ECY Stack

[maxmusle1]

Cycled this way w good results :
20mg eph
200mg caffeine
81mg ASA
2-3x daily (never after 3pm)
for 3 weeks , then
Clen 40-100mcg/T3 25mcg
For 2 weeks . Repeat if needed.

Max
Not for anyone with heart issues and should talk to MD before running anything.

 

[Biggerp73]

[

Do you know if this happened to any males?

You know I'm a little curious because my face has looked old, sunken, and wrinkly for a couple years and I've been wondering what caused it, because I didn't have that issue before. And I did run a lot of DNP right around the time that happened.

 

[Sixfoottwo]

I don’t think DNP is healthier…also from a woman’s perspective I have witnessed other women that have taken it and it eats away the fat in their faces and never comes back. They are left with sunken eyes and skin folds around their mouth.

My diet and cardio leads the fat loss, the ECY stack is just an extra push.

It does so with men as well. At least, I'm a man and noticed it a bit too. I'm just reversing from a cut, used DNP at 200 mg for 10 and 400 for 5 days and my face sunk in as well. But off a skull face haha. I have a good face but it definitely didn't make me prettier.

Hoping it will bounce back once kcal are above maintenance again.

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

One plastic surgeon told one of the women that all her collegen and fat in her face was “eaten” up and not even filler could help her.

I hope it's not true but it's best to be careful. It's possible dnp could do this. This needs to be investigated.

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

Jamie the giant seems to have had a more youthful face before dnp. Currently, it looks different. It could be all the androgens though but this concerns me about dnp. I think the collagen or whatever it is in cheeks cause a healthy looking non sunken in aroundncheeks and if dnp burns it up then it isn't worth it. I don't know if it does.

Logically I just thought one loses fat like anywhere else. Very possible the mechanism involved burns up that nice healthy collagen or whatever it is in cheeks.

 

[Worldsfastestfatty]

I personally prefer to take Yohimbine pre- fasted cardio upon waking and then other stims (eph, clen, dmaa whatever) after fasted cardio as I find the stims lower cardio performance.

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

If DNP does in fact burn up facial fat it's either burning up collagen, elastin, or fat pads or all three, in the face, to cause this negative aesthetic appearance.

 

[Flexxx90]

[

Do you know if this happened to any males?

No, I only one one male that took it for one of his preps. He did have a lot of fat loss in his face but it seemed to bounce back to normal after prep.

 

[Flexxx90]

If DNP does in fact burn up facial fat it's either burning up collagen, elastin, or fat pads or all three, in the face, to cause this negative aesthetic appearance.

Correct, obviously you can’t choose where fat loss is.

 

[Flexxx90]

Might sound a bit vain, for me keeping my face and skin looking young is important. Same with keeping it feminine. Might take me longer to get my stage goal, but that’s ok.

 

[jeroendebleser]

Is it really worth it? Stim addiction. Adrenal fatigue. Raised cortisol levels. Rebound weight gain. Elevated blood pressure. Strain on the heart. Cardiac hypertrophy. And for how much extra fat burn? Say your eating at a 500 calorie deficit with no ECY. How many more calories of fat will you burn because of ECY? Honestly I'd rather use a low dose of DNP. I think it would be drastically more effective, and actually healthier in some important ways.

That's all true mate but you don't take ECY/ECA to burn fat directly (or you shouldn't at least), you take it to blunt your hunger.

It goes great in combination with DNP by the way

 

[USMuscle9403]

It had a long lasting effect on where my face stores fat, too. When I would gain weight, I would first notice it by my face getting soft and round. Now, even if I gain weight, my face still remains square and lean. Dnp is a hell of a drug. There are other places that seem to not gain any fat, either. I kinda chalked it up to getting older, you know how even a fat older guy can have shredded body parts? Maybe it's something else...

 

[Flexxx90]

It had a long lasting effect on where my face stores fat, too. When I would gain weight, I would first notice it by my face getting soft and round. Now, even if I gain weight, my face still remains square and lean. Dnp is a hell of a drug. There are other places that seem to not gain any fat, either. I kinda chalked it up to getting older, you know how even a fat older guy can have shredded body parts? Maybe it's something else...

The male I know that took DNP has done a bit of extensive research on it. He said that he thinks some of the fat cells that DNP shrinks you never get back. Haven’t looked into myself because I am not going to take it but I thought it was interesting. Especially when the complainant of all 3 women were the same, their face never filled back out.

 

[275bills]

Cycled this way w good results :
20mg eph
200mg caffeine
81mg ASA
2-3x daily (never after 3pm)
for 3 weeks , then
Clen 40-100mcg/T3 25mcg
For 2 weeks . Repeat if needed.

Max
Not for anyone with heart issues and should talk to MD before running anything.

So you were only using t3 in 2 week cycles ?

Interesting

 

[Elvia1023]

Extreme fatloss is going to mean you lose fat all over including your face. It's not as if certain drugs will just cause you to lose fat in one area only. People can hold fat in many different ways and when getting very lean certain areas are more stubborn that others. Many people can get extremely lean and they still have quite fat faces and others get "death face" weeks before their contest. DNP is the superior fat burner and it's non selective so you will burn it everywhere.

Women getting extremely lean, especially when using androgenic drugs are going to risk changes to their facial appearance. Some will go more extreme than others and everyone has a different genetic response. I have seen women who use alsorts of stuff and they are still feminine and others who have used low doses of what people consider more mild compounds and virilization was apparent.

This thread just mentioned dnp and changes to women's faces and I realize these women would have noticed the changes to their faces in a matter of weeks due to extreme dieting (combined with dnp etc) so it's not so much a hormone issue but I think it should be highlighted. Obviously fat loss is all about dieting and net energy balance (certain drugs can increase energy expenditure) but I mention androgenic aids because they are definitely a factor when discussing changes to face shape and facial fat distribution. Changes to certain hormones (especially estrogen and cortisol) can substantially change women's faces over time. So whilst women may have taken dnp (or other fat burners) I am sure some of them are using certain aas and perhaps a serm and/or AI combined with extreme dieting. As mentioned DNP does eat away at fat so it's no surprise when everything is combined it can cause certain issues.

I make this post because I spoken with 100's of people who have used DNP and many use it extensively and the only people who notice massive changes to their faces are simply those who tried to get as lean as possible and pushed dieting to the extreme. Women have to be especially careful and the more gear they take and the more extreme they diet (even with gear) the worse their faces are likely to look over time. If you want to look extremely beautiful (society standards) the last thing you should be doing is trying to get shredded as possible (with or without androgenic aids). That's why it's often a case of careful balance for most women who compete in regards to drugs and staying as feminine as possible.

As people have posted ECA has many benefits than DNP doesn't have and is especially useful in the later stages of a prep. DNP will burn more fat but adding something that can suppress your appetite and increase your energy is only going to help when dieting hard. DNP can be horrible for many at the end of their preps because they are already on low calories so they can barely function as fatigue becomes almost unbearable. This is why I would always favour something like ECA at this time and if someone wants to use DNP then adding some stimulants with it would be advisable.

OP I am not a fan of clen either buy just use what you think is most effective and have had results with in the past. Although I keep clen doses very low (40mcg max) due to the side effects. I personally wouldn't add in the ECA until later on as taking strong stimulants for 3 months is never going to be great. It's done by many but they often have major issues especially post show. At the very least have 2 weeks off after approx 4 weeks usage then run it up until your contest. I prefer to buy the ingredients individually that way you can add in the likes of caffeine and yohimbine earlier into a diet. Then in your final run (approx 6 weeks) you could use eca and clen but keep the doses sensible. If you need a little extra later on then up the dose but you don't need to go over the top. I have seen protocols were they push the likes of clen and t3 extremely high but it is totally unneeded imo.

 

[Elvia1023]

Cycled this way w good results :
20mg eph
200mg caffeine
81mg ASA
2-3x daily (never after 3pm)
for 3 weeks , then
Clen 40-100mcg/T3 25mcg
For 2 weeks . Repeat if needed.

Max
Not for anyone with heart issues and should talk to MD before running anything.

Something like this can be great but I would keep the clen dose low. I also wouldn't run t3 for 2 weeks. I would either not run it at all or run it for the entire duration of your prep. You also have to be careful stopping all these drugs so I wouldn't just stop all at the same time. If you run them for a long period I would drop the eph for example keeping in the caffeine and t3 then 2 weeks later drop the t3 then 2 weeks later drop the caffeine and don't use them (excluding caffeine) again for as long as possible.

 

[Elvia1023]

It had a long lasting effect on where my face stores fat, too. When I would gain weight, I would first notice it by my face getting soft and round. Now, even if I gain weight, my face still remains square and lean. Dnp is a hell of a drug. There are other places that seem to not gain any fat, either. I kinda chalked it up to getting older, you know how even a fat older guy can have shredded body parts? Maybe it's something else...

There is definitely something in it (DNP) but I think there are many other factors. Most men once you diet down then rebound and repeat the process over years your body composition changes. As you grow and gain more muscle through the years it changes your metabolism and body composition. Then comes the other 1001 dietary, training and hormonal factors. So many different hormones effect how we look and these will change as we get older (test and gh for example). In regards to your facial fat just look up the effect prolonged high cortisol can have on that. So many different things can raise cortisol levels including alcohol, nicotine, opiates, ssri's, prednisone or other corticosteroids.

 

[Flexxx90]

Extreme fatloss is going to mean you lose fat all over including your face. It's not as if certain drugs will just cause you to lose fat in one area only. People can hold fat in many different ways and when getting very lean certain areas are more stubborn that others. Many people can get extremely lean and they still have quite fat faces and others get "death face" weeks before their contest. DNP is the superior fat burner and it's non selective so you will burn it everywhere.

Women getting extremely lean, especially when using androgenic drugs are going to risk changes to their facial appearance. Some will go more extreme than others and everyone has a different genetic response. I have seen women who use alsorts of stuff and they are still feminine and others who have used low doses of what people consider more mild compounds and virilization was apparent.

This thread just mentioned dnp and changes to women's faces and I realize these women would have noticed the changes to their faces in a matter of weeks due to extreme dieting (combined with dnp etc) so it's not so much a hormone issue but I think it should be highlighted. Obviously fat loss is all about dieting and net energy balance (certain drugs can increase energy expenditure) but I mention androgenic aids because they are definitely a factor when discussing changes to face shape and facial fat distribution. Changes to certain hormones (especially estrogen and cortisol) can substantially change women's faces over time. So whilst women may have taken dnp (or other fat burners) I am sure some of them are using certain aas and perhaps a serm and/or AI combined with extreme dieting. As mentioned DNP does eat away at fat so it's no surprise when everything is combined it can cause certain issues.

I make this post because I spoken with 100's of people who have used DNP and many use it extensively and the only people who notice massive changes to their faces are simply those who tried to get as lean as possible and pushed dieting to the extreme. Women have to be especially careful and the more gear they take and the more extreme they diet (even with gear) the worse their faces are likely to look over time. If you want to look extremely beautiful (society standards) the last thing you should be doing is trying to get shredded as possible (with or without androgenic aids). That's why it's often a case of careful balance for most women who compete in regards to drugs and staying as feminine as possible.

As people have posted ECA has many benefits than DNP doesn't have and is especially useful in the later stages of a prep. DNP will burn more fat but adding something that can suppress your appetite and increase your energy is only going to help when dieting hard. DNP can be horrible for many at the end of their preps because they are already on low calories so they can barely function as fatigue becomes almost unbearable. This is why I would always favour something like ECA at this time and if someone wants to use DNP then adding some stimulants with it would be advisable.

OP I am not a fan of clen either buy just use what you think is most effective and have had results with in the past. Although I keep clen doses very low (40mcg max) due to the side effects. I personally wouldn't add in the ECA until later on as taking strong stimulants for 3 months is never going to be great. It's done by many but they often have major issues especially post show. At the very least have 2 weeks off after approx 4 weeks usage then run it up until your contest. I prefer to buy the ingredients individually that way you can add in the likes of caffeine and yohimbine earlier into a diet. Then in your final run (approx 6 weeks) you could use eca and clen but keep the doses sensible. If you need a little extra later on then up the dose but you don't need to go over the top. I have seen protocols were they push the likes of clen and t3 extremely high but it is totally unneeded imo.

Thank you for the additional information, great insight. I agree with you on the points you made about women and a careful balance.

I like that recommendation on the 4 weeks on 2 weeks off.

 

[Elvia1023]

Thank you for the additional information, great insight. I agree with you on the points you made about women and a careful balance.

I like that recommendation on the 4 weeks on 2 weeks off.

There are so many different ways and all of them will work but I can tell you are very health conscious so you want to run something that you can recover easily from. That's why I prefer saving the harsher stuff for the later stages (final 4-6 weeks). As you know you only need your diet and maybe some light aids (caffeine etc) to get in shape. You save the harder stimulants for when you actually need them. Now if you need them earlier on add them in but at a lower dose and there is nothing wrong with upping the dose just don't go crazy. By your posts it's clear you aren't the type to just push for the sake of pushing and your proposed doses are standard so you will be fine. Some coaches have their women just take more and more and more regardless of feedback and whilst it can be effective it often leads to terrible issues post (and during) cycle. I was going to mention if you do well with yohimbine just carry on using that but if not rauwolscine could be worth using instead of it.

 

[Flexxx90]

There are so many different ways and all of them will work but I can tell you are very health conscious so you want to run something that you can recover easily from. That's why I prefer saving the harsher stuff for the later stages (final 4-6 weeks). As you know you only need your diet and maybe some light aids (caffeine etc) to get in shape. You save the harder stimulants for when you actually need them. Now if you need them earlier on add them in but at a lower dose and there is nothing wrong with upping the dose just don't go crazy. By your posts it's clear you aren't the type to just push for the sake of pushing and your proposed doses are standard so you will be fine. Some coaches have their women just take more and more and more regardless of feedback and whilst it can be effective it often leads to terrible issues post (and during) cycle. I was going to mention if you do well with yohimbine just carry on using that but if not rauwolscine could be worth using instead of it.

I’ll read up on rauwolscine. Thanks for the info!