My first cycle

[Mota]

I'm 27, 170lbs, 5'11".
I don't meet the standard requirements for what most consider ready for AAS. I've only been serious about my training for 9 months. (gained 20lbs so far)

But I've done a ton of reading. I know the risks. And I've decided to go for it so at this point any flames telling me I'm no where near my natural potential are not needed.

For a while my PCT plan was 40/40/20/20 Nolva and 100/100/50/50 Clomid but for this cycle from what I've read doing both would be overkill. The Nolva seems to be a better SERM all around and has less sides so I would have rather ran it as my PCT. But I've read in several spots that clomid helps fire up the body's HPTA axis for reasons that are pretty unclear. It seems since both are breast cancer drugs no real studies have been done into why this happens or which is a better PCT drug.

If anybody knows if clomid really does fire up the balls faster than nolva or if that is just brosci BS I would very much appreciate some additional opinions.

 

[ythrashn]

Whatever, I think that's all a bunch of bullshit anyway.
It would be better if you were to wait another 9 months if not a year and grow naturally.

If you want to run a cycle go for it....
It will help you reach your goals much faster thats for sure..
The thing is, I hope you can stick with it after PCT and keep most of your gains.

At 170 pounds I think 375mg a week would make you feel like a god.

Get some coco butter cause you'll probably grow so fast you'll develop stretch marks...LOL

 

[Mota]

At 170 pounds I think 375mg a week would make you feel like a god.

Get some coco butter cause you'll probably grow so fast you'll develop stretch marks...LOL

LOL. Thats what I like to hear. Thanks man.

So you prefer nolva to clomid for PCT?
Any reason you feel its better?

 

[ythrashn]

Well you can use either, its really a personal preferance.

Clomid just has some side effects that Nolva doesnt have.

I've stuck with Nolva never used clomid because of the side effects that I heard.

Like blurred vision, and emotional instability.

"Crying while watching the Notebook"...LOL

Clomid:
This effect in turn stimulates both LH (Leutenizing Hormone) and FSH (Follicle Stimulating Hormone), which then stimulates the release of testosterone. For this reason, we typically see Clomid used in Post Cycle Therapy routines. Personally, I’m a fan of another SERM (Nolvadex) in this regard. For reference purposes, 150mgs of Clomid will elevate testosterone levels to approximately 150% of initial baseline value (1). You don’t have to use 150mgs, however; In my research, I’ve found that doses as low as 50mgs will show improvements and elevations in testosterone

Nolva:
Nolvadex also has some highly important and practical roles for a steroid using athlete who is coming off a cycle. Hypogonadic and infertile men given Nolvadex, saw significant increases in the serum levels of LH, FSH, as well as testosterone levels(3)(4). In fact, 20mgs of Nolvadex can possibly raise your testosterone levels approximately 150% (5). SO clearly this is something we should consider using not only during a cycle to prevent gyno, but especially afterwards, to restore our natural hormonal function.

They'll do the same thing brother....^^^

Just nolva wont make you a emotional roller coaster....

 

[drob29]

I'm 27, 170lbs, 5'11".
I don't meet the standard requirements for what most consider ready for AAS. I've only been serious about my training for 9 months. (gained 20lbs so far)........But I've done a ton of reading. I know the risks. And I've decided to go for it so at this point any flames telling me I'm no where near my natural potential are not needed. .

well tough shit big guy. This is an open forum and you dont get to dictate what other members say.

IMO, your AAS use is both unneeded and irresponsible. You have been training for 9 months , and have put on 20 lbs. This was a very good beginning. But now, you have gone and fucked it up. If you are not near (and in your case, you should be 200 lbs minimum before you started so your A LONG WAY away) your natural max, then gains will most likely be lost when your off cycle. I have been around a little, and AAS boards are littered with skinny twits like you who cycle, put on 35 lbs, but cant keep it. So they think they need more, or higher doses, and before they know it they are running massive cycles and end up in a world of shit. I have no idea what will happen to you, but from everything I have read, and in my experience, you running a cycle now was a mistake.

Get off now, run a quick PCT, train for another couple years, and get to 200 lbs, then run your cycle. Of course you probably wont do that, but in case you have rethought what your doing, you can get out now with minimal damage and recover fully.

And to those who have dished out cycle advice in this thread without knowing a members stats, you deserve a bitch slap as well. Without basic stats (age, ht, wt, bf, lift history, cycle history, diet, goals) providing cycle advice is not only foolish, its irresponsible. Smarten up.

 

[ythrashn]

well tough shit big guy. This is an open forum and you dont get to dictate what other members say.

IMO, your AAS use is both unneeded and irresponsible. You have been training for 9 months , and have put on 20 lbs. This was a very good beginning. But now, you have gone and fucked it up. If you are not near (and in your case, you should be 200 lbs minimum before you started so your A LONG WAY away) your natural max, then gains will most likely be lost when your off cycle. I have been around a little, and AAS boards are littered with skinny twits like you who cycle, put on 35 lbs, but cant keep it. So they think they need more, or higher doses, and before they know it they are running massive cycles and end up in a world of shit. I have no idea what will happen to you, but from everything I have read, and in my experience, you running a cycle now was a mistake.

Get off now, run a quick PCT, train for another couple years, and get to 200 lbs, then run your cycle. Of course you probably wont do that, but in case you have rethought what your doing, you can get out now with minimal damage and recover fully.

And to those who have dished out cycle advice in this thread without knowing a members stats, you deserve a bitch slap as well. Without basic stats (age, ht, wt, bf, lift history, cycle history, diet, goals) providing cycle advice is not only foolish, its irresponsible. Smarten up.

If someone is dead set on running a cycle....
This bitching does no good. ^^^
You may as well help them out so they don't do any preventable damage.

Whats better, let them run a cycle completely irresponsibly, misinformed, or run a cycle irresponsibly, but informed?

Hmm... perhaps you should smarten up... and offer advice where you can give it.

As you can see I told him it was a bad idea in past posts, but if he's going to run it he may as well do it as close to "right" as possible.

Hopefully he can keep some of the gains, but he may not and probably wont.

Good luck!!

 

[drob29]

If someone is dead set on running a cycle....
This bitching does no good. ^^^
You may as well help them out so they don't do any preventable damage.
Whats better, let them run a cycle completely irresponsibly, misinformed, or run a cycle irresponsibly, but informed?
Hmm... perhaps you should smarten up... and offer advice where you can give it.
As you can see I told him it was a bad idea in past posts, but if he's going to run it he may as well do it as close to "right" as possible.
Hopefully he can keep some of the gains, but he may not and probably wont.
Good luck!!

well if a 14 year old 130lb eigth grader "dead set" on running a cycle do you offer advice then as well?

There are many boards on the net that support cycles for just about anyone regardless of stats, Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure and Anabolex.com are two that offer horrific advice to just about anyone. They have the "well he is going to do it anyway" approach like you do. IMO pro muscle "has a slightly higher standard" than that

And, I did offer advice. I told him to get off now and get to 200 lbs naturally, then reconsider a cycle.

You need to consider who your posting to and their stats before you stick your nose into a thread and suggest AAS for a member who clearly does not need it.

 

[ythrashn]

This guy is an adult!! 27 years old! He's old enough to make his own decisions.
What did I tell him...?
"It would be better if you were to wait another 9 months if not a year and grow naturally."
He's started his cycle he's dead set on running it and clearly is not going to stop. I'll help him as best as I can...period.


That 14 year old comment is ridiculous and laughable.

 

[drob29]

This guy is an adult!! 27 years old! He's old enough to make his own decisions.
What did I tell him...?.

Here is what you told him, for the record

..I'd run it for 12-16 weeks though.

Start your AI 4 weeks into the cylce.
Adex .25 mg EOD.
Adjust from there.

Aspirate before injecting. You dont have to yank back real hard. If you are in a vein the plunger will pull back very easily.Aspirating after injecting will just pull the oil mixed with a bit of blood back out, and is pointless.
When injecting in the quad, go high to the outside. Don't inject in the center of the muscle. I made the same mistake in the beginning. Go high to the outside and it will be painless............ good luck....

I've heard of peeps getting good gains for a first cycle at 250mg...Although, I would recommend at least 400-500mg a week.
I think you would be happier with results.
250mg is going to shut your boys down just as fast as 500mg will. Recovery will be the same also...

If you are going to run a cycle and shut down your natural test. You might as well not do it half assed.

For your pct 20/20/10/10 of Nolva would suffice for this cycle.
No clomid needed.
Start PCT two weeks after last pin.

HCG would be good to have so your boys dont shut down completely also,but is not required.

then he posted:

I'm 27, 170lbs, 5'11".
I don't meet the standard requirements for what most consider ready for AAS. I've only been serious about my training for 9 months. (gained 20lbs so far)
But I've done a ton of reading.

Your next post pretty much says it all.

Whatever, I think that's all a bunch of bullshit anyway.

and there ya go.

You believe stats, and height/weight/lift history are meaningless. HMMM...really..

It would be better if you were to wait another 9 months if not a year and grow naturally. If you want to run a cycle go for it....
It will help you reach your goals much faster thats for sure..
The thing is, I hope you can stick with it after PCT and keep most of your gains. At 170 pounds I think 375mg a week would make you feel like a god.

Get some coco butter cause you'll probably grow so fast you'll develop stretch marks...LOL

well I guess you did tell him to wait 9 months more didnt you. my bad bro. .....Oh, by the way, you also gave him alot of cycle advice mixed in with you "be sure to wait 9 more months" comment.

IMO your way off base, dont try to cover your ass now with "I told him to wait 9 months".

Your best bet is to cut your losses and shut up now.

 

[Mota]

drob29 your a douche.... Its not your place to decided if I'm worthy of doing a cycle. I know a ton of guys who are not 200lbs and 8% bf but still have run a cycle, loved it, and kept most of their gains. Half these guys are idiots and didn't do any reading before hand. I have friends that have done oral only cycles (dbol, M1t, ect...). I have a friend who's one and only only cycle was straight tren... None of these idiots who did no research even did any sort of PCT. They still don't regret doing it and had no problems.
I'm an adult. I've done my reading. I'm going to run a responsible cycle with proper PCT. I understand that my diet and training must stay in order past the end of my PCT if I want to keep as much of my gains as I can. If my goal was to be a body builder and be 250lbs and 5% bf down the road then you might be correct and it would be easier for my to hit that goal if I trained natural to my natural max.. But that is YOUR goal.. Not mine. If I choose to use AAS to accelerate my results then thats MY call. I understand the risks.

I'd appreciate it if you pulled your head out of your ass and didn't give people shit who are trying to keep me as safe as possible on the path I've gone down.

 

[gelatine]

Here's how I look at it: if you're 170lbs and can't gain weight, it's stupid to do AAS. Why? Because that person is obviously eating like a grandmother, and whatever gains they get are going to go away because they're still eating nothing after they get off their cycle. This is your standard bodybuilding.com retard in a nutshell.

Remember to eat like a champ, and keep eating after you get off the cycle. Your body is going to fight the gains once you're off, so I hope you have a fast recovery. Keep your gains up for a couple of months before trying to cut the fat at any rate.

You also want to be careful with the weights, especially since you're far from your potential. If you start getting some major increases in the poundage you're moving, you want to listen hard and fast to any complaints your body has.

 

[Mota]

Thanks. At least that is constructive advice. I do understand that diet is 80% of it and I have been putting on weight since I changed my diet about 6 months ago. I have stepped it up another 700cals/day in the last 2 weeks as I know when I'm on cycle I do need to eat more.
I know you guys who are gifted with good genetics believe that everybody has the same body as you and that if you eat and work out growing is easy up until 200lbs or so. But I am naturally very skinny and know that I've had to work three times as hard for every pound as some friends of mine do.

Could I get to 190 natty? Yea... But if i get to 190 using AAS in 3 months instead of 2 years is it really going to be any harder to maintain that size? Once the PCT crash is over you all know that its not.. Muscle is muscle. Yea, I'm taking a short cut, I can live with that.

 

[drob29]

.........Could I get to 190 natty? Yea... But if i get to 190 using AAS in 3 months instead of 2 years is it really going to be any harder to maintain that size? Once the PCT crash is over you all know that its not.. Muscle is muscle. Yea, I'm taking a short cut, I can live with that.

ok.....since you have done 9 months of working out, and all that reading, good luck to you Mota.