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Crossing the Blood Brain Barrier w/ Longvida Curcumin & Mag L-Threonate

MR. BMJ

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I can't add anything, but I wanted tp point out that KAL does make a Mag Glycinate in 200mg softgels (and hard pressed tablets). I usually take 2-3 at night as glycinate supposedly helps more on the calming side of things. I take it with my TN Sleep Aid.

For curcumin, I have not stayed up to date on it, as it seemed like a wild wild west of who had the best version. I figured after some time it would sort itself out...though maybe it needs further time. I have not looked at the research, mostly by posts here at proM, as i haven't had time to look into it. I mostly use LEF's version, but have used Jarrows, one other brand with Novasol, and I have also just recently been take The Lab's J-Flex. So right now LEF (BID) and J-Flex (6x caps/d).

I'd be interested in others thoughts on the Longvida and the Mag threonate....I just don't have time to look into it. I doubt there will be any head-2-head research comparisons at this time with it, but that is my guess....though hopefully i'm wrong. Probably right now the best thing to do is take it and judge by labs and feel.
 

Knight9

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1. BCM 95® – Curcumin Formulated with Turmeric Oil
An example of this approach in market is BCM- 95®/BIOCURCUMAXTM, a “Curcuminoids Complex with Volatile compounds not less than 95%”. The product was patented in 2002 and the patent method discusses increasing the bioavailability of 98% pure Curcumin from a presumptive benchmark levels of 60-65% to 90-97% levels with added turmerone- enriched oil.

The presumption the marketers make in their bioavailability claim for Curcumin is based on the measurement of Curcumin in an unscientific approach due to the spectroscopic method used to estimate unabsorbed Curcumin in the fecal matter. Another anomaly in the study mentioned in the patent actually mentions range of absorption of 60-65% for unmodified Curcumin, which would be considered an extremely bioavailable compound by any standards, therefore this measurement in the bioavailability context, casts a long shadow of doubt on the protocol and analytical methodology adopted in the study which was conducted to prove the bioavailability of BCM-95® only.

Turmeric essential oil has not been proven to be safe for humans, and one study by Prof. Janet Funk clearly showed that Tumeric oil has a detrimental effect on the protective actions of Curcuminoids 18.



2. MERIVA® – CURCUMIN FORMULATED WITH PHOSPHATIDYLCHOLINE
A second formulation consisting of Curcumin (20%), Phosphatidylcholine (40%) and microcrystalline cellulose has been reported to increase the bioavailability of Curcuminoids 29 times 19.

However, what the product actually does is increase the concentration of the phase II metabolic products, namely the glucuronides and sulfates, which are the inactive forms of Curcumin. These glucuronides, as recounted earlier, neither display activity against cancer cells nor inhibit pro-inflammatory NFkB. Their bioavailability claim is based on a single human study involving only nine subjects divided in three arms of the study (three subjects each).

Studies on this brand of ‘enhanced’ Curcumin only substantiate the known anti-inflammatory effects of curcuminoids, but do not show or prove the benefits of any enhanced bioavailability on their existing results. The studies conducted only demonstrate the end points which were achieved by previous studies using Curcuminoids alone.

A new report on phosphatidylcholine appeared in the Nature News and Views article published in the columnCardiovascular Disease20 that reviewed the evidence high-fat foods are rich in the lipid phosphatidylcholine – the ingredient used in Meriva® – and its metabolite choline. Intestinal bacteria convert phosphatidylcholine and choline into Trimethylamine oxide (TMAO). The liver enzyme FMO3 converts Trimethylamine (TMA) into TMAO – a metabolite that is then found in the blood. Research conducted by Wang et al. as published in Nature21 showed that circulating levels of TMAO may contribute to greater plaque formation in the arteries, and could result in heart disease.



3. CURCUWIN™ – CURCUMIN FORMULATED WITH ULTRASOL™ TECHNOLOGY
The manufacturer of a product called CurcuWIN™ claims 46 times greater Curcumin bioavailability compared to standard Curcumin, BCM-95® or phytosomal Curcumin, Meriva®. The product claims to use an unknown ‘UltraSOLTM nutrient technology’, which increases all of the pharmacologically inactive Curcumin conjugates, including the glucuronides and sulfates.



4. THERACURMIN® – CURCUMIN USING NANOTECHNOLOGY
An ‘enhanced’ Curcumin product called Theracurmin® using a nanotechnology and water dispersion technology claims 40 times greater bioavailability in rats and 27 times higher bioavailability in humans compared to powdered Curcumin 22.

This technology also increases all of the pharmacologically inactive Curcumin conjugates, namely the glucuronides and sulfates.



5. LONGVIDA® – CURCUMIN FORMULATED INTO SOLID LIPID PARTICLES USING LECITHIN
Longvida® is marketed as “solid lipid particle formulation of curcumin”23. The manufacturer claims that their technology increases the bioavailability of Curcumin 65 times and states that their Curcumin detected in blood serum is free Curcumin and not glucuronidated or conjugated Curcumin metabolites. However no detailed toxicity studies are available on such products of recent origin. Here again lecithin could produce TMAO, a cardiotoxic chemical.



6. CAVAMAX® W8 – CURCUMIN FORMULATED WITH CYCLODEXTRIN
CAVAMAX® W8 is an ‘enhanced’ Curcumin made by complexing Curcumin with gamma cyclodextrin. The in vivobioavailability was measured in rats and showed a 10 to 20 times higher total curcuminoids. According to their research “Animals that received CAVAMAX® W8 curcumin showed a 10 to 20 times higher amount of total curcuminoids in their blood plasma, expressed as the sum of free curcumin and its metabolites (curcumin sulfates and curcumin glucuronides), than animals that received a commercial product or pure curcumin powder. This huge difference in HPLC- measured curcumin metabolites indicates that a maximum amount of curcumin was delivered into the blood stream of the rats, which can only be explained by the very highly bioavailable CAVAMAX® “W8 curcumin.”

In a human serum pharmacokinetic study, the manufacturer concluded that “Curcumin uptake was at least 4.4 times higher than the next-best commercial curcumin formulation in this clinical study.” The problem with these measurements in the rat and human study is that they estimate inactive metabolites, assuming that the metabolites are active, which they are not.

Cyclodextrin complexes are often used to increase the bioavailability of natural compounds. However, there is a toxicity issue where some cyclodextrins solubilize cholesterol, which can then be depleted from cell membranes. Beta cyclodextrin has a regulatory limit of 5 mg/kg/day because it is known to deplete cholesterol from cell membranes in this manner24.

Another toxicity issue has been revealed in rat studies where cyclodextrins were thought to increase the solubility and absorption of toxic contaminants in ingested food 25.



7. CURCUMIN FORMULATED WITH BIOPERINE®
This combination consist of two GRAS, patented ingredients Curcumin C3 Complex® and BioPerine®, a Piper nigrumextract. BioPerine® has been clinically studied for increasing the bioavailability of several nutrients including Curcuminoids. In a clinical study conducted in 1998 on healthy volunteers, it was found that BioPerine® can increase the bioavailability of curcuminoids by 20 folds26. This increase was measured for the Curcumin itself and not for its phase II metabolites. One of the reasons for this finding comes from the fact that the BioPerine® consists of piperine which is known to inhibit the formation of phase II metabolites because of glucuronidation. Piperine reduces glucuronidation by inhibition of UDP- glucuronyl transferase activity and by lowering the levels of endogenous glucuronic acid. Curcumin has tendency to undergo rapid biotransformation, its conversion in particular to Phase II metabolism is often seen as detrimental to bioactivity. BioPerine® helps in inhibiting the formation of phase II metabolites of Curcumin27. Piperine promotes nature’s own mechanism namely the flippase activity by P-gp inhibition and reduces the glucoronidation of Curcumin. This effect is short lived and requires simultaneous consumption of 5 mg of BioPerine® along with Curcuminoids. BioPerine® does not indiscriminatingly increase the Curcumin bioavailability. Other formulations increase the glucoronidation of Curcumin. In addition piperine has thermogenesis activity. As the thermogenesis occurs, the demand of fresh nutrients increases to sustain the metabolic process, facilitating better absorption of nutrients in intestine.







Safety of Curcumin C3 Complex® and BioPerine® has been evaluated in a clinical study performed by Tufts University. The results of the study showed that Curcumin and BioPerine® combination can be safely taken without any interaction with commonly prescribed medication such as flurbiprofen, acetaminophen and midazolam28. However no such data on drug interactions is available with any other curcumin formulation.

Extensive biotransformation in the body, an in-depth knowledge of Curcumin biotransformation and role of metabolites inside the body is important to apply the concept of bioavailability more constructively.



Table I gives an interesting comparison of above seven curcumin preparations in context of their composition, bioavailability, actual Curcumin in the product as well as estimated bioavailable Curcumin in the body.
The chart is informative for retailers & consumers to understand the difference between various curcumin preparations available in the market. The table can assist in choosing the right formulation by providing answers to following questions:

– Which formulation has maximum Curcumin in the product based on both composition as well as dose equivalency (Available Curcumin= Bioavailability Factor X content of Curcumin)
– What forms of Curcumin are made bioavailable (Does it include phase II metabolites?)
– Which formulation is GRAS and safe
– Use of excipients and associated toxicity
– How many clinical studies have been conducted on the formulations
 

Knight9

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Curqfen and Meriva are the only two forms I’ve ever seen any joint/anti inflammatory relief from. Bcm-95, longvida, Curcuwin, or with BioPerine never gave any relief. The below was written by a member on another forum.


I would personally like to see CurQfen in the product. Free curcuminoids seems to be the most active component we are looking for after curcumin supplementation and this material provides the highest levels of free curcuminoids in the blood when compared to a generic 95% curcumin extract. The galactomannans from fenugreek form a gel like structure that protect the curcumin from intestinal conjugation while also sticking to the epithelial cells to assist with absorption. Animal data also shows improved uptake of the free curcuminoids from this material into key areas like the brain, heart, liver, and spleen. The effective dosage range is between 500-1,000mg of this material daily. Another additive that may be worth exploring is turmerones. They seem to complement curcuminoids in their ability to regulation inflammation and they can further assist the absorption of curcuminoids by impacting P-glycoprotein (P-gp) activities in the intestines. I linked studies below:

CurQfen:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1756464615000535

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1756464616000426

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6174784/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30889454/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27043120/

Turmerones:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9215873/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3282471/
Thank you! This is the form I forgot about during my discussion a couple weeks back and I was never able to remember it!
 

Knight9

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Interesting discussion. I just got my bloods done and waiting for results, I paid for a huge vitamin profile to check levels of D, Magnesium, B vit and about everything else so I'm very curious.

I've been taking this magnesium; https://bioptimizers.com/product/magnesium-breakthrough/
In depth discussion here: https://superhumanradio.net/shr-254...ntended-way-weight-lifting-makes-aging-easier

I'm not affiliated with that company or anything and not necessarily trying to promote them but after listening to this, researching, and looking at other products my wife and I have both settled on using this one and both have noticed a difference in how we feel.
Can't argue with feeling a difference but I would contend that it very easily could be from a single form or perhaps two. Proprietary formulas are my pet peeve..especially in this day and age. Not to mention, this is a magnesium kitchen sink approach. I have known Carl for years..and i love how his brain works and what he is trying to continuously do..but he is very excitable and often what he promotes is what sponsors his site. He actually interviewed me once in 2010 live from a bodybuilding show and small expo.

I would love to hear about your bloodwork results.
 

sickboy

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Interesting thread- don’t have much to add on Mag Threonate. And never noticed much with curcumin. I get much better results with broccoli sprouts in my diet for inflammation.

I’ve been taking Magnesium Glycinate before bed for for the last 6 months. It causes a noticeable calming effect within 30-45 mins. Sleep quality is much improved. Would also add that since I’ve been taking it, I get the most vivid dreams every single night, without fail. Even if I get up to use the bathroom, when I go back to sleep, another dream. So real I can remember each dream the next day.
This is the brand I’ve been talking. 500mgs per cap.

 

Knight9

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Interesting thread- don’t have much to add on Mag Threonate. And never noticed much with curcumin. I get much better results with broccoli sprouts in my diet for inflammation.

I’ve been taking Magnesium Glycinate before bed for for the last 6 months. It causes a noticeable calming effect within 30-45 mins. Sleep quality is much improved. Would also add that since I’ve been taking it, I get the most vivid dreams every single night, without fail. Even if I get up to use the bathroom, when I go back to sleep, another dream. So real I can remember each dream the next day.
This is the brand I’ve been talking. 500mgs per cap.


It would be very interesting to me if you elected to try Mag L-Threonate from say...LEF or Jarrow @ one serving prior to bed and see if the same happens or if it is enhanced even moreso.

500mg Glycinate in a pill is wild. Naturally Id be skeptical but all I'd need to see is some reviews and perhaps testing to be convinced. Three to five years ago, all glycinate seemed to be in 100mg tablets.
 

headtrainer

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What I can say about magnesium is this: I haven’t had a kidney stone since I started taking it 5 years ago and I used to get 1-2 stones every year. I will continue taking magnesium!
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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Curcumin and Magnesium are two of the most important supplements for overall health and longevity. Longvida Curcumin and Magnesium L-Threonate have both been proven to cross the BBB-also proving they are pretty bio available.

I just currently started using Longvida in Nordic Naturals Omega Curcumin.(It also contains NAC and L-glutathione. I also shelved what I will use next which is Omega Memory with Longvida, Phosphatidylcholine, Huperzine A, and a higher dose of DHA.
I am waiting to get my Vitamin D checked(I've been taking 20,000 units a day for 2 months) and will see my levels and then add Magnesium to my supplement intake and see how much my levels are boosted by the increased activation.

I have recommended my mother who is in her 70s to take Magnesium L-Threonate and she barely supplements but told me she notices a difference. This will be the initial form I add @2000mg (144mg elemental) when I check my levels again and will also get a Magnesium RBC panel. After that I will decide if adding Magnesium Glycinate is warranted.


I'm looking for input or knowledge on these forms of two very important supplements and i am also wondering if another form is expected to be used in conjunction junction with these since these end up penetrating the BBB.
For example, if I want optimal magnesium for other things like sleep and blood pressure or optimal curcumin for inflammation etc, will taking another form be necessary? Seems to me if significant amounts end up in the brain, they will not be in other places..or at least not as plentiful elsewhere.

Some things to talk about! Looking forward to discussion!
what are your thoughts about magnesium injections? Seems easy enough to brew. Its just water and magnesium ran through a .22 whatman. I've been toying with the idea of mag injections into my pec which from a past injury always forms muscle knots/tension/spasms and causes me pain. Seems like it would help to inject it with magnesium.
 

Knight9

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what are your thoughts about magnesium injections? Seems easy enough to brew. Its just water and magnesium ran through a .22 whatman. I've been toying with the idea of mag injections into my pec which from a past injury always forms muscle knots/tension/spasms and causes me pain. Seems like it would help to inject it with magnesium.
I would have no idea speaking on this. Unless it was proven to have localized healing properties, I would think it would be pointless. Magnesium can be absorbed transdermally in epsom salt baths. With that kind of delivery method available - as well as oral forms that seem geared to do different things in the body, I would have to have real evidence injecting it would have some sort of intense benefit.
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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I would have no idea speaking on this. Unless it was proven to have localized healing properties, I would think it would be pointless. Magnesium can be absorbed transdermally in epsom salt baths. With that kind of delivery method available - as well as oral forms that seem geared to do different things in the body, I would have to have real evidence injecting it would have some sort of intense benefit.
Agreed. I'm going to try it anyway. Magnesium has a poor absorption rate of around 35%. Intramuscular should be much higher, close to 100%. I would say injected into the muscle itself would provide disproportionate muscle relaxation to that muscle versus other muscles in the body (of course some will go systemic).

As to curcumin, I have experimented around with the major formulations and prefer Meriva, both oral and in my own IM formula with castor oil/polysorbate 80/Peg400 at 50mg/ml. If I take it orally its around 500mg/day with omega oils (hemp).
 

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I do hope this conversation will continue. I've had myself, my wife, and our son on longvida curc for a while now. I've wondered the same thing: would it be beneficial to take another formulation alongside the longvida?
 

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I ordered two bottles of longvida curcumin. I'm going to take it for some time and see how it goes. Theracurmin also has my interest.

Anyone use Theracurmin?
 

aphextwin

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I love the Longvida Curcumin. For those who take this product, how much you take daily? I’m doing a 1000 mg a day and can tell my knees no longer ache anymore when running stairs.
 

aphextwin

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Curcumin and Magnesium are two of the most important supplements for overall health and longevity. Longvida Curcumin and Magnesium L-Threonate have both been proven to cross the BBB-also proving they are pretty bio available.

I just currently started using Longvida in Nordic Naturals Omega Curcumin.(It also contains NAC and L-glutathione. I also shelved what I will use next which is Omega Memory with Longvida, Phosphatidylcholine, Huperzine A, and a higher dose of DHA.
I am waiting to get my Vitamin D checked(I've been taking 20,000 units a day for 2 months) and will see my levels and then add Magnesium to my supplement intake and see how much my levels are boosted by the increased activation.

I have recommended my mother who is in her 70s to take Magnesium L-Threonate and she barely supplements but told me she notices a difference. This will be the initial form I add @2000mg (144mg elemental) when I check my levels again and will also get a Magnesium RBC panel. After that I will decide if adding Magnesium Glycinate is warranted.


I'm looking for input or knowledge on these forms of two very important supplements and i am also wondering if another form is expected to be used in conjunction junction with these since these end up penetrating the BBB.
For example, if I want optimal magnesium for other things like sleep and blood pressure or optimal curcumin for inflammation etc, will taking another form be necessary? Seems to me if significant amounts end up in the brain, they will not be in other places..or at least not as plentiful elsewhere.

Some things to talk about! Looking forward to discussion!

Knight! I’m not trying to hijack this thread but I’m curious why you are consuming so much vitamin d? We’re you low?
 

Knight9

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Knight! I’m not trying to hijack this thread but I’m curious why you are consuming so much vitamin d? We’re you low?

Because of the virus..and the benefits(via all the gene signaling and other things Vitamin D controls). 20,000iu daily put me at 84.9 last week. I just added magnesium glycinate 500mg at night and will re test how much more is activated in the next month or two.
Two baselines in the last 5 yrs on no vitamin D yielded 19.6 both times.
In the past, 5000 has had me at 45.2..
10,000 at 63.8.
Ideally, I'd want to be at 70-80 always.

Product is Life Extension D3 and K2 with Sea Iodine. Four daily after a large meal.
 

Knight9

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I love the Longvida Curcumin. For those who take this product, how much you take daily? I’m doing a 1000 mg a day and can tell my knees no longer ache anymore when running stairs.
Did you get Omega Curcumin or Omega Memory by Nordic? I take 2 daily which gives me 400mg Longvida, but I strive to use another product in conjunction with it to achieve 3g of EPA+DHA. Currently it's Nordic Ultimate Omega 2x or Carlson's liquid.
 

aphextwin

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Because of the virus..and the benefits(via all the gene signaling and other things Vitamin D controls). 20,000iu daily put me at 84.9 last week. I just added magnesium glycinate 500mg at night and will re test how much more is activated in the next month or two.
Two baselines in the last 5 yrs on no vitamin D yielded 19.6 both times.
In the past, 5000 has had me at 45.2..
10,000 at 63.8.
Ideally, I'd want to be at 70-80 always.

Product is Life Extension D3 and K2 with Sea Iodine. Four daily after a large meal.

Great write up my friend. I sometimes will take 10,000. I believe we will continue to see more info to come showing that Vit D helps fend off covid. If anything it may help people recover faster from it. I always tell people it’s a must have supplement in the right amounts along with mag and omega-3s.
 

aphextwin

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Did you get Omega Curcumin or Omega Memory by Nordic? I take 2 daily which gives me 400mg Longvida, but I strive to use another product in conjunction with it to achieve 3g of EPA+DHA. Currently it's Nordic Ultimate Omega 2x or Carlson's liquid.

I have been using Igennus’ brand. You can’t ever go wrong with Nordic or Carlsons.
 

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