Possible kidney issues, GFR 35

[Flex500]

Find a kidney specialist who will want to do the following:

1) 24h urine collection+ blood work to calculate creatinine clearance and to check for proteinuria.
2) Ultrasound of the kidneys and Doppler ultrasound to check for Renal Artery Stenosis

Until then, drop the nephrotoxic NSAID and (potentially in those with CKD) creatine. Reduce protein intake. I would keep the ACE inhibitor in there until 1) and 2) have been performed. Unless there is one of the few contraindications, ACE inhibitors or ARBs are recommended medications to delay disease progression in CKD, chiefly through their ability to reduce proteinuria. See https://kidneyfoundation.cachefly.net/professionals/KDOQI/guidelines_bp/guide_11.htm

I would not start using Astragalus until you have been properly diagnosed. You don't want to take any drugs that might mask the underlying issue by boosting eGFR without any corresponding changes in histology.

Yeah...this...OP needs referred to a specialist. The first time my creatinine was elevated I went to a nephrologist and ran more tests than a I ever thought existed plus 24 hour urine collection. In my case everything was fine but if it wasn't I wanted to immediately be working with a specialist.

OP: I assume you are working with your GP, which is fine, but don't feel bad about getting aggressive. I'd demand a specialist referral or at the very least maybe he can run many more tests and see one of his partners who has more experience with kidney issues, even if not a specialist at first?

 

[Cv215]

Is there a certain type of astralagus one should get? Like root or extract or something like that? When i was at vitamin shoppe i remember seeing like five different bottles that all said Astralagus.

 

[mike036]

Is there a certain type of astralagus one should get? Like root or extract or something like that? When i was at vitamin shoppe i remember seeing like five different bottles that all said Astralagus.

I use the Vitamin Shoppe brand, they only have one kind. I have 4 sets of bloodwork now showing it’s effectiveness at raising gfr. My lowest gfr pre astragalus was 65. My most recent gfr was 92

 

[warlock]

I use the Vitamin Shoppe brand, they only have one kind. I have 4 sets of bloodwork now showing it’s effectiveness at raising gfr. My lowest gfr pre astragalus was 65. My most recent gfr was 92

That's impressive. How many mg have you been taken?

 

[mike036]

That's impressive. How many mg have you been taken?

I was taking 3 grams twice/day and recently dropped it to 2 grams twice/day and am scheduled to do blood work in 2-3 weeks

 

[qbkilla]

Depends but for bodybuilders its worse to have protein in your urine. The glomerulus should be able to filter nearly all proteins and if your getting it in ur urine its breaking down that mesh network. Creatinine on the other hand is just used because its a decent indirect marker. We are classically taught to think of inulin as the gold standard ( i dunno if that is true anymore) but we use creatinine as its made by our bodies in a general consistent concentration and gets freely filtered by our glomerulus and it is considered to not be readily secreted or absorbed..but truthfully it is secreted to a small degree.

Using the classical MDRD calcualtion the assumptions are made that creatinine is stable....buuuut bodybuilders do things like take creatine thus artificially throwing off the equation thus making some drs who dont know better thing your kidneys are crapping out. Its also true of steroids that increase creatine stores in our muscles and having higher muscle mass. but its a good indirect marker for the general pop.

In general AAS can be pretty tough on your kidneys...both through direct androgenic induced glomerulosclerosis, blood pressure issues and mess up your RAS a bit.

Thank you. I have had doctors over the years seem not concerned with the protein in urine because it has went up, down, and it seems to be higher the times I had an std (chlymidia and ghonorhea) and they attributed it to that, and creatine was normal. However all the research online has said any protein in urine is very bad

 

[Bio]

Mike I'm sorry to hear this. Kidney function decreases with age let alone what we do to ourselves along the way. Like the saying goes, "The old man pays for what the young man does." Not saying you're old but just not 20's to 30's anymore, just like me! Like everyone suggested, get on Astragalus. As far as Astragalus dosage goes we keep saying that 3 grams is a good amount. I recently had a sick cat and I wanted to see if Astragalus was safe for cats and if so what products are out there. It is safe and I came across some products but this information regarding dosage surprised me...

"Is Astragalus safe for cats?

Best of all, like most immunotonic herbs, astragalus is very safe. A daily dose is as simple as a sprinkle of the ground root on food. A typical dose for dogs would be the range of 4g to 6g daily, and cats 2g to 3g daily."

Sooooo, if a little 'ol kitty cat can handle 2 to 3 grams a day and a dog can handle 4 to 6 grams daily we should be able to handle more? How much more, I don't know. Now it's time to research at what dosage does toxicity begin.

 

[Cv215]

I use the Vitamin Shoppe brand, they only have one kind. I have 4 sets of bloodwork now showing it’s effectiveness at raising gfr. My lowest gfr pre astragalus was 65. My most recent gfr was 92

Thats awesome. Ill pick some up today. I meant when i was at vitamin shoppe i noticed they had a couple different brands that all said Astralagus. Ill grab the vitamin shoppe brand though. Sounds like it's pretty effective for you guys.

 

[Cv215]

Mike I'm sorry to hear this. Kidney function decreases with age let alone what we do to ourselves along the way. Like the saying goes, "The old man pays for what the young man does." Not saying you're old but just not 20's to 30's anymore, just like me! Like everyone suggested, get on Astragalus. As far as Astragalus dosage goes we keep saying that 3 grams is a good amount. I recently had a sick cat and I wanted to see if Astragalus was safe for cats and if so what products are out there. It is safe and I came across some products but this information regarding dosage surprised me...

"Is Astragalus safe for cats?

Best of all, like most immunotonic herbs, astragalus is very safe. A daily dose is as simple as a sprinkle of the ground root on food. A typical dose for dogs would be the range of 4g to 6g daily, and cats 2g to 3g daily."

Sooooo, if a little 'ol kitty cat can handle 2 to 3 grams a day and a dog can handle 4 to 6 grams daily we should be able to handle more. How much more, I don't know. Now it's time to research at what dosage does toxicity begin.

Do you know if there is like a stronger form of Astralagus? Or is it all the root that we're getting. For instance some products will say root and some will say extract, and usually the extract is quite a bit more potent.

Or sometimes there's better delivery formulas or something or products that absorb better. Sort of like coq10 and ubiquinol.

Is this the case for astralagus or is just getting the root and taking 3 or 4 grams as effective as it gets.

 

[mike036]

Thats awesome. Ill pick some up today. I meant when i was at vitamin shoppe i noticed they had a couple different brands that all said Astralagus. Ill grab the vitamin shoppe brand though. Sounds like it's pretty effective for you guys.

Definitely stick with the Vitamin Shoppe brand. They make a 300 count bottle that is very cost effective. Myself and some other members have had positive results proven through bloodwork.[/QUOTE]

 

[Bio]

Do you know if there is like a stronger form of Astralagus? Or is it all the root that we're getting. For instance some products will say root and some will say extract, and usually the extract is quite a bit more potent.

Or sometimes there's better delivery formulas or something or producr. Sort of like coq10 and ubiquinol.

Is this the case for astralagus or is just getting the root and taking 3 or 4 grams as effective as it gets.

The back of the bottle should have what it equates to.

I don't know if taking it with other supplements make it more available, increase absorption time, etc. Something else to research.

I also used the Vitamin Shoppe brand.

 

[KillerStack]

Do you know if there is like a stronger form of Astralagus? Or is it all the root that we're getting. For instance some products will say root and some will say extract, and usually the extract is quite a bit more potent.

Or sometimes there's better delivery formulas or something or products that absorb better. Sort of like coq10 and ubiquinol.

Is this the case for astralagus or is just getting the root and taking 3 or 4 grams as effective as it gets.

I bought some German 1:30 extract, "3 times more potent than other astragalus extracts".
No idea if it is or not but and this was only one I could ffind that was this "strong".

 

[MikeS]

Thanks again guys, and Bio I appreciate yur concern. Wise advice...
I got the Astralagus Vit Shoppe 500mg 300 count. probably will use 3g daily to start.
Im getting off creatine, reduced protein intake, switching from ACE inhibitor to calcium blocker,
off slin, off Nsaid.
Off and tren or Eq as well, these are the most renal toxic AAS. No orals of course.
Will do bloods and urine in 4-6wks and then consult Nephrologiist if needed.
Have done alot of research in 24hrs, spoken to 2 Dr (both GPs) and info here is helping.
Have a good grasp on what I need to do. Hoping for the best.

Didnt have specific CystatinC done, but that is used in the eGFR equation, not creatinine.
Had a separate Creatine blood done though.

 

[Swifto]

Thanks again guys, and Bio I appreciate yur concern. Wise advice...
I got the Astralagus Vit Shoppe 500mg 300 count. probably will use 3g daily to start.
Im getting off creatine, reduced protein intake, switching from ACE inhibitor to calcium blocker,
off slin, off Nsaid.
Off and tren or Eq as well, these are the most renal toxic AAS. No orals of course.
Will do bloods and urine in 4-6wks and then consult Nephrologiist if needed.
Have done alot of research in 24hrs, spoken to 2 Dr (both GPs) and info here is helping.
Have a good grasp on what I need to do. Hoping for the best.

Didnt have specific CystatinC done, but that is used in the eGFR equation, not creatinine.
Had a separate Creatine blood done though.

What has your AAS usage been since you had GFR tested in normal range?

I think you should do what gotgame and MyNameIsJeff have outlined. I wouldn't be self medicating right now with Astragalus because its been repeated by some and advised here. No offence to anyone, but none of us are nephrologists here.

 

[qbkilla]

Definitely stick with the Vitamin Shoppe brand. They make a 300 count bottle that is very cost effective. Myself and some other members have had positive results proven through bloodwork.

[/QUOTE]

The astralogus decreased creatinine levels, protein in urine, or both?

 

[Swifto]

Some good reading:

THE AGING KIDNEY: PHYSIOLOGICAL CHANGES

Age-associated loss of kidney function has been recognized for decades. With aging, many subjects exhibit progressive decreases in glomerular filtration rate (GFR) and renal blood flow (RBF), with wide variability among individuals. The fall in GFR is ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Ageing and the Glomerular Filtration Rate: Truths and Consequences

The process of glomerular filtration of plasma fluid has been known for over 160 years and the measurement of the rate of its formation (glomerular filtration rate, GFR) has been possible for over 80 years. Studies conducted in the 1930's to the 1950's ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[mike036]

The astralogus decreased creatinine levels, protein in urine, or both?
[/QUOTE]
I lowered creatinine and increased my eGFR using astragalus

 

[Butters]

does astralagus actually help your kidneys? or does it just artificially increase eGFR?

i've read that the increase in eGFR goes away after you stop taking it?

 

[thethinker48]

does astralagus actually help your kidneys? or does it just artificially increase eGFR?

i've read that the increase in eGFR goes away after you stop taking it?

We don't know the mechanism through which it actually works. The data isn't there.

From the guys Dante has worked with who had terrible GFRs and protein spillage, it brought them back to close to a normal state. The other alternative is continued decline and dialysis, so it's better than that option.

 

[qbkilla]

I think we need to differentiate between actual gfr, and egfr.

I see dozens of people online say "my gfr is this" only to turn out they have no clue what their gfr is.

A blood test can only give you a creatinine value. Which a doctor puts in a formula and then that estimates your gfr (which is called an egfr or estimated gfr).

As far as I know, someone correct me if I am wrong, no one here knows their real gfr unless you took a 24 hour piss test