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Fat loss & dose amount

co1e_train

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Hey guys,

Wanted to get some of the boards thoughts on a topic of fat loss phases when no show is set.

Using myself as an example I am dieting for the next 8 weeks to remove some extra flub I've accrued. Frankly just got too fat and bit sloppy so decided to take 10 weeks at least, maybe longer, and remove as much as I possibly can. I have 8 weeks to go and I and my wife are going to the beach in 8 weeks so for the sake of vanity I would like to pull off as much fat as I can between now and then.

I have been using TRT amount of 250mg/wk since October of 2016 and have used nothing else. I am considering going to 350mg test/wk and 200mg tren ace/wk to help speed things along.

My question is would adding more gear actually help me get leaner faster? I would like to look as good as I can for the vacation so I wonder if I ought to maybe use more or if that would be advantageous and wanted to get some thoughts from you all.

I am a firm believer that diet, training and cardio is what drives fat loss and in my mind, since I am not prepping for a show, it would make more since to save higher gear use for what it is truly for: muscle growth.

My plan is to start an aggressive growth phase in July as we are vacationing the 2nd and 4th week of June. This is the real reason for the cut as I want to get a decent amount of fat off me before pursing growth.

I have chosen to follow Dave Palumbos keto-like diet for this dieting phase. I train 6 days a week and currently do 30 mins of cardio 6 days a week.

I give all this context so you can see where I am coming from. I am getting leaner in the 2 weeks I've been dieting but I would be open to utilizing higher doses if that would accelerate my rate of fat loss and overall look.


Thanks!
 

Fit2Serve

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I think you are crazy for doing dave's keto diet. was miserable for me. i get leanest with carbs.

YES, more gear will get you leaner faster. Def add the tren ace. its very helpful for leaning up. I would atleast double your test dose. From 250mg to at least 500mg maybe 750mg. i would normally suggest starting low with dose and then ramping up dose as you go but 8 weeks isnt very long so maybe just start blast with a good dose of test and def start the tren. i'd prob suggest starting with 50mg tren ace eod upping dose by 25mg every 2 weeks until you start getting bad sides then kinda stay at that dose til the 8 weeks is up.
that should do it.
just hope you dont think you gotta go without carbs to get LEAN. you absolutely dont.
-F2S
 
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epoxy

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keeping your diet 100% on point and being as strict as possible with additional cardio sessions and longer lift sessions focused on higher volume is going to do more for helping you lean out than adding more test or tren. that being said, the tren dose you're running is pretty low i usually suggest 50mg daily or 350mg a week. i love the look tren gives you, but it goes away, and it's not a miracle drug for dropping weight. if anything, more people use it to eat shittier without as bad of consequences from GAINING weight. i always have found it very hard to put on weight on tren. but i also never saw it just shed fat off of me the way DNP does or strict diet/training.
 

DTA707

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It would be smarter to save the higher use to build muscle like you say imo

Sent from my SM-S975L using Tapatalk
 

co1e_train

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I think you are crazy for doing dave's keto diet. was miserable for me. i get leanest with carbs.



YES, more gear will get you leaner faster. Def add the tren ace. its very helpful for leaning up. I would atleast double your test dose. From 250mg to at least 500mg maybe 750mg. i would normally suggest starting low with dose and then ramping up dose as you go but 8 weeks isnt very long so maybe just start blast with a good dose of test and def start the tren. i'd prob suggest starting with 50mg tren ace eod upping dose by 25mg every 2 weeks until you start getting bad sides then kinda stay at that dose til the 8 weeks is up.

that should do it.

just hope you dont think you gotta go without carbs to get LEAN. you absolutely dont. i dont know of one top pro that does keto:lightbulb: if there is there arent many of em

-F2S


Really appreciate the input man, thank you.

And I don't believe that I can't utilize some carbs I chose this style of dieting for two reasons:

1. I find I handle fats quite well. I find that I feel good and tend to perform better with higher fats and keeping carbs periworkout however...

2. I opted for no carbs this 8 weeks just to see how/if it accelerated my fat loss and to simply push calories down a bit more.

I wouldn't diet this way if I was setting up a 16-20 week prep or something but with the short time frame I figured why not see how it helps me along.

Certainly when it comes time to shift gears I'll be utilizing carbs for sure AND I won't ever allow myself to get so heavy again.

As far as doing goes I have EQ, deca and a little NPP as options as well as Dbol and tbol if I wanted to throw any of that in.
 

co1e_train

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keeping your diet 100% on point and being as strict as possible with additional cardio sessions and longer lift sessions focused on higher volume is going to do more for helping you lean out than adding more test or tren. that being said, the tren dose you're running is pretty low i usually suggest 50mg daily or 350mg a week. i love the look tren gives you, but it goes away, and it's not a miracle drug for dropping weight. if anything, more people use it to eat shittier without as bad of consequences from GAINING weight. i always have found it very hard to put on weight on tren. but i also never saw it just shed fat off of me the way DNP does or strict diet/training.


Absolutely concur with diet and training. That's what will ultimately make or break it. My dose question is just more or less would it be helpful.
 

co1e_train

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It would be smarter to save the higher use to build muscle like you say imo

Sent from my SM-S975L using Tapatalk


This always what I've tended to ascribe too but wanted to hear what others had to say. Thanks for the thoughts
 

little slice

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androgenic substances can make your body more inclined toward fat loss, yes..


higher doses, generally speaking, will also help you hold lean tissue while you are deep in caloric deficit.


also help you maintain strength which is essential for maintaining leann tissue
 

co1e_train

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androgenic substances can make your body more inclined toward fat loss, yes..





higher doses, generally speaking, will also help you hold lean tissue while you are deep in caloric deficit.





also help you maintain strength which is essential for maintaining leann tissue


Absolutely and I suppose I've felt that correct training and diet with moderate amounts of product will eliminate the worry of losing tissue BUT performance is a big deal too and I want to ensure that is valuable.



Here is another point to consider: it is my ultimate goal to attain the largest amount of LBM I can possibly attain and hope to carry the "pro" level of size in a good condition. With this considered does that change what I ought to do dose wise now when I am just looking to shed as much as I can in a short amount of time before ramping up into a growth phase?
 

little slice

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hope to carry the "pro" level of size in a good condition.



lolwut..



do you have ANY idea how truly massive IFBB pros are? there is a reason they are called "freaks"


I trained with one before... guy was insanely big...literally the biggest human ive ever seen (who wasn't morbidly obese obvi).

guy looked like a boulder. Huge, grainy, full af..


onstage next to other IFBB pros? He looked pretty average... ended up in last callouts LOL


unless you mean physique class... then that's certainly attainable.
 

co1e_train

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lolwut..







do you have ANY idea how truly massive IFBB pros are? there is a reason they are called "freaks"





I trained with one before... guy was insanely big...literally the biggest human ive ever seen (who wasn't morbidly obese obvi).



guy looked like a boulder. Huge, grainy, full af..





onstage next to other IFBB pros? He looked pretty average... ended up in last callouts LOL





unless you mean physique class... then that's certainly attainable.


I absolutely understand the level of size they contain is absurd and a result of genetics and enormous amounts of work over long periods of time to achieve that kind of body.

I am not saying that I will absolutely reach that - I very well might not - but that is the goal that I have.
 

little slice

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I am not saying that I will absolutely reach that - I very well might not - but that is the goal that I have.



well, nothing wrong with aiming super high, as long as you remain reasonable in your expectations...



you will likely need more than 500mg/week of gear tho lol
 

Fit2Serve

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Absolutely and I suppose I've felt that correct training and diet with moderate amounts of product will eliminate the worry of losing tissue BUT performance is a big deal too and I want to ensure that is valuable.



Here is another point to consider: it is my ultimate goal to attain the largest amount of LBM I can possibly attain and hope to carry the "pro" level of size in a good condition. With this considered does that change what I ought to do dose wise now when I am just looking to shed as much as I can in a short amount of time before ramping up into a growth phase?
IMO, you are thinking about it wrong. Dont think of using AAS for "growth phase" or "cutting phase" etc. if you are blasting whether in "growth phase" or "cutting phase" you will likely be gaining some LBM. in about every study there is on testosterone all groups using test had more LBM than placebo. And they didnt even lift weights in alot of those studies.... take LITTLE SLICE for example in his 30 day HARD dieting he said he was still maintaining and/or even gaining strength. This is what AAS makes possible.
I even think its easier to gain muscle while being leaner rather than fatter. Metabolism is FAST can eat more and really manipulate insulin and hunger etc.
kinda just ranted there, hope that applies in some way:eek:
-F2S
 

co1e_train

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well, nothing wrong with aiming super high, as long as you remain reasonable in your expectations...







you will likely need more than 500mg/week of gear tho lol


Absolutely, and part of the goal is to keep the expectations in check and hold them with an open hand because I can't force something if I just don't generically have it.

Now if it takes me 15 years to get there or in the ball park then fine - I really enjoy the lifestyle for the sake of it and this is the hobby I have chosen to pursue but it by no means is my end all be all. It's just Bodybuilding.

And yes you are right which is why I shared that goal - basically if that is my goal should I be utilizing higher amounts of product, among other things, now even during this 8-10 week diet.
 

co1e_train

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IMO, you are thinking about it wrong. Dont think of using AAS for "growth phase" or "cutting phase" etc. if you are blasting whether in "growth phase" or "cutting phase" you will likely be gaining some LBM. in about every study there is on testosterone all groups using test had more LBM than placebo. And they didnt even lift weights in alot of those studies.... take LITTLE SLICE for example in his 30 day HARD dieting he said he was still maintaining and/or even gaining strength. This is what AAS makes possible.

I even think its easier to gain muscle while being leaner rather than fatter. Metabolism is FAST can eat more and really manipulate insulin and hunger etc.

kinda just ranted there, hope that applies in some way:eek:

-F2S


Thanks for sharing and for ranting ha! It absolutely does. What it communicates that irregardless of the "phase" if I have the goal that I do then I need to be supplementing for such regardless.

And I am with you there on being leaner - that we grow better - which is why I am pushing for these 8 weeks to tighten up and make the next time I pursue growth be all the better.
 

tenny

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you wont get anywhere NEAR "PRO SIZE" using TRT doses....
by the pics you've posted in the past....and PRO SIZE is your
goal...??? it will never happen in this lifetime.....honesty it would
probably take you 5 to 7 years of NONSTOP heavy cycling to
just get to NPC competitive size....I hate putting numbers on things
so its just a guess, from my experience....

that's just some common sense perspective....

but you CAN maintain PRO SIZE with TRT doses....

if that helps.

:cool:

OHHHH....

and I want to answer the question you asked in the first place:eek:

yes....higher doses and more compounds will speed up fat loss process.

:)
 
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juggy38

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you wont get anywhere NEAR "PRO SIZE" using TRT doses....
by the pics you've posted in the past....and PRO SIZE is your
goal...??? it will never happen in this lifetime.....honesty it would
probably take you 5 to 7 years of NONSTOP heavy cycling to
just get to NPC competitive size....I hate putting numbers on things
so its just a guess, from my experience....

that's just some common sense perspective....

but you CAN maintain PRO SIZE with TRT doses....

if that helps.

:cool:

OHHHH....

and I want to answer the question you asked in the first place:eek:

yes....higher doses and more compounds will speed up fat loss process.

:)
You make a good point Tenny. If you looked at most pros in their early 20s, they were probably carrying more mass and leaner than most of us juiced gym rats achieved in our late 20s after years of AAS
 
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Musclegeek79

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U gotta go caloric deficit to lose weight. It's quite simple. I rely on iifym program.
 

warlock

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androgenic substances can make your body more inclined toward fat loss, yes..


higher doses, generally speaking, will also help you hold lean tissue while you are deep in caloric deficit.


also help you maintain strength which is essential for maintaining leann tissue
little slice, what are your favorite androgenic substances for this purpose?
 

little slice

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little slice, what are your favorite androgenic substances for this purpose?


testosterone and halotestin



I don't rely on androgens for fat loss though.. the amount of fat loss they 'provide' is mininscule IMO.. especially when compared to fat burners


they just make you 'more inclined' in fat loss direction
 

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