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Two GH studies everyone should be aware of.

G.I.Bro

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Here are two studies anyone who spends hard earned coin on GH of any kind should be aware of. I know one of these studies has been posted here before, but this first one I had never seen. So I am just passing it along and keeping them current. :D

1) IM administration superior to Sub-Q. Better CMax and AUC numbers. Not just simply more GH in blood faster, but more concentration over time too.
Pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics of GH: dependence on route and dosage of administration

Methods: Healthy trained subjects (10 males, 10 females) received bolus injections of rhGH on three occasions: 0.033 mg/kg s.c., 0.083 mg/kg s.c., and 0.033 mg/kg i.m. Concentrations of 22 and 20 kDa GH, IGF-I, and IGF-binding proteins (IGFBP)-3 were measured repeatedly before and up to 36 h after injection.

Results: Serum GH maximal concentration (Cmax) and area under the time-concentration curve (AUC) were higher after i.m. than s.c. administration of 0.033 mg/kg (Cmax 35.5 and 12.0 μ g/l; AUC 196.2 and 123.8). Cmax and AUC were higher in males than in females (P < 0.01) and pharmacodynamic changes were more pronounced. IGFBP-3 concentrations showed no dose dependency. In response to rhGH administration, 20 kDa GH decreased in females and remained suppressed for 14–18 h (low dose) and 30 h (high dose). In males, 20 kDa GH was undetectable at baseline and throughout the study.

Conclusions: After rhGH administration, pharmacokinetic parameters are mainly influenced by route of administration, whereas pharmacodynamic variables and 20 kDa GH concentrations are determined mainly by gender. These differences need to be considered for therapeutic use and for detection of rhGH doping.

2) AM/PM (2x) administration leads to higher IGF-1 levels versus 1x bolus PM
Metabolic effects of growth hormone ad... [Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). 1994] - PubMed - NCBI

CONCLUSIONS:
Twice-daily GH injections, apart from producing a more physiological serum GH profile, were superior to one injection in increasing serum IGF-I and decreasing IGFBP-1 levels. Both of these changes tend to amplify the effects of the administered GH. Twice-daily injections, however, resulted in lower night-time levels of lipid intermediates.
 
I find it interesting that it says AM/PM is superior to ONE bolus PM.

Does that mean AM/PM would be superior to ONE bolus ANYTIME? Or specifically PM only?

Great post! I have always said IM!
 
I find it interesting that it says AM/PM is superior to ONE bolus PM.

Does that mean AM/PM would be superior to ONE bolus ANYTIME? Or specifically PM only?

Great post! I have always said IM!

I find it interesting as well. 10iu at bedtime has ALWAYS worked miracles on me. I as well do IM
 
I find it interesting as well. 10iu at bedtime has ALWAYS worked miracles on me. I as well do IM

Anything over 4ius at one time is a waste of hgh. 4ius every 5 hours for the win. Atleast that's what ipchina had on their website and also what UCP says. It makes sense. Excess of anything at one time is going to be wasted.
 
I find it interesting that it says AM/PM is superior to ONE bolus PM.

Does that mean AM/PM would be superior to ONE bolus ANYTIME? Or specifically PM only?

Great post! I have always said IM!

I think the take away is that breaking it up leads to more IGF-1. It happened to be AM/PM vs. PM. Here is a quote from the study. Note the small group size.

In a cross-over study, 8 GH deficient patients (age 16-43 years) were treated with 3 IU/m2/24 h of human GH. The dose was injected in the evening for 4 weeks and for another 4 weeks two-thirds was injected in the evening and one-third in the morning. At the end of each period the patients were admitted to the hospital for 37 hours. Steady-state profiles of GH, IGF-I, IGF binding proteins 1 and 3, insulin, glucose, lipid intermediates and metabolites were obtained following administration of 3 IU/m2 of GH (at 1900 h (one injection) and at 1900 and 0800 h (two injections)).

Now, I must say MANY disagree with this for good reason. I find Adonis89's writeup PROMOTING 1 PM bolus dose to also be persuasive and logical for on some points. Alpha Body - Physique Enhancement. Many prefer this method as well. But it is hard to argue with numbers. But as always, there is a study for every side of the issue it seems. Still, If I was doing 8-10iu I would want it broken up to ensure better utilization. The body can only make use of so much in one window of time.

I find it interesting as well. 10iu at bedtime has ALWAYS worked miracles on me. I as well do IM

Hard to argue that you would see great results at 10iu a day NO MATTER how or when you injected it. Most of us average joe wunnabes just dabbling in GH out of curiosity (myself) are running 4-5iu/day. I dont doubt 10iu bolus works well for you, I think it would work well for anyone. But here is the study anyway.

Anything over 4ius at one time is a waste of hgh. 4ius every 5 hours for the win. Atleast that's what ipchina had on their website and also what UCP says. It makes sense. Excess of anything at one time is going to be wasted.

I tend to agree with this also. If you are using 8-10iu/day it may be an especially good reason to break up your dosing 2x. We know that lipolysis is essentially "maxed out" at like 1.5iu anyway. Anything above that is not going to make you "leaner, faster" in terms of that time window of fat burning. The higher IGF levels from higher GH doses could, but in that case, the studies indicate 2x leads to higher IGF as well.
 
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Anything over 4ius at one time is a waste of hgh. 4ius every 5 hours for the win. Atleast that's what ipchina had on their website and also what UCP says. It makes sense. Excess of anything at one time is going to be wasted.

Well from personal results I always liked the e3d bolus route the best. However I stick to what my coach tells me now and bedtime works well. You can also(you better be experienced) use some lantus before bed to keep sugars from creeping up from the GH
 
Anything over 4ius at one time is a waste of hgh. 4ius every 5 hours for the win. Atleast that's what ipchina had on their website and also what UCP says. It makes sense. Excess of anything at one time is going to be wasted.

Maybe...but I'm not totally convinced yet. UCP's understanding/way of doing things has no science behind it as far as I can tell. He was undoubtedly told this...whether it is right or not.
 
Interesting that this thread popped up as the other day I've been thinking of trying a few things differently. right now I take 10 iu gh pre workout, then my slin, then hit the gym, but I was curious about trying 3.5 iu gh in the AM along with slin, then again in the evening before the gym... then finishing up with just gh right before bed. this would be only on training days which for is me 2 on 1 off, 2 on 1 off ect.

any thoughts jj?
 
anyone popping 10 ius of GH will pretty much remove themselves from the scientific communities aims. In other words, studies like the above are done using subjects using healthy doses of GH. That much GH will mostl likely eliminate the need for specific dosing protocols. If I shoot you with a shotgun, it won't matter if I'm five feet away or 10. You're dead.

As to splitting the doses, according to the study? The numbers speak for themselves. And the lowered IGFBP1 is a huge reason along to consider it. You want IGFBP3, while IGFBP1 is going to inactivate it. Which makes sense. You overdo your dose and you will also get a huge spike in your body's compensatory mechanisms. Incidentally, the reason insulin is so nice with GH, other than counteracting glucose pathology? Insulin increases IGFBP3.

Hell I might even suggest those using 10 ius to split into three doses of 3 ius. You'll be short 1iu but I imagine the net result will still be an increase in results due to less binding protein.
 
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One thing I still dont really have answered is meal timing with GH. I'd love to see some of your guys thoughts on that.

In my situation, I take 2iu AM, do some cardio (ideally), work all day,workout at like 6:30pm, get home by 8'ish. Pin CJC-MOD/GHRP2 immediately. Wait 15, have BCAA/pro, wait another 20 or so and have my PWO meal. This is easily my LARGEST meal of the day and its usually a mix of fat/cho/pro altogether. About 1.5-2 hours after dinner (last meal) I pin my PM 2iu of GH and go to bed. I have a meal plan where the macros per meal are identical but my PWO meal has double the carbs, extra veggies and extra fat/sugar (from probiotic Kefir) and usually a little extra protein. I may have some extra fruit. If I cheat some on macros, its always this meal. Anyway, you get the point.

As you can see, I have a Large spike in GH right before my largest meal (with fat) from the peps followed by my next GH shot. One thing GH in the blood does that is NOT positive is cause an acute/temporary insulin resistance. This is at a time when I'm processing easily the largest amount of CHO and fat for the entire day. A protocol of this nature seems like it could promote insulin resistance and pancreatitis in the long term. Do you really want to have insulin resistance during this major feeding window? Probably not. Or perhaps I'm over-thinking and it does not matter all that much. I know Adonis89 would say that is not ideal.

Should I keep it like it is or move the evening GH as LATE as possible before bed and also do the Peptide pin like 30min BEFORE workout rather than POST workout where the spike corresponds with a majority of PWO meal digestion?

/end OCD thread
 
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Maybe...but I'm not totally convinced yet. UCP's understanding/way of doing things has no science behind it as far as I can tell. He was undoubtedly told this...whether it is right or not.

George Farrah had a similar hgh protocol for a friend but the insulin protocol was 2-3x/wk 3x/day with tons of simple carbs, so much that it made me violently sick.
 
Interesting that this thread popped up as the other day I've been thinking of trying a few things differently. right now I take 10 iu gh pre workout, then my slin, then hit the gym, but I was curious about trying 3.5 iu gh in the AM along with slin, then again in the evening before the gym... then finishing up with just gh right before bed. this would be only on training days which for is me 2 on 1 off, 2 on 1 off ect.

any thoughts jj?

I like your idea on twice a day. If you are on riptropin then 3.5ius is actually 4.9ius.
 
I like your idea on twice a day. If you are on riptropin then 3.5ius is actually 4.9ius.

Using rips too. But I dont really bank on it being overdosed even though I know it generally is (hopefully). I do 4iu/day and just consider the extra gravy. :D How much EXTRA iu per vial is there alleged to be? I have seem people say 12-14iu and it varies. How reliable is this anyway?
 
Using rips too. But I dont really bank on it being overdosed even though I know it generally is (hopefully). I do 4iu/day and just consider the extra gravy. :D How much EXTRA iu per vial is there alleged to be? I have seem people say 12-14iu and it varies. How reliable is this anyway?

It was proven in the lab testing section that riptropin contains 14ius per vial
 
I take my entire vial of Riptropin right before I hit the sack and I sleep like a baby. I am not sure exactly why but I always had sugar cravings but since I have been on GH Im not feeling it as much at all. I am hungry all the time but its usually a hunger for good, clean food.
 
It was proven in the lab testing section that riptropin contains 14ius per vial

I'm still not convinced, seeing how I tested in the 400s twice on IGF tests on 5iu (or 7iu if it's 14iu per vial). No I didn't test 3 hours post shot but I still split up the dose 2x per day
 
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Anything over 4ius at one time is a waste of hgh. 4ius every 5 hours for the win. Atleast that's what ipchina had on their website and also what UCP says. It makes sense. Excess of anything at one time is going to be wasted.

4iu in am 4iu in pm bulk....4iu once a day for cut...hey buddy you still with crimson I don't see their ad on your shit anymore..i tried to pm u but your box is full
 
I'm still not convinced, seeing how I tested in the 400s twice on IGF tests on 5iu (or 7iu if it's 14iu per vial). No I didn't test 3 hours post shot but I still split up the dose 2x per day

an igf-1 test wouldn't need perfect timing of the GH. IGF-1 tests are also hard to gauge. You could very well be on to something, but at the same time, so many factors play into IGF1 levels it's hard to always determine.
 
an igf-1 test wouldn't need perfect timing of the GH. IGF-1 tests are also hard to gauge. You could very well be on to something, but at the same time, so many factors play into IGF1 levels it's hard to always determine.

I've also tested 607 total testosterone two days after taking a trt dose of 150mg, so my body might just be different considering I am under 30 years old. Most reputable source's gear was used too. This was a couple years ago. When I was natural, I tested in the 300s when I was on a low calorie cutting diet. Maybe I'm weird?
 

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