Pros and Cons

[ddcmdb]

Ok, I have a friend who is a very passionate Vegan. I'm wondering if the long term can affect one's health?

This is a post he made on his web page: TO EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU WHO CONSUMES MEAT: Congratulations on your part in contributing to the paltry, filthy, slave-like conditions in which people the world over work. Mothers are kept from their children for years at a time so they can make enough just enough $ to not starve to death all so you can shovel that 99 cent McShitcken down your throat.

Their blood, mixed with sweat, dirt and fecal matter, is ON YOUR HANDS. Make fun of vegans and eat animals all you want, but the only meat you have any business eating is that which you kill. To even the most occassional meat-eaters: do not quote philosophy or scripture about caring for your fellow man or about loving thy neighbor while you eat meat without knowing for a fact it was raised true-free-range in the U.S. You are a hypocrite.

He started this huge debate and it was all good and fun until a friend of his kept telling everyone who ate meat to fuck off ha.

I explained to him that my family raises alfalfa, wheat, and cattle and that it's been going on for six generations and I enjoy putting my money into something that my family stands for and what we've done.

My question is if this lifestyle is truly healthy? and is it truly beneficial. I've learned in all my classes that they would be deficient in alot of things and that diet would require them to supplement for the rest of their lives. I just can't imagine what kind of impact this would have on kids eating this way? I would make the assumption that kids wouldn't be nearly the height or weight or musculature with a vegan diet and could quite frankly be detrimental to their health.

Someone shed some light on this, so next time this gets brought up I'll be loaded for my side of the story.

 

[hawkmoon]

I have never met a healthy looking vegan, they may be out there, but I haven't met one.


As far as arguing with him - I'd put it up there with religion: logical reasoning won't work, so don't even try. Let him live his life and ignore his rants.

 

[ddcmdb]

Just read your post. Yes I agree he looks like he has HIV and isn't very tall.

I just got mad cuz I was like what the fuck? lol My family raises alfalfa and sells to dairy's so the cows can get sufficient nutrients to produce good milk.

 

[NYC Diesel]

Tell him if he we weren't made to eat meat we wouldn't have canine teeth what a fucking toolbag, have your own beliefs but don't hate on others because they don't follow your ways....Bet you the piece of shit couldn't get his ass in the gym 3 days a week but yet thinks he's somehow superior by not eating meat, tell your friend to take a sausage and shove it in his mouth.

 

[ddcmdb]

He doesn't shop at wal-mart either... Just one of those people. I'm like damn dude if you're that worried about the environment why wouldn't you just get groceries at wal-mart beside your house instead of driving 10 miles out of the way to the health foods store.

God I'd post the whole fucking argument if it wasn't 49 comments long. It was ridiculous.... It's just ridiculous man... He's not exactly a friend but a "friend" (my girl cuts hair with his wife and I met him through that). Thought he was cool until I read his self righteous "hate the omnivore thread".

 

[scrapper13]

he will probably outlive all of us lol

 

[buselmo]

This is a post he made on his web page: TO EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU WHO CONSUMES MEAT: Congratulations on your part in contributing to the paltry, filthy, slave-like conditions in which people the world over work. Mothers are kept from their children for years at a time so they can make enough just enough $ to not starve to death all so you can shovel that 99 cent McShitcken down your throat.

Their blood, mixed with sweat, dirt and fecal matter, is ON YOUR HANDS. Make fun of vegans and eat animals all you want, but the only meat you have any business eating is that which you kill. To even the most occassional meat-eaters: do not quote philosophy or scripture about caring for your fellow man or about loving thy neighbor while you eat meat without knowing for a fact it was raised true-free-range in the U.S. You are a hypocrite.

What?

some people just have no purpose in life... other than being annoying...

tell him to live on 2 cucumbers a day and sponsor 25 poor families with the money he saves... lets see how much he "cares" for man kind.

 

[Rictor33]

People are their moral high-horses.. They will get over it at some point. Being vegan makes you deficient in many vital vitamins and minerals and in the long run is probably not the healthiest way to live your life. Ever see those orthorexic people who die at like age 45 because their so malnourished? We have teeth and a digestive system that are used for consuming animals. If you're on top of the food chain, why waste it? He's another guy who is going to martyr himself out for every cause out there and not let anyone forget about it.. He will sit on his soapbox and act high and mighty about his righteous lifestyle choices and how he's 'better' than everyone else because he is trying to do something to save the world. Well he'll find himself alone a couple years down the road and he'll wonder why. He can scream at the top of his lungs about his anti-meat Jihad, but the fact is he is not going to change anything. So why waste your time over it? A true vegan? Methane is used in many fuels we use today? Wanna stop traveling? Oh thats right, maybe you can ride your bike everywhere like some Brooklyn hipster faggot.. Down Pillows? Oops. Baseball? Football? Fuck that stuff. How far are you willing to go before you realize you are hurting yourself for absolutley NO REASON.

 

[ddcmdb]

He then proceeded to get punked....
I was just pissed like man seriously? It's no wonder you're 5'5" dude.

This is what got thrown back in his face:
Just think of all those poor starving people and the terrible conditions that they must go through. What kind of hellhole, poverty-stricken countries do they live in?

**broken link removed**

Oh... 95% of it is from Canada, New Zealand, and Australia, which are modernized, fully industrialized countries in which the standard is within the top 10 countries in the world. Well shit, how inconvenient. Better luck next time, champ.

He replied with this:

I'll only respond to Mike for now. I didn't say 3rd world countries. In fact, i didn't specify what kind of country because this happens mostly in modernized countries. Even work conditions in North America are deplorable, and we supposedly have sanctions/conditions in place to prevent these things. Many, many North American working conditions are disgusting and totally illegal. Plenty of modern countries ignore or simply lack laws to protect workers in the meat industry. Also, Mike, your stats are misleading. That 5% still accounts for millions of lbs of meat brought in by many workers in Asia, Africa and, I believe parts of Australia living in these conditions. Keep justifying your diet however you like, man. But your stats aren't completely relevant to my point.
Sun at 1:46am

Oh, and how did I miss the fact that those stats account for meat AND DAIRY. We import more dairy than meat from places like Canada. And the dairy trade, while it has it own set of serious problems, is not what im addressing. This makes your stats completely irrelevant to my point. Nice try, Mike. You get points for style but I'm going to have to deduct for lack of real substance.

Then got shot down again:
I'll give you that, the stats don't consider for working conditions... but keep in mind that sweatshop conditions are substantially harder to get under the radar in industrialized countries that have legislation against it, such as the US, Canada, and Australia. Not impossible, just much harder.
Asia is the worst about this, but we don't import any beef, pork, poultry, or eggs from China. In fact, they import a lot of that, along with most of their fruit and veggies, from us. Most of what foods the US imports from China are spices and specialty foods, not staple items like beef.

Also, if you'll have another look at our 2008 imports there, we don't import a single pound of meat from Africa or Asia (other than Japan). Both countries have very little usable farmland, and what little they can grow stays in the country.

In addition, to quote from the document, "These data are for meat and poultry imports." "All egg product imports were from Canada." Read it again... you have gravely misunderstood its meaning.

So he quit arguing with this guy and started in on the people who weren't as educated on the matter...

I don't go around trying to enforce my lifestyle on others and make them think that the way the live was derived from satans lifestyle.

 

[Snuka]

Most vegans I know are wanna be's. They don't do it because health reasons. They do it because either they love animals too much or they want to lose weight. Every vegan I have met was a uneducated woman who didn't know anything about nutrition. All they did was stop eating meat and ultimately became unhealthy. Their hair looked like shit, they lost all their muscle mass....etc.

Most are either underweight or way over weight. Remember potato chips and oreo's are not made of meat.They have no idea how to complement proteins so that you can make incomplete protein sources complete.None of girls I know even take supplements like calcium, vitamin d etc.... Also they do not know which fruits and vegetables contain what vitamins and how much. Being a vegan takes research and an education. LONG LIVE BEEF!!!!!!

 

[hawkmoon]

Ah, the heck with it, just ask him:
"If we weren't supposed to eat animals why are they made out of delicious meat?"

 

[Rictor33]

Alot of vegetarian/vegan girls I know/have met are in their late teens/early 20's and basically have no idea about nutrition. More often then not their masking an eating disorder and end up becoming anemic when their mommy and daddy finally force them to go to a doctor after weeks of complaining about lethargy. The problem is with those diets is you kill your thyroid and when you go back to eating normally you blow up like a balloon.

 

[Athlete]

Ah, the heck with it, just ask him:
"If we weren't supposed to eat animals why are they made out of delicious meat?"

Ah, but I we weren't supposed to eat humans, why are we made of delicious meat?

Seriously though, I will never, ever, unless it's a matter of survival, eat factory farmed meat again. It's a fucked up industry, and I'm not going to support it. Period.

Fish, that's fine. Caught in the wild? No problem.

So yeah, I'm more with the vegans than I am with the Joe Schmoe meat eater.

 

[robot]

While I admit that I am definitely not a fan of feedlots, pig barns or chicken factories, I am a big fan of meat.

Veganism as a health stance doesn't make make a lot of sense. Humans are not herbivores.

Veganism as a pollitical stance makes even less sense to me. People are not hungry because there is not enough food. The problem is almost entirely in the logistics of transportation and distribution. Arguing that I should not eat meat because it is expensive ignores the simple fact that I can afford it.

Veganism as an ethical stance makes a little bit of sense to me because as I said modern feedlots, pig barns and chicken factories offend me but I can choose to buy pasture raise and free range and remove this ethical dilemna without spending my life eating tofu.

Veganism as a moral stance is outlandish. No where in nature do you find something that doesn't eat something else. Even plants eat animals. This is entirely natural.

oh well, on the plus side they take up less space and if they annoy me I can always eat them.

 

[hawkmoon]

Ah, but I we weren't supposed to eat humans, why are we made of delicious meat?

I have no idea if we are delicious; is there something you want to tell us Mr. Dahlmer?


I would certainly eat farm raised if I could, but in Japan I take what I can get.

 

[michelin]

oh well, more for those of us that eat it. Thank your friend for me

 

[Phidias]

I have a hardtime picturing myself a condemned man whose last will would be "a cigarette and a plate of lettuce leaves"... LOL!

 

[Ehren]

Like it or not, humans are made of meat. We dont have ruminant bellies like gorillas or cows that can convert vegis into protein.

Can they combine food to get the protein they need, sure. But that takes WAAAAY more knowledge and consistency than even what BBers do. Hence the HIV-addled look most have. On the other hand, Bill Pearl did it, supposedly.

Ive dealt with this recently. My sister was pregnant at 35 and a long time Vegan, she just doesnt like meat, not political. She got preggo and with support from her asshole hippie friends, kept it vegan. And lost the baby.

She had some bloodwork done and it was terrible, hormones all out of whack, Thyroid was nil etcetera.

Sedond try now, she's in her 8th month and eating meat by the plateload. She feels better, the fetus is healthy, all appears to be going well! My fingers are crossed.

We are made of it, that simple.

 

[thebrick]

I have never met a healthy looking vegan, they may be out there, but I haven't met one.

I agree. They always look kinda of a pasty greyish-green color and anorexic

Oh! Almost forgot my favorite vegan/animal-rights story: worked with a woman years back, same thing, passionate animal rights, blah, blah, blah, but drove a Jag XJ6 that was lined with the hides of a whole heard of cows. Things that make you go, hmmmm...

 

[Shelby]

To those of you who have not met a healthy,
good looking, strong and active vegetarian,
well . . . let me introduce you to my wife.
(To those who have taken the time to look
at any of my vacation fotos, she is prominently
displayed there.)

She has been a vegetarian for over 30 years
and is in her early 50's and I can honest say
she is the healthiest, and pound for pound the
strongest person I have ever met. She pays
a great deal of time and attention to diet
and exercise and it show in her physique, her
health and her performance. She has raced
bicycles in the US and Europe and is one of
those rare creatures that gets stronger with
each set when training with weights and she
is freakishly strong in many exercises. Her
legs (which are better than most men's)
and torso I would put up against just about
anybody, her hamstrings in particular which
she does next to nothing for.

She is currently in training for a long distance
walk, the Pacific Crest Trail, which is a 2,650
mile national scenic trail that runs from Mexico
to Canada through California, Oregon and
Washington. It will take her about 4 months.

She has nothing against people who eat meat,
has made her choice to be a vegetarian for
health and ethical reasons and regularly prepares
meat for me, perfectly, without ever a tasting it
herself.

I could go on and on but won't.

And you know me, I'm up for posting pics to back
it up if anybody is interested. Let me know.

No dairy or eggs? Fish?