Ugl vs pharma question

[Zamun]

My friends parents are both in pharma and work at a high level in drug development. We had a conversation about this years ago, and they both told me to never use generic anything.

They said that the way you arrive at synthesizing a drug and the excipients used can have a significant effect on how the end product behaves, even if the chemical structure of the drug is technically the same.

I am not educated on the matter so I can't explain it in detail/scientifically the way they did, and have no way to verify it.

I can say I've noticed differences between pharma/generics/UGL with testosterone a few times, but this could be due to quality control. Other times no difference. I'm using generic GH now with no problems. I've had pharma test cyp from a generic give me significantly lower levels than the name brand. So who knows. I just use name brand pharma when I can for peace of mind.

Completely agree with this. Generic version of my BP med barely lowers it. Name brand drastically lowers it. There’s no reason for this if “generic is the same “

 

[Siggy]

Completely agree with this. Generic version of my BP med barely lowers it. Name brand drastically lowers it. There’s no reason for this if “generic is the same “

Depends on a few things. Im sure the variance is dependent on the type of medication but theres also a HUGE difference amongst who is making the generic version.

All generics are not equal.

I have a prescription for generic adderall. I only take Teva generic adderall. If they are out of Teva at my pharmacy and only have a different manufacturers generic version, I will literally simply go without adderall for as long as it takes till they get Teva restocked.

 

[grizzly978]

Notice no difference if the ugl is a good one vs Pharma.
Some of the good ugls put more care because it’s custom made, ie - Coors light or a local brewery that makes their own special beer

 

[mexbeast]

Been using both for 25 years, as long as they raise the blood levels I see no difference, most of what I built was using ug, anybody remember tokkyo labs d-bol?

 

[BLKGUY2006]

Used pharm test for a bit for legality purposes years back through a script… Can’t say I notice a difference between the two. I’m always over 1000 nowadays.

Cage

I never noticed a difference either. With UGL’s like on here that are such good quality I don’t really think it matters. Maybe with HGH but I damn sure can’t afford pharma grade so I’ll never know that one.

 

[BLKGUY2006]

Been using both for 25 years, as long as they raise the blood levels I see no difference, most of what I built was using ug, anybody remember tokkyo labs d-bol?

I do but can’t remember what I used. God so many good places have come and gone. O from Europe was the shit!!!!

 

[thethinker48]

I work in big Pharma, There's differences even with Pharm products. We see this with Biologics, and Biosimilars. And even identical drugs

You can Google people's experiences some pharm brands like Sun Pharma and Hikma vs Pfizer Testosterone

There's a threshold that has to be met, and then there's variance after that

At the end of the day it's just a drug (testosterone), it can be properly made anywhere with sterility

 

[Zamun]

I work in big Pharma, There's differences even with Pharm products. We see this with Biologics, and Biosimilars. And even identical drugs

You can Google people's experiences some pharm brands like Sun Pharma and Hikma vs Pfizer Testosterone

There's a threshold that has to be met, and then there's variance after that

At the end of the day it's just a drug (testosterone), it can be properly made anywhere with sterility

Hikma just as bad as sun? There’s a Pfizer shortage so they’ve been trying to give me that.

 

[thethinker48]

Hikma just as bad as sun? There’s a Pfizer shortage so they’ve been trying to give me that.

None of these brands are bad, they're pharm grade

But there's always some variance in drug % per label, and Pfizer Test tends to always be more favorable according to many users

I remember when PM had all the board UGLs tested, there was variance of 5-20% +/- across many of them, and that was just testosterone. Pharm is similar except there's stricter quality control

 

[Zamun]

None of these brands are bad, they're pharm grade

But there's always some variance in drug % per label, and Pfizer Test tends to always be more favorable according to many users

I remember when PM had all the board UGLs tested, there was variance of 5-20% +/- across many of them, and that was just testosterone. Pharm is similar except there's stricter quality control

Do you know if their raws are made in house or sourced elsewhere (china/india)?

 

[mexbeast]

None of these brands are bad, they're pharm grade

But there's always some variance in drug % per label, and Pfizer Test tends to always be more favorable according to many users

I remember when PM had all the board UGLs tested, there was variance of 5-20% +/- across many of them, and that was just testosterone. Pharm is similar except there's stricter quality control

But what the OP is asking is if you achieve a 5000ng on Pfizer and if you also achieve 5000ng on ungl, will there be a difference? I doubt it

 

[thethinker48]

Do you know if their raws are made in house or sourced elsewhere (china/india)?

I don't work in manufacturing so I can't speak from personal experience

But it's well known that China, Brazil, India are the major raw exporters for drugs

 

[thethinker48]

But what the OP is asking is if you achieve a 5000ng on Pfizer and if you also achieve 5000ng on ungl, will there be a difference? I doubt it

No lol

It's just a hormone, the ligand will bind to the receptor regardless of the label of the vial

 

[rAJJIN]

My question is still in the raw hormone.
Is it all created equal or can there be variables. Excluding everything else such as age, storage, handling etc.
Is it made exactly the same. Sourced from the same ingredient and what process from nothing to having a “raw” for sale.

With Ai and information bases these days I would think it can be explained. Maybe one the thousands of podcasts? If not it could be a good topic.

I’d like to see the process in detail and explained by someone knowledgeable.

What variables?
What equipment?
What can go wrong or rite? How
Many days, weeks, hours is the process?
Can anything be substituted or changed?
Does it all turn out exactly the same?

Is the forum or black market raw the same exact batches going to licensed drug company’s? It’s made at the same site and done out the back door? Or another location same specs?

Any difference in compounding pharmacy raw material vs Watson or phizer etc.

 

[aHarness]

My question is still in the raw hormone.
Is it all created equal or can there be variables.

I mean, if there was a variation in the synthetic hormone then it would no longer be that hormone, no?

 

[rAJJIN]

I do t know the answer.
I was hoping to hear from someone involved in the production of it.
I know with test e for example not all powder batches would look the same. And some were/are responsible for out of the ordinary pip. If it’s the same with no variation please explain.

Same with trenbolone powder.
I’ve seen batches of it much different in color
In the raw hormone. Both real, I’m sure of that, but seem to be slightly different variation or batch.

 

[Hyperemia]

I do t know the answer.
I was hoping to hear from someone involved in the production of it.
I know with test e for example not all powder batches would look the same. And some were/are responsible for out of the ordinary pip. If it’s the same with no variation please explain.

Same with trenbolone powder.
I’ve seen batches of it much different in color
In the raw hormone. Both real, I’m sure of that, but seem to be slightly different variation or batch.

I won't disagree that the process in how the hormone is made does carry some weight, as far as degradation, stability, etc. People always mention generic vs pharm with other meds like t3 /t4 and how different manufacturers will give them different levels on their bloodwork but I don't think it's a fair comparison in that in those instances it seems to be more a quality control issue. From personal experience, I believe that if 200mg of test of pharm and ugl give you the same numbers on blood work, there is no discernible difference to the user.

 

[rAJJIN]

I don’t disagree with that and I’m sure no expert. My simple thinking is start from the very beginning of the process, and identify, if any, variables. That would be the actual production process of the “raw materials.
It seems to be something not many if any here are very familiar with.

 

[specter]

I do t know the answer.
I was hoping to hear from someone involved in the production of it.
I know with test e for example not all powder batches would look the same. And some were/are responsible for out of the ordinary pip. If it’s the same with no variation please explain.

Same with trenbolone powder.
I’ve seen batches of it much different in color
In the raw hormone. Both real, I’m sure of that, but seem to be slightly different variation or batch.

Now im not involved in production, but the ppl i know who are, says the PIP is because of carbolic acid thats made during the production of the testosterone enanthat raw, its supposed to mostly be washed out of the raw powder and if that process is not done perfectly to much remains and causes pip.

 

[lifter]

Now im not involved in production, but the ppl i know who are, says the PIP is because of carbolic acid thats made during the production of the testosterone enanthat raw, its supposed to mostly be washed out of the raw powder and if that process is not done perfectly to much remains and causes pip.

What about a vial of test sitting around for a few years?
I have heard that carbolic acid can be the culprit for UGL vials that have sat around for years.

I know from personal experience that I can use a pharma vial of test even up to 7 years later and no PIP. With UGL vials, some give me major PIP when trying in present time but the same batch vials (from same order) from a few years ago gave me no issues when I first got them.

The above leads me to believe there are some differences.