Help getting off stims : ideas?

[whacked]

Sup all

Need some help for those that went through this.

I’ve been on some form of “exotic stim” for 20-25 years at once/day.

“Exotic” stims I’m on = DMAA, DMHA, and some of these pre-w/o stims have other things in them like Yo and Alpha-yo etc

Reallllllllly not looking fwd to this but it’s just time!! HELP!!

I was checking HR today and detected an arrhythmia (heart is skipping a beat 3-4x per minute - WTH)

I’m pissed bc I’ve procrastinated on this for years.

I knew this wasn’t a great idea but am a zombie w o these and too busy as a business owner to “have to deal w this”. Shame on me

Daily:
4:30 am - Caffeine (200mg)
6am - Stim + shower
Hit the weights at 7am
(Not doing a lot of cardio at all these days)

Relevant info:
I’m 50
I’m lean (12%)
A1C = 5.0 (healthy)
Lipids = no issues
Clean diet
No alcohol
No smoking
No illicit drugs other than:
200mg Test (self-Rx TRT)
+ 2 iu’s of GH
On Telmisartan and Nebivolol

Thanks

 

[Dens228]

If it were me I'd cut it down to just the caffeine at first. If I needed a midday pick up it'd me low dose caffeine. After a few days I'd fight through it with just the am caffeine, then a few days later eliminate that. In my powerlifting days I'd rely on the real ECA stack for three or four weeks, ending that was brutal after meets but I just went cold turkey everytime.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Not my area, and i'm tossing a response from my hip, but i'd fall back on low dose caffeine/coffee only, and maybe add in some nootropic agents to bridge you down. I would not think cutting it off cold turkey would be ideal, but i'd be happy to read what others think.

 

[Cerberus777]

Lion's Mane and Cordyceps mushrooms can help with the energy in the gutter feeling. Your dopamine will take a hit for a while.

 

[adam2433]

Dependence after years is going to take a lot longer to wean than a few days. I’d go slow with a taper. Cold turkey and you’re going to feel 10x shittier.

It won’t be easy but it’ll be worth it. I came off rx benzos after 13yrs and couldn’t be more happy I did.

 

[whacked]

Thanks fellas.
Slow and steady will be the deal.
This is gonna SUCK
lol

 

[qbkilla]

If it were me I'd cut it down to just the caffeine at first. If I needed a midday pick up it'd me low dose caffeine. After a few days I'd fight through it with just the am caffeine, then a few days later eliminate that. In my powerlifting days I'd rely on the real ECA stack for three or four weeks, ending that was brutal after meets but I just went cold turkey everytime.

This, just use the caffeine as needed coffee or energy drink. To me that's more than enough never understood pre workout to begin with. I assume people use them because they think it gives a pump or placebo. I don't think caffeine actually does anything for me it's just part of my routine. Bronkaid is a stimm too and it actually can help with body composition, never had trouble coming off but if your worried your addicted may just want a couple cups coffee as needed.

 

[rotinaj]

I am incredibly skeptical that your two doses of stimulants during your day are causing a cardiac arrhythmia.

For reference, during my last cut I was consuming a whole pack of nicotine pouches, a long and short acting RX Adderall, and 2 to 3 doses of 300mg caffeine 4-5 days a week with only slightly elevated BP & HR but not irregularities. (I’m only consuming my prescribed RX when not cutting)

Was this diagnosed by a doctor?

Were you able to witness the arrhythmia without the stimulants in your system?

If it is from the stimulants I suggest going cold turkey.
If you have the discipline to start/run a business you should have the discipline to spend 3 to 4 weeks feeling like crap while your body readjusts.

 

[goback2013]

This, just use the caffeine as needed coffee or energy drink. To me that's more than enough never understood pre workout to begin with. I assume people use them because they think it gives a pump or placebo. I don't think caffeine actually does anything for me it's just part of my routine. Bronkaid is a stimm too and it actually can help with body composition, never had trouble coming off but if your worried your addicted may just want a couple cups coffee as needed.

Ephedrine withdrawals and depression are definitely real. At least with me. I don't even touch the stuff anymore.
I barely use caffiene either. Two of the shittiest stims available.

 

[goback2013]

I am incredibly skeptical that your two doses of stimulants during your day are causing a cardiac arrhythmia.

For reference, during my last cut I was consuming a whole pack of nicotine pouches, a long and short acting RX Adderall, and 2 to 3 doses of 300mg caffeine 4-5 days a week with only slightly elevated BP & HR but not irregularities. (I’m only consuming my prescribed RX when not cutting)

Was this diagnosed by a doctor?

Were you able to witness the arrhythmia without the stimulants in your system?

If it is from the stimulants I suggest going cold turkey.
If you have the discipline to start/run a business you should have the discipline to spend 3 to 4 weeks feeling like crap while your body readjusts.

How much Adderall do you take as part of your cut and outside your cut ?

 

[rotinaj]

How much Adderall do you take as part of your cut and outside your cut ?

I take it for incredibly crippling ADHD not for any other purpose lol.
20mg extended on my regular days and I have 10mg instant PRN.


I can tell you that stimulants like amphetamines are rather dangerous and habit forming
*physiologically* not psychologically… unlike caffeine.
The come down from going cold turkey is crippling(but doable) if you are not mentally strong and I would sooner recommend a week or two of DNP over a 2-3 months of Adderall for cutting honestly.

 

[qbkilla]

Ephedrine withdrawals and depression are definitely real. At least with me. I don't even touch the stuff anymore.
I barely use caffiene either. Two of the shittiest stims available.

What others stems do people use for body composition purposes? Ephedrine is a well known fat burner (similar to clen, not as good but you can get the real deal and not worry about bunk/UGL labs not being able to measure it). Caffeine, everyone takes it. I personally don't like taking ephedra and can't wait to come off it when I do run it for a few weeks. Maybe I just don't have an addictive personality? Really the only reason I use caffeine is because energy drinks taste good, cofeee too, more a placebo I don't actually feel more alert. Yohimbine now that stuff fasted makes me feel funny lol

 

[Tomgrass]

Buy urself the best nootropic preworkout with a little coffeine like 100-150 mg. There are really awesome one on the market right now , it will be like 1+1=3. Synergy gonna be a key here as you need to have low dose of stims.

 

[jeroendebleser]

You're hardly on any stimulants so I don't expect too much problems quitting them.

You're worrying too much about it.

Because you're on so little, I personally recommend going cold turkey.

 

[Pheedno]

Whether it's actually causing the issue or not, you're now mentally wrestling with the intake of the supplements.
If you're taking high intensity stimulants then just switch to something with less punch. A couple cups of coffee in the morning and as much green tea as you "need" during the day. Slowly reduce those amounts if you want.

Also, if you are on a low carb diet of any kind. It's very possible that your fatigue is from lack of salt. Anytime I've gone low carb(<.75g/lb) and do not keep my salt intake in the 7-10g range(bodyweight and activity specific), I'll load caffeine with no help, realize my salt is low and a teaspoon of salt in water feels like a stimulant.

 

[okko]

Ephedrine is fantastic because of the mind boost (clarity of mind) in my opinion I took 25mg injection a day
Clen is more brutal even at 60 and doesnt have same mood brain enhancement for me
These 2 and T3 T4 make HGH lethargy and fat loss so easier

 

[okko]

Definitely agree with keto and salt including potassium salt as well

 

[whacked]

I am incredibly skeptical that your two doses of stimulants during your day are causing a cardiac arrhythmia.

I hear ya and what you’re saying does make sense.

You are correct in that currently, it is indeed just a “working theory” that my stim use caused the PAC (Premature Atrial Contraction — official Dx).

I ended up making a trip to the ER b/c I’m a worry wart and wanted to rule out A-Fib (Atrial Fibrillation) - my dad has this (a type of arrhythmia) and it’s a Dx to be concerned with.

I don’t know what else could have caused this and the ER Doc was pretty unconcerned (after EKG showed it was NOT A-Fib) and just told me to f/u w a Cardiologist.

He also said PAC is not in the same category of stroke risk as A-Fib and even said it’s somewhat common.

EKG showed mild LVH (already knew about this for 5 years) and all labs (Bp, Tropinin and electrolytes etc) were normal so he sent me on my way.

When I researched this, caffeine was at the top of the list of things to avoid so I connected the dots this way in me head.

I do take really good care of my health overall; but this is the one I have not. I can’t help but think stim-abuse is the cause.

Lastly, again - I’m on these exotic stims (think…CRAZE, etc) and not just benign caffeine - so who the heck knows what these unique meth-like drugs (lol) actually do

 

[whacked]

What others stems do people use for body composition purposes? Ephedrine is a well known fat burner (similar to clen, not as good but you can get the real deal and not worry about bunk/UGL labs not being able to measure it). Caffeine, everyone takes it. I personally don't like taking ephedra and can't wait to come off it when I do run it for a few weeks. Maybe I just don't have an addictive personality? Really the only reason I use caffeine is because energy drinks taste good, cofeee too, more a placebo I don't actually feel more alert. Yohimbine now that stuff fasted makes me feel funny lol

DMAA
DMHA
& various other clandestine chemical analogies of CRACK. Lol

Think products like CRAZE etc and all the others that spiked their formulas w who knows what, made millions and then changed their formula before they got caught.

While I limited my stim use to 200mg of caffeine in the AM (not a big deal at all); and one dose of exotic stims 1.5 hours later w a pre/w/o…

I do think the latter (exotic stim) adversely affected via me cumulative use for 20-25 years.

 

[whacked]

Buy urself the best nootropic preworkout with a little coffeine like 100-150 mg. There are really awesome one on the market right now , it will be like 1+1=3. Synergy gonna be a key here as you need to have low dose of stims.

Thanks. Any good ones you can recommend?