Those who have had echos

[jerseystepup]

My echo report came back everything within normal range. No echocardiographic abnormalities, no doppler abnormalities.. But on the report it says i have an ejection fraction of 76%. After reading around this seems to be a bit high... Do athletes have higher injection fraction than the norm? I'm just wondering what could be the reasoning for this.. I wasnt anxious at the time of the test.. And also im a 28 year old male... Not overweight, normal BP, normal HDL/LDL. thanks anyone with experience with this.

 

[elvisman99]

My echo report came back everything within normal range. No echocardiographic abnormalities, no doppler abnormalities.. But on the report it says i have an ejection fraction of 76%. After reading around this seems to be a bit high... Do athletes have higher injection fraction than the norm? I'm just wondering what could be the reasoning for this.. I wasnt anxious at the time of the test.. And also im a 28 year old male... Not overweight, normal BP, normal HDL/LDL. thanks anyone with experience with this.

I had an echo done in November and my EF was 45-50%.. And after a cardiac cath. i had an EF of 40% and a mildly dilated left ventricle so After reviewing with the cardiologist she talked with me about possible causes of the EF being at 40%.. 1.alcoholic cardiomyopathy because i partied like a champ my whole life , 2. was idiopathic cardiomyopathy ( origin unknown) and 3. Athletes heart (Athletic heart syndrome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

Bro who authorized you to get a ECG? Did u have an abnormality in arythmia? Usually 28 yr olds dont request to there Physician a ECG referral.. Do you have a family history?

 

[jerseystepup]

My mother and sister both have Mitral-valve prolapse.... I've been getting some anxiety attacks lately which included chest pain.. So my dr wrote a script for it... the script said R/O MVP on it.. i have the report right in front of me.. The cardiologist impression was:
1. No echocardiographic abnormalities
2. No significant doppler abnormalities

The Dr. knows of my past AAS use as well, I'm pretty upfront with him... He thinks its just all stress causing the anxiety due to a combination of the Winter, finishing school, and not being able to find a job.. Some people handle stress better than others i guess..

But anyway, the only thing that struck me off in the report was the high EF %.. I seem to be just a bit higher than the upper end of normal.

 

[maldorf]

My mother and sister both have Mitral-valve prolapse.... I've been getting some anxiety attacks lately which included chest pain.. So my dr wrote a script for it... the script said R/O MVP on it.. i have the report right in front of me.. The cardiologist impression was:
1. No echocardiographic abnormalities
2. No significant doppler abnormalities

The Dr. knows of my past AAS use as well, I'm pretty upfront with him... He thinks its just all stress causing the anxiety due to a combination of the Winter, finishing school, and not being able to find a job.. Some people handle stress better than others i guess..

But anyway, the only thing that struck me off in the report was the high EF %.. I seem to be just a bit higher than the upper end of normal.

Definetly high normal, but to me thats a great number. They speak of elite cyclist having EF of up to 85% or so. I would trade all the money in the world to have your heart. You must have good genes and be doing something right. Are you using any AAS now, or have you in the near past?

 

[jerseystepup]

I havent used AAS in about 3 years, and since them took up MMA and BJJ so i lost a decent amount of weight and have been training for endurance as opposed to heavy lifting... But my story is typical, my first cycle or 2 i did super young, with no research, no pct.. yadda yadda... and 2 after that properly... All test based... My last cycle about 3 years ago was 750 mgs test, 500 mgs deca, and anadrol... I plan on shortly starting cyp at 500 mgs a week for 10 or 15 weeks depending on how i feel... i have some GP dbol to kickstart, and some DB winny for a finisher... my heart has always been my biggest concern, now i feel alot better just having piece of mind.

 

[maldorf]

I havent used AAS in about 3 years, and since them took up MMA and BJJ so i lost a decent amount of weight and have been training for endurance as opposed to heavy lifting... But my story is typical, my first cycle or 2 i did super young, with no research, no pct.. yadda yadda... and 2 after that properly... All test based... My last cycle about 3 years ago was 750 mgs test, 500 mgs deca, and anadrol... I plan on shortly starting cyp at 500 mgs a week for 10 or 15 weeks depending on how i feel... i have some GP dbol to kickstart, and some DB winny for a finisher... my heart has always been my biggest concern, now i feel alot better just having piece of mind.

I truly believe that the heart is the one organ that suffers the most stress when using AAS. If youre embarking on the journey of usage again, keep a close eye on your health. Regular blood work at least 2x per year and I would try and get an echo once a year. YOur doses sound reasonable, just be careful not to rely on the drugs too much as you progress or youll find yourself doing higher and higher doses over the years.

 

[jerseystepup]

Yea, i totally understand what you mean... Almost to the point of debating whether its even worth it to cycle again.. even if it is just 500 mgs of test... PLEASE don't take this the wrong way but Ive lurked here for quite some time and im familiar with alot of the issues that bros have here, including your own, knowing ultimatly your going to need a transplant.. Its scares the hell out of me. I can't imagine being in your position and have to give you alot of credit because you seem positive about the situation, in the sense that "it is what it is".... It scares the hell out of me though, and if i were in you place lord only knows where my sanity would be.. So hopefully im not making any stupid decisions here.

 

[maldorf]

Yea, i totally understand what you mean... Almost to the point of debating whether its even worth it to cycle again.. even if it is just 500 mgs of test... PLEASE don't take this the wrong way but Ive lurked here for quite some time and im familiar with alot of the issues that bros have here, including your own, knowing ultimatly your going to need a transplant.. Its scares the hell out of me. I can't imagine being in your position and have to give you alot of credit because you seem positive about the situation, in the sense that "it is what it is".... It scares the hell out of me though, and if i were in you place lord only knows where my sanity would be.. So hopefully im not making any stupid decisions here.

To be honest, if I had it to do all over again I would have never taken any at all. That would have been the right decision for me. If I were a healthy young man and were to do some, i think I would go the route of just using test and nothing else. 500 mg/wk would be plenty. Maybe you can reconsider taking those orals.

 

[jerseystepup]

That's sound advice, perhaps your right... Do you have any type of family history of heart issues? Are your problems attributed to your AAS usage? I was planning low dosages... dbol 30 mgs... winny 50 mgs... but health is #1 at this point... I'm still young, I'm only 28, but i think this is the age that you start to realize what exactly your gambling with here.

 

[thebrick]

Yea, i totally understand what you mean... Almost to the point of debating whether its even worth it to cycle again.. even if it is just 500 mgs of test... PLEASE don't take this the wrong way but Ive lurked here for quite some time and im familiar with alot of the issues that bros have here, including your own, knowing ultimatly your going to need a transplant.. Its scares the hell out of me. I can't imagine being in your position and have to give you alot of credit because you seem positive about the situation, in the sense that "it is what it is".... It scares the hell out of me though, and if i were in you place lord only knows where my sanity would be.. So hopefully im not making any stupid decisions here.

The answer is simple. Do what gives you peace of mind and is something you are comfortable with. Training natural is not a curse. Life will bring its own worries without adding to the mix.

 

[jerseystepup]

The answer is simple. Do what gives you peace of mind and is something you are comfortable with. Training natural is not a curse. Life will bring its own worries without adding to the mix.

Your totally right, but the way i was looking at it when i got my results back, is that will one more cycle, especially as simple as what im planning, have the probability to do major damage... Knowing the shape my heart is in now, i cant see serious issues developing overnight, but more as a grandual onset over the long term.

 

[thebrick]

Your totally right, but the way i was looking at it when i got my results back, is that will one more cycle, especially as simple as what im planning, have the probability to do major damage... Knowing the shape my heart is in now, i cant see serious issues developing overnight, but more as a grandual onset over the long term.

My answer to that is, just one more "simple" cycle probably will not do any damage, if any. The next question is, are you OK with just one more simple cycle? Then you can just walk away from enhanced training? If not, what is that point? If you are on pins and needles about it, why are you doing it?

 

[maldorf]

My answer to that is, just one more "simple" cycle probably will not do any damage, if any. The next question is, are you OK with just one more simple cycle? Then you can just walk away from enhanced training? If not, what is that point? If you are on pins and needles about it, why are you doing it?

Exaxtly what I wanted to say. Honestly there is no point in doing just one cycle. Once you go off, your muscles are going to slowly atrophy back to normal. If youre going to make any long term changes using AAS, you have to use them long term.

As far as me, we have a history of high blood pressure in the family but nothing like what happend to me has ever occured in our family as far as I know. I am the first. I believe that for most that have heart trouble when using AAS its probably a combination of genetics and the drugs. For me though, I have little doubt that the AAS triggered what happend to me.

 

[muscledoc1]

My echo report came back everything within normal range. No echocardiographic abnormalities, no doppler abnormalities.. But on the report it says i have an ejection fraction of 76%. After reading around this seems to be a bit high... Do athletes have higher injection fraction than the norm? I'm just wondering what could be the reasoning for this.. I wasnt anxious at the time of the test.. And also im a 28 year old male... Not overweight, normal BP, normal HDL/LDL. thanks anyone with experience with this.

Jersey,

So your heart function is what we call HYPERDYNAMIC,which could be from several reasons:1)Volume-overload
2)what was your HR?(was it over 100bpm at the time of the test?)
3)If you could see the difference between the echo's of high endurance athletes(such as cyclists),and bodybuilder/heavy-weight lifter you will see that the more conditioned(endurance athlete)-will have thinner LV walls,slower HR,and higher EF(ejection fraction over 60%),the weight lifters echo would look like that(usualy):thicker LV walls,slower HR(usualy),and a lower EF.
It all comes down to the body's compensation mechanism(the heart adjusts itself to the body needs).
Could very well be that thats your normal heart function,if everything else is ok like you said-i wouldnt worrie about it.

 

[elvisman99]

Jersey,

So your heart function is what we call HYPERDYNAMIC,which could be from several reasons:1)Volume-overload
2)what was your HR?(was it over 100bpm at the time of the test?)
3)If you could see the difference between the echo's of high endurance athletes(such as cyclists),and bodybuilder/heavy-weight lifter you will see that the more conditioned(endurance athlete)-will have thinner LV walls,slower HR,and higher EF(ejection fraction over 60%),the weight lifters echo would look like that(usualy):thicker LV walls,slower HR(usualy),and a lower EF.
It all comes down to the body's compensation mechanism(the heart adjusts itself to the body needs).
Could very well be that thats your normal heart function,if everything else is ok like you said-i wouldnt worrie about it.

Yeah that sounds like me MuscleDoc,,, I had a dilated LV by 15%, myHB was around 65-70 and an EF of 40%... Im currently on Rampril 2.5mgs/2x Daily and Coreg 6.25mg/ 2x daily