The MOTHER OR ALL CYCLES!!! How to put together??

[Fullybuilt]

Dammit, it was supposed to say mother "of" all cycles, but you cant edit the title LOL
Ok its gonna start in oct or nov and its gonna be a lean bulker.

16weeker but im wondering if I should add certain compounds in the beginning or end and im gonna do two orals and were to incorperate those.
Here are the options, let me know what you all think is best, and please no saying "thats too much,etc..." I know what im doing and im a hard gainer but im at 5'10" 235lbs %11 b/f

Ok: Here is what my original plan was:
weeks 1-16 Gh 6iu's ED/50mg proviron and 25mg aromasin ED
weeks 1-4 and 8-12 IGF1Lr3 80mcg EOD
weeks 4-8 and 12-16 8-10ius Slin PWO only
Weeks 1-16 1gram test(prop and cyp)
Weeks 1-12 NPP 700mg/wk
Weeks 12-16 Tren 100mg EOD
Weeks 1-4 Tbol 80mg ED
Weeks 10-16 Var 80mg ED

So im just wondering, should I keep it like that or change something around, like doing the tren 4weeks and NPP the last 12. Also should I use the tbol with the NPP in the beginning or the var or use the var with the tren,etc..... I just wonder is there is a better way of putting that together b/c some compounds react better with other. Thanks

 

[glenihan]

i'd be interested to see if you wouldn't gain just as much just using test for 16 weeks and tren for 10.....

 

[Fullybuilt]

Already gonna use 500iu HCG 2x weekly. I def plan on 2gallons of water, 1000mg milk thistle and 1000mg ala daily, etc.... Im gonna eat a lot on this cycle but keep junkfood to a minimum to keep my cholesterol in check.The cycle sounds like a lot b/c its a lot of compounds but they are not all at once. Its basically a test cycle with a deca(npp) and oral the first 12weeks and the same the last 4 but tren instead of deca(npp)

 

[STORM SHADOW]

I think the combination of tbol/var/proviron/tren/ makes for a rough cycle on the organs. I would maybe scrap the proviron until PCT, and instead consider HCG 500iu EOD or some thing? I think 50-60mg/var is sufficient as well.

On a cycle like this I would never dare to try it taking any thing less then 2 gallons of h20/day along with milk thistle/liv52/synthergine, with the slin I would also drink cranberry juice.

I know that Proviron makes a great PCT... but shouldn't we also use it during mass cycles to keep the higher levels of estrogen from attaching to receptors? seems the proviron acting as an estrogen itself will attach to the estrogen sensitive receptors keeping the stronger estrogens from causing related problems such as gyn?

THE STORM

 

[Nssca]

i'd be interested to see if you wouldn't gain just as much just using test for 16 weeks and tren for 10.....

I agree. if you cant gain from test and tren your either not eating enough or your over training.

 

[RBB]

I agree. if you cant gain from test and tren your either not eating enough or your over training.

agreed. test and tren is all you need to grow on. maybe some gh as well. if you're a "hard gainer" like you say try eating more, not using more gear.

 

[Gavin Kane]

Almost every one of my off-season cycles were either just test or test and tren when I was bulking for the nationals.

Of course I do gh year round and take slin and igf but as far as androgens go, test and tren is awesome. I used to take boatloads of test and eat everything I could get my hands on. It was good enough to get me to the national stage.

 

[dr.tooth]

your cycle sounds like one of mine. i think you are being a little bit excessive on the gh. i use 3.6 iu's for 5 days on / 2 days off till week 8 and then rev it up to 6 then to 9 the last 4 weeks. no need for the proviron due to the aromasin. add nov or prov the last 4 weeks. your body needs some estro to function correctly (meaning natural hormone production and i am not talking about sex hormones). never used t-bol but from what i heard its like d-bol without the sides. i would run that for 6 weeks then switch to drol for the last 6 weeks. i would start with longer acting test like ent than gradually switch to cyp then to prop. i would run the tren for the last 6 weeks along with the drol, prop, var, nov, proviron. you can even add some winstrol the last 6 weeks too! bro is this cycle for the nats in miami? cause this is turning in a bulker then i real tightener...! as far as the igf1, i use it at 100 mcg IM in my bi and tris (25 per bi and 25 per tri alternating heads) 3 days on 4 days off in between my insulin and its preworkout!!!

 

[dragonfire101]

Are you competing or planing to.

5'10" 235lbs %11 b/f

Those look like some good stats. Wouldn't say your a hard gainer. Were are you trying to get.

Thats alot of orals and alot of aromisin ED. What's the reason for the NPP. Are you trying to bulk or cut or do both.

 

[terryd5150]

.... if you're a "hard gainer" like you say try eating more, not using more gear.

The best advice in the whole thread.

 

[Fullybuilt]

To anwser some ?'s. This cycle is for as much muscle as possible without massive water retention and fat gain. thats why im not running long acting esters or drol.Im not competing. I did once and it wasnt for me. Unfortunatley I don't really have the genetics to do well plus im only 24 and didnt even pick up weight until 19 and 2years was basically all dieting. So I really only have a few years of bulking under my belt so I don't have much maturity at all. Lots of mass though. Legs contribute to much of my weight. About 29" now and calves are around 18.5"
Anyway, many of you are saying test and tren to grow, but NPP is somewhat similar to tren and im adding tren at the end without npp so really this is only a test and trenlike cycle, with some orals and GH. I'll try to post some b/f and after pics for this one.

 

[Fullybuilt]

Are you competing or planing to.


Those look like some good stats. Wouldn't say your a hard gainer. Were are you trying to get.

Thats alot of orals and alot of aromisin ED. Why not just run tren all the way through. What's the reason for the NPP. Are you trying to bulk or cut or do both.

I've never tried NPP and wanted to give it a shot. I heard awesome things about it. And this is mainly a bulker so I think i'll benefit. 16weeks of tren seems too harsh, but if I don't like the NPP as much as the tren, i'll prob cut the NPP at the 6week mark and replace it with tren at 100-150mg EOD

I thought 25mg aromasin ED was a normal dose especially since im running 1g test and 700mg NPP? don't they aromatize pretty bad? Maybe i'll use 12.5 ED and get my estradiol checked then i'll know if I gotta up it.

 

[Fullybuilt]

The best advice in the whole thread.

I definatley agree. Unfortunately when on cycle my appetite goes to shit. Especially on tren, thats why im hoping NPP will give me an appetite. I may just have to run 1000mcg b-12 daily to help with it.

 

[Dave_19]

I know that Proviron makes a great PCT... but shouldn't we also use it during mass cycles to keep the higher levels of estrogen from attaching to receptors? seems the proviron acting as an estrogen itself will attach to the estrogen sensitive receptors keeping the stronger estrogens from causing related problems such as gyn?

THE STORM

I only say to consider running it PCT instead is to give the liver a break. It’s only moderately toxic yes but combined with every thing else listed in that cycle it really is a lot of extra un-necessary stress IMO.

 

[Massive G]

Almost every one of my off-season cycles were either just test or test and tren when I was bulking for the nationals.

Of course I do gh year round and take slin and igf but as far as androgens go, test and tren is awesome. I used to take boatloads of test and eat everything I could get my hands on. It was good enough to get me to the national stage.

Word.
although I am not big on people using tren as a base of every cycle a core of test deca or EQ can't be beat.
Guys? ever wonder what the pros are on, or used when gaining mass?
I can gurantee it wasn't tboll var and all these fancy dancy cycles blocking estro and prolactin and etc.
Most of the big boys do the model T stuff but go on the boards and see the kids doing all these fancy cycles with the latest compounds and IGF-1 slin GH etc which they aren't even getting half the benefit of because they are so young.

 

[Dave_19]

Word.
although I am not big on people using tren as a base of every cycle a core of test deca or EQ can't be beat.
Guys? ever wonder what the pros are on, or used when gaining mass?
I can gurantee it wasn't tboll var and all these fancy dancy cycles blocking estro and prolactin and etc.
Most of the big boys do the model T stuff but go on the boards and see the kids doing all these fancy cycles with the latest compounds and IGF-1 slin GH etc which they aren't even getting half the benefit of because they are so young.

I agree about the tren, If you value your kidneys you wont get used to incuding this as base for all cycles. imagine at 24 if you bbing for another decade and use tren every cycle for 10 years.. Ouch

 

[bulldog21]

Word.
although I am not big on people using tren as a base of every cycle a core of test deca or EQ can't be beat.
Guys? ever wonder what the pros are on, or used when gaining mass?
I can gurantee it wasn't tboll var and all these fancy dancy cycles blocking estro and prolactin and etc.
Most of the big boys do the model T stuff but go on the boards and see the kids doing all these fancy cycles with the latest compounds and IGF-1 slin GH etc which they aren't even getting half the benefit of because they are so young.

Train hard, eat alot, keep super supplements simple= Gain weight

Last time I checked you needed some estrogen to put on size......

 

[RBB]

I definatley agree. Unfortunately when on cycle my appetite goes to shit. Especially on tren, thats why im hoping NPP will give me an appetite. I may just have to run 1000mcg b-12 daily to help with it.

nandrolone isn't going to do anything for your appetite. why not throw some EQ into the mix if that's what you're looking for. i'm starving all the time on EQ.

 

[STORM SHADOW]

I only say to consider running it PCT instead is to give the liver a break. It’s only moderately toxic yes but combined with every thing else listed in that cycle it really is a lot of extra un-necessary stress IMO.

What we ought to do is start a new thread and call it MOAB Mother of All Bombs and have everybody chime in what the MOAB cycle would look like. It should be a 4 gram'r or more lol

THE STORM

 

[AWN2004]

See how your cycle is so planned and well written down to the last unit/ml? Thats exactly how your food menu should be. I dont think Ive ever gotten better results than when my first priority was my food intake, training, rest, supps, gear, in that order. Count calories, carbs, and proteins and you cant go wrong.