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For you beginners out there... Think about this

Wow...interesting timing. I myself am considering taking a year or 2 to submerge myself in this "cult", to see if it's something for me. Very thought-provoking.

So if you were to do it over again, would you never have started using AAS? Or just try to keep it to small cycles & personal use?

How old were you when you first got "on"?
 
did you ever manage to find a good job with that huge "criminal" background?
 
You are a good dude sharing this

I know your story is 100x worse than mine. I always appreciate your posts when you come out and tell things like it is. Like I told you in a pm awhile back, you gave me a true wake up call through some of your small subtle posts here and there.

I am way too smart to ever have something like that happen to me.
Yeah, right.

Nice post. It was a good read. Not saying you are typical, but I always wonder what happens when you start AAS at a relatively young age. The day of reckoning may dawn.


Glad to hear you are back on a good path. You are right? Seems so.

You are probably right my friend but I hope to get things in order on the health aspect...

Good stuff, bodybuilding has made me a better person in many ways. I have learned more about myself through the arduous measure of training and dieting. I have met many great people through the community. I also understand the dark side of the sport and I take responsibility for the repercussions. It comes down to having balance in your life, healthy balance. I recently saw where Sam Byrd said the best advice he was ever given was to "Follow your dreams but don't let your life become one."

I love bodybuilding. Hence the reason I never stopped after all the legal troubles. I just do things much differently now and am much more aware of my decisions. You are absolutely right about balance. It is something I need to improve in. If any of you have tips on balance, I would love to hear it.

The hardest part I find on having balance is the simple fact of finances. Between AAS and HGH, its nearly impossible to afford for a guy fresh out of college. I have loans and everything else to pay. Thats why so many guys end up selling. Its the sad truth.

Young guys like you, and younger, just can't imagine what you described becoming a reality for them. It's good that people know not only the risks but the consequences of those risks as well! Good post for first hand information and awareness, but I doubt it will deter most people.

We're untouchable man, nothing bad will ever come our way because of steroids! :rolleyes:

Great advice. Don't worry about 'preaching' cos your not doing anything like that. You are being honest and saying exactly what you have learned and what you have been through. This thread is golden for any newbies reading... you can easily fall into the same position. No one thinks they are gonna be like that when they first start a few dbol or their 500mg test per week. They think they will cycle on and off and be fine and well we all know the rest.

I have yet to go high dose and haven't encounted any legal issues. But I can admit it has taken over too much. I think they key is balance just as hillbilly stated. I often find myself thinking I am talking about the gym too much and getting more and more one dimensional in a way... boring is another word.

All people new to aas can learn alot from this. They sometimes read the older guys posting similar or regarding health and think well he is old and it's different now and that they are only young and have a few years to do what they want. But here you have a 25 year old saying how it is... only takes a few cycles and then wanting more time on and on and your on test the rest of your life.

Just a few cycles til we get that "perfect body" and then we'll stop and be happy forever! hahaha

Good stuff man, and you're still young, thus you have primarily faced the stigma of gear, ie.LE and gf's and trouble with the parents. For you young guys, that's only half the story. On that path, in another decade, he would be writing about serious health concerns also if he didn't take care of his business correctly.

I spent a few hours last night reading Big A's growth thread in the beginner forum despite being 42, just because I wanted to shake it up a little, and I'm no pro, thus I'm always learning. When he says that the cost of ancillaries, lab tests, liver aids, proper supplements, etc. should be 2 x the cost of gear, think hard about that. I see a lot of what I think are younger guys at times whining about a minimum of $250 or $300 with a sponsor, and I understand there may be times when that's a pain if you just need an ancillary or something, but in reality, most of the time if you're sweating an extra few hundred, I find it hard to believe that most are covering the health aspects of this whole thing correctly with timely lab work and liver aids and comprehensive monitoring.

I consider myself really cautious, and I still found a few things there that I wasn't doing enough, or paying close enough attention to. If you can't afford to do it right, save up, and wait until you can, rather than make a guinea pig of yourself on a budget. I've been a lab test monkey the past few months, because just when I think I have it covered, someone brings up something new to me like C-reactive protein, and I'm testing again, and this is just in preparation for starting up again, as I haven't been on recently. It isn't a game for teenagers, unless you have a trust fund and are far more responsible than I was way back then.

I really didnt even touch on the health aspect but you are completely right. Younger guys can handle more stupid shit than the older guys, but the sooner we realize how important staying healthy while taking these drugs the better off we will be in the long run obviously. Thankfully I've realized this.

Wow dude, thanks for sharing that. Stopped and made me think a little.

I too started out on WBB. Back then I thought all I needed was some atlarge products and to eat everything in site... Funny how things come full circle isn't it?

Results and ETS is all we need man LOL. That and force feeding! haha I do like Chris though and his products are top notch...

Wow...interesting timing. I myself am considering taking a year or 2 to submerge myself in this "cult", to see if it's something for me. Very thought-provoking.

So if you were to do it over again, would you never have started using AAS? Or just try to keep it to small cycles & personal use?

How old were you when you first got "on"?

I was 20 years old when I did my first cycle.

If I could do it all over again, yes I would still have started using AAS. I would have done things MUCH differently though...

I'm not knocking this lifestyle because I really do love it. I'm just trying to get the younger guys (and anyone for that matter) to really give thought on the risks they take on a daily basis and to be aware because everyone makes mistakes and one slip up with this shit and it could mean serious consequences...

did you ever manage to find a good job with that huge "criminal" background?

I wouldnt call it a "huge" criminal background lol. I was never charged with anything. And for you dummies out there, no I didnt snitch on anyone. Although I was given the option to work with the Feds.... I didnt give it one minute of thought. Through the advice of some of you here on Pro M I gave Rick Collins a call and he hooked me up with a local lawyer who then worked with Rick when he needed guidance on anything. The legal system is a complete joke when it comes to AAS. No one knows a damn thing.
 
I lose very little size and even less strength when im off...I think most people lift too light and forget to eat when they come off...I eat 2000cals of junk when im on and 3500 clean when im off and maintain 240 to 260 year around..I hit 4 plates seated military on the smith for a double while i was on cycle and 3 mths after being off everything including test I hit 3plates and a quarter for 12 on the smith..but unlike alot of guys if I run over 300 week test I get weak and run down..

That's what you got from that? Did you read the entire post?

Jay, that sucks bro, BUT, at least you are here telling people about it now instead of 5 yrs from now just getting out of prison
 
I wish I would have known before starting that this would be a lifelong commitment. I was 16 when I started researching AAS, the only reason I didn't start then was because I wanted to continue growing taller.
I thought I was going to do 2 cycles, blow up to a lean 220, and be done with it all.
I don't want to say that I have regrets about using AAS, but I do wish I knew that it was a lifestyle.
Every now and then someone asks me for advice about AAS in person, and they tell me about their 1 or 2 cycle plan..... I can't help but laugh, and tell them that is exactly what I thought was going to happen with me.

The only guys that I know that really did do one or two cycles and then never touched AAS again are guys that don't even lift anymore either.
I have yet to meet someone that still lifts passionately after using AAS, but going back to natural/clean status permanently.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for sharing this Jay, very touching man. Definetely makes you take a step back and ponder what you really want man, this sport can be an evil sport and can really really take over peoples life. The hardest thing is finding the balance. Hope everything is well brother. Glad to have you hear!
 
Great thread Jay. You touched on a lot of points that the guys just getting started probably never think about. We all start at low doses saying that we are going to do a cycle or two, get an awesome body and then stop. That NEVER happens as we all know. Dosages get raised, cycles become more frequent, the quantity of the items purchased grows larger. I researched the medical and legal ramifications of this lifestyle for many years before I finally decided to get started and even still things have grown to a level that is sometimes uncomfortable. Being a competitor trying to be the best that I can possibly be makes things even difficult. Especially during contest prep we must do things in a way that is impossible to do with true safety in mind. I have been AAS them for a relatively short period of time (less than 5 years) and have lately put more thought into how to do things in a healthier way (though that's relative in this instance). I'm glad to be apart of a forum like this where people are very open about the issues that they have had when it comes to their health. My decisions are certainly changing because of it.

I have seen close friends and even a family member get in some legal troubles due to stupid decisions related to AAS. Certainly one of the worst things anyone can do here is get involved in any type of distribution behavior, as that's a recipe for disaster. Its only a matter of time before people are going to get caught. Thankfully I was always smart enough to stay away from that type of behavior. I hope that many new guys get the chance to view this thread. It's nice to hear this kind of stuff coming from an average guy who is just like many others. Thanks for the eye-opener Bro.
 
That's what you got from that? Did you read the entire post?

Jay, that sucks bro, BUT, at least you are here telling people about it now instead of 5 yrs from now just getting out of prison

yes I read it and I get it...I also understand that anyone that is competitive in life regardless if they are competing with themselves or others is going to anything in they can to be at the top..it also states BEGINNERS and I would think it applies to everyone being that we all can learn something from it..what is a beginner?..this is a normal diary for anyone that tried to push to get somewhere misguided..I think my problem and I will get flamed for this is the AA type of mentality and doomsday your heart is going to blow up shit I see here alot now,,most of the issues may have been aas related and alot are genetic weakness that aas made worse..after all I have read and seen now I realize no one really knows shit when it comes to this we are all research subjects trying becoming more aware of what our body's are doing..the bottom line is LIFE has to have balance and bodybuilding isn't the problem it's the ,,I hear how I spend too much time in gym..well where would YOU be otherwise would you really be at home being a family guy ? be honest !If you really are that commited to the gym you would prob be passionate about anything you do and be submerged in it..funny thing about reading this topic is jdub figured life out sooner than alot of us did and his trouble with the law is nothing when you compare it too a DUI ..
 
To the OP - awesome Post! Thanks for sharing.



I have yet to go high dose and haven't encounted any legal issues. But I can admit it has taken over too much. I think they key is balance just as hillbilly stated. I often find myself thinking I am talking about the gym too much and getting more and more one dimensional in a way... boring is another word.

To Elvia: So, what are you going to do about it? Read this and pass it on, or act on it? Just stimulating some thought ; )
 
Thanks for sharing Jay. I'm 25 now, been natural all my life and thinking about taking the next step. The legal and relationship consequences are what I am worried about most!
 
That's what you got from that? Did you read the entire post?

Jay, that sucks bro, BUT, at least you are here telling people about it now instead of 5 yrs from now just getting out of prison

Yeah, it could have been much much worse.... Luckily I had a completely clean record before any of this happened though, and that I had just graduated from a university with two good degrees... That definitely helped with the final decision from the Judge. On the other hand though, the state defender wanted to stick me for everything he could. The guy was a real piece of shit.

I wish I would have known before starting that this would be a lifelong commitment. I was 16 when I started researching AAS, the only reason I didn't start then was because I wanted to continue growing taller.
I thought I was going to do 2 cycles, blow up to a lean 220, and be done with it all.
I don't want to say that I have regrets about using AAS, but I do wish I knew that it was a lifestyle.
Every now and then someone asks me for advice about AAS in person, and they tell me about their 1 or 2 cycle plan..... I can't help but laugh, and tell them that is exactly what I thought was going to happen with me.

The only guys that I know that really did do one or two cycles and then never touched AAS again are guys that don't even lift anymore either.
I have yet to meet someone that still lifts passionately after using AAS, but going back to natural/clean status permanently
.

Thats a very good point. For us guys who take this serious and are truly passionate about making improvement to our physiques, there is no way we will ever be content with being clean. Once you stop the drugs, the progress stops with it. It took me years of going in circles to figure that out.

Thanks for sharing this Jay, very touching man. Definetely makes you take a step back and ponder what you really want man, this sport can be an evil sport and can really really take over peoples life. The hardest thing is finding the balance. Hope everything is well brother. Glad to have you hear!

Balance is everything. But the issue still comes down to money. Unless you are very well off financially, its going to be tough to afford all the HGH and AAS when you reach a certain level. Its always more more more more, of everything. So you constantly begin to worry about ordering more, how you're gonna afford it, etc. It can take over your thoughts very easily..

Great thread Jay. You touched on a lot of points that the guys just getting started probably never think about. We all start at low doses saying that we are going to do a cycle or two, get an awesome body and then stop. That NEVER happens as we all know. Dosages get raised, cycles become more frequent, the quantity of the items purchased grows larger. I researched the medical and legal ramifications of this lifestyle for many years before I finally decided to get started and even still things have grown to a level that is sometimes uncomfortable. Being a competitor trying to be the best that I can possibly be makes things even difficult. Especially during contest prep we must do things in a way that is impossible to do with true safety in mind. I have been AAS them for a relatively short period of time (less than 5 years) and have lately put more thought into how to do things in a healthier way (though that's relative in this instance). I'm glad to be apart of a forum like this where people are very open about the issues that they have had when it comes to their health. My decisions are certainly changing because of it.

I have seen close friends and even a family member get in some legal troubles due to stupid decisions related to AAS. Certainly one of the worst things anyone can do here is get involved in any type of distribution behavior, as that's a recipe for disaster. Its only a matter of time before people are going to get caught. Thankfully I was always smart enough to stay away from that type of behavior. I hope that many new guys get the chance to view this thread. It's nice to hear this kind of stuff coming from an average guy who is just like many others. Thanks for the eye-opener Bro.

More more more, thats the name of this game. And when you start out you never think thats what it will come to. Most guys wont just come out and say it. A lot of guys on this forum act like you can just do 500- 750mg of test with compounds here and there and grow on it forever. Its total bs. I tried to believe it for years and I listened to those guys. Until I found out myself it just doesnt work that way.

And like I told AlphaMaleDawg in a pm the other day (which really got me thinking about making this thread) - I NEVER would have thought in a million years there would be a day that I completely dreaded cruising on 300mg of test and HGH. I used to dread coming off, now its turned into dreading running a low dose of test along with hgh. How sad is that?
 
yes I read it and I get it...I also understand that anyone that is competitive in life regardless if they are competing with themselves or others is going to anything in they can to be at the top..it also states BEGINNERS and I would think it applies to everyone being that we all can learn something from it..what is a beginner?..this is a normal diary for anyone that tried to push to get somewhere misguided..I think my problem and I will get flamed for this is the AA type of mentality and doomsday your heart is going to blow up shit I see here alot now,,most of the issues may have been aas related and alot are genetic weakness that aas made worse..after all I have read and seen now I realize no one really knows shit when it comes to this we are all research subjects trying becoming more aware of what our body's are doing..the bottom line is LIFE has to have balance and bodybuilding isn't the problem it's the ,,I hear how I spend too much time in gym..well where would YOU be otherwise would you really be at home being a family guy ? be honest !If you really are that commited to the gym you would prob be passionate about anything you do and be submerged in it..funny thing about reading this topic is jdub figured life out sooner than alot of us did and his trouble with the law is nothing when you compare it too a DUI ..

I do go to the gym, bust my ass there, run my own business AND have a family. Priorities brotha.

Your original post was about not losing strength/size after cycles. Jay Dub went a little further into the possibilities of this lifestyle. I believe THAT was what he was trying to warn guys against, NOT losing strength/size
 
I lose very little size and even less strength when im off...I think most people lift too light and forget to eat when they come off...I eat 2000cals of junk when im on and 3500 clean when im off and maintain 240 to 260 year around..I hit 4 plates seated military on the smith for a double while i was on cycle and 3 mths after being off everything including test I hit 3plates and a quarter for 12 on the smith..but unlike alot of guys if I run over 300 week test I get weak and run down..

Run-on sentence much?
 
great honest post

It all happens so fast you dont realize what you have gotten into. Or at least it did for me. I had a simular experience early in my life, and it definately changed me. Thank god im good now and you seem to be too. A great post post, will make ya think.
 
To the OP - awesome Post! Thanks for sharing.





To Elvia: So, what are you going to do about it? Read this and pass it on, or act on it? Just stimulating some thought ; )

The legality issues etc don't really come into it for me. Plus I am not gonna start injecting 100mg+ tren ed cos someone online says to do so. Health wise sure I am gonna go up in dose in the next few years... but this will be gradually. But I am gonna try and stay away from orals... still take some but not in every cycle.

Now for the important things I plan to balance my life out more. Start going out more and doing fun things like I used to do. Not use all my money for food, aas and the gym. I a very poor so things can only get better. Just joined a new gym and it is more than 1/4 the price of my old one. It has been paid for the year so with the money I save each month I am gonna take Barbie out and do something nice. More trips to restaurants, cinema, shopping etc. Just have more fun in general and maybe a few parties on the way :)
 
i appreciate your truth about your story

also i agree on the whole low doses and growing forever bs thats always spewed on the forums

also the whole coming off and maintaining their gains...lol...if that were the case i'd be huge forever from running a single cycle 5 yrs ago...give me a break
 
Wow great post, thanks for sharing mate.
 
As a 23 year old currently in grad school who started at 21...your post definitely resonates with me. The legal aspect is always my number one fear. I can control the health part with careful monitoring, but I cannot control the law, just imagine one incident of bad luck could bring my world down around me despite this being the only "bad" thing I do.

I haven't hit the part where I just stay on, but my cycles keep getting longer. At least the doses are still low I tell myself. I doubt time on will = time off this time either.

Thanks for sharing.
 

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