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The textbooks are wrong!

brownbanana

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That was something Viktor Frankl said in the beginning of Man’s Search for Meaning.

It has been something I have realized more and more lately.

Let me begin from the beginning and I will I will tie it in with bodybuilding.

I started on Alinboard. A friend of mine had mentioned steroids. We wanted results, we were 18. I instantly had pre-conceived ideas of steroids, how they were dangerous, how they ruin your body, how they are for cheaters.

I realized just now, Alinboard wasn’t the first site I found “Information”, but a paid site, that had a link to Alinshop.

I was never one for the ‘learned’, I was lucky to have passed high school. Not for lack of intelligence but for lack of interest.

Soon after my search for a source of steroids, I started reading, of course after a post I made. That I was 18, 155lbs, been training for a couple of years and was struggling to gain muscle.

Of course, I was flamed. Although, some were kind and helped. One in particular made me a tailored diet. Of course, I was told to stay natty. But naturally I didnt listen, but that doesn’t mean I didnt listen at all. I learned how to eat and train. I soaked up the knowledge. Not only from Alinboard but also from the textbooks. How the body works, how long it takes the muscles repair, that I dont grow in the gym but in my dreams. Whoops, I mean in my sleep. Or was that a mistake?

At the time, I picked up Arnolds Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding.

Because of my pre-conceived ideas, and believing I wasn’t smart, I had a philosophy of “work harder, not smarter”. I also believed that strong mind equals strong body. And in this case, or my case, strong body, strong mind. Since I recognized my weakness. Which wasn’t psychological but beliefs. So, I worked on my body, if I couldn’t be smart, I could be strong. But it was more, I couldn’t quite put my finger on it.

To bring this around to the present, the textbooks are wrong.

Vicktor Frankl says this in his book, which is about his experiences during the Holocaust. He was a Jew, and survived the Gettos, and later, the extermination camps. He was a psychiatrist, they [Nazi] took everything from him, everything that can be taken from a man. Even his name was taken from him. He was given a number, a number he didnt need to remember, for it was tattooed on his forearm.

What he realized, how the textbooks were wrong was because of what he could survive through, or how he says it, “man can get use to anything, but dont ask how”.

You may be asking, what does this have to do with bodybuilding?

He realized, that the books said man needed, so and so, amount of sleep to function, he needed, so and so, amount of calories to function, and if not, he would deteriorate.

Of course, he proved that wrong. That he could eat only 150 calories a day and work slave labor. Yet retain muscle. That he didn’t have to sleep for days on end to function. And, that the textbooks were wrong.

He also realized something else, that there was one thing, something a man had, that could not be taken from him. His freedom to choose his attitude in any given situation.

Therefore, as said by the great Kant, “I must abolish knowledge, to make room for belief”.

As I find myself getting back into bodybuilding, I find my knowledge restricting! Limiting! Confining!

As if all my learning is drowning my potential!

And I see it on the board.

Who says Arnold’s knowledge is outdated? Who says what is right and wrong? What works and what doesn’t?

We must be wary of knowledge, we must be wary of learning, we must be on guard, to guard our ability to believe in ourselves and to believe in others.

What do you guys think? Do many of you feel the same way? Has the same fear/knowledge shown its ugly face? Have you told others what is and what is not? How you told others... to not believe... and... in who?
 
Last edited:

Pissbrain259

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That was something Viktor Frankl said in the beginning of Man’s Search for Meaning.

It has been something I have realized more and more lately.

Let me begin from the beginning and I will I will tie it in with bodybuilding.

I started on Alinboard. A friend of mine had mentioned steroids. We wanted results, we were 18. I instantly had pre-conceived ideas of steroids, how they were dangerous, how they ruin your body, how they are for cheaters.

I realized just now, Alinboard wasn’t the first site I found “Information”, but a paid site, that had a link to Alinshop.

I was never one for the ‘learned’, I was lucky to have passed high school. Not for lack of intelligence but for lack of interest.

Soon after my search for a source of steroids, I started reading, of course after a post I made. That I was 18, 155lbs, been training for a couple of years and was struggling to gain muscle.

Of course, I was flamed. Although, some were kind and helped. One in particular made me a tailored diet. Of course, I was told to stay natty. But naturally I didnt listen, but that doesn’t mean I didnt listen at all. I learned how to eat and train. I soaked up the knowledge. Not only from Alinboard but also from the textbooks. How the body works, how long it takes the muscles repair, that I dont grow in the gym but in my dreams. Whoops, I mean in my sleep. Or was that a mistake?

At the time, I picked up Arnolds Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding.

Because of my pre-conceived ideas, and believing I wasn’t smart, I had a philosophy of “work harder, not smarter”. I also believed that strong mind equals strong body. And in this case, or my case, strong body, strong mind. Since I recognized my weakness. Which wasn’t psychological but beliefs. So, I worked on my body, if I couldn’t be smart, I could be strong. But it was more, I couldn’t quite put my finger on it.

To bring this around to the present, the textbooks are wrong.

Vicktor Frankl says this in his book, which is about his experiences during the Holocaust. He was a Jew, and survived the Gettos, and later, the extermination camps. He was a psychiatrist, they [Nazi] took everything from him, everything that can be taken from a man. Even his name was taken from him. He was given a number, a number he didnt need to remember, for it was tattooed on his forearm.

What he realized, how the textbooks were wrong was because of what he could survive through, or how he says it, “man can get use to anything, but dont ask how”.

You may be asking, what does this have to do with bodybuilding?

He realized, that the books said man needed, so and so, amount of sleep to function, he needed, so and so, amount of calories to function, and if not, he would deteriorate.

Of course, he proved that wrong. That he could eat only 150 calories a day and work slave labor. Yet retain muscle. That he didn’t have to sleep for days on end to function. And, that the textbooks were wrong.

He also realized something else, that there was one thing, something a man had, that could not be taken from him. His freedom to choose his attitude in any given situation.

Therefore, as said by the great Kant, “I must abolish knowledge, to make room for belief”.

As I find myself getting back into bodybuilding, I find my knowledge restricting! Limiting! Confining!

As if all my learning is drowning my potential!

And I see it on the board.

Who says Arnold’s knowledge is outdated? Who says what is right and wrong? What works and what doesn’t?

We must be wary of knowledge, we must be wary of learning, we must be on guard, to guard our ability to believe in ourselves and to believe in others.

What do you guys think? Do many of you feel the same way? Has the same fear/knowledge shown its ugly face? Have you told others what is and what is not? How you told others... to not believe... and... in who?
If you wish to delve into a philosophical investigation on the nature of human reason, knowledge and illusions, I highly recommend reading Immanuel Kant's Critique of Pure Reason circa 1781. Please share with us your thoughts upon completing this cerebral discourse as posited by Kant.
 
Last edited:

brownbanana

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If you wish to delve into a philosophical investigation on the nature of human reason, knowledge and illusions, I highly recommend reading Immanuel Kant's book Critique of Pure Reason circa 1781.
I did and what I realized, it is “reason” that is constricting.

For example, reason tells me, that by current understanding of our bodies, Arnold is a freak of nature. And that is why his way of working out worked for him.

Granted, we can take this conversation far, we can dwelve deeper into thought. But what about our goals with the body?

I look at Arnold’s Encyclopedia of bodybuilding and ask myself, why not?
Why not workout twice a day?

His philosophy to bodybuilding seems to be more about “belief” than “knowledge”.

Knowledge is part of it, but, its almost like we have become so much mind, so to speak, about bodybuilding, we forget how to be flexable with ideas. For example, starting cycle, 500mg of test only. At minimum 350 grams of protein, carbs... etc. and anything else is going off the beaten path and not worth the discussion.
 

brownbanana

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If you wish to delve into a philosophical investigation on the nature of human reason, knowledge and illusions, I highly recommend reading Immanuel Kant's Critique of Pure Reason circa 1781. Please share with us your thoughts upon completing this cerebral discourse as posited by Kant.




More related to bodybuilding, bear with me

That the mind and body are not two different things but one in the same thing. What differs is how we view it, or in this case ourselves.

What Kant was doing, was restricting “reason”, thereby critiqueing it. Pure reason that is. Pure, as he says is in abstract only. And reason unchecked, is dogmatic, but oddly enough, we use a dogmatic method to critique it [reason].

But that is the thing. We also dissociate from ourselves or bodies by attaching too much to knowlege. We limit outselves. Reason by itself is restriction.

Let’s put it this way, in stead of positing Kant’s philosophy, lets posit Arnold’s philosophy of bodybuilding.

Let me quote him, Arnold:


"When I was 10 years old, I was already flexing my arms every day. By the time I started bodybuilding at age 15, biceps were the most noticeable muscle group on my body. By flexing my biceps so much, I'd learned to control them more completely."

"When you think of biceps as merely muscles, you subconsciously have a limit in your mind, which for biceps is something in the area of 20" or 21". When you limit yourself to that measurement, it is very hard to get to that level and, needless to say, impossible to get past it. But when you think about mountains, there is no limit to biceps growth, and therefore you have a chance of going beyond normal mental barriers."
 
Last edited:

Pissbrain259

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More related to bodybuilding, bear with me

That the mind and body are not two different things but one in the same thing. What differs is how we view it, or in this case ourselves.

What Kant was doing, was restricting “reason”, thereby critiqueing it. Pure reason that is. Pure, as he says is in abstract only. And reason unchecked, is dogmatic, but oddly enough, we use a dogmatic method to critique it [reason].

But that is the thing. We also dissociate from ourselves or bodies by attaching too much to knowlege. We limit outselves. Reason by itself is restriction.

Let’s put it this way, in stead of positing Kant’s philosophy, lets posit Arnold’s philosophy of bodybuilding.

Let me quote him, Arnold:


"When I was 10 years old, I was already flexing my arms every day. By the time I started bodybuilding at age 15, biceps were the most noticeable muscle group on my body. By flexing my biceps so much, I'd learned to control them more completely."

"When you think of biceps as merely muscles, you subconsciously have a limit in your mind, which for biceps is something in the area of 20" or 21". When you limit yourself to that measurement, it is very hard to get to that level and, needless to say, impossible to get past it. But when you think about mountains, there is no limit to biceps growth, and therefore you have a chance of going beyond normal mental barriers."
Segueing from Kant to quoting Arnold is an audacious and perplexing move, kind sir. Be that as it may or may that as it be, I will attempt to amuse you vis-a-vis Arnold's "philosophy of bodybuilding." Yes, I too ready Arnold's Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding 20+ years ago back in undergrad and thought it was 'Bible' of bodybuilding. Tried it and failed to think and be like Arnold. Then came years of rigorously studying and learning human physiology, biochemistry, molecular biology, pathophysiology, human genetics, pharmacology, neuroscience, etc. all of which has served me well in 'bodybuilding' and life's endeavors. Paradoxically, it seemed the more I learned as the years passed by, the more I realized the true expanse of my ignorance. To unequivocally believe that you can subconsciously will your biceps into growing until you have Mt. Everest on one arm and K2 on the other is to deny certain inescapable truths. While I do agree with the notion that our minds are capable of seemingly impossible feats both physically and mentally, we humans as a species have our limitations inherent by the fact that we are merely mortals inhabiting a pale blue dot suspended like a speck of dust on a sunbeam in the vast enveloping cosmos. To be pithy, if it works for you, great. If not, try something else. Q.E.D.
 

Bio

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If anything, the experiences shared on this board tell people to do what works for them. The experiences are shared and put out there as ideas for others. It just happens that some things out there give a good result to many.
 

brownbanana

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Segueing from Kant to quoting Arnold is an audacious and perplexing move, kind sir. Be that as it may or may that as it be, I will attempt to amuse you vis-a-vis Arnold's "philosophy of bodybuilding." Yes, I too ready Arnold's Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding 20+ years ago back in undergrad and thought it was 'Bible' of bodybuilding. Tried it and failed to think and be like Arnold. Then came years of rigorously studying and learning human physiology, biochemistry, molecular biology, pathophysiology, human genetics, pharmacology, neuroscience, etc. all of which has served me well in 'bodybuilding' and life's endeavors. Paradoxically, it seemed the more I learned as the years passed by, the more I realized the true expanse of my ignorance. To unequivocally believe that you can subconsciously will your biceps into growing until you have Mt. Everest on one arm and K2 on the other is to deny certain inescapable truths. While I do agree with the notion that our minds are capable of seemingly impossible feats both physically and mentally, we humans as a species have our limitations inherent by the fact that we are merely mortals inhabiting a pale blue dot suspended like a speck of dust on a sunbeam in the vast enveloping cosmos. To be pithy, if it works for you, great. If not, try something else. Q.E.D.
That is Reason (at the head of the Republic) with the intuition of Greatness at the heart of yourself.

The question is How to think and be like Arnold. Which sounds like imitation, but is Arnold the source? If he is not, then it is not imitation.
 
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brownbanana

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Segueing from Kant to quoting Arnold is an audacious and perplexing move, kind sir. Be that as it may or may that as it be, I will attempt to amuse you vis-a-vis Arnold's "philosophy of bodybuilding." Yes, I too ready Arnold's Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding 20+ years ago back in undergrad and thought it was 'Bible' of bodybuilding. Tried it and failed to think and be like Arnold. Then came years of rigorously studying and learning human physiology, biochemistry, molecular biology, pathophysiology, human genetics, pharmacology, neuroscience, etc. all of which has served me well in 'bodybuilding' and life's endeavors. Paradoxically, it seemed the more I learned as the years passed by, the more I realized the true expanse of my ignorance. To unequivocally believe that you can subconsciously will your biceps into growing until you have Mt. Everest on one arm and K2 on the other is to deny certain inescapable truths. While I do agree with the notion that our minds are capable of seemingly impossible feats both physically and mentally, we humans as a species have our limitations inherent by the fact that we are merely mortals inhabiting a pale blue dot suspended like a speck of dust on a sunbeam in the vast enveloping cosmos. To be pithy, if it works for you, great. If not, try something else. Q.E.D.
Pragmatically it works, I cant deny that. It seems Arnold has what I can only label at the moment, faith in his imagination. But not in any delusional sense, perhaps more of an illusion (something you mentioned in your first post)

And as Bio mentioned, there is plenty of knowledge here, much that is pragmatic and for the most part, it stays pragmatic.

I am trying to do away with the knowlege, that is, leading with. And get back to a primitive (instinctual) and more imaginary, or better said, more visionary sense of viewing bodybuilding.
 
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brownbanana

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https://youtu.be/mjOheDX8aLA





If I can add helpful points: listen with the heart (not analytical), but as a whole, meaning. When we watch a good movie and someone asks us how it was, we can answer in a verity of ways, but one way in particular is, what was the moral of the story? Meaning, what was the basic archetypal imagine (dare I say?) what we witnessed.

And maybe this is more of my intention for the original post, how to cultivate this sort of “understanding”, I am wary of the term knowledge for superstition reasons, bare with me in that respect.
 

jeroendebleser

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If you wish to delve into a philosophical investigation on the nature of human reason, knowledge and illusions, I highly recommend reading Immanuel Kant's Critique of Pure Reason circa 1781. Please share with us your thoughts upon completing this cerebral discourse as posited by Kant.
Kant rules
 

Pissbrain259

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Pragmatically it works, I cant deny that. It seems Arnold has what I can only label at the moment, faith in his imagination. But not in any delusional sense, perhaps more of an illusion (something you mentioned in your first post)

And as Bio mentioned, there is plenty of knowledge here, much that is pragmatic and for the most part, it stays pragmatic.

I am trying to do away with the knowlege, that is, leading with. And get back to a primitive (instinctual) and more imaginary, or better said, more visionary sense of viewing bodybuilding.
Bro, it sounds like you are excessively complicating something that is in truth much simpler than most individuals realize. If you want to discuss epistemology or theoretical physics, great. However, I am drawing Venn diagrams and barely see an infinitesimal degree of overlap between bodybuilding and the aforementioned subjects.
 

Pissbrain259

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If anything, the experiences shared on this board tell people to do what works for them. The experiences are shared and put out there as ideas for others. It just happens that some things out there give a good result to many.
Agreed. :yeahthat:
 

brownbanana

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Bro, it sounds like you are excessively complicating something that is in truth much simpler than most individuals realize. If you want to discuss epistemology or theoretical physics, great. However, I am drawing Venn diagrams and barely see an infinitesimal degree of overlap between bodybuilding and the aforementioned subjects.
It may seem like that at first my friend. You have mentioned, the intense study, the uncountable hours, the will power spent in the books.

And let me ask you, has that not changed your World-view?

Has that not changed how you view yourself?

The thing is, after all that work, all those hours, perhaps you are a rare sort, someone that avoided the trap of viewing people as meat-machines? Something we call machine-functionalism.

Then again, I have a hard time bridging the gap, for you, your studies have to do with the body. Mine on the other hand, were about the soul. But my ends, i dont believe are very far off. Strong mind equivocal to strong body, strong body = strong mind.

You sharpened your knowledge to better enhance, to better perfect, your body. I am assuming. Which includes yourself.

I shattered my skull (in a similar way that we tear our muscle fibers for strength) or as you called it, a cerebral discorse.

And perhaps I have forgot how to climb back down. But as I decend, I find myself not alone. Perhaps I forgot how to differentiate between viewing the forest and viewing the trees.

Before I begined my studies, what was real was the weight, the iron, and my hand infused with my will.

After my studies, what was real was nerves, sensations, and perception. That “I” only felt the bar because of a certain amount of pressure set off a chain reaction, that ends with a connection between the sensations and some sort of representations my brain creates, of what is in front of me. Point being, there is a medium between me and the weights. Some sort of relay. And the pain I feel in my legs as those last few reps on the leg press are c-fiber nerves going off and sending me a signal.

And what I seek, at least one of many, is that sort of niave realism I took to be the world once.

Granted, if I have complicated the issue, I simply cant ignore it, I must untie the knot.

I will get back to you soon, I once had Arnold’s Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding, I gave it away to a 15 year old boy, I believed it was a good start on his journey. But subconsciously believing it was outdated to be of any use. Only to realize the gems it contains were not explicit, were not about the physiology of the human body. Perhaps more about something you said, “How to think, and be like Arnold”. I bought it off prime so it should be here soon.

“Let us not pretend to doubt in philosophy what we do not doubt in our hearts”. Charles Sanders Peirce — and I am relating this to Arnold’s philosophy.
 
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MikeS

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I read Viktor Frankls book - Man’s Search for Meaning
About how a man in the Nazi concertration camps made a choice mentally to not feel unhappy and defeated. Amazing book, HIGHLY recommended for anyone to read.
 

brownbanana

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“I remember the first real workout I had as vividly as if it were last night. I rode my bike to the gym, which was eight miles from the village where I lived. I used barbells, dumbbells and machines. The guys warned me that I’d get sore, but it didnt seem to be having any effect. I thought I must be beyond that. Then, after the workout, I started riding home and fell off my bike. I was so weak I couldn’t make my hands hold on. I had no feeling in my legs: they were noodles. I was numb, my whole body buzzing. I pushed the bike for a while, leaning on it. Half a mile farther, I tried riding it again, fell off again, and then just pushed it the rest of the way home. This was my first experience weight training, and I was crazy for it.” (Arnold: the education of a bodybuilder, pg.15)

https://youtu.be/84cVizR6sPQ

You have to admit, he is not intellectualizing it like I am or have been. For two reasons: one being: an artist doesn’t think while creating. And two, that feeling of being with a woman is the only thing I have found that sort of naive realism I once had in the gym. No thoughts, no thinking, past and future doesn’t exist. Hell, the present barely exists. In the truest sense of the word, I am Being-in-the-world.
 
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knucklehed

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I see a lot of overlap.

When it comes to success in bodybuilding, I prefer prioritizing the portion that is "Art", "mind over matter" and the intangibles.

Nutrition," Sets and Reps" and the" Drugs" most of all bore me.

I like to believe there is more in the mix.

Arnold is a great example. Much more than a bodybuilder.
 

brownbanana

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I see a lot of overlap.

When it comes to success in bodybuilding, I prefer prioritizing the portion that is "Art", "mind over matter" and the intangibles.

Nutrition," Sets and Reps" and the" Drugs" most of all bore me.

I like to believe there is more in the mix.

Arnold is a great example. Much more than a bodybuilder.
One thing is for sure, it’s the emotional element that moves us. I seem to get lost sometimes heading to the gym, thinking about sets, reps, diet. And it just drain me emotional. I think in steps, but forget where I am going and why. Instead of just Being and let the music or whatever passion is stirring in me, and letting it sort of take possession of me.
 

Pissbrain259

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If you have actually read Kant's Critique of Pure Reason (the actual book that is ~700 pgs), then I highly recommend reading and digesting the following philosophical books in no particular order.:

Thinking, Fast and Slow by Daniel Kahneman (my personal fave)

An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding by David Hume

Meditations on First Philosophy by Rene Descartes

The Structure of Scientific Revolutions by Thomas Kuhn

Being and Nothingness by Jean-Paul Sartre

Essay Concerning Human Understanding by John Locke

The Conquest of Happiness by Bertrand Russel
 

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