Switch from HIT to volume Training?

[245]

Hey everyone,

I'm now 4 weeks out from my first contest (22 y/o). I went down to 210 from 245/250 and training a Dorian-like version of HIT, I am actually still increasing strength on some exercises.

Now I've been thinking it might make sense for me to switch to volume training for the last month in order to reduce the load my joints and connective tissue gotta bear and more importantly to enable my muscles to be able to STORE MORE GLYCOGEN, which I think will lead to a fuller appearence on stage once I have carbed up.

Am I on the right track? Who has experience with switching over to volume precontest?

Thank you guys, I really need some help!

 

[lucian]

well...

if it aint broke dont fix it. i use high volume year round and i dont tink this close you should change things too much. maybe slow down the reps a bit and use better form so the wt is not as heavy. this should reduc ethe joint stress. maybe add a few forced reps w the lighter wt. but it may throw everything way off changing it this close.
god bless
lucian

 

[245]

Thanks lucian,

appreciate the answer. My reps are already slow and the form is good, so my weights are not as spectacular
I am much more concerned about glycogen storage, what's your opinion on this?

 

[lucian]

.....

well my opinion and its only my opinion as i have no scientific proof but....
i have dont the high intensity stuff and did not have the full round feeling. i feel to get that total round big look you have to do lots of compound sets, isolations, supersts ect and fill up w carbs. for about the last 4 years ive been doing 15-25 sets per big body part, 10-12 for small ones, and reps from 7-25 ranging inbetween and even have done some 100 rep sets. i still continue to improve. marathon workouts of sometimes 2 hr pre contest.
remember this is just how i feel, some people dont agree and they have things that work for them.
god bless
lucian

 

[chris250]

honestly I seen your pics and you look really good for your first show...I would say maybe up your volume a little bit, dont go to failure on every set...But still train as heavy as you can, but slow the reps down...I personally like a higher rep range 10-20 reps on everything...But, I have recently lower my volume down, cause of energy levels are low from dieting...

chris

 

[245]

10-20 on all exercises? I'm currently doing 6-10 reps.... think I should up it for "voluminization" (sp?)?

 

[chris250]

10-20 on all exercises? I'm currently doing 6-10 reps.... think I should up it for "voluminization" (sp?)?

245,

No thats not what Im say at all...If it's working for you than dont change up a thing...What got you the muscle in the first place, is what will keep it until the very end....I myself just like that rep range (10 to 20 reps) For me I feel I get more out of it, if I get a killer pump...But, everyone is different...I dont think one or two high rep sets at the end of a workout woundnt killy ya or overtrain you...But, it might not do much of anything except give you a good pump on whatever bodypart your training...

chris

 

[chris250]

Hey everyone,

I'm now 4 weeks out from my first contest (22 y/o). I went down to 210 from 245/250 and training a Dorian-like version of HIT, I am actually still increasing strength on some exercises.

Now I've been thinking it might make sense for me to switch to volume training for the last month in order to reduce the load my joints and connective tissue gotta bear and more importantly to enable my muscles to be able to STORE MORE GLYCOGEN, which I think will lead to a fuller appearence on stage once I have carbed up.

Am I on the right track? Who has experience with switching over to volume precontest?

Thank you guys, I really need some help!

Here is what I would do-

keep the same split and volume for the most part...

last movement just do a high rep set (15-20 reps) so for example if your doing chest and biceps in your hit routine it would like something like this---

Incline Smythe bar- 2 x warm ups/ 2 working sets x 6-8 reps
DB flat flys- 1 x warm ups/ 1 working set x 6-8 reps
Machine incline or flat press- 1 x warm ups/ 1 all out set for 20-25 reps

DB alt. Curls- 2 x warm ups/ 1 working set x 6 -8 reps
Machine precher curls- 1 x warm ups/ 1 working set x 6 -8 reps
standing cable curls- 1 x warm up/ 1 all out set for 20-25 reps

maybe something like that

chris

 

[245]

Got ya!
This is probably the best option and I get to enjoy the best of both worlds.
Thanks Chris!!!

 

[lucian]

....

those final pump sets can be a biiiiitch. lol just fill the muscle with blood, and hit a few poses afterwards. dont forget to stretch also.

god bless
lucian

 

[buselmo]

I will just tell you my experience with switching from low to high volume..

I was full, big, and pretty lean when i was training low volume with phil hernon. I always like to pick other trainers brains and gather as much info as i can to see how it affects my body. well, I trained under the guidance of the 2006 arabian champion (i posted his pics in an older thread) and he made me train high volume. told me not to count reps, but do 12-16 sets per muscle, train 2 days on 1 off, hitting every muscle once per week... well, I went from full, lean and strong to flat, "stringy", and weak in a matter of 2 weeks. My waist looked bigger, and my arms and legs looked smaller. i hated the way i looked. i went back to low volume and within 3 days i got my old "good" look back. The trainer was really good and had a good reputation and was very surprised of what happened. he actually gave me my money back and told me to not change the training style i'm on (low volume) since it works for me.

just think back to when you trained before you switched to HIT. was it high volume? did you start looking better when you switched to HIT? I would assume that you did since you stuck with it for a while. so i'd say stick with til the end of the contest.

I don't have a lot of experience in contest (only competed 4 times), The thing i've noticed is this:
I alwasy look great a couple of weeks out, but my waist is too big (and usually i'm not lean enough even on contest day)... I always carb deplete, switch to high volume, then carb load the 2 weeks before a contest (except for once where i carb depleted but stayed on HIT and low volume) in all contests, i looked leaner but i had that "tired muscle" look and i looked much smaller than the weak before. If i ever decide to compete again, i would never carb deplete or do any of that stuff. i'd just keep on drinking tons of water til the day of the contest then stop and only eat protein.
I have never noticed any "glycogen super compensation" in my life. And IMHO, I don't think a 5% increase in glycogen storage or whatever would make much difference, and it'll only give you a higher chance to fuck up.

in other words (as lucian said), if it aint broke, don't fix it.

 

[245]

I will just tell you my experience with switching from low to high volume..

I was full, big, and pretty lean when i was training low volume with phil hernon. I always like to pick other trainers brains and gather as much info as i can to see how it affects my body. well, I trained under the guidance of the 2006 arabian champion (i posted his pics in an older thread) and he made me train high volume. told me not to count reps, but do 12-16 sets per muscle, train 2 days on 1 off, hitting every muscle once per week... well, I went from full, lean and strong to flat, "stringy", and weak in a matter of 2 weeks. My waist looked bigger, and my arms and legs looked smaller. i hated the way i looked. i went back to low volume and within 3 days i got my old "good" look back. The trainer was really good and had a good reputation and was very surprised of what happened. he actually gave me my money back and told me to not change the training style i'm on (low volume) since it works for me.

just think back to when you trained before you switched to HIT. was it high volume? did you start looking better when you switched to HIT? I would assume that you did since you stuck with it for a while. so i'd say stick with til the end of the contest.

I don't have a lot of experience in contest (only competed 4 times), The thing i've noticed is this:
I alwasy look great a couple of weeks out, but my waist is too big (and usually i'm not lean enough even on contest day)... I always carb deplete, switch to high volume, then carb load the 2 weeks before a contest (except for once where i carb depleted but stayed on HIT and low volume) in all contests, i looked leaner but i had that "tired muscle" look and i looked much smaller than the weak before. If i ever decide to compete again, i would never carb deplete or do any of that stuff. i'd just keep on drinking tons of water til the day of the contest then stop and only eat protein.
I have never noticed any "glycogen super compensation" in my life. And IMHO, I don't think a 5% increase in glycogen storage or whatever would make much difference, and it'll only give you a higher chance to fuck up.

in other words (as lucian said), if it aint broke, don't fix it.

Thanks for sharing your experience, really appreciate it!
Like I said I'll keep the training the same except a little pump set at the end, or maybe something like the FST-7 method, adding a few pump sets at the end of my hit routine.
Just a quick question: I understand why you wouldn't deplete, but why not add some more carbs on the last 1 or 2 days before the contest? I noticed that whenever I upped my carbs a little bit, veins start popping out all over the place... kinda nice feeling )

 

[chris250]

I will just tell you my experience with switching from low to high volume..

I was full, big, and pretty lean when i was training low volume with phil hernon. I always like to pick other trainers brains and gather as much info as i can to see how it affects my body. well, I trained under the guidance of the 2006 arabian champion (i posted his pics in an older thread) and he made me train high volume. told me not to count reps, but do 12-16 sets per muscle, train 2 days on 1 off, hitting every muscle once per week... well, I went from full, lean and strong to flat, "stringy", and weak in a matter of 2 weeks. My waist looked bigger, and my arms and legs looked smaller. i hated the way i looked. i went back to low volume and within 3 days i got my old "good" look back. The trainer was really good and had a good reputation and was very surprised of what happened. he actually gave me my money back and told me to not change the training style i'm on (low volume) since it works for me.

just think back to when you trained before you switched to HIT. was it high volume? did you start looking better when you switched to HIT? I would assume that you did since you stuck with it for a while. so i'd say stick with til the end of the contest.

I don't have a lot of experience in contest (only competed 4 times), The thing i've noticed is this:
I alwasy look great a couple of weeks out, but my waist is too big (and usually i'm not lean enough even on contest day)... I always carb deplete, switch to high volume, then carb load the 2 weeks before a contest (except for once where i carb depleted but stayed on HIT and low volume) in all contests, i looked leaner but i had that "tired muscle" look and i looked much smaller than the weak before. If i ever decide to compete again, i would never carb deplete or do any of that stuff. i'd just keep on drinking tons of water til the day of the contest then stop and only eat protein.
I have never noticed any "glycogen super compensation" in my life. And IMHO, I don't think a 5% increase in glycogen storage or whatever would make much difference, and it'll only give you a higher chance to fuck up.

in other words (as lucian said), if it aint broke, don't fix it.

I find this interestin...I kinda do HIT with a touch of volume throw in...I have done almost every type of routine there is...DC, HIT, Volume (lee preist style, cutler style) and everyting throw in...But mostly I like just hitting everything once every 5th ot 6th day...By doing one major bodypart with a smaller one (maybe abs/calves, bis/tris) I like about 6-10 sets for bigger bodyparts and 4-6 for smaller ones...Reps around 10-20 on everything

chris

 

[buselmo]

Just a quick question: I understand why you wouldn't deplete, but why not add some more carbs on the last 1 or 2 days before the contest? I noticed that whenever I upped my carbs a little bit, veins start popping out all over the place... kinda nice feeling )

Because, as i said before, i don't believe in "super duper extra over glycogen compensation" ... I would actually find that it would make more sense to not train for a couple of days before the contest (2 or 3 days)... say 3 days, and drop the carbs to half of what they are 2 days before a contest.

let me tell you something to try. have a cheat meal or cheat day on saturday. drop carbs to half or 1/4 of what they are in your diet on sunday and monday. and when you train on monday, check out the way you look. make sure to drink 1-2 gallons of water per day.
I never did this on contests (because i tried them after i decided not to compete for a year or two) and i just get the best pumps, and look my best on that day. the way i look at it... you already filled up your glycogen stores on saturday. sunday and monday are enough to flush all the water out from under your skin, but you're still drinking it and your muscles are filled with glycogen (maybe a bit dehydrated, but they'll have water when they need it). and when you pump up or train, you will fill out like crazy without having a lot of water under your skin. sounds like the exact opposite of what I have been hearing for the past 7 years, but to me, it makes more sense to do it this way. just my personal opinion anyway.

 

[El_Animal]

Because, as i said before, i don't believe in "super duper extra over glycogen compensation" ... I would actually find that it would make more sense to not train for a couple of days before the contest (2 or 3 days)... say 3 days, and drop the carbs to half of what they are 2 days before a contest.

let me tell you something to try. have a cheat meal or cheat day on saturday. drop carbs to half or 1/4 of what they are in your diet on sunday and monday. and when you train on monday, check out the way you look. make sure to drink 1-2 gallons of water per day.
I never did this on contests (because i tried them after i decided not to compete for a year or two) and i just get the best pumps, and look my best on that day. the way i look at it... you already filled up your glycogen stores on saturday. sunday and monday are enough to flush all the water out from under your skin, but you're still drinking it and your muscles are filled with glycogen (maybe a bit dehydrated, but they'll have water when they need it). and when you pump up or train, you will fill out like crazy without having a lot of water under your skin. sounds like the exact opposite of what I have been hearing for the past 7 years, but to me, it makes more sense to do it this way. just my personal opinion anyway.

You basically came to the same conclusions as Skip.

 

[chris250]

Because, as i said before, i don't believe in "super duper extra over glycogen compensation" ... I would actually find that it would make more sense to not train for a couple of days before the contest (2 or 3 days)... say 3 days, and drop the carbs to half of what they are 2 days before a contest.

let me tell you something to try. have a cheat meal or cheat day on saturday. drop carbs to half or 1/4 of what they are in your diet on sunday and monday. and when you train on monday, check out the way you look. make sure to drink 1-2 gallons of water per day.
I never did this on contests (because i tried them after i decided not to compete for a year or two) and i just get the best pumps, and look my best on that day. the way i look at it... you already filled up your glycogen stores on saturday. sunday and monday are enough to flush all the water out from under your skin, but you're still drinking it and your muscles are filled with glycogen (maybe a bit dehydrated, but they'll have water when they need it). and when you pump up or train, you will fill out like crazy without having a lot of water under your skin. sounds like the exact opposite of what I have been hearing for the past 7 years, but to me, it makes more sense to do it this way. just my personal opinion anyway.

yeah its kinda like skiploading...