Not Gaining no matter what I try!

[Coopie]

I recently had a conversation w/ a gym buddy about the exact same thing. He's a very sharp and shredded 180 lbs - even has a "thick" look to his body because he's only about 5'5" tall. Problem is that he's been 180 lbs forever! Just like you, he's tried everything.

I suggested that he swap out his "Supplements" for real meals. For example, in order to get extra calories into his body, he would eat 3 or 4 protein bars a day and the same # of shakes. I told him that for me, real food protein (chicken, tuna, steak, salmon, eggs) got me bigger than shakes and bars ever did. Even nowadays, at 220 lbs, I only have a post workout shake, a pre-bedtime shake, and 2 bars all day long - the rest of my meals are real meals!

Give it a shot... Got nothing to lose!

 

[BCC]

I have to disagree with the real meals.

Calories are calories regardless of what they come from.

A given person needs a certain number of calories per day to maintain their bodyweight. If they want their bodyweight to go up, then they take in more calories. Same if they want it to go down.

Gaining and losing weight couldn't be any simpler.

Gaining muscle is where the science of macronutrients come into play. But if you can't gain any weight then no matter how you play with your macro's, you clearly just aren't eating enough to support the formation of any tissue, therefore no drugs or tweaks in macronutrients are going to make any difference.

 

[Coopie]

BCC - I was 100% in agreement with you until I tried it myself. I made no changes to anything I was doing, just swapped out some bars and shakes for some chicken breast and fish. My net calories remained very close, and my protein intake was consistent. Within days I was "fuller" looking, and in a few weeks I was heavier (don't remember how much).

I know, from a purely mathematical standpoint it should not matter, but for me, it did. Maybe I'm missing something else that was responsible for the additional growth but I can't figure out what it was.

 

[MassMachine]

60-25-15

When looking for mass i say the 60-25-15 is the way to go. Carbs are very important when putting on mass. The high protien diets are great for cutting but mass needs carbs.
I have tried both and the high carbs is the way to go. I seen a lot of naturals get huge on this diet.
You must gain fat if you want to get big. Just ask all the big guys you see.

MM

 

[MassMachine]

Try This

This is an excellent way to gain mass. Dont complain you cant get big unless your willing to do what it takes.

For 2 weeks you will have to stuff your self with lots of calories, protein, carbs, and fat. Don't worry about eating low fat. Just eat a ton of food at least 5000 calories a day and make sure you keep your protein intake at least 250 grams per day. Eat something every 2 hours during the day. You'll also need to increase your water intake to at least 1 gallon per day. Supplement your diet with a good creatine + carb supplement and a good whey protein powder .

Keep your training hard and heavy. Train 4 or 5 days a week.

After about 2 weeks your body will start to reach a plateau. If you follow this program exactly you will have gained about 5 lbs. of bodyweight. Now you need to back off for a week and basically let your body re-prime itself.

For 5-7 days you will eat a minimum amount of food. Eat no more then 2000 calories per day (200 grams of carbs, 200 grams of protein, and very low fat). Stop taking creatine and eat stuff like very lean meat, chicken breast, fish, fruit, and veggies. Also cut back your weight training to every other day, and don't really push yourself in the gym. This is just a maintenance phase.

During this phase you will lose a few pounds of water because you won't be eating as much. Don't let this discourage you because after a week of low calorie eating you will go back to stuffing yourself for 2 weeks and training hard. Your body will then absorb the extra food like a sponge and drive your natural anabolic hormones crazy. It will be like you are on steroids. You will get awesome pumps in the gym and gain strength and size very rapidly. You should be able to gain at least 5 lbs. during this phase.

But after 2 weeks your anabolic hormones will go back to normal and your growth will slow down. So then you will go back to low calorie eating for a week to re-prime your body and the bulk up for 2 weeks, etc....

This technique works awesome for gaining muscle mass and strength. I used this technique personally to bulk up.

After you have done this for at least 6 months you should have gained 30+ lbs. of bodyweight. Of course some of the weight will be bodyfat, but you can stick to the low calorie phase for a month or two and increase your cardio exercise to burn off the extra fat.

 

[maxsupplements]

does this work well?

even if you are clean does this eating cycle work well? i have done something very similar, but didnt notice gains like that- natural. If i am "on" then gains like that come easy, but if i am clean, i seems to fluctuate weight, but it doesnt stay. i will go up 5 lbs, and then back down and then back up... this repeats itself, but i understand the idea, just doesnt work too well for a hardgainer! and no thats not an excuse...

 

[BCC]

I agree with you maxsupplements. My weight would just go up then right back down, then up no higher than before.

The best method is to always just eat more food.

 

[maxsupplements]

i really have to eat like a monster for longer

for me to put on mass, it takes me eating CRAP FOOD for atleast 2 meals each day and the rest good clean meals, and then at that i have to eat at least 6k calories a day for 12 weeks AT LEAST!!! last cycle i ran i bulked for 12 weeks and then cut down and have gained at least 10 lbs of LBM from that one. and i flucutated like 20 pounds (water & BF). im now running IGF by itself (pct)and really liking the results so far. only like a week too. i am more vascular than ever before.
massmonster- how long have you done this? eating this way? and also, what are your genetics like, sounds like you are a genetic freak if you can just eat like that over and over and do nothing but gain weight!!!

 

[MassMachine]

If you are natural the 60-25-15 is the way to go for mass. Depending on your matabolism you can use the above diet as a natural and gain. If you are a natural eating to clean is what kills their growth potential and being afraid to gain fat also is a downfall.
I think many could get much more mass if they learned to relax their diet. Many turn to drugs way to soon and do not add the size potential they have because of the Mary-Kate and Ashely syndrome.

MM

 

[wostok]

2 things.

number 1. You said that you havent taken more then a week off from training in 4,5 years!!! its time for you to take a whole month off.

and you say that you always eat clean. Eat a bag of chips or an litre icecream everyday... it could be exactly what you need

 

[big4nuthin]

Thanks you guys!

After much deliberation and reflection I have come to one final conclusion and that is I am not eating enough carbs, eating to clean for to long, and not enough calories. Sure I was getting enough protien and perhaps enough EFA's but my total caloric intake was roughly around 2000-2500 a day and that very clean and very little carbs. I think I was also suffering from a little burn out. Going through the motions, but not really feeling it. I have made some changes, so we will see if thats what was missing. I will lay out a rough plan for critque later, but until then I just want to say thanks again to everyone that chimed in!

 

[Crowler]

After much deliberation and reflection I have come to one final conclusion and that is I am not eating enough carbs, eating to clean for to long, and not enough calories. Sure I was getting enough protien and perhaps enough EFA's but my total caloric intake was roughly around 2000-2500 a day and that very clean and very little carbs. I think I was also suffering from a little burn out. Going through the motions, but not really feeling it. I have made some changes, so we will see if thats what was missing. I will lay out a rough plan for critque later, but until then I just want to say thanks again to everyone that chimed in!

Sounds like you have a plan good going. IMO your metabolism has been slowed down possibly because of your restricted diet.

2250 calories at 205 pounds WOW I do 4200 cals when I want to lose fat.


CROWLER

 

[big4nuthin]

I now realize I was on fumes

Sounds like you have a plan good going. IMO your metabolism has been slowed down possibly because of your restricted diet.

2250 calories at 205 pounds WOW I do 4200 cals when I want to lose fat.


CROWLER

Yeah, I did some basic math and was shocked to see how little I was taking in. The funny thing is, I was always full. I would eat 1 can of chicken with a little potatoe and feel bloated or stuffed. I would also do this 4-6 times a day switching out the carbs for EFA's or nuts. Very little fruit, and almost no junk. I think I trained my metabolism to be so efficient that I was able to just maintain while getting leaner and leaner BF% wise. I put too much thought into just getting my protiens and not enough other macronutrients. Well, I am wondering now, how do I get pyched up to eat enough and all the time. I know that sounds a little wierd, its just that I am really unsure of how I am going to force all that food in there and how long can I do it. Not pussying out, just trying to find a manageable way for the long run. Perhaps I will have to cycle my diet, like on of the other posters suggested.

 

[MassMachine]

You do not have to go crazy. Just increase your cals by 500. This will give you 3000 a day. 60-30-10. 450 carbs,225 pro, 33 fat. Give it a month and see what your gaining. As your weight increases increase and you platue up your cals a little. Give yourself a big cheat day at least once a month to keep your body from adapting.
As far as worring about eating enough throw in a couple power shakes.
8 oz Lowfat yogurt,light n lively
1 meduim banana
1 cup milk 2%
1 scoop whey vanilla
These are around 500 cals and taste great. 2 or 3 of these is 1000-1500 right there.
If you need menue ideas feel free to ask.

MM

 

[big4nuthin]

Thanks MassMachine

You do not have to go crazy. Just increase your cals by 500. This will give you 3000 a day. 60-30-10. 450 carbs,225 pro, 33 fat. Give it a month and see what your gaining. As your weight increases increase and you platue up your cals a little. Give yourself a big cheat day at least once a month to keep your body from adapting.
As far as worring about eating enough throw in a couple power shakes.
8 oz Lowfat yogurt,light n lively
1 meduim banana
1 cup milk 2%
1 scoop whey vanilla
These are around 500 cals and taste great. 2 or 3 of these is 1000-1500 right there.
If you need menue ideas feel free to ask.

MM

I agree about the power shakes being a big assistance in getting extra cals and all the macro's. I finally found a Protien powder that I can use without all the neg. sides like bloating, nausea, and so on. This is my first month using a protien supplement since stopping about a year ago and it really has made things much easier. I am now getting about 700 extra cals from shakes.

 

[Crowler]

Yeah, I did some basic math and was shocked to see how little I was taking in. The funny thing is, I was always full. I would eat 1 can of chicken with a little potatoe and feel bloated or stuffed. I would also do this 4-6 times a day switching out the carbs for EFA's or nuts. Very little fruit, and almost no junk. I think I trained my metabolism to be so efficient that I was able to just maintain while getting leaner and leaner BF% wise. I put too much thought into just getting my protiens and not enough other macronutrients. Well, I am wondering now, how do I get pyched up to eat enough and all the time. I know that sounds a little wierd, its just that I am really unsure of how I am going to force all that food in there and how long can I do it. Not pussying out, just trying to find a manageable way for the long run. Perhaps I will have to cycle my diet, like on of the other posters suggested.

Doesn't sound like you are pussying out, just being realistic based on past experience. I really don't have an answer except that for me I find I eat my least tasty foods first and then if I have not taken in enough calories and am TOTALY full, I eat things that taste GREAT but are considered junk food.

BTW I just ordered some B12 from Synthetek, it is suppose to help stimulate the appetite. I will let you know how it goes.


CROWLER

 

[MiniMax]

I saw your signature and made me think about how many times a normal person should exercise in order to stay healthy. A 30 min exercise, three times a week is ok ?

 

[McMacho]

I think this is the correct schedule for newbies. As time passes and you learn more about nutrition and exercise, you can modify it according to your needs.

 

[big_byrd52]

I've seriously attacked the high protein route and in all honesty, all it really did was make me fat. Sure I gained muscle, just as much, if not more of the gain was fat. I think nutrition is a fine balance that each of us must learn what's best for our goals.
__________________
** xcel **

Xcel, this is exactly what i have learned! i dropped my protein intake from 450 grams or so down to anywhere from 250-300 and increased carb intake. I was bloated as hell all the time at first, but once my body got used to the carbs, i got and stayed much leaner! i just recently read that the body processes 95% of protein eaten no matter how much u eat. so if ur over doin it, it can easily be stored as fat.

I always read u just gotta eat more to grow. But everyone is different, and as much as i said it before, i guess i just didnt think that applied to me. I would bulk on 4000 cals and get fat as hell, just watching the scale go up. sure it works, but i get so sloppy lookin, or at tleast i think so, im embarrased to take my shirt off. I have learned i only need about 3000-3500 cals to grow. i know some of u guys get tired of eating, i have done that too trying to eat upwards of 5000 cals a day. but it really sux when u have to scale back and watch what u eat even when ur bulking-- so dieting is realy a bitch!

 

[McMacho]

Our own bodies is the sole indicator of the way we should plan our future food intake although my guess is that we should always follow the basic rules of nutrition and expand them whenever necessary.