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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 01-14-2015, 05:39 AM
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Well divorce time.

In summary I'm a 35 year old married man with 3 children. Been with my wife since 1999. My wife has borderline personality disorder. We just recently called a divorce. I walked in on her crying. As the typical knight in shining armor I went to consolidate the damsel in distress. Asking her why she is crying. She said that if she dies our children will hate her. Most of our fights are about how much I hate her and this one was about how my negative perception of her will rub off on our children if she dies prematurely. I'm seeing a counselor who said I shouldn't engage her on these things. By consolidating her immaturity Im just enabling her victimization. Of course walking away just feeds into her distorted perception of reality. So the next cycle of emotions is anger and why I want to leave her. Which is true I do. Anyways to make a long story short she starts figuratively cornering me pressing me with statements like "Are you in or out" either you are fully invested in this marriage or you are out and we will sell the house tomorrow. Fair questions considering that I want out but she is basically calling a bluff and putting me into a corner. My typical response is to people please and tell her how much I love her. But after 15 years of losing myself I decided to say OK I WANT OUT. Called her on it. It felt so good to say this but afterwards I have all the mixed thoughts. Its about time I stood up for me but the other half is like I take it back I don't want to hurt you.

Anyways just had to vent this out. I started recording our arguments and journaling my thoughts because a BPD woman can have your head spinning. On top of it my wife is a psychiatrist which means she can have my male mind twisted and turned.
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Old 01-14-2015, 05:44 AM
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Bro I went through something similar with my ex wife, she was just a liar and a neurotic drama queen, but in the end the result was the same she gave me an ultimatum- I took the door.

IN retrospect it was the right decision but at the time I wasn't sure, now I'm glad I did it.
You have children and that makes it more complicated, but I believe that you are going to be a better father to them being healthy emotionally and mentally than you can be dealing with her creating the environment she's making.
You can't live like that and be healthy.
Good luck.
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Old 01-14-2015, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
In summary I'm a 35 year old married man with 3 children. Been with my wife since 1999. My wife has borderline personality disorder. We just recently called a divorce. I walked in on her crying. As the typical knight in shining armor I went to consolidate the damsel in distress. Asking her why she is crying. She said that if she dies our children will hate her. Most of our fights are about how much I hate her and this one was about how my negative perception of her will rub off on our children if she dies prematurely. I'm seeing a counselor who said I shouldn't engage her on these things. By consolidating her immaturity Im just enabling her victimization. Of course walking away just feeds into her distorted perception of reality. So the next cycle of emotions is anger and why I want to leave her. Which is true I do. Anyways to make a long story short she starts figuratively cornering me pressing me with statements like "Are you in or out" either you are fully invested in this marriage or you are out and we will sell the house tomorrow. Fair questions considering that I want out but she is basically calling a bluff and putting me into a corner. My typical response is to people please and tell her how much I love her. But after 15 years of losing myself I decided to say OK I WANT OUT. Called her on it. It felt so good to say this but afterwards I have all the mixed thoughts. Its about time I stood up for me but the other half is like I take it back I don't want to hurt you.

Anyways just had to vent this out. I started recording our arguments and journaling my thoughts because a BPD woman can have your head spinning. On top of it my wife is a psychiatrist which means she can have my male mind twisted and turned.
Do you really want out or do you just want to get away from her illness?
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Old 01-14-2015, 07:27 AM
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I'm a youngster but it sounds like you love your wife a lot your just sick of the emotional roller coaster, but being with someone for 15 years in my opinion isn't something to give up on even given the circumstances, maybe this is a stage in yallslife together that brings yall closer.


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Old 01-14-2015, 08:59 AM
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Your counselor is correct, if you play in to it. You reward the behavior. If she didn't tell you....If you've been rewarding any of her behavior for a long time, you will see what is called an extinction burst. Which is her pressing the issue harder and harder. I'm dealing with something similar. I should be better prepared since I have a degree in animal behavior. But its very hard to not do something that feels like the right thing to do.

like OTH asked do you want out, or out from the behavior? For some they can be separate if shes willing to see help.
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Old 01-15-2015, 02:51 AM
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Thanks for the questions and support guys. I appreciate it. Of course its hard to summarize 15 years of marriage in a paragraph and I'm old enough to know I bring shit to the table as well. I have struggled with addictions most of my life and now that I'm clean and sober my "looking glass" is much more clear on her behaviors.

My counselor had me read a book called "Family Guide to BPD" and the first chapter is welcome to Oz. Point for point the book completely described my life. One day I'm idealized and a source of unconditional love and the next I'm the worst husband in the world. She has even accused me of sexually assaulting her. I'm put into no-win situations. Everything, including her craziness, is always my fault. My part in our problems are terrible unforgivable sins while her part of our problems is because of me. She user fear guilt etc to emotionally manipulate me.

What hit me hard was doubting my own sense of reality. I started secretly recording our fights so that I could get a sense of WTF just happened. I'd bring up a hurt of mine, some want or need, and I'd walk away feeling like a bad husband. As a counselor she'd turn my head inside and out. I started keeping a journal so I could remember details because she distorts reality and truth.

What hurts the most is she holds my kids away from my family. My family wasn't allowed at the birth of my boys but her family was all allowed. My family hasn't even seen my youngest son yet. Not only because my wife holds them back from my family events but because my family has had enough of her craziness and refuses to visit. Every pregnancy my wife has blown up on them and said things like they will only have supervised visits etc.

I've lost myself over this marriage ... slowly day by day. I'm ashamed of the man I've become. I'm a leader competitive alpha male type in all aspects of my life but when it comes to my wife I was a doormat and had no boundaries.

But we all have lessons to learn.
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Old 01-15-2015, 03:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
Thanks for the questions and support guys. I appreciate it. Of course its hard to summarize 15 years of marriage in a paragraph and I'm old enough to know I bring shit to the table as well. I have struggled with addictions most of my life and now that I'm clean and sober my "looking glass" is much more clear on her behaviors.

My counselor had me read a book called "Family Guide to BPD" and the first chapter is welcome to Oz. Point for point the book completely described my life. One day I'm idealized and a source of unconditional love and the next I'm the worst husband in the world. She has even accused me of sexually assaulting her. I'm put into no-win situations. Everything, including her craziness, is always my fault. My part in our problems are terrible unforgivable sins while her part of our problems is because of me. She user fear guilt etc to emotionally manipulate me.

What hit me hard was doubting my own sense of reality. I started secretly recording our fights so that I could get a sense of WTF just happened. I'd bring up a hurt of mine, some want or need, and I'd walk away feeling like a bad husband. As a counselor she'd turn my head inside and out. I started keeping a journal so I could remember details because she distorts reality and truth.

What hurts the most is she holds my kids away from my family. My family wasn't allowed at the birth of my boys but her family was all allowed. My family hasn't even seen my youngest son yet. Not only because my wife holds them back from my family events but because my family has had enough of her craziness and refuses to visit. Every pregnancy my wife has blown up on them and said things like they will only have supervised visits etc.

I've lost myself over this marriage ... slowly day by day. I'm ashamed of the man I've become. I'm a leader competitive alpha male type in all aspects of my life but when it comes to my wife I was a doormat and had no boundaries.

But we all have lessons to learn.
It seems very unhealthy relationship. I went through a divorce 5 years ago. I never looked back. I knew it was the right decision and you will too when you get to that point. However it still won't be easy to walk away. After all it is 15 years and you have children. Never mind the material things, you can replaced that. I went in the living room one day after 20 years and told my ex wife I want a divorce. I never looked back and all that time I spent with her, I don't have any feelings at all for her. Time heals all wounds, but it still takes time to heal. In this situation, you will hear many opinions, but what you think, is what is important the most. Wish you the best for this situation.
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Old 01-15-2015, 03:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
Thanks for the questions and support guys. I appreciate it. Of course its hard to summarize 15 years of marriage in a paragraph and I'm old enough to know I bring shit to the table as well. I have struggled with addictions most of my life and now that I'm clean and sober my "looking glass" is much more clear on her behaviors.

My counselor had me read a book called "Family Guide to BPD" and the first chapter is welcome to Oz. Point for point the book completely described my life. One day I'm idealized and a source of unconditional love and the next I'm the worst husband in the world. She has even accused me of sexually assaulting her. I'm put into no-win situations. Everything, including her craziness, is always my fault. My part in our problems are terrible unforgivable sins while her part of our problems is because of me. She user fear guilt etc to emotionally manipulate me.

What hit me hard was doubting my own sense of reality. I started secretly recording our fights so that I could get a sense of WTF just happened. I'd bring up a hurt of mine, some want or need, and I'd walk away feeling like a bad husband. As a counselor she'd turn my head inside and out. I started keeping a journal so I could remember details because she distorts reality and truth.

What hurts the most is she holds my kids away from my family. My family wasn't allowed at the birth of my boys but her family was all allowed. My family hasn't even seen my youngest son yet. Not only because my wife holds them back from my family events but because my family has had enough of her craziness and refuses to visit. Every pregnancy my wife has blown up on them and said things like they will only have supervised visits etc.

I've lost myself over this marriage ... slowly day by day. I'm ashamed of the man I've become. I'm a leader competitive alpha male type in all aspects of my life but when it comes to my wife I was a doormat and had no boundaries.

But we all have lessons to learn.
Maybe it is time to start weighing your options. No matter what decision you ultimately make, it will not be easy. Is she currently practicing? You said she was a psychiatrist?
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Old 01-15-2015, 04:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
Thanks for the questions and support guys. I appreciate it. Of course its hard to summarize 15 years of marriage in a paragraph and I'm old enough to know I bring shit to the table as well. I have struggled with addictions most of my life and now that I'm clean and sober my "looking glass" is much more clear on her behaviors.

My counselor had me read a book called "Family Guide to BPD" and the first chapter is welcome to Oz. Point for point the book completely described my life. One day I'm idealized and a source of unconditional love and the next I'm the worst husband in the world. She has even accused me of sexually assaulting her. I'm put into no-win situations. Everything, including her craziness, is always my fault. My part in our problems are terrible unforgivable sins while her part of our problems is because of me. She user fear guilt etc to emotionally manipulate me.

What hit me hard was doubting my own sense of reality. I started secretly recording our fights so that I could get a sense of WTF just happened. I'd bring up a hurt of mine, some want or need, and I'd walk away feeling like a bad husband. As a counselor she'd turn my head inside and out. I started keeping a journal so I could remember details because she distorts reality and truth.

What hurts the most is she holds my kids away from my family. My family wasn't allowed at the birth of my boys but her family was all allowed. My family hasn't even seen my youngest son yet. Not only because my wife holds them back from my family events but because my family has had enough of her craziness and refuses to visit. Every pregnancy my wife has blown up on them and said things like they will only have supervised visits etc.

I've lost myself over this marriage ... slowly day by day. I'm ashamed of the man I've become. I'm a leader competitive alpha male type in all aspects of my life but when it comes to my wife I was a doormat and had no boundaries.

But we all have lessons to learn.
That book is a great eye opener. The only reason I stayed is my wife is in therapy. Its still hard, It may still not work out...but I would have left if she wouldn't get help. Regardless of what you choose, talking it out with a counselor will help you regain who you are and help you heal.
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Old 01-20-2015, 06:09 PM
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If she gets gratification from keeping your child or children from your family she truly is not worth it imop
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Old 01-21-2015, 02:13 AM
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Cerberus777 how long have you been with your wife? How did you know she had BDP? Just curious to hear your side.

GS I don't think that my wife is taking pleasure in holding back my family. I think its about control and her anxiety. My wife will take a comment personally as an attack on her character. If I suggest an action of hers disappointed me she will say that it hurt her soul and that I hate her. Over the past several years my family has built up some resentment towards my wife so my wife is scared if my kids visit they will pick up on "how much my they hate her" (her perception) and my children will start to hate her. So interactions had to be almost like "supervised visits" until they just didn't occur anymore.

Here is the first portion of the first chapter of the book "The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder."

Chapter 1
Welcome to Oz

Do you feel as though you’re walking on eggshells around someone important in your life? Does this phrase immediately strike not just a chord but a whole piano concerto? If so, someone in your life may have either borderline personality disorder (BPD) or borderline traits. Take a look at the following questions. If you answer “yes” to most of them, your loved one
might have BPD:

• Does she see you in one of two modes: either a hateful person who never loved her or a source of blessed, unconditional love?

• Does he continually put you in no-win situations? When you try to explain that his position is the opposite of what he said earlier, does it bring on more criticism?

• Is everything always your fault? Are you the target of constant criticism?

• Are there times when everything seems normal and you’re on her good side—even idealized—but then for no obvious reason everything falls apart? • When he’s angry, does it degrade into a take-no-prisoners, vicious attack that leaves you reeling?

• Does she use fear, obligation, and guilt to get her way? Do you feel so manipulated that you don’t trust her?

• Are you starting to doubt your own sense of reality? Has constant exposure to his skewed sensibility, combined with isolation from family and friends, made you feel like Dorothy confounded in the strange Land of Oz?
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Old 01-21-2015, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
Cerberus777 how long have you been with your wife? How did you know she had BDP? Just curious to hear your side.

GS I don't think that my wife is taking pleasure in holding back my family. I think its about control and her anxiety. My wife will take a comment personally as an attack on her character. If I suggest an action of hers disappointed me she will say that it hurt her soul and that I hate her. Over the past several years my family has built up some resentment towards my wife so my wife is scared if my kids visit they will pick up on "how much my they hate her" (her perception) and my children will start to hate her. So interactions had to be almost like "supervised visits" until they just didn't occur anymore.

Here is the first portion of the first chapter of the book "The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder."

Chapter 1
Welcome to Oz

Do you feel as though you’re walking on eggshells around someone important in your life? Does this phrase immediately strike not just a chord but a whole piano concerto? If so, someone in your life may have either borderline personality disorder (BPD) or borderline traits. Take a look at the following questions. If you answer “yes” to most of them, your loved one
might have BPD:

• Does she see you in one of two modes: either a hateful person who never loved her or a source of blessed, unconditional love?

• Does he continually put you in no-win situations? When you try to explain that his position is the opposite of what he said earlier, does it bring on more criticism?

• Is everything always your fault? Are you the target of constant criticism?

• Are there times when everything seems normal and you’re on her good side—even idealized—but then for no obvious reason everything falls apart? • When he’s angry, does it degrade into a take-no-prisoners, vicious attack that leaves you reeling?

• Does she use fear, obligation, and guilt to get her way? Do you feel so manipulated that you don’t trust her?

• Are you starting to doubt your own sense of reality? Has constant exposure to his skewed sensibility, combined with isolation from family and friends, made you feel like Dorothy confounded in the strange Land of Oz?
I've been with my wife 14yrs. She told me she had depression and ADHD when we hooked up, when she was 20. by 26 there was more than that going on, to spare the details. She was hospitalized and given a Bipolar diagnosis. But she didn't respond to medication well. And had many traits of BPD. Later she was given a combined diagnosis of bipolar with BPD.

Its been a real ride, I've learned that being top dog in your career, can mean your codependent in your home...this means you're attracted to and attract this type of person....this was me.


Walking on egg shells is a great book to understand, and live with BPD in your life.

Last edited by Cerberus777; 01-21-2015 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 01-21-2015, 12:57 PM
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Don't be a doormat during the divorce especially during any custody negotiations. She will do everything in her power to turn those kids against you and your family. I can tell she is the type.
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Old 01-21-2015, 11:57 PM
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Your wife sounds exactly like my ex wife. We were married for 17 years, had three kids. She had the kids, all our friends and even me convinced that I was the monster who was to blame for all our problems. She has been diagnosed as bipolar. I don't know what is wrong with her clinically speaking, but the reality is that she loves to get drunk and throw shit, scream and yell, kick, punch or come at me with kitchen cutlery. Then blame it all on me and the kids because we made her do that.( I never laid a hand on her btw ) She works as a counselor! We got divorced 6 years ago. It hurt like hell at first.( that's when I got back in the gym and got re acquainted with my passion of lifting, she didn't like me wasting time on it, so for 17 years I worked out in the garage so she wouldn't complain....she still did) The divorce was hard on the kids at first. It was only a few months of her turning all her crazy bullshit frustration on them and I got them back. Our lives have become so much happier and peaceful without my ex-wife involved. I don't just recommend divorce to anyone who can't get along or has issues, but with our situations being so similar I will tell you it is the best thing that ever happened for me and my kids. It has been a second chance for a happy life. Good luck to you.
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Old 01-23-2015, 02:16 AM
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Thanks again guys. I appreciate the input. I have a feeling the divorce is going to be nasty with the children. To my face she claims she will not hold the children back from me. But she already is holding them back from my family. The other day I text her.

Me: How are you? Its been stressful you want me to bring something home?
Her: You can do whatever you want. I'm going out.
Me: Oh good your bff Mandy?
Her: Nope.
Me: Oh you don't want to talk about it?
Her: We wont be home when you get here. Have a good night.
//My gut is telling me something and my radar goes off.
Me: U taking the boys?
Her: Yes.
Me: Where?
Her: Play date.
Me: They are my children to I would like to know where they are going.
Me: You would want to know the same.
Her: No kidding. I'm aware of the paternity of our sons. I'm taking them to a play center.
Me: Where?
Her: I don't want to be around you so I'm taking them out.
Me: Where?
Her: McDonalds play center.
Me: I totally understand you don't want to be around me but I get to know where you are taking my boys.
Her: I just told you calm down. They are our children. Not just yours.
Her: Any other questions?
Me: I just want to know where they are.
Her: READ WHAT I WROTE MCDs.

So later I confront her about this message. Why so angry? She completely denies being angry at all. Says that was my perception. I asked her why she was reluctant to explain where she was going with the kids. She claims she forgot where she was meeting her friends. However, I'm a computer guy, our browser history shows she was googling the address of the McDs just two hours before. So that was a lie.

I completely ignored her red flags before. I think this is a big red flag she will use our children.
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Old 01-23-2015, 02:25 AM
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Another story. So her grandparents are having their 60th anniversary this summer. They are across the country, a plan trip, and will probably be 2-3 weeks. She knows I wont be going. When she mentioned this I said great, awesome, it will be nice for the boys to see them. When can my sons see my family a one hour drive away? Boom. The fight is on.

Its crazy.

She is texting everyone telling them that I called a divorce. Now I'm having to explain that I felt it wasn't 100% me I was pushed in a corner and gave her an answer.

Her bff Mandy posts a message to her facebook "Thinking of you. Your value doesn't decrease based on someones inability to see your worth" Of course her friend only enables her victimization. I'm tempted to post as a comment that when my wife is alone she may find out that her friend gave her some bad advice. I think her comments are antagonistic and not supportive.
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Old 01-23-2015, 05:11 AM
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I completely ignored her red flags before. I think this is a big red flag she will use our children.
Oh she will. I promise you that. You will too. That's why the children always take the brunt of these breakups/divorces.

She was using the children here to make you concerned where she was going and that she WASN'T telling you.

You were using the children to discover what her activities were going to be. What if she'd said she was going to meet a guy?

I'm not saying this to piss you off or hurt you. You've obviously been through enough already. But you're going to have to take the lead in shielding these children because she has a mental disorder/illness.
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Old 01-23-2015, 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by anarchocapitalist View Post
Her bff Mandy posts a message to her facebook "Thinking of you. Your value doesn't decrease based on someones inability to see your worth" Of course her friend only enables her victimization. I'm tempted to post as a comment that when my wife is alone she may find out that her friend gave her some bad advice. I think her comments are antagonistic and not supportive.
Mandy is Mandy. No changing her. It's no coincidence that your wife's bff just happens to be a person that probably also plays the victim to get attention/love/support (you know the deal). They're a match made in heaven!
BillHilton, richiec and E.J. like this.
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Old 01-23-2015, 05:49 AM
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I definitely hear what you were saying. My counselor had mentioned that my focus has to be whats best for the children not either of us.

Honestly if she was meeting another man I would be happy for her. She isn't my problem anymore. I'm in a place now where she can do what she wants. I truly do want separate lives as much as possible with three children.

At the moment I was nervous my wife was moving out with my sons and not telling me. However you are right I can't use that as an excuse. When we are completely divorced I just have to trust she will make the best judgment.
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Old 01-23-2015, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by OuchThatHurts View Post
Oh she will. I promise you that. You will too. That's why the children always take the brunt of these breakups/divorces.

She was using the children here to make you concerned where she was going and that she WASN'T telling you.

You were using the children to discover what her activities were going to be. What if she'd said she was going to meet a guy?

I'm not saying this to piss you off or hurt you. You've obviously been through enough already. But you're going to have to take the lead in shielding these children because she has a mental disorder/illness.
Very insightful.
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