Blood Pressure Meds and Treatment -A Discussion

[Massive G]

I decided to start this thread as we discussed this over at MM and blood pressure can really be the "silent killer" to your cardio vascular system and kidneys. No joke. We don't need any help as we already stress the kidneys with high bodyweights, most lifters are dehydrated, and we bang our kidneys with high blood pressure in short bursts of high intensity training-which also dumps protein into the kidneys. Add in thickened blood, and fluid retention from AAS use and you complicate things further.

I developed high blood pressure in 2000, and got treatment. After 5 years he and I agree the only way I can ever possbily come off the meds is by losing weight. On meds my BP averaged in the mid 120's/over mid 80's. It can creep up to 140/90 but I keep a record of it.

I have been over 250 now for 10 years and hell averaged close to 3 bills for 5.
Weight is and was a concern for me so I left no stone unturned to get my BP down. It's complicated and requires a doc's help as self medicating BP meds can be dangerous in juicers especially the types that reduce blood volume and heart rate.
A one time reading at a doc's office is pretty inaccurate, the best way is to get a cuff and keep a log at home for an average.

It's important the doctor works with you on the meds he prescribes as many have unwanted side effects and can be dangerous in juicers with the thickened blood (especially types that reduce blood volume via the kidney, or with diuretic action)


Here are the types and how they work for those interested:

Diuretics-no explanation needed.

Beta-blockers-Beta-blockers reduce nerve impulses to the heart and blood vessels. This makes the heart beat slower and with less force. Blood pressure drops and the heart works less hard.

ACE inhibitors-Angiotensin converting enzyme (ACE) inhibitors prevent the formation of a hormone called angiotensin II, which normally causes blood vessels to narrow. The ACE inhibitors cause the vessels to relax and blood pressure goes down.

Angiotensin antagonists-Angiotensin antagonists shield blood vessels from angiotensin II. As a result, the vessels become wider and blood pressure goes down.

Calcium channel blockers (CCBs)-CCBs keep calcium from entering the muscle cells of the heart and blood vessels. This causes the blood vessels to relax and pressure goes down.

Alpha-blockers-Alpha-blockers reduce nerve impulses to blood vessels, which allows blood to pass more easily, causing the blood pressure to go down.

Alpha-beta-blockers-Alpha-beta-blockers work the same way as alpha-blockers but also slow the heartbeat, as beta-blockers do. As a result, less blood is pumped through the vessels and the blood pressure goes down.

Nervous system inhibitors-Nervous system inhibitors relax blood vessels by controlling nerve impulses. This causes the blood vessels to become wider and the blood pressure to go down.

Vasodilators-Vasodilators directly open blood vessels by relaxing the muscle in the vessel walls, causing the blood pressure to go down.

The above descriptions are very simplistic but you can see the broad array and choice a physician will have to choose.

I tried a beta blocker and hated it, it made me feel groggy and as the Doc described in elementary terms "It slows everything down" not a good choice for me.

It took several different types of blood pressure meds till we found 2 that worked with out sides.

It's strange because each drug has different sides even though in the same class as we tried Prinivil (ACE inh) and it had nasty side effects for me frequent urination and headaches whereas Altace is virtually symptom free.

My doc and I chose Altace (ACE inhibitor) and Norvasc (Calcium channel blocker) and they work quite well for me. But please don't self medicate and try to dose BP meds to control it as you can see above it's complicated and can reduce blood volume and slow your HR down which may not be good in people with heavy blood as discussed before.

PEACE
Be safe fellas I see posts on the boards all the time from people taking diuretics to reduce water retention from GH and AAS and that is damn dangerous to self medicate like that. Get blood work done and work with a doc on any BP meds or diuretics to stay safe.

 

[thebrick]

excellent info. thanks!

 

[Kaiser]

Very well written and informative. I copied this info local for later use if I need it. Thank you.

 

[thebrick]

My doc and I chose Altace (ACE inhibitor) and Norvasc (Calcium channel blocker) and they work quite well for me. But please don't self medicate and try to dose BP meds to control it as you can see above it's complicated and can reduce blood volume and slow your HR down which may not be good in people with heavy blood as discussed before.

Massive, how much did your pressure drop after trying the Altrace/Norvasc combo?

 

[Massive G]

Massive, how much did your pressure drop after trying the Altrace/Norvasc combo?

pressure went from averaging in the upper 130's/90's to normal measurements.
The norvasc did the job for the most part but was reduced as they added in altace later on for protein in my urine and my pressure actually dropped too low (for me) 110/70 or so making me dizzy.
That's why it's best to work with a doc.
As mentioned in the thread, Prinivil made me feel like shit-where as Altace was virtually symptom free other than it reducing my BP too low initially.

 

[Big_O]

Hmmm!

I'm 47 and have to take Norvasc also....My B/P right now is 138/92.....I'm clean right now but I'll be going back on here in a few more weeks....

When I was on my cholesterol went up to 288...just got the results in from last week and it's at 180.....

Altace..I'm always open to try something different...

 

[Conan21]

Thanks for the info Massive G!!!

 

[Jerkyboy]

My BP was 140's/90's for a while. (Even after being OFF For about 1 year) So my doc put me on Micardis tabs. Suppose to be a newer safer type of drug.

There is 40mg of telmisartan per pill and I take 1 per day. Brings my BP down to 120-130's/70-80's. (Dont know exactly cause I didnt really pay attention when they take my BP, I just know its now in the normal range)


The whole thing was unexpected, when I was a kid (or high school student) my BP Was always on the low low side of the HEALTHY ZONE. You know, something like 100/60 or something. Amazing what a few years of non-stop juicing will do to your heart! dangit

If anyone needs more info on this, I can type up some info from the package insert if you want me to.

My Doc says it inhibits the enzyme that effects the heart and raises BP. Blocks it somehow from either attaching to the receptors or being released at all.

**They advised me NOT to take 2 tabs (80mg) or that would lower it too much and I'd be in danger of too LOW of BP. (never thought anyone could have that problem either - but I took their word for it***

 

[Snarf]

Thanks for the BP review Massive - too many people don't pay attention to their blood pressure. In fact the guidelines for what constitutes a healthy/normal blood pressure was just adjusted downwards so many with borderline blood pressure are now classified as high.

 

[manboy270]

Good Info!

I've been on meds about 6 years now. Started on low dose of Norvasc and it wasn't enough. Next I tried Diovan (my brother takes this) and I had a reaction too it-my heart went crazy-scary shit! Doc put me on Aetenolol (beta-blocker)for a few years. This one worked good except it really does slow you down. I really noticed it while squating-took a long time for me to recover between sets-my heart just wasn't working at full capacity. I read a post, I think by Phil Hernon, about Lotrel for HBP and he mentioned its' kidney sparing effects and few sides so I went back to the Doc and gave it a go. Really good stuff. My BP now hovers in the low 130's/upper 60's-really good for me. I haven't really noticed any side effects either. There are tons of meds out there and it's cool when you can find one that really works for you-BTW thanks for the heads up Phil.

 

[Homer]

Massive G, What kind of cuff do you use at home? How much was it?

 

[gymrat215]

good stuff massive, i was lookin for some info on this

 

[RicPhoenix]

High blood pressue, is an interesting thing in that you can be predisposed to it genetically. So while body weight, gear etc are a factor, you could lose weight and still keep high blood pressure or a person could have never been over weight and have high blood pressure. In Australia we have TV commercials about blood pressure and diabetes because most people do not know they have an issue with it.

I find it interesting that it sounds like the doctor mentioned here went straight to drugs instead of looking at nutrition and exercise first and then drugs second or a combination of the two when examining the "options" for health care.

Cardiovascular exercise decreases blood pressure and most westerners are consuming far more salt and sugar than recommended by the various nutrition societies. The RDI for sodium is 920-2300mg daily for men in Australia. (you get that in a couple slices of bread or a bag of chips or a packet of cookies)

Here in Australia it is recommended that everyone gets 30 min. of activity daily either continuous or in 3 , ten minute sessions which may mean just walking from the car and up a flight of stairs to your office. Most of us do not realise how inactive we are for example:

The average person in the suburbs with a 2 car garage attached to the house gets up, has breaky, jumps in the car, drives to the office car park, gets on the lift and walks 10 meters to his desk and sits ALL day, has lunch...drives homes parks in the attached garage, walks 10 meters to the bedroom to change clothing and sits for TV and a meal then bed. ( I think I read that New Yorkers are less obese than other segements of American society ...does that sound right? possibly due to less car travel and more walking)

Now do that 5 or 6 days a week for 365 days a year....and we wonder why we do not get exercise?

 

[leapfrog]

IMO

most doctors have no fucking clue.if you truely have high blood pressure i would suggest you go to the MAYO clinic.depending where you live find the one closest to you.anyway my father had high BP for 20yrs,i remember many times him going to the ER with 220/180 and them admitting him and not being able to get it down.after multiple doctors and thousands in useless (not to mention harmfull medications) he went to the mayo clinic.5 minutes into the interview the doctor said i know exactly what's wrong with you.problem:your kidneys produce a hormone called renin which plays a major roll in your BP.my father wasn't producing enough renin,so they prescribed him the proper meds and his BP is 120/60.he is 68 and 50 lbs over weight,but takes very good care of himself.he asked the man at the clinic how he figured it out so quick,the man replied that we are taught that if we can not diagnose 90% of our patients in the first 20 minutes of the first interview:we are not doing something right.my dad was amazed when he saw the bills (blood work $12.00,x-rays $40.00 etc-compared to most docs BW 200.00,x-rays 400.00 to 700.00).he will no longer go to a regular doctor,he drives to arizona anytime he has to go to the doc.


i've been researching medical shit for 20 yrs so i don't go to the doc but when i do they usually kick me out because i ask to many questions or tell them they are wrong.almost all docs prescribe meds according to what pharmaceutical rep takes care of them the best.i have alot of friends who are reps and i knew 1 that got in trouble for not spending enough on their expense account.how about this:avg time you spend with the doc,3 minutes.i'm sorry but the medical industry,is a scam.BIG PHARMA can suck a dick!!! cialis 12 bucks,when they have been available for yrs for a buck at most.THIS is my opinion,and as we all know they are like assholes everyone has one .

leap

 

[Homer]

I have been looking for a home digital BP monitor kit but they don't come bigger then 17". Anyone have any ideas where to find a larger one?

 

[juicyr6]

I have been looking for a home digital BP monitor kit but they don't come bigger then 17". Anyone have any ideas where to find a larger one?

i had the same problem , so i bought a wrist monitor...However it is said that the wrist monitor is not as accurate, after reading and researching a bit, i now understand that your wrist needs to be at the same height as your heart to get a more accurate reading.

either lay down to take a more accurate measure (so your heart is at the same height) or rest your rest on a table while your heart is a table height...

(i hope im not being to confusing)

 

[Phlmuscle]

They sell cuffs for people with larger biceps. When I bought my blood pressure monitor in Wal-Mart they had them on the rack. Sold separately that would fit the model I was buying.

 

[jaguar1]

Blood Pressure

Thanks for the info - the various posts have written in are these people on BP Meds and Gear at the same time , i would like to know as i want to start using gear again thanks for your help. My Med is called INDAPAMIDE SR 1.5mg tablets (NATRLIX SR ). I am form the UK so this drug maybe called something else in the USA. Thanks again.

 

[juicyr6]

They sell cuffs for people with larger biceps. When I bought my blood pressure monitor in Wal-Mart they had them on the rack. Sold separately that would fit the model I was buying.

yes they do, but the highest they go i think is 17inches.

 

[ag-guys]

I decided to start this thread as we discussed this over at MM and blood pressure can really be the "silent killer" to your cardio vascular system and kidneys. No joke. We don't need any help as we already stress the kidneys with high bodyweights, most lifters are dehydrated, and we bang our kidneys with high blood pressure in short bursts of high intensity training-which also dumps protein into the kidneys. Add in thickened blood, and fluid retention from AAS use and you complicate things further.

I developed high blood pressure in 2000, and got treatment. After 5 years he and I agree the only way I can ever possbily come off the meds is by losing weight. On meds my BP averaged in the mid 120's/over mid 80's. It can creep up to 140/90 but I keep a record of it.

I have been over 250 now for 10 years and hell averaged close to 3 bills for 5.
Weight is and was a concern for me so I left no stone unturned to get my BP down. It's complicated and requires a doc's help as self medicating BP meds can be dangerous in juicers especially the types that reduce blood volume and heart rate.
A one time reading at a doc's office is pretty inaccurate, the best way is to get a cuff and keep a log at home for an average.

It's important the doctor works with you on the meds he prescribes as many have unwanted side effects and can be dangerous in juicers with the thickened blood (especially types that reduce blood volume via the kidney, or with diuretic action)


Here are the types and how they work for those interested:

Diuretics-no explanation needed.

Beta-blockers-Beta-blockers reduce nerve impulses to the heart and blood vessels. This makes the heart beat slower and with less force. Blood pressure drops and the heart works less hard.

ACE inhibitors-Angiotensin converting enzyme (ACE) inhibitors prevent the formation of a hormone called angiotensin II, which normally causes blood vessels to narrow. The ACE inhibitors cause the vessels to relax and blood pressure goes down.

Angiotensin antagonists-Angiotensin antagonists shield blood vessels from angiotensin II. As a result, the vessels become wider and blood pressure goes down.

Calcium channel blockers (CCBs)-CCBs keep calcium from entering the muscle cells of the heart and blood vessels. This causes the blood vessels to relax and pressure goes down.

Alpha-blockers-Alpha-blockers reduce nerve impulses to blood vessels, which allows blood to pass more easily, causing the blood pressure to go down.

Alpha-beta-blockers-Alpha-beta-blockers work the same way as alpha-blockers but also slow the heartbeat, as beta-blockers do. As a result, less blood is pumped through the vessels and the blood pressure goes down.

Nervous system inhibitors-Nervous system inhibitors relax blood vessels by controlling nerve impulses. This causes the blood vessels to become wider and the blood pressure to go down.

Vasodilators-Vasodilators directly open blood vessels by relaxing the muscle in the vessel walls, causing the blood pressure to go down.

The above descriptions are very simplistic but you can see the broad array and choice a physician will have to choose.

I tried a beta blocker and hated it, it made me feel groggy and as the Doc described in elementary terms "It slows everything down" not a good choice for me.

It took several different types of blood pressure meds till we found 2 that worked with out sides.

It's strange because each drug has different sides even though in the same class as we tried Prinivil (ACE inh) and it had nasty side effects for me frequent urination and headaches whereas Altace is virtually symptom free.

My doc and I chose Altace (ACE inhibitor) and Norvasc (Calcium channel blocker) and they work quite well for me. But please don't self medicate and try to dose BP meds to control it as you can see above it's complicated and can reduce blood volume and slow your HR down which may not be good in people with heavy blood as discussed before.

PEACE
Be safe fellas I see posts on the boards all the time from people taking diuretics to reduce water retention from GH and AAS and that is damn dangerous to self medicate like that. Get blood work done and work with a doc on any BP meds or diuretics to stay safe.

Interesting article.

AG
www.ag-guys.com