Updated labs... GH/IGF on TP Black and some estradiol and Liver function to correct

[Josefein421]

Some of you might remember my post about possible fake genotropin here:

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/index.php?threads/igf-78-on-5-4iu-genotropin-seems-i-got-scammed.179464/

Long story short I was getting no noticeable effects from it when up to 7.5iu/day. Nothing. No sides either. No water, no lethargy, no increase rest HR. Got labs done

GH serum 5.5
IGF 78

A lot thought it was fake. A lot of people thought the tren played a role in low lab values. Compared to previous on TP black 5iu/day same protocol testing:

GH serum 16.8
IGF 411

Numbers were one thing but the lack of any noticeable benefit on $1500/month of pharma GH is what got me. Coach got super defensive as he had pushed me to use the brand and source saying if not that do none bc generic was "garbage".

New labs last week. Off tren for 3.5 weeks. I have reversed my diet and admittedly eaten way too much dessert and still held very good condition. I feel full and know there is some water. I have mild CTS at times. HR is fine. Just tight hands, tingling occasionally during the night. Labs

GH serum 34.3 (< 7.1)
IGF 340 (52-328)

So my labs are far higher on the generic both last time and this time. Yes I was taking the tren @50 a day and I now know that could've played a role. But that big a role? And still the no disernable benefit or side effects? My fingernails are growing at the rapid rate now. Same as before. Nothing on "geno". Anecdotal but just noting.

Other labs... 500 test a week, 5iu TP a day. 3.5 weeks off tren ace, oral winstrol and t3:

Test total 2646 (250-1100)
Test free 944 (35-155)
Estradiol 119 (< 29)
T4 4.6 (4.9-10.5)
T3 39 (22-35)
TSH 1.23 (0.4-4.5)
AST 100 (10-40)
ALT 231 (9-46)
Glucose 105 (70-99)

Just realized my fasting glucose on the geno was in the 70s and now was 105 on the same GDA. What does that mean.... I don't know. Just saying...

Deadlifted hard and heavy w back training the night before labs. Maybe 11hrs prior. Could be the liver values. Never had elevated liver values aside from a time I got labs done for non bodybuilding related right after a trip to New Orleans. Perhaps the training, tren/winstrol I'm recovering from... I'll get another set in a month to see.

Go back to old PCP that I trust next week (no more shit VA) to ask about blood pressure, sleep study and thyroid. He wanted me to do synthroid M/W/F before. Maybe I will do it. Maybe metformin instead of GDA.

And I think I'll start aromasin 12.5 EOD and see what that does. Estradiol is a little high but I don't feel anything so I don't want it crash it either.

More labs in a month. Thoughts welcome. Not throwing any stones. That situation is over. Regardless, TP is legit and I'll sticking w him from now on.

 

[Hyperemia]

Just realized my fasting glucose on the geno was in the 70s and now was 105 on the same GDA. What does that mean.... I don't know. Just saying...

It means your instincts were right, just like the new tests show. Sucks but at least you know it wasn’t in your head and you’ve got a quality source now

 

[slesh]

Great post with facts/evidence to back it up. Love shit like this.

 

[Pull Freak]

Hard to not go with TP!!! Proven time and time again!

 

[cage99]

Other labs... 500 test a week, 5iu TP a day. 3.5 weeks off tren ace, oral winstrol and t3:

Test total 2646 (250-1100)
Test free 944 (35-155)
Estradiol 119 (< 29)
T4 4.6 (4.9-10.5)
T3 39 (22-35)
TSH 1.23 (0.4-4.5)
AST 100 (10-40)
ALT 231 (9-46)
Glucose 105 (70-99)

Glad you got your proof, but damn your enzymes are really elevated…. Are your AST/ALT values typically elevated like this?

I was running 150mg Drol for probably 5 weeks and here’s my values for reference.
ALT - 64
AST - 49

Cage

 

[bbxtreme]

Some of you might remember my post about possible fake genotropin here:

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/index.php?threads/igf-78-on-5-4iu-genotropin-seems-i-got-scammed.179464/

Long story short I was getting no noticeable effects from it when up to 7.5iu/day. Nothing. No sides either. No water, no lethargy, no increase rest HR. Got labs done

GH serum 5.5
IGF 78

A lot thought it was fake. A lot of people thought the tren played a role in low lab values. Compared to previous on TP black 5iu/day same protocol testing:

GH serum 16.8
IGF 411

Numbers were one thing but the lack of any noticeable benefit on $1500/month of pharma GH is what got me. Coach got super defensive as he had pushed me to use the brand and source saying if not that do none bc generic was "garbage".

New labs last week. Off tren for 3.5 weeks. I have reversed my diet and admittedly eaten way too much dessert and still held very good condition. I feel full and know there is some water. I have mild CTS at times. HR is fine. Just tight hands, tingling occasionally during the night. Labs

GH serum 34.3 (< 7.1)
IGF 340 (52-328)

So my labs are far higher on the generic both last time and this time. Yes I was taking the tren @50 a day and I now know that could've played a role. But that big a role? And still the no disernable benefit or side effects? My fingernails are growing at the rapid rate now. Same as before. Nothing on "geno". Anecdotal but just noting.

Other labs... 500 test a week, 5iu TP a day. 3.5 weeks off tren ace, oral winstrol and t3:

Test total 2646 (250-1100)
Test free 944 (35-155)
Estradiol 119 (< 29)
T4 4.6 (4.9-10.5)
T3 39 (22-35)
TSH 1.23 (0.4-4.5)
AST 100 (10-40)
ALT 231 (9-46)
Glucose 105 (70-99)

Just realized my fasting glucose on the geno was in the 70s and now was 105 on the same GDA. What does that mean.... I don't know. Just saying...

Deadlifted hard and heavy w back training the night before labs. Maybe 11hrs prior. Could be the liver values. Never had elevated liver values aside from a time I got labs done for non bodybuilding related right after a trip to New Orleans. Perhaps the training, tren/winstrol I'm recovering from... I'll get another set in a month to see.

Go back to old PCP that I trust next week (no more shit VA) to ask about blood pressure, sleep study and thyroid. He wanted me to do synthroid M/W/F before. Maybe I will do it. Maybe metformin instead of GDA.

And I think I'll start aromasin 12.5 EOD and see what that does. Estradiol is a little high but I don't feel anything so I don't want it crash it either.

More labs in a month. Thoughts welcome. Not throwing any stones. That situation is over. Regardless, TP is legit and I'll sticking w him from now on.

The numbers never lie. Glad you saw this through!

I would give the tren and winny a break and grab you a bottle of Life Support from AA to get your liver back in good health.

Being on HGH I would swap the T3 for T4 to get your thyroid back into range.

 

[Josefein421]

Glad you got your proof, but damn your enzymes are really elevated…. Are your AST/ALT values typically elevated like this?

I was running 150mg Drol for probably 5 weeks and here’s my values for reference.
ALT - 64
AST - 49

Cage

They are not. Usually normal range. The time I got labs after a weekend in New Orleans they were higher.

Im not overly concerned as I think it is a tren, winstrol, training combo. I will give it a month, take 3 days off and get them redrawn. I should've done that this time.

Liver is resilient so I'm not worried about them up now and I've seen pt's much much higher but obviously want to make sure they don't stay up or get worse. Unfortunately I didn't get them during or after any of the few times I took an oral to compare.

 

[Josefein421]

The numbers never lie. Glad you saw this through!

I would give the tren and winny a break and grab you a bottle of Life Support from AA to get your liver back in good health.

Being on HGH I would swap the T3 for T4 to get your thyroid back into range.

I have the liver support from Justin Harris's 1st Detachment I'm finishing and grabbed the liver support from Revive bc I needed more greens powder.

Tren and orals are done. So is T3. I never heard of supplementing T4 w gh until I saw you mention it a little bit ago. I have to research it. Perhaps that is a better option than Synthroid.

 

[bbxtreme]

I have the liver support from Justin Harris's 1st Detachment I'm finishing and grabbed the liver support from Revive bc I needed more greens powder.

Tren and orals are done. So is T3. I never heard of supplementing T4 w gh until I saw you mention it a little bit ago. I have to research it. Perhaps that is a better option than Synthroid.

I figured you were on top of the liver. I just like the glutathione when running orals. Will help keep your liver enzymes in range while on cycle as that’s still the goal ideally.

There’s some great threads on here around HGH and T4. Higher amounts of HGH over longer periods of time can suppress T4 levels so running 25-50mcg (go off bloodwork) will usually keep things in balance. It’s a lot easier and forgiving IMO than trying to mess with T3.

 

[danieltx]

Glad you got your proof, but damn your enzymes are really elevated…. Are your AST/ALT values typically elevated like this?

I was running 150mg Drol for probably 5 weeks and here’s my values for reference.
ALT - 64
AST - 49

Cage

The numbers never lie. Glad you saw this through!

I would give the tren and winny a break and grab you a bottle of Life Support from AA to get your liver back in good health.

Being on HGH I would swap the T3 for T4 to get your thyroid back into range.

Did y'all miss that he trained back 11 hours before his labs and did heavy deadlifts? His liver values would likely be in range if he'd taken a few days off training.

 

[hevi-head]

What’s your testing protocols for the gh?
The standard 10iu then bloods 3 hours later?

 

[Fleezy]

l

Did y'all miss that he trained back 11 hours before his labs and did heavy deadlifts? His liver values would likely be in range if he'd taken a few days off training.

His PCP shit a brick and told him to go to the ER probably

 

[bbxtreme]

Did y'all miss that he trained back 11 hours before his labs and did heavy deadlifts? His liver values would likely be in range if he'd taken a few days off training.

I did, but I’ve beat the hell out of my legs hours before getting blood drawn and haven’t seen it that high. But I’m super OCD with my blood work and supps these days.

Either way, deadlifts, winny and tren… I’ve seen much higher. I’ll never forget what Milos told me once (my numbers were much higher) “these are normal bodybuilding ranges.”

Not saying I agree with that. But many guys walk around year round with high enzyme levels.

 

[fredmac82]

Hard to not go with TP!!! Proven time and time again!

In TP we trust!

 

[livinlean]

I don't know if I'm missing something here but what does this prove? If you switched from your "pharma" to TP and saw that increase that would have been great but you also changed the tren variable.

 

[slesh]

I don't know if I'm missing something here but what does this prove? If you switched from your "pharma" to TP and saw that increase that would have been great but you also changed the tren variable.

Read it again. There were 3 tests. Tren variable was the third. The first two are consistent other than the brand of GH.

 

[livinlean]

Read it again. There were 3 tests. Tren variable was the third. The first two are consistent other than the brand of GH.

My bad, the wording "Compared to previous on TP black 5iu/day same protocol testing:" had my thinking OP was posting past results with TP.

 

[RandomMachine]

Read it again. There were 3 tests. Tren variable was the third. The first two are consistent other than the brand of GH.

Unless I'm reading it wrong.

Test A is suspected pharma
While dieting and on tren

Test B is previous TP numbers to at some date prior to test A (what led him to suspect the pharma quality because he had better numbers previously on generic) Check his previous post to see those numbers matched here.

Test C is new TP numbers
Whole no longer dieting or using tren

All testing protocols were the same im assuming to mean timing and methodology.

Hopefully he will clarify.

Tren and dieting are known to lower IGF. Which makes it hard to use this as true proof. As I suggested previously, he really needs to send the pharma to Janoshik. It's the only true way to know. IGF is a fickle measurement.

The GH serum test is the one I would lean more towards proving the pharma is suspect. Only if the testing protocols were truly the same.

 

[slesh]

Unless I'm reading it wrong.

Test A is suspected pharma
While dieting and on tren

Test B is previous TP numbers to at some date prior to test A (what led him to suspect the pharma quality because he had better numbers previously on generic) Check his previous post to see those numbers matched here.

Test C s new TP numbers
Whole no longer dieting or using tren

All testing protocols were the same im assuming to mean timing and methodology.

Hopefully he will clarify.

Tren and dieting are known to lower IGF. Which makes it hard to use this as true proof. As I suggested previously, he really needs to send the pharma to Janoshik. It's the only true way to know. IGF is a fickle measurement.

The GH serum test is the one I would lean more towards proving the pharma is suspect. Only if the testing protocols were truly the same.

Yeah makes sense. I know it says “previously” but I figured just meant same overall protocol but before switching to pharma. @Josefein421 please chime in to confirm consistency.

 

[Josefein421]

I apologize for the confusion. .

First test was the alleged genotropin at 5iu while taking 600mg of test and 350mg tren ace.

Second test was 5iu TP w 250mg of test.

Third test was 500mg test and 5iu TP black.

The reason for even getting the test on the geno was because I wasn't seeing any side effects or benefits even when I was up to 7.5 a day. Yes it has been stated repeatedly the tren could've played a role in the IGF number is that the sole reason for the big disparity? I don't know. Does it mean the GH was fake because I didn't see any discernible effect and had literally zero side effects? I don't know. Originally I had planned to take the third test while still on the tren but that's just not how it worked out.

I said in the original post I'm not drawing any conclusion or making any accusations. I don't want to get into that. I'm just giving data and people can infer what they want about whatever you want. If the numbers were what they were on the labs with the geno and I saw some kind of results I wouldn't pay the numbers much mind. I went from 3 to 5 to 7.5 and noticed nothing at any dose.

Testing protocol was exactly the same for all three tests. Same method at same lab.

I'm not wasting money sending a pen to Jano. I don't care. I wasted enough money on it and on that coach. Have a bitter taste from my interactions with him towards the end. No hard feelings no accusations about anything. Just posting the data I got is all