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interesting jerry ward video

5millionbucks

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So I know I made a thread a lil while ago about if it was possible to keep anabolic steroid gains. So recently I just watched a vid of bios3 talk about everytime he came off he reverted back to his original size pre steroids, even if he pct, take hgh, pgf, peptides etc. nothing helped him. I hear some people can keep their gains even after a year off(like 50-70%) and then some people like him lose everything no matter what they do. Heres the vid I'll post it below; shows him coming off and monthly changes then coming back on the juice. Pretty interesting; was wondering if some of yall experience the same changes as he would going natty again.

 
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jeroendebleser

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Can't disagree with him on anything he said. People lie (about dosages) and they lie a lot.
 

Fa Seeshus

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Not that I disagree with him, but Jerry's body is pretty banged up from wrestling and injuries, so when he trains completely off it might be harder for him to maintain the muscle than it is for other people, hence the drastic loss of gains.
 

Phidias

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That good ol' Lucian... haven't seen him post on PM in ages, more or less since he became one of those internet fitness celebrities... :p

I like him and always did, too bad he doesn't seem to ever give credit to Promuscle for ALL he learnt here through the years, mainly before 2010 when he used to be a resident posting daily... :cool:

On this precise topic, as jeroendebleser said above, hard to disagree with him... what was built with AAS disappears when you take them away from the equation for good... only TRT, can save your muscles if you come off... let's not fool anyone about it. :eek:

Another good reason to tell newbs to build as much lean mass as genetically possible while they're still natural... THAT size will be kept forever (as long as you eat and train right, of course) even though you eventually decide to jump on gear one day and end up quitting after some time, may it be weeks or years. ;)
 

Voxide

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Lol, have you ever seen one of his "full day of eating" vids? Maybe 2 real food meals and the rest powders and bars. Have you ever seen him train? Touch and go bench pressing.

It's no surprise at all that he reverts to his original size after coming off.

He's a had a long standing battle with addiction in the past and I can't commend him enough for coming out of that alive because it is not easy, but some of the things I've heard on his channel are downright caricatures of everything that's wrong with this community.
 
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5millionbucks

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That good ol' Lucian... haven't seen him post on PM in ages, more or less since he became one of those internet fitness celebrities... :p

I like him and always did, too bad he doesn't seem to ever give credit to Promuscle for ALL he learnt here through the years, mainly before 2010 when he used to be a resident posting daily... :cool:

On this precise topic, as jeroendebleser said above, hard to disagree with him... what was built with AAS disappears when you take them away from the equation for good... only TRT, can save your muscles if you come off... let's not fool anyone about it. :eek:

Another good reason to tell newbs to build as much lean mass as genetically possible while they're still natural... THAT size will be kept forever (as long as you eat and train right, of course) even though you eventually decide to jump on gear one day and end up quitting after some time, may it be weeks or years. ;)


I mean he always did say that Phil Heron helped him out and coached him. Also pretty sure he mentioned promuscle and getbig in his past vids, thats how I know he used to be an active member on here.
 

5millionbucks

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Crazy thing is I made a thread about keeping gains off anabolics on here a few months ago. It was mixed but here it is, some people said yes and some people said no; could be genetics involved too. I mean with all the years abusing steroids and training; how could you not keep some gains, and I'm basing it off all the years training(not the years of gear) I mean some muscle had to be simulated or built from training(obviously 75% gear).

heres the thread-http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...um/146944-keeping-gains-off-juice-no-trt.html

The vid I posted was a guy who was on **EDIT** channel; and basically he maintained 70% of what he gained of juicing on and off after staying natty for a year. So I mean I don't know; plus my older bro has ran a few cycles and prohormones in the past; and to be honest if he actually starts working out again and eating right he goes back to a bigger and leaner build than he was before hoping on the sauce; problem with him is when he got off cycles he barely pct'd right, stopped training heavy and didnt eat enough; if he did that who knows how much he would of kept.
 
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Voxide

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Crazy thing is I made a thread about keeping gains off anabolics on here a few months ago. It was mixed but here it is, some people said yes and some people said no; could be genetics involved too. I mean with all the years abusing steroids and training; how could you not keep some gains, and I'm basing it off all the years training(not the years of gear) I mean some muscle had to be simulated or built from training(obviously 75% gear).

heres the thread-http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...um/146944-keeping-gains-off-juice-no-trt.html

The vid I posted was a guy who was on **EDIT** channel; and basically he maintained 70% of what he gained of juicing on and off after staying natty for a year. So I mean I don't know; plus my older bro has ran a few cycles and prohormones in the past; and to be honest if he actually starts working out again and eating right he goes back to a bigger and leaner build than he was before hoping on the sauce; problem with him is when he got off cycles he barely pct'd right, stopped training heavy and didnt eat enough; if he did that who knows how much he would of kept.
If you're one of those people that immediately jumps to 750mg Test with M1T for a first cycle, you're not gonna keep jack shit.

There's a reason why it's advisable to only take what you actually need to grow.
 
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5millionbucks

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If you're one of those people that immediately jumps to 750mg Test with M1T for a first cycle, you're not gonna keep jack shit.

There's a reason why it's advisable to only take what you actually need to grow.

Really not even 3 lbs of lean muscle.....? :(
 

jeroendebleser

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That good ol' Lucian... haven't seen him post on PM in ages, more or less since he became one of those internet fitness celebrities... :p

I like him and always did, too bad he doesn't seem to ever give credit to Promuscle for ALL he learnt here through the years, mainly before 2010 when he used to be a resident posting daily... :cool:

On this precise topic, as jeroendebleser said above, hard to disagree with him... what was built with AAS disappears when you take them away from the equation for good... only TRT, can save your muscles if you come off... let's not fool anyone about it. :eek:

Another good reason to tell newbs to build as much lean mass as genetically possible while they're still natural... THAT size will be kept forever (as long as you eat and train right, of course) even though you eventually decide to jump on gear one day and end up quitting after some time, may it be weeks or years. ;)

Hey I didn't know this guy is actually Lucian. I still remember him from my first stint on here.
 

MyNameIsJeff

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If you're one of those people that immediately jumps to 750mg Test with M1T for a first cycle, you're not gonna keep jack shit.

There's a reason why it's advisable to only take what you actually need to grow.
AT least those 3lb of gyno tissue will stay with you forever :eek:
 

Fa Seeshus

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thethinker48

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Jerry has stated in the past that he was 190-200 lbs in proper stage condition using everything (gear, GH, insulin, IGF). There is a genetic component there. Just like there's a genetic component in him benching 500 lbs at a young age.

Phidias made an excellent point, come off completely with a damaged HPTA and you'll see yourself whither eventually. The hormonal environment has to be there to sustain the muscle. Look at Matt Porter, when he came off everything, it didn't even look like the same person.

Soon as he added TRT and 2ius GH, he regrew back.

And TRT is still an advantage over endogenous levels; throw some low dose GH in there, and you'll look damn good if you've spent time in the trenches building that muscle (using gear as support for training and diet, not training and diet as support for gear).

I do think some guys are such tremendous responders to hormones, than they never really learn how to train or eat properly; and when they pull the plug, they shrink.
 

KillerStack

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Jerry has stated in the past that he was 190-200 lbs in proper stage condition using everything (gear, GH, insulin, IGF). There is a genetic component there. Just like there's a genetic component in him benching 500 lbs at a young age.

TBH he was never in proper stage condition. It is possible for most all to become shredded but Jerry seems a bit delusional about his conditioning and probably just can't see he's been at least 30lbs away from that, at best. Genetics are a bitch, not everyone has the ability to weigh a certain wished-for amount when conditioned, no matter how aggressive you are with drugs. However I wish guys like him would at least shred that shit up properly even if it means ending up at 150lbs or whatever - extreme conditioning can be highly impressive in itself. One pet peeve I have is guys apparently not having one single high quality pic of their peak physiques, like Jerry. What's up with that? Multiple shows over many years and zero high quality pics?
 

Crom

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I think studies have shown that people using AAS have more cell nuclei then a natural person (correct me if I am wrong). This will give them larger muscles even when off as long as they train. Of course, as an older guy I think TRT is essential. So you would be able to be slightly bigger and stronger going off then compared to yourself never having used AAS...again as long as you keep training and doing everything you did but without the AAS.

Regarding Jerry I haven't seen what he has done earlier in his lifting career but the few videos he has done recently showing him squatting and benching clearly shows the man has no clue how to train. Injuries and lack of mass on him despite using what he uses tells us that.
 
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pickapeck

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I think Jerry's HPTA crashed and never came back. That isn't always the case. I used AAS on and off for 3 years and then took 1.5 years off. By the end of the off period I rebounded and was back to normal response. Those first 6 monthsoff suck. Most of us will be catabolic from a shocked endocrine system. Then, sometime after that which veries from person to person, the endocrine comes back on line and the body normalizes. If yur HPTA is shot that won't happen. If it does bounce back then things are better. Essentially you will regain some of those gains as a "natural". After cycling for a few more years I wen off for newly 10 years and again it took a good 1.5 years to snap back. After that, being natural I put more size on my legs with no drugs.

I was a martial arts guy at 27 when I started AAS. I was 180 or maybe a little less. So basically built like a fairly lean MMA fighter. I cycled up to about 210. Then when I went off I got very soft. Once the endocrine came back on line I got lean again and and stabilised at 195-200. So, overall Iput on about 15 lbs of lean body weight from AAS that I kept. I always took an off cycle and after 45 I always tested and saw my hormones come back on line. once they were back on line I always leaned out and bounced back to that lean 195-200 lbs.

Now I am late 50s and take 100 mg test a week and basically stay at 195-205. So, even in old age I am holding that ~200 lbs of decent shape with normal levels of T.

I think Jerry had a more susceptible HPTA and that is a big difference. I have seen a lot of guys fry their HPTA and are never the same without some hormone supplementation. He now sits at 900 ng/dL which is high normal and basically holds 195-200 lean. So if his HPTA worked he would be similar. Therefore, he maintains 25 lbs of mass that he put on using AAS with normal levels of T. Jerry's problem is that he is stubborn and fails to recognize that if his endocrine snapped back, like some guys do, then he would be holding onto 25 lbs of gains put on whilst using steroids.
 

5millionbucks

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yeah I mean in a previous video he said he tried the hcg on cycle then triptorelin after, and all the other pct shit he did in the past and he said he always reverted back to his original size naturally. Its possible that taking anabolics at a very young age before 20 could be the culprit of it?
 

Voxide

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yeah I mean in a previous video he said he tried the hcg on cycle then triptorelin after, and all the other pct shit he did in the past and he said he always reverted back to his original size naturally. Its possible that taking anabolics at a very young age before 20 could be the culprit of it?

Yeah probably. There's a possibility your shit will never be the same as it could have been if you mess with that shit too early. It boils down to him, like many others, just riding off their genetics and drugs instead of actually fucking working and paying their dues before they make the jump to being chemically enhanced. When he tried doing the physique competitor thing he literally looked as though he started shooting dope again lmao. Breakfast was legit like 1 packet of quick oats and a pop-tart. I was like BRUH what is you doin'.
 
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jeroendebleser

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Let's not be too harsh on what was once a liked member here Voxide.

To what exactly was he addicted? If it was coke or amphetamine, I can see why he probably would need AAS to keep his muscle mass. Although if you manage to eat enough on them, it shouldn't make a difference. I'm on amphetamine 24-7 and as long as I eat as I would otherwise, there's no problem with gaining or maintaining.
 

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