Bodybuilding Secrecy good or bad?

[Ak47]

I get why pros and gurus don’t disclose their secrets. But with so many pros always claiming that they take so much less than most people at the gyms, don’t you think it would help people stop abusing these drugs with more transparency? With so many people dying from diuretics why don’t gurus chime and say, “hey this is what I do with my clients and what seems to work.” It’s not like they will lose clientele, so why not be more transparent?

 

[Bio]

Nobody owes anybody an explanation about what they do. There are legalities surrounding it. Someone contacting a coach is a different story, that's a private conversation.

 

[btails]

As with a lot of things in life.. you don't get the full story until it's earned and you're ready.. you pay your dues and eventually someone will take you aside and tell you what's up.

 

[Ak47]

Nobody owes anybody an explanation about what they do. There are legalities surround it. Someone contacting a coach is a different story, that's a private conversation.

It’s not a question of owing anything. More a sense of responsibility. We have Milos who is open about his insulin protocol, JP and few others who openly discuss their cycles. So limited information is there and none of these guys are hurting for clients and haven’t had any legal issues. I just think there is way more misinformation than facts and if that can be addressed we probably would see much safer cycles and less deaths

 

[Bio]

I enjoy it when a bodybuilder is transparent but they're truly only responsible for themselves. The truth is out there and its been out there. Let's say someone takes 5 grams of gear. I understand not wanting to come out and say that. Even if they say they started out with much lower doses and worked up to that, some entry level newbie will jump straight to the high dosages thinking it's the answer. Their transparency doesn't guarantee anything.

It's a marathon not a sprint but there are genetic freaks. Unfortunately people with much lesser genetics see how fast these freaks get massive and think the answer to getting that big that quick is massive amounts of gear. For most this takes time and people want results NOW!

I've stated this before, when I spoke with Victor Conte and he was testing the bodybuilders of the 90's to do their micronutrition, he said they were on 3 to 5 grams of gear.

Big A, the owner here, is an IFBB pro and has been transparent, b-boy is an IFBB pro and he has been transparent, and many more. The issue that still exists today is thinking there's a secret or a secret way to stack things. That's misinformation. There's no secret drugs or protocols. Stick to the basics and fine tune from there with the information that's already out there!

 

[Ruhlfreak55]

IMO anyone openly discussing what the gubmint has deemed illegal drug use, attached to their face (vids, pics etc), is an idiot. In this day and age with the power trip the various levels of gov't are on...it just sets you up to be cannon fodder. Insulin is a little more of a gray area, need a prescription but you can get it without so I don't even know exactly the legalities there.

edit: To clarify, that action is idiotic, the people in question aren't blatantly idiots.

 

[johnjuanb1]

Coaches are essentially prescribing drug protocols without being a licensed physician. If they post in the open what their drug protocols are they’re asking for potential lawsuits and harassment from popo.

 

[LK3]

i think its much more damaging to society and men or boys at large that more normal ppl are not more honest about aas. particularly athletes and actors.

while i understand the idea behind it, social stigma etc... that will never go away until more regular people are open and honest about there drug use. this doesnt only apply to aas. usually the most vocal example we have of drug users are pretty poor examples of humans or at the very least poor examples of high level drug users.

we would be a lot better off if people dropped there preconceptions and began to look at this all for face value. which should come down to the simple betterment of the life of the individual.

drugs should make life better!
enjoy your drugs today!

 

[buck]

Pretty much every time i see a pro talk about how much gear they take, people often call them a liar and say they can't get to their size on the dose they claim. There are also many pros recently that have talked about the small or nonexistent diuretic use. Saying that people that use them are often people that are not lean enough but are trying to get around that. But people often don't want to here any of that for various reasons.

 

[Kaladryn]

It’s not a question of owing anything. More a sense of responsibility. We have Milos who is open about his insulin protocol, JP and few others who openly discuss their cycles. So limited information is there and none of these guys are hurting for clients and haven’t had any legal issues. I just think there is way more misinformation than facts and if that can be addressed we probably would see much safer cycles and less deaths

Insulin is an over-the-counter medication and not a controlled substance. JP lives in the UK where it is legal to possess and use AAS. So neither of these examples count.

 

[Kaladryn]

Further, diuretics aren't that heavily used, they often aren't even needed except to clean up a mess. When they are used it's extremely low amounts (usually) because that is what works best, higher amounts are counterproductive and make people flat.

An exception would be female competitors who have a certain amount of estrogen production they can't do anything about (AIs can't reach ovarian aromatase).

 

[Reno911]

There really are no secrets in pro bodybuilding. There are high doses, low doses, and dosages in the middle. There are other compounds being used in someway or another but not anything that persons on this board wouldn't know about and/or have access to if they tried.

As far a secrecy look into tested sports/olympics, etc. That were the secrecy and science is.

 

[Bio]

There really are no secrets in pro bodybuilding. There are high doses, low doses, and dosages in the middle. There are other compounds being used in someway or another but not anything that persons on this board wouldn't know about and/or have access to if they tried.

As far a secrecy look into tested sports/olympics, etc. That were the secrecy and science is.

Victor Conte told me a story about the Olympics and I'm still hesitant to talk about on the forum to this day.

 

[Reno911]

Victor Conte told me a story about the Olympics and I'm still hesitant to talk about on the forum to this day.

Do tell!! LOL

I can't even imagine what was going on then with T&F, baseball, etc. Certainly a fun time to watch a bunch of gorillas at home plate holding a toothpick. IMO those where the Golden Years of baseball.

For anyone that hasn't seen it yet, watch Icarus.

 

[Orville Shreddenbacher]

Everyone wants to know the "secrets" about the drugs and amounts . drugs are a small fraction compared to genetics and more importantly the mindset to push past your brains off switch , step out of the comfort zone . Intensity and and the will to train on another level are not ingrained in everyone and drugs never make up for that . mind-muscle connection took years for me to develop . I come from a power lifting and combat sports background and I can say with certainty that a small percentile of people have what it takes to push hard and stay dedicated to anything physically grueling . Everyone wants a secret or a recipe to succeed but work ethic is near impossible to teach or give away . 100% to some is someone else's 50%

 

[qbkilla]

Nobody owes anybody an explanation about what they do. There are legalities surround it. Someone contacting a coach is a different story, that's a private conversation.

Agree with this. Nobody owes anyone anything. No one owes information, or the time it takes to pass on information. If someone has a secret (which I don't think most do), they have Evey right to not pass it on. Never understand why people get bothered when people deny aas use, it's illegal in most countries and stigmatized

 

[Gunsmith]

I don't think it really matters who tells anyone anything about what they take
Do you think that if you gave 10 gym rats the exact same drugs , training and nutrition that Ronnie Coleman used that you would get even one person close to his physique.??
if he told me he was only running a 500mg of test , who am I to call bullshit I mean he's a fucking genetic anomaly that might be all it takes
of course that's an extreme example , but if I got on the same protocol that "b-boy" or "CM" or any other pro here I'd be kidding myself to think I'd turn pro
i think guys hear that their favorite pro only uses a fraction of what they do and automatically call bullshit because "I use way more than that". But the fact is they are eating bullshit , training like a bitch and sleeping 4hrs a day , changing diets and training every other day trying to mind that magical combination.
I firmly believe that if a guy wants to truly see what his genetic potential is then he needs to invest in a coach that is steady producing champions and do EXACTLY what they tell you to

 

[KillerStack]

I don't think legality has much at all to do with why most pros aren't forthcoming about this stuff. It's because they are insecure and people will talk shit about them, which they will!

i think guys hear that their favorite pro only uses a fraction of what they do and automatically call bullshit because "I use way more than that". But the fact is they are eating bullshit , training like a bitch and sleeping 4hrs a day , changing diets and training every other day trying to mind that magical combination.

Genes are everything. But the biggest myth in all my over 30 years of following bodybuilding is that pros train like it's life and death. That their willpower and pain tolerance is on another level. A few do, but generally it's all BS. I know a pro who has been to the O stage several times and his training is pathetic. 135lbs bb rows, 280lbs deadlifts, 20lbs db curls and so on. Diet is shit too except for a few weeks before shows. And the female pros are even worse, top female pro bodybuilders. They don't really exert themselves, just go through the motions, laugh and gossip half the session.

Shitty bodybuilders are mostly shitty because of shitty genes. Not because they can't conjure that killer instinct. This is not to discount effort altogether. Some like Dorian showed what genes + training like a madman can do. High effort pays as long as the genes are there but most top pros don't do anything special as far as training.

When I was a kid I read articles about Arnold training to the point of passing out and vomiting. Some talked about shitting blood or even getting a fever after hard workouts. Then you see them actually "training" lol. It was all BS. Even Dorian's training wasn't all that when I saw his tape. Say one set of 6 with 400lbs on the incline with one forced rep. Yeah hardly something that will almost send you to the hospital with rhabdo.

 

[qbkilla]

I don't think legality has much at all to do with why most pros aren't forthcoming about this stuff. It's because they are insecure and people will talk shit about them, which they will!


Genes are everything. But the biggest myth in all my over 30 years of following bodybuilding is that pros train like it's life and death. That their willpower and pain tolerance is on another level. A few do, but generally it's all BS. I know a pro who has been to the O stage several times and his training is pathetic. 135lbs bb rows, 280lbs deadlifts, 20lbs db curls and so on. Diet is shit too except for a few weeks before shows. And the female pros are even worse, top female pro bodybuilders. They don't really exert themselves, just go through the motions, laugh and gossip half the session.

Shitty bodybuilders are mostly shitty because of shitty genes. Not because they can't conjure that killer instinct. This is not to discount effort altogether. Some like Dorian showed what genes + training like a madman can do. High effort pays as long as the genes are there but most top pros don't do anything special as far as training.

When I was a kid I read articles about Arnold training to the point of passing out and vomiting. Some talked about shitting blood or even getting a fever after hard workouts. Then you see them actually "training" lol. It was all BS. Even Dorian's training wasn't all that when I saw his tape. Say one set of 6 with 400lbs on the incline with one forced rep. Yeah hardly something that will almost send you to the hospital with rhabdo.

Agee with most of ths. most guys who use AAS don't count calories, or eat too much to make the scale move, or too little, train with some complicated routine. educating them about AAS is not going to help them because their issue isn't their dosage or lack of education, its that they fuck everything else up.

4 compounds $200 in pills, powders, and pre workouts, 2iu of gh, then they don't train to failure or wont eat more than 2k calories, or the opposite, wont dip below 12 percent because they think they will look too small without the water and fat

 

[Kaladryn]

I don't think legality has much at all to do with why most pros aren't forthcoming about this stuff. It's because they are insecure and people will talk shit about them, which they will!


Genes are everything. But the biggest myth in all my over 30 years of following bodybuilding is that pros train like it's life and death. That their willpower and pain tolerance is on another level. A few do, but generally it's all BS. I know a pro who has been to the O stage several times and his training is pathetic. 135lbs bb rows, 280lbs deadlifts, 20lbs db curls and so on. Diet is shit too except for a few weeks before shows. And the female pros are even worse, top female pro bodybuilders. They don't really exert themselves, just go through the motions, laugh and gossip half the session.

Shitty bodybuilders are mostly shitty because of shitty genes. Not because they can't conjure that killer instinct. This is not to discount effort altogether. Some like Dorian showed what genes + training like a madman can do. High effort pays as long as the genes are there but most top pros don't do anything special as far as training.

When I was a kid I read articles about Arnold training to the point of passing out and vomiting. Some talked about shitting blood or even getting a fever after hard workouts. Then you see them actually "training" lol. It was all BS. Even Dorian's training wasn't all that when I saw his tape. Say one set of 6 with 400lbs on the incline with one forced rep. Yeah hardly something that will almost send you to the hospital with rhabdo.

I pretty much disagree with all this. I think legality absolutely has everything to do with it, I don't think anyone would talk shit or insecurity has anything too do with it, look at JP.

Genetics means a lot but won't take you far at the pro level without everything else being on point. It's not about how hard you train or don't train, it's about figuring out what works for you. I don't think anyone on a pro stage has pathetic training. Shit diet except for a few weeks before a show? No way. And female pros train hard as fuck. Sure some people train less intensely and do more volume and vice versa. Shitty bodybuilders are shit because they train and eat like shit. Even with bad genetics, you can build a great physique even if it's not "bodybuilding stage" great. Dorian had great genetics just not "perfect" ones. Arnold trained like a beast, and what Dorian was doing in the gym was crazy intense, you CAN tell from his videos. 6 reps with 400lbs and 1 forced rep when you are all out focused on the muscle and not just moving the weight could easily be crazy intense, without that intensity he might have only done rep. He's clearly not a strong bencher, that has nothing to do with bodybuilding.