IGF 78 on 5.4iu genotropin... seems I got scammed.

[Doitagain]

Yes Chase has below 200 IGF on over 18 units of GH. To me, that shows IGF is not as important as we think it is.

...and yet, this would be THE feature of Growth Hormone Resistance, as IGF-1 is the effector of growth induced by growth hormone. GH therapy (at supraphysiological doses) has been evaluated in acquired GH resistance and showed lack of therapeutic success.
Chese grows like weed nevertheless. Definitely interesting.

 

[luki7788]

Yes Chase has below 200 IGF on over 18 units of GH. To me, that shows IGF is not as important as we think it is.

exactly - because we should only be interested in the GH level in the muscles not the systemic level

 

[specter]

exactly - because we should only be interested in the GH level in the muscles not the systemic level

this is something i have been trying to tell ppl for a loooooooooooong time in my country, but ppl get stuck when some "known" bodybuilder says something and then a shitty no name guy like me claime othervise i must be lying because im not built like jay cutler... and gettin ppl to read studies etc is like getting a teenager to listen in school...

 

[rAJJIN]

It reminds me a little of when we first started doing serum tests.
Some say well it doesn’t matter if it is 12 or 36, it just means it’s real…

I bet though most everyone wants the brand that produces the higher numbers vs lower numbers.

 

[Josefein421]

I guess my biggest concern is that I took 2 brands at roughly the same dose (especially if we count TP as overdosed) same amount pre test, same time after inject to draw and used the same lab/draw site and got 2 vastly different results.

So from this thread I've learned the tren and the low calories could play a role. I never said it WAS fake to them or anyone. I'd need a Janoshick test for that. I just raised some big concerns and questions based on those results.

People here gave good info and possible explanations. Coach and source got very defensive, called me an asshole and offered zero explanation other than "the shit is real bc we are legit and supply olympians so how dare you question?!". That and the fact the source was provided by the coach and the use of pharma specifically was heavily pushed raised flags. But no I cannot say definitively it is fake.

Thanks to all. I learned a lot. Time for me to move on and keep progressing. Started 5iu TP black yesterday. At the end of diet end of Jan I will test again and see... same lab, same dose, same diet, same ped's. Only change will be TP for geno. Getting other blood drawn then anyway so I'll tack these on.

Thanks all.

 

[F350]

I guess my biggest concern is that I took 2 brands at roughly the same dose (especially if we count TP as overdosed) same amount pre test, same time after inject to draw and used the same lab/draw site and got 2 vastly different results.

So from this thread I've learned the tren and the low calories could play a role. I never said it WAS fake to them or anyone. I'd need a Janoshick test for that. I just raised some big concerns and questions based on those results.

People here gave good info and possible explanations. Coach and source got very defensive, called me an asshole and offered zero explanation other than "the shit is real bc we are legit and supply olympians so how dare you question?!". That and the fact the source was provided by the coach and the use of pharma specifically was heavily pushed raised flags. But no I cannot say definitively it is fake.

Thanks to all. I learned a lot. Time for me to move on and keep progressing. Started 5iu TP black yesterday. At the end of diet end of Jan I will test again and see... same lab, same dose, same diet, same ped's. Only change will be TP for geno. Getting other blood drawn then anyway so I'll tack these on.

Thanks all.

Did you use the same lab to test both results as well as take it the same time for both tests? Did you run it the same length of time w each product? Just trying to narrow down any posible things that could yield contradicting results.

 

[Josefein421]

Did you use the same lab to test both results as well as take it the same time for both tests? Did you run it the same length of time w each product? Just trying to narrow down any posible things that could yield contradicting results.

Yes to all of that. Hence the concern... The lack of variables aside from tren.

Like I said all good and moving on. I'll retest on the blacks.

 

[luki7788]

Yes to all of that. Hence the concern... The lack of variables aside from tren.

Like I said all good and moving on. I'll retest on the blacks.

trenbolone is not "only" - it makes a huge difference

 

[aHarness]

...and yet, this would be THE feature of Growth Hormone Resistance, as IGF-1 is the effector of growth induced by growth hormone. GH therapy (at supraphysiological doses) has been evaluated in acquired GH resistance and showed lack of therapeutic success.
Chese grows like weed nevertheless. Definitely interesting.

Less circulating IGF1 could just mean more is binding to tissue, no? Which would explain the better growth?

 

[Doitagain]

Less circulating IGF1 could just mean more is binding to tissue, no? Which would explain the better growth?

Correct. But Chase's IGF-1 level on 18iu of legit Serostim is still very low (he's not on Tren nor definitely on a low calories/carbs regimen and his liver is fine). Just an oddity.

 

[Bio]

Cris refunded this block of training that I was half way through. Not so much as a hint of an apology.

I thought he was really good til this and maybe when he told me to "chill the fuck out".

But even a thinly veiled apology would've meant something. Shitty.

I don't expect the generic replacement the source "promised" before calling me an asshole either.

This post above that you made is shy of 24 hours since your original post. You came here for advice, and got excellent advice regarding your numbers and how they might be affected. Without taking time to process things, and within that 24hr time period, you accused your coach and the supplier. I don't see anything concrete to prove that your GH is bunk. I think you let your emotions get the best of you and now you've unnecessarily burned bridges. You could have had Jano test it and in the meantime use generics until the results come back.

One question, how long were you on the Pharma GH before you decided to do bloodwork?

 

[Drax]

...For what its worth, Ace White Tops are

 

[VaginaBoob89]

Just ban right to defensive and the "In what fucking world..." idk what world dude. You attached your name and reputation. Idk why but now if it's fake it blows back on you too. I'll tell you who's not at fault here... ME so don't be a fucking jerk. Last time I had some concerns about not being where I thought I should be or pushing hard enough it was "You need to chill the fuck out." And had 750 cals a day yanked and "let's see what you're made of now".

I've worked hard and done everything I was asked. This is about the leanest at this musculature I've ever been. It's been trying... energy is super low, I moved and am mid divorce during this process and I keep grinding away. Yeah it's been really hard lately. More power to all those who compete and suffer much worse.

I don't think you should be prepping for a show right now. Your life is not in order at all. Only go on stimulants, trenbolone, low sleep, and low calories when you have external stressors minimized and your mental health is optimized; otherwise you're just asking to feel worse and worse and start with self-reinforcing stress that just spirals out of control and wrecks your mind as well as your physique. Also, not trying to be a dick but I'm guessing English isn't your first language, correct? You should try to write using complete sentences rather than disconnected fragments; it will make your writing far more comprehensible.

Good luck, man. It sounds like low IGF reading is the least of your problems right now. Your GH probably isn't fake. Its simple that the tren ace messing up that igf number. Don't sweat it. Divorce is terrible and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I sincerely wish you the best in navigating that very traumatic and difficult process.

 

[juggy38]

I don't think you should be prepping for a show right now. Your life is not in order at all. Only go on stimulants, trenbolone, low sleep, and low calories when you have external stressors minimized and your mental health is optimized; otherwise you're just asking to feel worse and worse and start with self-reinforcing stress that just spirals out of control and wrecks your mind as well as your physique. Also, not trying to be a dick but I'm guessing English isn't your first language, correct? You should try to write using complete sentences rather than disconnected fragments; it will make your writing far more comprehensible.

Good luck, man. It sounds like low IGF reading is the least of your problems right now. Your GH probably isn't fake. Its simple that the tren ace messing up that igf number. Don't sweat it. Divorce is terrible and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I sincerely wish you the best in navigating that very traumatic and difficult process.

It’s so easy to chase something with your head down during a divorce. Thinks it’s a survival mechanism. I did the same thing. And yes, life got more out of control as my tunnel vision got smaller and smaller.

To the Op….fucj this photoshoot. You’re a big sexy man. Drop the tren and enjoy life. Lift hard, eat pizza, watch cartoons, do things that make you happy.

The next year is going to be a mindfuck….worry about abs later

 

[stackdizzy]

What I wonder is how a source can get "real" pharm gh in large enough quantities to sell to a lot of people. Its not like its cheap to buy anywhere in the world??? I really don't know the logistics side of that business so keep that in mind. To me when a source has legit pharm growth and generic growth that just seems sketchy to me. Like is it easier to counterfeit real growth or obtain it on the open market?? Of course i don't know why a factory who makes generic gh and "real" gh wouldn't put gh in both of them even if its the same shit. my thoughs

Oh and whatever you doing now just regroup and get it done. would you rather sit around and worry if your going to be lean enough for a photo shoot or worry about bs with your ex. The best revenge is living well!

 

[Josefein421]

everyone is worried about my mental health lol. I appreciate that. I am in a very good place. I am very happy and content. This was the most stressful thing I had going on so that's not too shabby lol. And I've moved on. Nbd. Shoot is for me. Just a silly thing that I used to make a target. I'm enjoying the process and structure. Maybe I will compete later in the year. Idk. For now I'm happy and enjoying it.

Idk the details of what happened w the GH. Im over it. Started same dose of TP black and already feel it. Pumps when training are noticeable. Low back pump. That's the only thing that's changed. And that's what bothered me about the "pharma"... not only didn't I get noticeable results I got no side effects either. Now I understand maybe it was the tren. Maybe it was degraded. Maybe fake. I don't know. Cris was a dick more than once. No worries. No need to waste any more thought on it

Again, thanks to everyone here for the educational points, experiences, support and messages.

 

[F350]

What I wonder is how a source can get "real" pharm gh in large enough quantities to sell to a lot of people. Its not like its cheap to buy anywhere in the world??? I really don't know the logistics side of that business so keep that in mind. To me when a source has legit pharm growth and generic growth that just seems sketchy to me. Like is it easier to counterfeit real growth or obtain it on the open market?? Of course i don't know why a factory who makes generic gh and "real" gh wouldn't put gh in both of them even if its the same shit. my thoughs

Oh and whatever you doing now just regroup and get it done. would you rather sit around and worry if your going to be lean enough for a photo shoot or worry about bs with your ex. The best revenge is living well!

I know one way. my friend used to go buy them from the HIV/aids clinic patients as many of them just wanted cash for drugs.
Another option is they buy it Intl. Most other countries are not rapped and pillaged by big pharma nearly as bad as we are in the usa. I can get it for less than $3/ iu intl for personal use (no RX included) so the source buying bulk would get much better pricing.
If I were to buy that exact same HGH in the USA my cost as a clinic is $20+ per IU depending on the brand. The best pricing you will get in the USA from a legit pharm with an RX is astronomical. Omnitrope ends up the cheapest and youll still spend well over $20/iu once the clinic marks it up to keep their lights on. HGH is the absolute worst margin product available and has been that way since before I started back in 07 ish.

Last but not least, this is just my opinion but how can you definitively know it's the GH and not you without testing it? You can't just take someone's word for it when so many things can affect the end result. Especially HGH as people's results vary so much. As I said before, I took brand HGH and did not see an improvement in my IGF score but I 100% know it was real. I personally orderd it from the wholesaler to our pharmacy and ran 4+ different brands so no way 4 mnfctr's are cutting corners or made a bad product at the same time.
If you're going to put someone's info out there potentially hurting their business you should have 100% proof its fake and not your response. I realize that wasn't necessarily why you made this post but that's what has happened. We have no proof it was fake. Only your word which is really no different than him giving you his word it was good GH.

 

[275bills]

In Canada it's pretty easy to get hg gh ATM.

It's regulated through a naturopath and if you pay out of pocket you could go to multiple doctors lol

I've been scripted up to 6ius a day of omni

The price of them even at Costco is ridiculous now.

Thankfully we have tp and the other great sponsors on here

I will also mention I can switch brands easily but humatrop 72iu are way to $$$

I've heard geno are abit cheaper then omni so I might eventually look into that

 

[stackdizzy]

I know one way. my friend used to go buy them from the HIV/aids clinic patients as many of them just wanted cash for drugs.
Another option is they buy it Intl. Most other countries are not rapped and pillaged by big pharma nearly as bad as we are in the usa. I can get it for less than $3/ iu intl for personal use (no RX included) so the source buying bulk would get much better pricing.
If I were to buy that exact same HGH in the USA my cost as a clinic is $20+ per IU depending on the brand. The best pricing you will get in the USA from a legit pharm with an RX is astronomical. Omnitrope ends up the cheapest and youll still spend well over $20/iu once the clinic marks it up to keep their lights on. HGH is the absolute worst margin product available and has been that way since before I started back in 07 ish.

Last but not least, this is just my opinion but how can you definitively know it's the GH and not you without testing it? You can't just take someone's word for it when so many things can affect the end result. Especially HGH as people's results vary so much. As I said before, I took brand HGH and did not see an improvement in my IGF score but I 100% know it was real. I personally orderd it from the wholesaler to our pharmacy and ran 4+ different brands so no way 4 mnfctr's are cutting corners or made a bad product at the same time.
If you're going to put someone's info out there potentially hurting their business you should have 100% proof its fake and not your response. I realize that wasn't necessarily why you made this post but that's what has happened. We have no proof it was fake. Only your word which is really no different than him giving you his word it was good GH.

Who's info did I put out there? Did.I.give my word.that it.was.fake? I think your.confusing me with someone else?

 

[RandomMachine]

Who's info did I put out there? Did.I.give my word.that it.was.fake? I think your.confusing me with someone else?

I believe his first paragraph is directed at you. The second paragraph is directed to the original poster.