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Anyone else get better results and less sides from orals rather than oils?

BigNJ

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Most people get heart burn and indigestion and acid reflux on orals. Especially when you hit 35+ years of age.
One thing my Nephrologist said, "Stay away from Orals".
I do agree though, some orals work great, but the sides are brutal long term.
 

FrancisK

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Doesn't sound that bad to me. Compared to someone taking 30mg of SD every day for 3 weeks, you would have to run 16 weeks to put about the same total SD mg load on your liver. Then the kidneys are taking the load from the Var. Maybe without the extra Var on workout days, would be kinder on the kidneys.

My bloods have actually never shown bad liver values even when running high Anavar, but mind you I haven’t done bloods got specifically that in a while. My next run I will make sure, I always run tudca with my orals so maybe that‘a helping.
 

Cv215

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Orals do certainly blow oils out of the water. Its like i could stay on a hefty dose of test/deca for eternity and not get anywhere near the look i would get on four weeks of superdrol.

Idk, things certainly have changed though. 5-6 years ago it seemed like i could run huge doses of orals and get no side effects whatsoever, only the positive effects.

Nowadays, it really destroys my digestion right away. I think the reason i lose my appetite is because its slowing down digestion. I'm talking to almost a hault. Bowel movements become infrequent. It takes triple the time for my stomach to empty after meals leading to like a back up of food which results in loss of appetite. I had a buddy describe it this same exact way also. It happens right away so its not like it's even had time to effect blood values.

Tren is getting harder to tolerate. Trest did a number on me.

At this point, test, deca, a little bit of masteron, and hgh is all i can tolerate. I shouldn't really even be tolerating the deca because it does mess up my dick a little.

I think a little test and hgh is where I'll be at soon enough. And igf lr3 because suprisingly i think that stuff actually works a bit.
 

IronLion2

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I wish dbol/adrol werent literally the greatest things since slice bread but atlas, they are..... The past few years i've tried every combo of gear my sick little brain could come up with and i've never found any replacement for what they do to me.
 

Brock456

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Orals do certainly blow oils out of the water. Its like i could stay on a hefty dose of test/deca for eternity and not get anywhere near the look i would get on four weeks of superdrol.

Idk, things certainly have changed though. 5-6 years ago it seemed like i could run huge doses of orals and get no side effects whatsoever, only the positive effects.

Nowadays, it really destroys my digestion right away. I think the reason i lose my appetite is because its slowing down digestion. I'm talking to almost a hault. Bowel movements become infrequent. It takes triple the time for my stomach to empty after meals leading to like a back up of food which results in loss of appetite. I had a buddy describe it this same exact way also. It happens right away so its not like it's even had time to effect blood values.

Tren is getting harder to tolerate. Trest did a number on me.

At this point, test, deca, a little bit of masteron, and hgh is all i can tolerate. I shouldn't really even be tolerating the deca because it does mess up my dick a little.

I think a little test and hgh is where I'll be at soon enough. And igf lr3 because suprisingly i think that stuff actually works a bit.

You like superdrol? I ran it Back in the day before the ban and I only remember it giving me crazy back pumps. I think I did gain some weight. This was like 15 plus years ago so I don’t recall too well.

Can’t run deca at all. Even the lowest dose and high test gives me deca dick

Dbol gives me nose bleeds and kills my appetite, and var kills my appetite but nice lean gains
 

KillerStack

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Nowadays, it really destroys my digestion right away. I think the reason i lose my appetite is because its slowing down digestion. I'm talking to almost a hault. Bowel movements become infrequent. It takes triple the time for my stomach to empty after meals leading to like a back up of food which results in loss of appetite. I had a buddy describe it this same exact way also. It happens right away so its not like it's even had time to effect blood values.

I always got the "slowing down" of bowel movements but I always imagined it meant the orals were really helping suck all nutrients out of food. :D Never felt backed up or outright constipated though. But lately I've been getting heartburn. I've told people about heartburn and what a bitch it is but unless you have experienced it yourself it's hard to relate:D

One other drug that gives me major heartburn is Viagra.
 

LK3

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You make a good point but I definitely didn’t think I was taking small doses of the orals, that’s why i came off. But the fact remains the oral results blew away the oils. My run with the tren was 600mg a week and it sucked, felt like total shit while on the orals virtually no external sides.

So it pretty much comes down to either I run orals at a high dose and feel/look great or run high dose of the oils and feel like shit plus not look nearly as good.

Primo or masteron would be the solution to this but I’m trying to hold on to my hair, believe it or not tren isn’t as bad on my hair as those two. Whole other topic....


Everyone is different but that is what is happening to me.


the one thing i will add and please dont take this in the common pansy ass way as i am not one to talk in the perfect health catagory.

but of course you are gona look very different on trt then on a serious cycle, if i remember right you are older too, so jumping on a cycle is gona bring back all your previous work and you will look great, aas are great cosmetics. but that what they are at those doses. cosmetics, like a push up bra or make up.

no way about it, trt vs a gram cycle for an advanced lifter is 10-20lb very cosmetic difference in short time. but.... thats just the tanned pushup bra, fake eye lash, painted make up version of you.

you can live like that but it does come with mantanence and consiquences.

i made the decision years ago to down size and be very cautious with gear, but that because i do a LOT of other dumb shit.

with combo or orals, gh, higher test and rotating through various other things you could sustain the make up version for another 10-20 years but it just gona be up to you rotating through things as you can tolerate the various side effects of such things.

its gona change as you go, with constant drug use there is always ups and downs.
 

qbkilla

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If orals are bad for the liver in theory shount they lower igf output?
 

b_cornelius

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If orals are bad for the liver in theory shount they lower igf output?
Fructose lowers IGF because it occupies the liver for it's process into glucose, thus according to natty theorists. Heh.

In theory people used to take orals because they supposedly increased IGF. That was the one-two: class I (oils) with class II (orals). Today the straight up One-two is just taking Androgens with IGF (or GH), no need for orals except for their other differences in affection.

The liver? I dunno. People can get away with a lot of orals anymore. I'm not sure everyone experiences serious damage. A jaundiced liver from alcohol is probably a lot worse.
 

Biggerp73

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Doesn't sound that bad to me. Compared to someone taking 30mg of SD every day for 3 weeks, you would have to run 16 weeks to put about the same total SD mg load on your liver. Then the kidneys are taking the load from the Var. Maybe without the extra Var on workout days, would be kinder on the kidneys.
I dont think it works exactly like that. For example, 1mg superdrol everyday for twenty years vs. 100mg everyday for three months. Probably around the same amount of total mg of superdrol. But one of those won't damage your liver at all. The other, for some guys, could potentially cause some serious, even maybe life threatening issues.
 

FrancisK

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the one thing i will add and please dont take this in the common pansy ass way as i am not one to talk in the perfect health catagory.

but of course you are gona look very different on trt then on a serious cycle, if i remember right you are older too, so jumping on a cycle is gona bring back all your previous work and you will look great, aas are great cosmetics. but that what they are at those doses. cosmetics, like a push up bra or make up.

no way about it, trt vs a gram cycle for an advanced lifter is 10-20lb very cosmetic difference in short time. but.... thats just the tanned pushup bra, fake eye lash, painted make up version of you.

you can live like that but it does come with mantanence and consiquences.

i made the decision years ago to down size and be very cautious with gear, but that because i do a LOT of other dumb shit.

with combo or orals, gh, higher test and rotating through various other things you could sustain the make up version for another 10-20 years but it just gona be up to you rotating through things as you can tolerate the various side effects of such things.

its gona change as you go, with constant drug use there is always ups and downs.


Definitely agree LK3 but who was even debating that? I was saying I get better results from orals rather than oils, I didn't say I look better on cycle than cruising.....that's a given who would even be dumb enough to dispute that haha
 

boxer cam

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I dont think it works exactly like that. For example, 1mg superdrol everyday for twenty years vs. 100mg everyday for three months. Probably around the same amount of total mg of superdrol. But one of those won't damage your liver at all. The other, for some guys, could potentially cause some serious, even maybe life threatening issues.

Well it does, dose correlates to damage. A much lower dose with off days is going to be able to be taken for longer periods.

You probably should of got a calculator out, not even close. 1mg a day of SD for years sounds useless used as a example and 100mg a day for 3 months would cause most issues.
 

Biggerp73

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Well it does, dose correlates to damage. A much lower dose with off days is going to be able to be taken for longer periods.

You probably should of got a calculator out, not even close. 1mg a day of SD for years sounds useless used as a example and 100mg a day for 3 months would cause most issues.
The calculator says 1mg for 20 years would be 7200mg and 100mg for 3 months would be 9000mg. So let's make it 1mg for 27 years and 100mg for 3 months. As you said, the lower dose over more time wouldn't do anywhere near as much damage as 100mg for 3 months. That was my point - I don't think you can say two cycles do equal damage only because they have the same amount of mg.
 

boxer cam

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The calculator says 1mg for 20 years would be 7200mg and 100mg for 3 months would be 9000mg. So let's make it 1mg for 27 years and 100mg for 3 months. As you said, the lower dose over more time wouldn't do anywhere near as much damage as 100mg for 3 months. That was my point - I don't think you can say two cycles do equal damage only because they have the same amount of mg.

Cool, I wasn't sure if you were for or against. But I see we actually agree. I was trying to be conservative, with only going on mg to mg. I think low and longer or pulsing orals pre workout is massively better.
 

qbkilla

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Thoughts on hiv patients getting such high dosages of anadrol for years? How do their kidneys hold up? I guess without the stressors we combine on ours ( high bw, bp, protein, additional anabolics), drol on it's own won't typically harm kidneys in most? Var though, I would think on it's own long term would have their gfr plummeting.
 

jeroendebleser

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I wish dbol/adrol werent literally the greatest things since slice bread but atlas, they are..... The past few years i've tried every combo of gear my sick little brain could come up with and i've never found any replacement for what they do to me.

Exactly, I've tried replicating Adrol's effects with injectables in any possible combination and in all dosages... It just isn't possible unfortunately. Adrol rules.
 

b-boy

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Thoughts on hiv patients getting such high dosages of anadrol for years? How do their kidneys hold up? I guess without the stressors we combine on ours ( high bw, bp, protein, additional anabolics), drol on it's own won't typically harm kidneys in most? Var though, I would think on it's own long term would have their gfr plummeting.
Have you ever watched a pharma drug commercial? Half the commercial is listing the side effects, some are really fucking serious but they still prescribe that drug for the ailment its designed to treat dont they??? hmmmm?
 

LK3

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Definitely agree LK3 but who was even debating that? I was saying I get better results from orals rather than oils, I didn't say I look better on cycle than cruising.....that's a given who would even be dumb enough to dispute that haha

yeah but as we outlined its because your perspective is off.
if you ran say 300-500mgs of each tp/mp/npp then took into account ester wieght and looked at the mg total for that vs your oral cycle you would see they are really pretty similar in dose and effect.

the rest just becomes drug specifics, so understand the drug and use accordingly, the failure by and large lies there in.

your issue isnt intrisic oral vs inj it is drug xyz gives you this side effect and you dont like it where as drug abc doesnt give you this side effect so you like it. deca at 25mgs ed vs wini at 25 mgs ed give very different results. no mystery just different things.
 

Thappy

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From what i have read you are about the same age as me. orals work great for me but wreck my digestion and appetite.

My best combo(feel good and growth and recomp)
test npp hgh and humalog
test npp hgh and igfLR3

no deca dick quite the opposite where as im looking to come off soon and GF is begging me not too.
 

KillerStack

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Thoughts on hiv patients getting such high dosages of anadrol for years? How do their kidneys hold up? I guess without the stressors we combine on ours ( high bw, bp, protein, additional anabolics), drol on it's own won't typically harm kidneys in most? Var though, I would think on it's own long term would have their gfr plummeting.

I don't think they get "high doses for years". I'm not even sure it's commonly used for that or approved for that purpose.

People bring up the dosage for anemia, like up to 5mg/kg but I seriously doubt any 100kg dude was dling 500mg for years. Maybe 1mg/kg as a maintenance. If anyone here has seen Anadrol used for anything in medicine I'd be interested to hear what it looked like.

IIRC correctly there was a 12 week study in an older age group and 150mg was no better than 50 or 100mg and caused more enzyme elevations.
 

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