Lets critique proper form

[Pericles]

Thank you phil , a little unclear tho? Should I put my feet closer together so my knees wont bow(dive) out so much.? How do keep my knees from diving out???? not to sure what to do.. I know I need help when looking at my knees now??

when he said knees diving out he means your knees should not go out in front of your toes. You are initiating the movement with your knees and you should be initiating it with your hips and sitting back, its done similar to a romanian dl(push your ass away from you). Its got nothing to with your stance. You aren't hitting parallel, the top of your thigh should be parallel with the floor not the bottom, you get more glute and hamstring that way.

 

[7_Deadly_Sins]

Great info John! Takes a while to grasp all this stuff doesnt it......

Ya it does..not nearly as long if you listen to someone stronger/bigger than you..Ie a trainer or a more advanced training partner..They didn't get there over night that's for sure.
Great thread Phil!

 

[hotnuts]

LMAO. I think alot of people forget the gym is all about moving weight, and working your ass off and not what you are wearing to look good or pick up chicks. There are many guys who wear Ed Hardy shirts and Tapout gear w matching shorts. The woman are 10 times worse, with tons of makeup, the very strong aroma of cheap perfume and last week a girl was lugging her Louie Vatton bag around. Really irritates me. I don't put any thought into what I am looking like. Sorry to get off subject!

 

[halflife]

How about with machines for non-pressing movements.

If something has a cable operated constant rat of tension wouldn't you want to get the weight all the way up or down depending on the movement?

Not a fan of cables but even if the actual CABLE has constant tension (which for the most part it does) does that mean the target muscle has constant tension? No.

Think about bicep curl with a pulley cable - when your radius/ulna is furthest away from the anterior of your humerus do you have as much tension on your bicep as you would when they are at a 120-90 degree angle? No, you might feel a stretch in your bicep though.

Think about cable rows and lets say you want constant tension on your erector spinae muscles. So you wana go full range of motion eh? - sternum to knees it is. Let me know how much more you feel your hip flexors than your erector spinae group. You might feel a stretch but not constant tension.

There's an ideal range where you can get a good degree of constant tension on all movements. Where you feel the target muscle group not activating as much - your outside of it.

 

[halflife]

I started following some advice (dc video maybe?) to really contract the triceps to the point of even turning your wrists over to make sure you get a contraction. It is just for a split second and then you go right back into the eccentric. This really makes the muscle get a tight, almost cramp-like contraction

If it was a squeeze type movement like your explaining I'll bet my next 500$ trueprotein order it wasn't an official DC video (dvd) or a video that Dante did. Might of said to change form but there isn't but squeezing going on - thats for those volume guys lifting little weights ha.

But really in all seriousness, we've had this debate on PM so many times - just lift the weight? or squeeze and feel it...

Some will disagree (but I'm 99% sure Phil and Dante agree - they've said it time and time again in their posts) but don't worry about all this squeeze crap. It's about our god given intuition about physics and physiology 101 - lifting weights (physics) with muscles and causing the muscle to adapt (physiology). In essence, choose a lift that is good for your structure and can progress on, find the optimal range of motion, load the weight on and lift. Then keep progressing on that lift. For most people on this forum don't need worry about all this squeeze, try pull your hands apart on the bar when benching to activate triceps, opposite for chest, use the pinky twist technique for a better contraction.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

If it was a squeeze type movement like your explaining I'll bet my next 500$ trueprotein order it wasn't an official DC video (dvd) or one that Dante did. Might of said to change form but there isn't but squeezing going on - thats for those volume guys lifting little weights ha.

But really in all seriousness, we've had this debate on PM so many times - just lift the weight? or squeeze and feel it...

Some will disagree (but I'm 99% sure Phil and Dante agree - they've said it time and time again in their posts) but don't worry about all this squeeze crap. It's about our god given intuition about physics and physiology 101 - lifting weights (physics) with muscles and causing the muscle to adapt (physiology). In essence, choose a lift that is good for your structure and can progress on, find the optimal range of motion, load the weight on and lift. Then keep progressing on that lift. For most people on this forum don't need worry about all this squeeze, try pull your hands apart on the bar when benching to activate triceps, opposite for chest, use the pinky twist technique for a better contraction.

If you can squeeze and feel something with the weight, somethin is amiss........the only thing you should feel is a pain in your gut like you want to throw up.......

 

[Michaelthomasj]

WTF is with you guys cutting up your shirts down past your waist? By far my biggest pet peeve in the gym these days. Funny thing is its almost always someone under 200lbs and most are allergic to the squat rack as well.

eeewwww testy!

 

[Azwrkoutcrw]

Chill out!!!

WTF is with you guys cutting up your shirts down past your waist? By far my biggest pet peeve in the gym these days. Funny thing is its almost always someone under 200lbs and most are allergic to the squat rack as well.

You shouldn't let it bother you! Everyones got there own thing. And from what I know/seen... B~rad seems like a pretty cool guy anyhow!

 

[maldorf]

LMAO. I think alot of people forget the gym is all about moving weight, and working your ass off and not what you are wearing to look good or pick up chicks. There are many guys who wear Ed Hardy shirts and Tapout gear w matching shorts. The woman are 10 times worse, with tons of makeup, the very strong aroma of cheap perfume and last week a girl was lugging her Louie Vatton bag around. Really irritates me. I don't put any thought into what I am looking like. Sorry to get off subject!

Yeah. I like it when the women are chewing gum and talking on their cell phones while on the gym floor. Ive seen them stop a set midway to answer their phone and then not get off for 10 minutes or so. These chicks then get pissy and quit the gym after a few months when they see no results.

 

[mountaindog1]

great thread Phil

Awesome thread Phil...

Here is one of my sets of hack squats today...

YouTube - hack squats with drops.MPG

For me, I love to get deep, and not lose control. I like to hit higher reps on legs, always have. If you noticed at the end, I moved my feet together and down on the platform, that annihilates your teardrop. You can't tell, but I was on FIRE at the end.

This was after leg presses, leg curls, and a variation of leg extensions I do....love doing hack squats with pumped legs...

JM

 

[Shelby]

Awesome thread Phil...

Here is one of my sets of hack squats today...

YouTube - hack squats with drops.MPG

For me, I love to get deep, and not lose control. I like to hit higher reps on legs, always have. If you noticed at the end, I moved my feet together and down on the platform, that annihilates your teardrop. You can't tell, but I was on FIRE at the end.

This was after leg presses, leg curls, and a variation of leg extensions I do....love doing hack squats with pumped legs...

JM

John knows a thing or two about building great legs... here's a shot of his back in the day:

 

[mountaindog1]

Shelby - thank you brother!!!!! Really appreciate the kind words...

JM

 

[goonstopher]

If it was a squeeze type movement like your explaining I'll bet my next 500$ trueprotein order it wasn't an official DC video (dvd) or a video that Dante did. Might of said to change form but there isn't but squeezing going on - thats for those volume guys lifting little weights ha.

But really in all seriousness, we've had this debate on PM so many times - just lift the weight? or squeeze and feel it...

Some will disagree (but I'm 99% sure Phil and Dante agree - they've said it time and time again in their posts) but don't worry about all this squeeze crap. It's about our god given intuition about physics and physiology 101 - lifting weights (physics) with muscles and causing the muscle to adapt (physiology). In essence, choose a lift that is good for your structure and can progress on, find the optimal range of motion, load the weight on and lift. Then keep progressing on that lift. For most people on this forum don't need worry about all this squeeze, try pull your hands apart on the bar when benching to activate triceps, opposite for chest, use the pinky twist technique for a better contraction.

Strange because I trained based on feel this week for the first time in a long time and I am so soar I want to die. I haven't been sore like this in my life in fact I haven't been sore at all in over 8 years until doing this this week

 

[halflife]

Strange because I trained based on feel this week for the first time in a long time and I am so soar I want to die. I haven't been sore like this in my life in fact I haven't been sore at all in over 8 years until doing this this week

Nice I'm proud. You created high levels lactic acid in muscle, CPK in blood, etc.

Your soreness is also a primary result of changing your routine to something you haven't done in 8 years.

Now focus on muscle growth soreness is not directly correlated to growth.

Actually do what you want - we all have different goals, even though being sore is an odd one, I won't judge.

 

[LATS]

GUYS.. YOU CAN SQUEEZE AND TENSE A 15 POUND DUMBELL ALL DAY.. but you will not get near the benefits as if you did the same movement with double the weight with a little body "english".. if you are squeezing a 15 pound dumbell for laterals your delts will look like they use a 15 pound dumbell for laterals..lol..

 

[goonstopher]

Nice I'm proud. You created high levels lactic acid in muscle, CPK in blood, etc.

Your soreness is also a primary result of changing your routine to something you haven't done in 8 years.

Now focus on muscle growth soreness is not directly correlated to growth.

Actually do what you want - we all have different goals, even though being sore is an odd one, I won't judge.

Hey I am generally on your side of the argument so no need to fight.

I've only done 5x5, dc or various adaptations for as long as I can remember. Working a muscle once a week seems like the norm around here so I am trying to understand how people from that school of though judge their workouts and one way was through "feel". I have not found a better ruler in most volume/weekly programs because they generally just list reps and movements but no progression method which is causing me a lot of confusion. This starts getting off topic though and this is a very good thread.

 

[Nardz]

Maybe somebody can come up with a rational explanation as
the only thing I can figure out is that it just takes me awhile to
get "warmed up" and if that's the case, then I clearly need to
carve out a bigger chunk of time when it comes to squatting,
a way bigger chunk of time than I am accustomed to devoting.

Wonder if I'll be sore tomorrow? I doubt it. If I was, I would
have felt the soreness setting in before the gym door hit me
in the ass on the way out this morning.

PS. Impressive set of hacks (and legs) John.

Great work mate! Its obvious you have found a solution to your problem and thats proper warm up. Some people need more time spent warming up than others. I usually allow 4 warm up sets before starting any heavy leg movement. Another thing that works really well for me is performing other quad exercises before performing squats.

 

[halflife]

Hey I am generally on your side of the argument so no need to fight.

I've only done 5x5, dc or various adaptations for as long as I can remember. Working a muscle once a week seems like the norm around here so I am trying to understand how people from that school of though judge their workouts and one way was through "feel". I have not found a better ruler in most volume/weekly programs because they generally just list reps and movements but no progression method which is causing me a lot of confusion. This starts getting off topic though and this is a very good thread.

You either progress:
-more volume (set/reps)
-more weight
-less rest periods
-maybe change tempo
those are the main ones

But just like DC teaches, I believe stay in a rep range then when get out of it adjust the weight. If weight/reps go no where and you have changed up the excercise and still stuck in a rut? adjust diet and drugs. Some programs do the whole adjusting volume weekly increasing it over several weeks, then at peak drop it hard, then repeat. But all in all your weight needs to go up - yes reps and volume can but there is a limit - but there's plenty of weights in the gym

Anyway, if the program is volume and it doesn't change rep/sets each week or anything - your goal is still like DC, up the weight with good form. Also in your volume routine - I've found with more volume each lift doesn't go up every week consistently like with DC - just make sure there is an over all upward trend.

See we brought it back to the topic of the thread FORM

 

[kingpeon]

I'll start off the comments

1) You are too small
2) You aren't lean enough
3) You are weak
4) The music sucks
5) Your beard/hat/pants/v neck shirt sucks etc etc

OK this is from about an hour ago

Wide Grip Rack Chins +60 lbs. These are a REAL struggle for me and not too long ago I would have been lucky to do bodyweight for 11-20RP.

Did preacher curls and pinwheels before this and I'm flat and watery and did cardio this morning and all those other qualifiers of why I'm not jacked and tan lol

YouTube - Wide Grip Rack Chins

I started getting better results with this one when I would lean back and hit the bar with the sternum. Possibly the best exercise for the midback.

 

[bashu]

GUYS.. YOU CAN SQUEEZE AND TENSE A 15 POUND DUMBELL ALL DAY.. but you will not get near the benefits as if you did the same movement with double the weight with a little body "english".. if you are squeezing a 15 pound dumbell for laterals your delts will look like they use a 15 pound dumbell for laterals..lol..

Right... but let's say you're pretty advanced. Are laterals with some "body english" with 70 pounds still better than super strict laterals with 50 pounds? Assuming you focus on getting stronger (more weight or reps) every workout.