Attempting to get lean... Anyone care to critique what I'm doing?

[derzwerg]

Appreciate the response. I'm 6'5" so it takes a LOT of muscle for me to fill out, and feel like I'm wasting so much time cutting down to a stick figure before putting size back on. It seems to be the recommendation anywhere else you go, but I'm on this board because people know what they're actually talking about. I was out of the gym for almost a decade, I'm glad I cut some of the extra fat off, but you're right - its probably time to build something to cut down to.

Sorry to hijack thread OP.

Not hijacking at all man, it sounds like we're in a similar place. I really don't want to cut away to nothing but so many people preach getting proper lean first.

When I started this cut the only real goal was a quick clean up and try to regain some insulin sensitivity so I could push again.

 

[Maly]

At the end of last year, I found myself in a situation similar to yours. I was convinced that I was following a proper diet by severely restricting my calorie intake to 1600 per day (mostly protein and very little carbs). I felt drained and miserable, I shriveled up and hated life. Note that I'm not even a big guy, I've only been working out for around a year started as obese.

By December 2024, I had reached a breaking point with my starvation diet and decided to return to a more balanced eating routine. This led to not only regaining the weight I had lost but also gaining additional fat. I ballooned +15kg in 30 days (all fat) and it wasn't pretty. All my hard work down the drain.

At the start of 2024, I made the decision to hire @luki7788 as my coach. In just three months, I transformed – I was larger, yet significantly leaner than ever before. I've always been a fatty and never been lean <15%, but for the first time in my life I had veins in my lower abs.

What's truly ironic is that during my cutting phase, @luki7788 had me on literally twice the amount of food compared to my initial attempt at dieting. I was convinced that I'll never be able to lose weight with the amount of food I was eating, but I trusted the process. Now, as we transition into a growth phase, I find myself consuming more calories than ever before and enjoying life.

Nowadays, I'm eating nearly 500g of carbs, which means my calorie intake from carbs alone is higher than it was during my diet .

I recommend hiring a coach, have faith in the process. It's eye-opening to realize how much you (we generally) still have to learn.

 

[qbkilla]

"cico" (calories in / calories out) is a good model for the general population but probably not best for someone aiming to look like a decent bodybuilder.
"sustainable defect" has a really good ring to it though.

Can you explain more? I'm no bodybuilder I'm small but I would say I have high standards for staying lean. Typically small adjustments up or down with calorie intake or cardio I can move my weight up or down as I please. Anywhere from a 240lb parmabulker down to 178 one time just to push to where I felt like death, couldn't sleep, no libido. Always interested to hear your input I'm a big fan of carb cycling.

 

[qbkilla]

Chinese gh lol but yes, still a good bit of money and you're absolutely right.


Careful now, it's not going to take much to talk me into bulking lmao. But, as mentioned, I was under the impression I'd be better off if I could start leaner.
I really don't care that much about getting "shredded" but if I could finish a bulk with body fat around where it sits currently I'd be okay with that.
I'm way more concerned with putting on size right now, just trying to get staged for a productive bulk.



Let's not even talk about my legs lol I was thinking of adding a second leg day next bulk because they are pretty much non-existent

I recently did this. Been staying lean and focusing on those show parts arms, delts, the combo of low volume for legs and low calories (2500) did a number on legs. Currently hitting them 2x a week and bumping calories up lol

 

[bananas007]

"cico" (calories in / calories out) is a good model for the general population but probably not best for someone aiming to look like a decent bodybuilder.
"sustainable defect" has a really good ring to it though.

Can you explain the first part in more detail. I understand muscle burns more calories , NeAT, negative thermal energy from foods like broccoli but is it still not overall CICO that controls a large portion of fat loss ,( protein being high of course. )

 

[bananas007]

Sorry on my phone, so didn’t realize qbkilla asked similar question

 

[bbxtreme]

"cico" (calories in / calories out) is a good model for the general population but probably not best for someone aiming to look like a decent bodybuilder.
"sustainable defect" has a really good ring to it though.

You can’t say stuff like this on here. You’re going to make everyone re-think everything they’ve ever known.

But very true for bodybuilders.

 

[Shelby]

Can you explain more? I'm no bodybuilder I'm small but I would say I have high standards for staying lean. Typically small adjustments up or down with calorie intake or cardio I can move my weight up or down as I please. Anywhere from a 240lb parmabulker down to 178 one time just to push to where I felt like death, couldn't sleep, no libido. Always interested to hear your input I'm a big fan of carb cycling.

So you only pay attention to total calories? You don't pay attention to where they come from?

 

[Eguz22]

You can absolutely diet 5 days and bring calories up 2 days.

I would leave those experiments for later, now it is better to order the basics and follow a boring diet for a few weeks.

 

[qbkilla]

So you only pay attention to total calories? You don't pay attention to where they come from?

Of course. I mean once someone has all the basic covered,(, macros, micros, total protein, healthy food, pre and post meal) then gaining or losing comes down to cico

 

[Shelby]

Of course. I mean once someone has all the basic covered,(, macros, micros, total protein, healthy food, pre and post meal) then gaining or losing comes down to cico

So your statement of "all comes down to cico" really meant "all comes down to cico and a bunch of other stuff" (to which I'd also add hormones, which govern how calories are utilized).
Sorry for pedantic.

 

[qbkilla]

So your statement of "all comes down to cico" really meant "all comes down to cico and a bunch of other stuff" (to which I'd also add hormones, which govern how calories are utilized).
Sorry for pedantic.

Basically. Once everything is in place including training, sleep, proper food choices, timing, macros...then small adjustments to calorie intake or physical activity always work for me. I've never been into iffym which I guess is what my post may have suggested

 

[b-boy]

Reading this thread was hard for me. In the year 2024 it's unbelievable that people can't get themselves into conditioning of at least seeing a full set of abs with knowledge basically at your fingertips (the search button on PM).

I will say that after reading what your currently doing I think as a coach Ken skip hill would be a good coach for you. Diet hard and deplete through the week and skipload on Saturday (not guaranteed you will do this but I see it as something you would enjoy).

Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle) • Instagram photos and videos

8,221 Followers, 196 Following, 2,388 Posts - See Instagram photos and videos from Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle)

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[hevi-head]

Basically. Once everything is in place including training, sleep, proper food choices, timing, macros...then small adjustments to calorie intake or physical activity always work for me. I've never been into iffym which I guess is what my post may have suggested

Surely you can post some pics of all these comments lately from diet to rear delts and how what you’re doing is working so well?

 

[qbkilla]

Reading this thread was hard for me. In the year 2024 it's unbelievable that people can't get themselves into conditioning of at least seeing a full set of abs with knowledge basically at your fingertips (the search button on PM).

I will say that after reading what your currently doing I think as a coach Ken skip hill would be a good coach for you. Diet hard and deplete through the week and skipload on Saturday (not guaranteed you will do this but I see it as something you would enjoy).

Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle) • Instagram photos and videos

8,221 Followers, 196 Following, 2,388 Posts - See Instagram photos and videos from Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle)

www.instagram.com

I've done the skipload approach before and liked it alot. I know skip has a Long YouTube video where he talks about his approach and how it has changed over time from shit loading. Imma big fan. Alex is gone (rip) but if I was to ever hire a coach, skip would definitely be a guy.

Found the vid for op

 

[TedDansen]

I guess I don't see what the problem is. Your goal is to get to 10%, you've already lost 17 lbs and are getting leaner. Just keep going.

Yea you're not doing everything perfectly, but it doesn't sound like you want to commit that much of your life to this. I would just make a few minor changes like dropping T3 to 25 mcg or even 0, increase your fats a little, and try to vary your food choices a little more. Also, the time to add GH is now, it's good for losing fat.

 

[derzwerg]

Reading this thread was hard for me. In the year 2024 it's unbelievable that people can't get themselves into conditioning of at least seeing a full set of abs with knowledge basically at your fingertips (the search button on PM).

I will say that after reading what your currently doing I think as a coach Ken skip hill would be a good coach for you. Diet hard and deplete through the week and skipload on Saturday (not guaranteed you will do this but I see it as something you would enjoy).

Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle) • Instagram photos and videos

8,221 Followers, 196 Following, 2,388 Posts - See Instagram photos and videos from Ken “Skip” Hill [email protected] (@intensemuscle)

www.instagram.com

Skiploading was definitely something I had in mind. I listen to skip on the think big podcasts and just listened to a video on his trtbb channel about skiploading.
I've probably been doing more of a shitload lol but, in my mind, as long as my weight was dipping below the previous week's at some point I'd just keep on.

The past few weekends have been pretty bad and I think the biggest thing is just reigning the weekend in

 

[derzwerg]

I guess I don't see what the problem is. Your goal is to get to 10%, you've already lost 17 lbs and are getting leaner. Just keep going.

Yea you're not doing everything perfectly, but it doesn't sound like you want to commit that much of your life to this. I would just make a few minor changes like dropping T3 to 25 mcg or even 0, increase your fats a little, and try to vary your food choices a little more. Also, the time to add GH is now, it's good for losing fat.

Honestly, most of the comments have been things I kinda already knew so I don't even know why I felt the need to post. Feedback from others is definitely appreciated and it does help solidify the things I was already thinking. And some hard truths have been laid out which is also appreciated.

I'm going to try and get more variety in and raise the calories during the week. Hopefully that leaves me in a better place mentally when the weekend comes.

 

[derzwerg]

This is probably a really stupid question but, is there anything wrong with jogging for cardio?
LISS seems to be preferred and I'm currently doing incline treadmill but I'd like to start doing cardio outside. But I can't get my hr up just walking on a flat.

 

[juiceball44]

This is probably a really stupid question but, is there anything wrong with jogging for cardio?
LISS seems to be preferred and I'm currently doing incline treadmill but I'd like to start doing cardio outside. But I can't get my hr up just walking on a flat.

As long as you stay in zone 2 heart rate for cardio it doesn’t really matter what you do. Another option for walking outside is a weighted vest to bring up hr