is bulking a waste of time being natural?

[Kkv]

Yeah, right. No family wants bad publicity. He had been previously caught and arrested for possession of steroids so it is known that he was on them. We just don't know how much he was using and for how long. We also don't know what ancillaries he was on. If you think using steroids is healthy for you then you are dillusional.

That was his brother..

 

[TheOtherOne55]

I didn't list veggies as they are kinda obvious.

What's wrong with using fast food, ice cream, Gatorade as food? Petty sure there's this whle flexible dieting thing where you can get shredded on eating ice cream everyday supported by people like Alan Aragon, skip hill, etc...

And chipotle meal consists of rice, steak, tomatoes, beans, peppers and onions. I'd like t know how that's unhealthy in any way shape or form.

Red something on intensemsucle that said you need 2g protein per lb of bodyweight itten by Dante, but now that I think about it, he owns true protein and that might have just been a ploy to line his wallet. Good hing I don't buy from him.

Rutine si the DC 2 way split, but I do it like this, so it isn't DC just the split layout being used:

RP movement
Secondary movement
Stretching movement

So chest Is like this:

Incline bb bench 15RP
Icline DB bench 1xfailure
Incline flye 1xfailure

I can't even comment on anything in this thread. I've laughed out loud too many times.

 

[Turbo85]

I didn't list veggies as they are kinda obvious.

What's wrong with using fast food, ice cream, Gatrouts food? Petty sure there's this whle flex REALLY LY LY dieting thing where you can get shredded on eating ice cream everyday supported by people like Alan Aragon, skip hill, etc...

And chipotle meal consists of rice, steak, tomatoes, beans, peppers and onions. I'd like t know how that's unhealthy in any way shape or form.

Red something on intense musucle that said you need 2g protein per lb of bodyweight itten by Dante, but now that I think about it, he owns true protein and that might have just been a ploy to line his wallet. Good hing I don't buy from him.

Rutine si the DC 2 way split, but I do it like this, so it isn't DC just the split layout being used:

RP movement
Secondary movement
Stretching movement

So chest Is like this:

Incline bb bench 15RP
Icline DB bench 1xfailure
Incline flye 1xfailure

Buddy you may have found the website intense muscle and read one sentence about DC but you are missing the point that routine is for people with AT LEAST 2 yrs of REAL training and for people who have met there natural max or are extremely close which you are not. Training till failure on all sets is for a more advanced lifter just try and fix ur diet, and yes there is something wrong with fast food and chipotle is tons of preservatives and salt, stick with compound movements and actually listen to us if you are asking questions because you may not hear what you want but then again you are doing something wrong or there would be no need for questions about this subject and to top ot off you said you are thankful your mo ey doesnt go to true protein lmfao why not try putting your money there seems to be where most get it from but that goes hand in hand with listening to given advice good luck

 

[emeric delczeg]

why though

there's guys who are clearly using at my gym, who don't use anything more than 135 on all big lifts, can't even do bw exercises and are bigger and leaner than me. whats the point in pushing exercises that aren't doing jack shit imo, even when my diet is on point.

Some people exercise for health reason, some to just stay fit and some to slow down aging. Before you make any decision to take any AAS, find out if any body in you family has or had any blood disorder, gene disorders, motor neuron disease, Alzheimer, Parkinson`s,.

 

[Turkishexpress]

Honestly if you have to use steroids to look like "Zyzz", you got some crap genetics and should not mess with them to begin with. You can look like him with a good diet and basic training.

 

[Kkv]

Because I can get 5 lbs of whey for $32 and none of TPs prices can beat that. The majority of my training is compound movements, fo you want to see the rest of my routine?.

I can't even comment on anything in this thread. I've laughed out loud too many times.

Instead of being a smartass, why don't you try to help? Yet ANOTHER guy on this site who acts like he has all the answers but is unwilling to help and has wasted broadband by posting in this thread.

 

[thatbloke]

im gonna cop abit of flack for this, but so be it.................

im going to make it simple for you, this will work, its not the only way but its one simple way, even a moron could follow it

dont ask me questions as to why it works, or tell me how u heard something else, i dont give a shit, this works, if you heard something else works then go do it, but its obvious whatever you think or believe works doesnt, so how about not ask questions and jus read,

Diet:
Eat 1 gram protein per pound bodyweight
eat under 100 grams a day of fat
Carbs eat as many as you want, the rule is eat enough carbs until u gain weight, if u dont gain weight eat more carbs

by mathematical terms, if you consume more cals then burn ull gain weight, that simple, just eat enough carbs to make sure u gain weight

Training:
each bodypart once a week, high intensity, to failure (not beyond failure), rep ramge 8-12 for everything, your goal is to progress in strength, meaning do more reps, or if you can do 12 reps then increase the weight
chest: bench press, dumbell presses, incline press, 8-10 reps, 3-4 sets each
Back: deadlifts, t bar rows, pull ups, chinups, dumbell rows, 3-4 sets each
Legs, squats, leg press, hamstring curls, 3-4 sets each
arms, shoulders, calves, do wateva the hell ya want,

Steroids:
do your own research and learn how to cycle, simple rule, more roids you use the bigger you CAN be, key word CAN, doesnt mean will be, it means CAN be, so dont go thinking 'omg ill be huge on 1500mgs of testosterone a week' chances are only thing thatll be huge after your cycle will be the bitch tits you gotta have removed surgically after it, so use some logic and cautious how cycle

simple rule if ya wanna be huge,
250mg testosterone a week, all year round,
then you take higher dosages of roids (called a blast) for 10-12 weeks, (e.g 500mgs testosterone a week and 400mgs deca a week)
followed by 5 week breaks (called a cruise) (250mg testosterone weekly during this period)
then repeat

at the end of each blast ur physique should hold more muscle then it did at the end of the previous blast, if your not bigger then your last blast it means in your next blast eat more, if this makes you fat then increase the dosage or roids in the next blast but a small amount (e.g extra 250mgs of your choice of anabolic)

Your health
I really couldnt give 2 shits, thats your responsibility and problem, im not here to nanny you and tell you what you can and cant do,its your responsibility to look after your health and take the time to educate urself, which means research for yaself,

be aware staying on roids and using high dosages can/will damage your health to an extent, some people suffer close to no problems, for others it can cause severe life threatening problems, obviously the more you use or misuse of them can cause more problems that can be avoided

there are also side effects almost always encountered by using them, im not going to tell you what they are or how to prevent them, do some research, again even a moron could research what they are and how to prevent them

Advice:
i wouldnt call people aholes or idiots or smartasses on this forum, especially when they were able to figure out how to build impressive physiques quiet easily naturally that were far beyond yours and probably beyond yours even after uve used a few prohormone cycles
, and here you are thinking a cycle of SD is actually going to improve your physique into something you can be proud of, im gonna be honest with you,
your going to need alot more then a prohormone cycle of SD to change the body you have into something ull actually be proud to show off, but ill leave that to you to experience and learn for yaself,

ive always felt the best way to learn is from your mistakes, so i think you should do as you please, and wen you make mistakes you will learn from them

have fun

 

[cm]

I didn't list veggies as they are kinda obvious.

What's wrong with using fast food, ice cream, Gatorade as food? Petty sure there's this whle flexible dieting thing where you can get shredded on eating ice cream everyday supported by people like Alan Aragon, skip hill, etc...

And chipotle meal consists of rice, steak, tomatoes, beans, peppers and onions. I'd like t know how that's unhealthy in any way shape or form.

Red something on intensemsucle that said you need 2g protein per lb of bodyweight itten by Dante, but now that I think about it, he owns true protein and that might have just been a ploy to line his wallet. Good hing I don't buy from him.

Rutine si the DC 2 way split, but I do it like this, so it isn't DC just the split layout being used:

RP movement
Secondary movement
Stretching movement

So chest Is like this:

Incline bb bench 15RP
Icline DB bench 1xfailure
Incline flye 1xfailure

This whole post is a disaster, you are taking bits and pieces of programs and dietary advice and changing to fit you, and then when it doesnt work fast enough for you to look like a jerset shore douche in 6 months you ask about drugs
DAnte is one of the best
Skip never says you could eat ice cream everyday and get ripped
You are acting really childish and it almost seems like this whole thing is trolling

If those are your pictures earlier.....
There is no way you lifted for 2 years
no way you lift hard and heavy
No way you eat right

Dude, there is no flexibility. You either do it right or you fuck up

Perfect example, if you were following DC, even a modified version, you would know how important the 2 1/2# plates are and would have used them over and over again.
You would have increased your pressing/pulling movements to appreciable new level and show the fruits of your labor
example
If you have a 150# bench, you will look like it
If you have a 400# bench again you will look like it as well(not to say you would have made this much progress, but 2 years is a lot of workouts to move up a significant amount especially because you are so "green")

What is wrong with using fast food??
If you eat fast food, you will look like it
want to look like a million bucks, eats off the dollar menu.?. Sound logic

Listen up, were all not wrong. Why do you keep thinking your way isnt??

 

[OceanoDepths]

What ever happened to just eating and lifting? Don't over complicate things, and if it ain't broke don't fix it.. Add a decent dose of AAS and watch your body transform.. Injectable AAS > Oral PH.. If you're gonna go the hormone route, get some legit oil.. The kid's gonna do what he wants, it's his body.. All I will say is whatever you decide to do, do your research and stay on top of yo shit.. Good luck OP

 

[Elvia1023]

This thread is a complete disaster and not just due to the op.

The op doesn't have a clue and needs to eat a better diet and train harder and do that naturally for atleast 3 more years imo.

Allex posting a pic of someone who imo the op couldn't look like with 10 years of the best diet and training available if he remains natural.

But to the op if you want to take aas that's upto you. But I would first sort out your diet and overall mentality. I would do 500mg test for 12 weeks for a first cycle. 2nd cycle I would do 500mg test with 30 mg dbol. You don't need tren at all.

 

[ALLEX]

Kkv, here's my serious 0.02 on this:

I know how it is searching high and low for lifting and gear info and reading totally different approaches from different guys. It just confuses you.

Instead of doing that, try one of the following paths:

1 - Hire a decent trainer. Plenty of them on this site and elsewhere. Some of them charge pennies per day.

2 - Read the following post, print it and stick it to your wall. Follow this and forget about everyone else's advice.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/articles-forum/1158-growth-principles-beginners.html

No program is perfect. Choose one that seems logical to you from someone experienced and follow it. That's really all it takes...

 

[Elvia1023]

Kkv, here's my serious 0.02 on this:

I know how it is searching high and low for lifting and gear info and reading totally different approaches from different guys. It just confuses you.

Instead of doing that, try one of the following paths:

1 - Hire a decent trainer. Plenty of them on this site and elsewhere. Some of them charge pennies per day.

2 - Read the following post, print it and stick it to your wall. Follow this and forget about everyone else's advice.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/articles-forum/1158-growth-principles-beginners.html

No program is perfect. Choose one that seems logical to you from someone experienced and follow it. That's really all it takes...

Great advice.

I never recommend trainers but I think Phil Hernon would be ideal for you. He is so cheap for the year you will be shocked. Due to your poor mentality (imo) his knowledge and approach will help reconstruct the way you think about bb and diet in general. He will teach you about good diet and I think his health and longevity approach would be ideal for you. He is about building lots of muscle over time but being as healthy as possible. For your goals I think that would be an amazing choice for you. Let us know what you decide to do.

 

[iceman74]

bout to pop some sdrol
gonna pulse it at 40mg training 20mg non training for 4 weeks

My .02

Do not run 40mg/day - even as a pulse. The risk vs reward is not worth it. You'll likely feel like crap the entire cycle and the stress you put on your liver, plus the lethargy and you're lack of appetite will make the 4 weeks very miserable. PCT (and for a while afterwords) won't be any picnic either. Eat big and don't go over 20mg if you're going to use it at all. Personally, I wouldn't bother at all because you're going to lose 80% or so of your "gains" in PCT.

Safest bet, if you absolutely must run something hormonal at all, would be to go with 250mg of Test E for 12 weeks. With a proper diet and a solid PCT you'll be able to gain and retain a decent amount of weight with minimal side effects.

 

[Buttman3]

this is only true if you passed your natural genetic limit.

This is why i think its stupid to wait till you have been lifting for 10+ years when your basically at your natural genetic peak to cycle.


Bulking as a natural is not stupid, but after 3 years your gains are basically like 1-5 pounds of muscle a year. so yes, try to aim for 1 lb a month after you have been lifting for 3 years... or else it will be dumb to bulk for more than a lb a month... you will just gain fat

or better yet, cycle after you have been lifting for 2-3 years and you will be ok and most likely keep all your gains. YOU ONLY LOSE ALL YOUR GAINS IF YOU PASSED YOUR NATURAL LIMIT. thats why theres nothing wrong with cycling after lifting for only 2-3 years because you are not at your natural limit and will keep all your gains except water weight.



if you lose your gains and your not at your natural genetic limit, its because you dont know how to train or diet properly which most people dont. so yes you will lose your gains.

I know many people, myself included who continued to make after our first cycle. because we have not been lifting for long and were not at our natural limit after our first cycle so we wont lose our gains... but if you have been lifting for 10+ years and decide to cycle and get passed your genetic potential, than yes you will slowly lose all of your gains... if you have no anabolics inside of you.

Jelet,

The photos in your sig caught my attention . If you don't mind me asking mate, how old were you in the 1st and 2nd pic?

And is that you in the avatar?

I'd appreciate if you can share a few things such as current training schedule, overall diet, and cycle?

I'm also an ectomorph.

Cheers mate.

 

[Buttman3]

seems like a pretty stupid idea knowing that the large majority of the food you eat will be used for energy, and you'll probably gain 1-2 lbs of muscle every couple months if you do it properly. and if you just jab some test/tren, you can half ass diet and gain more muscle mass in 1 month than you will in a year of natural perfect diet and training. what is the point of being natural..? even if you lift weights recreationally and never plan on setting foot on a bbing stage, theres no point in staying natural and gaining at a snails pace

thoughts?

thoughts?
one of the more foolish things i have read in a while

Actually mate, I find this to be very true in my case as an ectomorph (gene runs in my family).

Back when I was doing it naturally in my early 20s, training 1.5 hours a day, 5-6 days a week with great diet for about a year straight, I gained no more than 10lbs.

When I was in my early 30s, it was almost impossible for me to make the gains like I did back then, and I got on Tren. I gained up to 6lbs in just one week! And I kept all of it. The thing was that my training and diet was pretty good, but it was nothing compared to when I was in my 20s, but still, my gain was WAY better than when I was a natural.

 

[Bronstonian]

Honestly if you have to use steroids to look like "Zyzz", you got some crap genetics and should not mess with them to begin with. You can look like him with a good diet and basic training.

sure that could be true for some people who have a great starting point and the right genetics.

but for people like zyzz himself, it's complete nonsense. he went from a 140 lb stick figure to 215 lbs at 8% in under 3 years. and that was cycling on and off for the majority of that, not staying on year round.

no one is making that kind of change naturally in that timeframe. not even phil heath.

zyzz did what he had to do to look how he wanted to look. his use was mild compared to many here who are still living. but he had a heart condition, didnt get bloodwork done often enough, ingested the wrong things in thailand and bangkok took him. the end.

 

[cm]

well, you said it. 1.5 years.................10 pounds

that is incredible progress, despite the fact you trained way too long and way too often
9 hours weight training per week is excessive

wtf do u guys think happens when you go to the gym do 50 some odd workouts per year for a bodypart, eat and sleep well, etc etc????????????

you gain small amounts of quality weight year after year.
people dont gain more then 10 pounds a year after they have been at it for a while.
At least not quality weight/stage weight

1/4-1/2 pound per month is tremendous progress. i dont care what body type you think you might be or how it limits you

 

[Buttman3]

Some of you guys are fucking retarded trying to give him a "OMG DON'T JUICE U NOOB" lecture. It's his life, he can do what he wants. He is no longer able to gain any substantial muscle at this point. The level of knowledge is truly disappointing and frustrating to read in this thread. If there is anyone that knows about natural training and plateaus, it's me.

Actually, I know about it as well.

I have been there, and it's very frustrating when people look at me and almost all of them would be saying, "eat more dude," without realizing I was eating like a pig!

I think that a lot of the people who aren't ectomorphs don't realize how hard it is to gain weight, just as people who aren't naturally fat don't realize how hard it is to lose fat.

"eat more and you'll get big," or "go on diet you fat ass."

It's not that simple, mates.

 

[Kkv]

Cm:

Here's me 2 years ago: DSC01219.jpg Photo by sushi362 | Photobucket

DSC01089.jpg Photo by sushi362 | Photobucket

And here's me recently:
Photoon6-14-13at1224AM_zps13f73c2e.jpg Photo by sushi362 | Photobucket


Honestly, has nobody on this site heard of flexible dieting??? People said DC was too advanced for my level, so I took the aspects I like from the program and added a little bit of volume. It isn't DC but who the fuck cares as long as I progress on it????

 

[Kkv]

Great advice.

I never recommend trainers but I think Phil Hernon would be ideal for you. He is so cheap for the year you will be shocked. Due to your poor mentality (imo) his knowledge and approach will help reconstruct the way you think about bb and diet in general. He will teach you about good diet and I think his health and longevity approach would be ideal for you. He is about building lots of muscle over time but being as healthy as possible. For your goals I think that would be an amazing choice for you. Let us know what you decide to do.

I'll consider it.