $125k a year is in a small hospital, with no competitors in the area. Another place about a hour away was higher, with one year experience, $200k with 6 weeks paid vacation a year......$15k sign on bonus.

The whole "smart enough" to do this and that crap....is exactly that. You ARE smart enough. It's just like bodybuilding. Will you be the best cardiac surgeon in the world? Probably not. Can you still be a good one? With enough hard work YES! I know some of the damn dumbest nurses outside work but at work they are brilliant.

 

[Medic08]

Forgive me for asking the obvious question, but why not set your sights a bit higher on med school?

I mean, if you want to be a bear, might as well be a grizzly.

It's only a few extra years of school, but the financial payoff and lifestyle is very nice. You can choose your specialty to fit your personal lifestyle goals. Not ALL MDs are overworked or have "god complex." JMO.

I am a paramedic and I planned on becoming on an MD(currently working on my BA in biology) and threw around the idea of becoming a PA.... However I did the pro's vs con's list and PA came out on top(for me anyway)

1. PA school = 4 years BA, 2 years PA school, no residency, student loans are smaller, less schooling, malpractice insurance cheaper, still coming out of school on average making $85-100k per year(depending on where you live and what your specialty is) and still able to have some sort of perosnal life

2. Med school = 4 years BA, 4 years med school, residency can be from 3 years all the way to 6 years depending on your specialty, student loans out like CRAZY, malpractice is sky high, no personal life until resdiency is finished.

This just naming a few things. IF I were to become a MD I would either be a ER dr. or a cardiologist. ER dr.'s on avereage come out of residency making $140K/year. Sounds good right? Wrong.... Tack on $500/month in student loans x's 10 years plus God knows what in malpractice insurance and all the sudden your $140,000/year just turned into $70k per year. Obviously depending on your specialty is how much you're paying in malpractice insurance.

Sure I want to have MD beside my name, but is it really worth it? IMO no. Now I've also thrown around the idea of bridging to RN(would only take 1 year) and then applying to CRNA school. CRNA's make ton's of money and all you do is push drugs, tube people, monitor them while they are under anathseia(sp?), and then wake them up, oh and some facilities let CRNA's do spinal taps/epi durals.

Im still young so thank God I have time on my side to think about these things, but teh good thing is that my BA will allow me to do anyone of the career's that I have listed above.

 

[Gambel]

A lot of good advice in this thread. I graduated from one of the top med schools in the country in the late 90s. Now just over a decade later, over 50% of the members from my graduating class (including myself) have left clinical medicine. Where did most of us end up:

1. Much higher paying administrative positions;
2. Start up consulting and health care-related tech firms;
3. Academic research (with no required patient panel or clinical appt);
4. Other forms of business (e.g., venture capital consultant, etc.).

Why have the majority of us moved on?
1. Frustration with the structure of managed care and poor health plan reimbursement;
2. Frustration over patients that are non-compliant with treatment yet want to blame the physician when their physical health deteriorates;
3. Earnings do not match the level of effort and long work hours required;
4. Shift in the balance of clinical decision making away from the physician and toward hospital administrators and bureaucrats.

It is unlikely that the OP has taken all of the course requirements to even be eligible for med school.

To the OP, my recommendation would be to focus on a career path that you enjoy. The "average" salaries that are reported on the web and the anecdotal salary information provided by others are no indication of the actual salary you earn. That will be based on countless factors. As others have mentioned, the best way to get started is to try and shadow a PA in several settings, an NP, etc. Through that experience, you will be able to deduce if you have a preference for one career path over another. Best of luck to you!

G

 

[witefall]

I am a paramedic and I planned on becoming on an MD(currently working on my BA in biology) and threw around the idea of becoming a PA.... However I did the pro's vs con's list and PA came out on top(for me anyway)

1. PA school = 4 years BA, 2 years PA school, no residency, student loans are smaller, less schooling, malpractice insurance cheaper, still coming out of school on average making $85-100k per year(depending on where you live and what your specialty is) and still able to have some sort of perosnal life

2. Med school = 4 years BA, 4 years med school, residency can be from 3 years all the way to 6 years depending on your specialty, student loans out like CRAZY, malpractice is sky high, no personal life until resdiency is finished.

This just naming a few things. IF I were to become a MD I would either be a ER dr. or a cardiologist. ER dr.'s on avereage come out of residency making $140K/year. Sounds good right? Wrong.... Tack on $500/month in student loans x's 10 years plus God knows what in malpractice insurance and all the sudden your $140,000/year just turned into $70k per year. Obviously depending on your specialty is how much you're paying in malpractice insurance.

Sure I want to have MD beside my name, but is it really worth it? IMO no. Now I've also thrown around the idea of bridging to RN(would only take 1 year) and then applying to CRNA school. CRNA's make ton's of money and all you do is push drugs, tube people, monitor them while they are under anathseia(sp?), and then wake them up, oh and some facilities let CRNA's do spinal taps/epi durals.

Im still young so thank God I have time on my side to think about these things, but teh good thing is that my BA will allow me to do anyone of the career's that I have listed above.

I'm not sure where you are getting your numbers from as far as MD income goes, but they are very far off. If you are looking at some "national average salary" info it is not correct b/c those numbers don't adjust for MDs that work part time or for the Health Dept or Prisons and such and they only can take into account salaried MD jobs, such as those at a hospital. Nobody can accurately determine the national average of private practice, full time MDs per specialty. Many sources will claim to have rough estimates, but they are all wrong.

I don't have any MD friends in private practice that make under 400K per year, and I'm not even in a major city. And the average is about 600K in my area. But to be fair, ER docs are on the "lower" end of the scale, but it's because they work for someone else. They don't own/partnership a business, they don't have business loans to pay but they don't have assets to sell when they retire either. A good friend of mine is an ER doc in a city of 200K people and he makes 250K a year. He works 4 days a week. Not a bad salary for the lower end of the profession, and for someone without overhead. Do the math and you will discover you can pay back student loans w/o even feeling it, along with a nice mortgage, private school for kids, vacations and retirement.

Time in school is a very bad factor to look at! It is much better to just take out loans for living expenses during the long training periods. You will easily make more than enough to pay the loans back and not feel it. If you use length of program to help determine your path, I promise you that you will regret it 15 years down the road. Nothing worse that to be mentally bored at work and know you could have done more.

Not everyone should go for MD or DMD (most dentists make 300K+ a year), but if you have the ability to do it, and you don't do it b/c of the wrong reasons, you will regret your life. That is a promise. Just think about it and make sure you pick your path based on the right reason . . . the job that will make you happy for a lifetime, not the path that got you there.