LANTUS experiences

[josemp]

Hi im a noob but I took 1 year of gh after an elbow surgery.

I too have read statements along this line of thought from certain papers and discussion boards: "In conclusion, replacement therapy with a low-dose GH in GH-deficient adult subjects is associated with a sustained deterioration of glucose metabolism" from here for example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12679422

My interpretation is that when you supplement with extra (exogenous) GH it fucks up your muscles glucose uptake (because of fat oxidation, which we all know happens) thus I decided to use lantus because I was trying to help my body regulate his glucose uptake (I was afraid unmetabolized glucose would potentially cause a number of health issues with long use) and also because some of it helps with producing more igf l3 (which I read somewhere it makes your dick grow ahahaha I was going to order online dht cream but was too expensive).

So in my noob experience I would only take lantus when I do GH because I think its healthier, any other insulin should work this way to an extent with some tweaks here and there

Cheers!

 

[Mike Arnold]

Hi im a noob but I took 1 year of gh after an elbow surgery.

I too have read statements along this line of thought from certain papers and discussion boards: "In conclusion, replacement therapy with a low-dose GH in GH-deficient adult subjects is associated with a sustained deterioration of glucose metabolism" from here for example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12679422

My interpretation is that when you supplement with extra (exogenous) GH it fucks up your muscles glucose uptake (because of fat oxidation, which we all know happens) thus I decided to use lantus because I was trying to help my body regulate his glucose uptake (I was afraid unmetabolized glucose would potentially cause a number of health issues with long use) and also because some of it helps with producing more igf l3 (which I read somewhere it makes your dick grow ahahaha I was going to order online dht cream but was too expensive).

So in my noob experience I would only take lantus when I do GH because I think its healthier, any other insulin should work this way to an extent with some tweaks here and there

Cheers!

If your issue is GH induced elevated BG levels, you should fix the underlying problem (i.e. insulin resistance). You do this by using insulin senstizers, etc. By addressing BG levels directly (exo. insulin), rather than addressing the underlying problem, you are only fixing the surface issue, while making the underlying problem worse.

 

[Elvia1023]

i feel like you’re missing the point. No one has said “____ iu for _____ weeks will make you insulin resistance.” Not one person said that. Basically everyone here has said log and R can be run indefinitely. Maybe you aren’t reading the replies here. WE are saying that Lantus acts differently and can’t be lumped into that group. Why do you do a trial run for us and tell us how it goes? Then you’ll have answer.

Obviously the same could be said for everything we take but there are a few things many of us have taken that you literally have to take them to know. I think Lantus is one of those drugs you simply have to try it to truly know. It's completely different to rapid or fast (regular) acting slin. Now fast slin is another thing you simply need to take as well and when you try both people will relate to your posts in this thread. Even if you understand all the science it doesn't matter and a 4 week run will tell you so much more.

I could go into this much deeper but in simple terms the potential for unwanted fat gain on lantus is very high. Most people I know who have used it had to either stop it, back of and/or adjust their diet. Now if someone can bang in a high dose of hgh that will help matters but for the rest I would say less is more and you need to be 100% with your diet. I stay lean most of the year even on a decent amount of calories and I am what many would call very ectomorphic. I can also high dose fast slin around training and just get fuller and tigther. However when slin is active all day I notice a big difference. There is too much to this subject and 1 post can't cover it and of course everyone is different.

Luki I do think you are a great candidate for trying lantus to grow. You are tall, have a fast metabolism and right now are super lean. You are also on a decent dose of hgh and can run that with no issues. All in all I say go for it and try lantus to see if it helps get you to the size you desire. Some love the stuff and blow up from it whilst others don't like it at all (very mixed reviews). I personally much prefer fast acting slin timed around acitivity/training. There are a few ways you could go about this but I would recommend using lantus 2-4 times (start at 2 and adjust if needed) per week. I would start at 40-50iu and just move up 10iu per day and well it's up to you. I know you push things and want the best possible results so see how you are. You mentioned 100iu in one post and I think that would work. Just move up and see how you respond and go from there. I would also carry on with your 10iu humalog pre and post on top of it.

 

[KillerStack]

You mentioned 100iu in one post and I think that would work. Just move up and see how you respond and go from there. I would also carry on with your 10iu humalog pre and post on top of it.

It's interesting that Palumbo said it would have been impossible for Dallas to have used 100iu of Lantus in the morning and 20iu of Humalog with each meal. According to Palumbo no one could eat enough carbs to live through it. Shows how little some of these guys know.
I think Mike Arnold talked about Lantus at 120iu and up to get much out of it. You have guys on this forum doing things Palumbo considers impossible.

 

[Elvia1023]

It's interesting that Palumbo said it would have been impossible for Dallas to have used 100iu of Lantus in the morning and 20iu of Humalog with each meal. According to Palumbo no one could eat enough carbs to live through it. Shows how little some of these guys know.
I think Mike Arnold talked about Lantus at 120iu and up to get much out of it. You have guys on this forum doing things Palumbo considers impossible.

I have only used small amount of lantus but you are completely correct. As people know 50iu lantus is nothing like 50iu of faster acting brands. It's active most of the day so most big guys need to push the dose to have a big effect. I have only ever used a max of 50iu (usually 30-40iu) which I consider a low dose of lantus. I am very slin sensitive and can even skip meals (experimented) on that dose and be totally fine. There are people running 200iu per day and as long as they are a machine with their nutrition they shouldn't have any major issues. The same but to a much bigger degree could be said for 100iu lantus per day. Literally 6 decent meals per day with a lot of carbs and no one should be having any issues.

I have heard of guys doing 50iu humalog in one shot which to me is stupid/pointless. I think someone on here even experimented with 100iu humalog in one shot. Obviously that is completely stupid but the extremes highlight the need for carbs doesn't move up equally with the insulin dose. Meaning if you need 100g carbs with 10iu humalog you won't need 500g carbs with 50iu. Again those extreme numbers for humalog are pointless and totally unneeded and a complete waste. I am very slin sensitive and even I have tried 20iu (maybe 25iu) in one shot before. I experimented with 15-20iu humalog pre and post workout for a short time as well. Milos Sarcev has guys using high amounts pre and post twice daily. It's weird Palumbo would state that as he must know Milos has guys on approx 100iu humalog daily so the 20iu with each meal should be very believable. Now sure he spoke in regards to the added lantus as well but still people could easily do it if they wanted. Now should they do that... fuck no. If your insulin sensitivity is that fucked up to warrant those sort of doses you need to get off it asap. It's crazy to me that there are guys who can take 10iu humalog and barely eat when I would go hypo from a tiny dose.

The same could be said for many coaches and some of the things I hear are ridiculous. They act like things are impossible or x is crap when there are 100's of guys on this very forum experiencing different. I just watched all of Chad's interview with Nick Trigilli. How he doesn't know one person who has ever got good results from dnp. How it is poison etc etc. How every person he knows who tried it said it done nothing and they lost no fat. I am not promoting dnp usage but it's the strongest fat burner by a mile. I often say to people just diet and they don't need it but to act like it does nothing is bizarre to me. He must only know a few guys who have used it. I have guys reordering it all the time and reselling it and it's because it works. It may not be the best thing for you but even when I tried it at 1 cap per day the results were ridiculous. I tried 2 caps and had a severe allergic reaction so would never do that again but I could see/feel the difference daily. That's just one example of so many and I often think how the fuck can they think certain things when they are top coaches. Although Dave is a weird one because unlike many of the other big names he is actually extremely intelligent and knows his stuff. I know you follow his stuff so would probably agree he has the knowledge but on some opics his views are very outdated.

 

[KillerStack]

I have only used small amount of lantus but you are completely correct. As people know 50iu lantus is nothing like 50iu of faster acting brands. It's active most of the day so most big guys need to push the dose to have a big effect. I have only ever used a max of 50iu (usually 30-40iu) which I consider a low dose of lantus. I am very slin sensitive and can even skip meals (experimented) on that dose and be totally fine. There are people running 200iu per day and as long as they are a machine with their nutrition they shouldn't have any major issues. The same but to a much bigger degree could be said for 100iu lantus per day. Literally 6 decent meals per day with a lot of carbs and no one should be having any issues.

I have heard of guys doing 50iu humalog in one shot which to me is stupid/pointless. I think someone on here even experimented with 100iu humalog in one shot. Obviously that is completely stupid but the extremes highlight the need for carbs doesn't move up equally with the insulin dose. Meaning if you need 100g carbs with 10iu humalog you won't need 500g carbs with 50iu. Again those extreme numbers for humalog are pointless and totally unneeded and a complete waste. I am very slin sensitive and even I have tried 20iu (maybe 25iu) in one shot before. I experimented with 15-20iu humalog pre and post workout for a short time as well. Milos Sarcev has guys using high amounts pre and post twice daily. It's weird Palumbo would state that as he must know Milos has guys on approx 100iu humalog daily so the 20iu with each meal should be very believable. Now sure he spoke in regards to the added lantus as well but still people could easily do it if they wanted. Now should they do that... fuck no. If your insulin sensitivity is that fucked up to warrant those sort of doses you need to get off it asap. It's crazy to me that there are guys who can take 10iu humalog and barely eat when I would go hypo from a tiny dose.

The same could be said for many coaches and some of the things I hear are ridiculous. They act like things are impossible or x is crap when there are 100's of guys on this very forum experiencing different. I just watched all of Chad's interview with Nick Trigilli. How he doesn't know one person who has ever got good results from dnp. How it is poison etc etc. How every person he knows who tried it said it done nothing and they lost no fat. I am not promoting dnp usage but it's the strongest fat burner by a mile. I often say to people just diet and they don't need it but to act like it does nothing is bizarre to me. He must only know a few guys who have used it. I have guys reordering it all the time and reselling it and it's because it works. It may not be the best thing for you but even when I tried it at 1 cap per day the results were ridiculous. I tried 2 caps and had a severe allergic reaction so would never do that again but I could see/feel the difference daily. That's just one example of so many and I often think how the fuck can they think certain things when they are top coaches. Although Dave is a weird one because unlike many of the other big names he is actually extremely intelligent and knows his stuff. I know you follow his stuff so would probably agree he has the knowledge but on some opics his views are very outdated.

Watching those videos with Trigili and Chad had me tearing my hair off lol. Like you said, the comments on DNP were ridiculous. If he said it makes you feel like shit and might damage your eyes or make you get an allergic rash that would be one thing, but to say you don't lose fat with it is ridiculous. And the comments on some guy having DNP powder in tin foil - as if that has anything to do with anything lol wtf. Nick was like how do you know how much to take? Ever heard of this thing called a scale? I'm sorry but I can only conclude that these guys are idiots. Chad talks like a moron, fuck this, fuck that, literally x 1000 He appears to have helped some guys careers but it's obviously not due to a vast knowledge base. One thing with Chad is that he looks like a mean and dominant guy and you can tell people have "respect" for him and suck up to him.
He talked of how Dallas would be completely upfront with him about everything, how he told him he smokes weed all day long. Then the next thing he says is that he suspected Dallas was doing a ton of EPO without telling him, after seeing that "cycle" email. He says that email was a "shopping list" for 2 people, Dallas and some other guy- yeah a shopping list lists weekly and daily dosages, makes no sense whatsoever. He said he regretted talking about drugs in the GI interview, but he did manage to say many contradictory things there. You know he isn't saying what he knows is true but what people should hear in his opinion.
There were so many things in those videos that were ridiculous. Didn't watch the last part yet.

Palumbo is intelligent but at the same time he doesn't seem to care to learn and study things before talking about them. As you say, very outdated stuff. Not even outdated but he never cared to learn.

 

[Elvia1023]

Watching those videos with Trigili and Chad had me tearing my hair off lol. Like you said, the comments on DNP were ridiculous. If he said it makes you feel like shit and might damage your eyes or make you get an allergic rash that would be one thing, but to say you don't lose fat with it is ridiculous. And the comments on some guy having DNP powder in tin foil - as if that has anything to do with anything lol wtf. Nick was like how do you know how much to take? Ever heard of this thing called a scale? I'm sorry but I can only conclude that these guys are idiots. Chad talks like a moron, fuck this, fuck that, literally x 1000 He appears to have helped some guys careers but it's obviously not due to a vast knowledge base. One thing with Chad is that he looks like a mean and dominant guy and you can tell people have "respect" for him and suck up to him.
He talked of how Dallas would be completely upfront with him about everything, how he told him he smokes weed all day long. Then the next thing he says is that he suspected Dallas was doing a ton of EPO without telling him, after seeing that "cycle" email. He says that email was a "shopping list" for 2 people, Dallas and some other guy- yeah a shopping list lists weekly and daily dosages, makes no sense whatsoever. He said he regretted talking about drugs in the GI interview, but he did manage to say many contradictory things there. You know he isn't saying what he knows is true but what people should hear in his opinion.
There were so many things in those videos that were ridiculous. Didn't watch the last part yet.

Palumbo is intelligent but at the same time he doesn't seem to care to learn and study things before talking about them. As you say, very outdated stuff. Not even outdated but he never cared to learn.

Exactly. I know Nick bullshits but I only watched that interview because he hyped it up so much. He said it's probably the greatest bodybuilding interview of all time. I knew it wouldn't be but I figured Chad doesn't publicly talk much and they may go into various details of what he had guys doing so I was curious. But it was all just complete nonsense and as you state the two of them constantly contradicting themselves. The way Chad made it out Dallas must have been on an extremely high EPO dose for well over a year straight. I think Nick stated he used a 1/10th of the dose for 5 weeks but I am not going to bother confirming that by watching the video again. The other Chad interview was even worse as you know. That "shopping list" makes no sense either but he said it's definitely that and it's been confirmed by someone who would know. It was a run down of compounds and doses and all one list so who knows. Yes with Dave it seems he learnt all his stuff 2 decades ago and he hasn't bothered to update his knowledge since then.

 

[Midwest7]

Lantus should be the base and go to. Most forgiving, and that's coming from someone who depends on ins.

 

[Elvia1023]

Lantus should be the base and go to. Most forgiving, and that's coming from someone who depends on ins.

It's different when you are diabetic though. You physically need insulin. As you state it's definitely the most forgiving insulin when it comes to hypoglycemia. So sure if a non diabetic bodybuilder wanted to use insulin it makes perfect sense to use lantus as it's very easily controlled and shouldn't give any issues. It can also be a great tool for putting on size for many people as well. Although I do think many have to be careful with it in regards to fat accruel when eating in a surplus. Everyone is different and there are 101 factors including ones diet (macros and overall calories), other drugs used (hgh, l-carnitine, clen etc) and goals etc). I know many who love lantus especially when trying to gain size but for many I do think shorter acting slins are generally better for them.

 

[Midwest7]

It's different when you are diabetic though. You physically need insulin. As you state it's definitely the most forgiving insulin when it comes to hypoglycemia. So sure if a non diabetic bodybuilder wanted to use insulin it makes perfect sense to use lantus as it's very easily controlled and shouldn't give any issues. It can also be a great tool for putting on size for many people as well. Although I do think many have to be careful with it in regards to fat accruel when eating in a surplus. Everyone is different and there are 101 factors including ones diet (macros and overall calories), other drugs used (hgh, l-carnitine, clen etc) and goals etc). I know many who love lantus especially when trying to gain size but for many I do think shorter acting slins are generally better for them.

Well said, for those who have no yet been hypo or aren't prepared with a meter or glucose/sugar near A fast acting could be dangerous. One must have the bases cover of they want to play this game.

 

[Midwest7]

Hi Mike, what would you suggest for insulin senstizers? Do you lean in the direction of a glucophage? @Mike Arnold

 

[BigNJ]

Hi Mike, what would you suggest for insulin senstizers? Do you lean in the direction of a glucophage? @Mike Arnold

He already mentioned few supplements in this thread.

 

[tren_plz]

I've got more lantus than most Walgreens. LMK

@BigNJ He's referring to metformin, not berberine etc.

Are you the same Midwestchest from IG?

 

[Panther51]

He already mentioned few supplements in this thread.

Hey buddy. I understand, I asked about a specific one. Thanks!

Big dog! I am not him but I hope all is well! The current situation is rough for is all but i send you my best @tren_plz

 

[jaxino]

Now I understand because I was having subpar results with 25iu Lantus (split in two) and 5iu Log prewo + 5iu Log postwo...

When on just 20iu R (10iu every 5h) I could see difference in just one week... (I used also a 3rd dose 10iu after another 5h but was a bit too watery tbh).....

Well I am happy at this point to know that my 30 Lantus pens are useless..... FUCK.

 

[BigNJ]

I've got more lantus than most Walgreens. LMK

@BigNJ He's referring to metformin, not berberine etc.

Are you the same Midwestchest from IG?

No.

 

[jaxino]

A lot of bodybuilders recommend doing stupid things, including many of the pros from the 90's and early 2000's (and even today) who ruined their physiques by the end of their careers. Unfortunately, many bodybuilders aren't really up to date on PED science.

If you really want to do an extended high dose Lantus cyle, doing it couple times isn't going to do much harm to your physique, but if you continue to take this approach over the long-term, you will eventually REGRET the day you made that decision. Just ask all the retired pros who ruined their physiques (and health) because of it. High dose, high frequency insulin use leading to insulin resistance is the single biggest physique related mistake an aspiing pro could make in the PED department.

This is no longer a secret, but somehat common knowledge these days. Ask anyone knowledgable (coaches, bodybuiding-focused doctors, etc.) in this sport and see what kind of answer you get...and by knowldgeable, I am NOT referring to those who may have been big names back in the day, but whose knowledge of the subject hasn't progressed since the 90's. For example, if you hear someone say that the way for a bodybuilder to fix GH induced elevated blood sugar levels is to use insulin, RUN away as fast as you can. Such idividuals know little about this complex subject and will lead you down a dangerous path. Those type of recomendations plyed a big role in damaging many great and potentially great physiques...not to mention the number of health problems it caused.

But then what's the perfect way to fix insulin resistance from HGH?
For example if you use 10iu ed?

The only things that come to my mind are:
-inject a bolus dose pre and/or post wo
-use insulin sensitizers like Metformin/Berberine
-(IGF1-LR3, but you can't stay on that forever)
-use Log/R pre and/or postwo

What else we can do?

 

[luki7788]

Training fucking hard, don’t eat shit food and do fasted cardio year round

 

[OuchThatHurts]

Training fucking hard, don’t eat shit food and do fasted cardio year round

This exactly. And this applies no matter what you're doing. Lantus/no lantus, Insulin/no insulin, PEDs/no PEDs.

Maybe metformin simply because it does so much more then just increase insulin sensitivity. Gives your beta cells a break to regenerate or at least be somewhat preserved from the onslaught of calories we throw at them and as a prevention against pre-diabetes and type-II. Of the high calorie, heavy duty BBers I know, I'd guesstimate that half are pre-diabetic.

 

[jaxino]

Training fucking hard, don’t eat shit food and do fasted cardio year round

That's what I am already doing.