Cortisol suppression while on

[mantus]

How does the body try to fix this,by increasing cort receptors,increasing cort itself or both?

 

[Mr Pickles]

How does the body try to fix this,by increasing cort receptors,increasing cort itself or both?

i think it order to counter the higher anabolism the body would pump out more cortisol to try to increase catabolism to balance things out.... negative feedback loop sorta thing

 

[mantus]

So i guess AAS block cort receptors and doesn't really lower overall cort itself ? When AAS is stopped even though there are still just as many cort receptors as before cycle,there is now more cort itself ? This is what i think i heard through the years and just wanted to get it right. thanks

 

[Mr Pickles]

AAS dont really do anything to the cortisol receptors i dont think... AAS just work on building up tissue... cortisol works on breaking tissue down... its like comparing transmission fluid to antifreeze... two different things... when you stop taking AAS there is going to be an elevated level of cortisol (higher than if you didnt take AAS).... so that's why you lose mass after a cycle (high cortisol combined with waiting for natty test levels getting back to normal)....

think of it as a scale... is anabolism goes up (AAS use) then your body strives to be equal so catabolism will go have increase (higher cortisol).... end result is after an extended cycle... the cortisol levels will get high enough to break down muscle at the same rate that AAS build them... so you plateau....

i dunno if i'm explaining it clearly...

 

[mantus]

I think the anti-catabolic effect of AAS(suppress cort receptors/cort itself or both) is and was always more important than the Anabolic effect as far as building muscle. I thought everyone felt this way

 

[SouthernMuscle]

I thought that d-bol was a strong glucocorticoid receptor antagonist.......

 

[Snarf]

I haven't kept up with the latest research (what there is of it) but I think Anabolic steroids could probably more accurately be named anti-catabolic steroids. As mantus stated, most of the net anabolism that takes place is due to the decreased catabolic affect associated with corticosteroid receptor antagonism by AAS.

It is hard to imagine that the body is pumping out enough glucocorticoids to plateau a 3g per week test cycle. If that happened, we would all have Cushing's Syndrome, which doesn't happen, In fact, you really don't see any symptoms of hyperphysiologic levels of glucocorticosteroids when on cycle.

 

[mantus]

I always looked at it like instead of muscle breaking down 30% when off cycle it only breaks down 10% while on and more reserves to build on top. I like the AM D-bol but i never knew about the dose,so i'm glad i learned something new

 

[mike ross]

you can use clen to help reduce cortisol as well post cycle

 

[Snarf]

you can use clen to help reduce cortisol as well post cycle

Clen reduces cortisol? Are you sure about this?

 

[mike ross]

reduces cortisol in low doses post cycle...ask a few other veterans about this as well

 

[mantus]

I don't like nervous system stimulants so i wouldn't use Clen even if it did

 

[Snarf]

reduces cortisol in low doses post cycle...ask a few other veterans about this as well

I think this is a major misconception. Clen is commonly used post cycle when you are in a catabolic state, however this does not mean that it in any way reduces cortisol levels.

Clenbuterol is a beta agonist, with specific affect and affinity to Beta 3 receptors. These beta-3 receptors increases insulin secretion and sensitivity, causing more glucose and amino acids to be transported into skeletal muscle thus causing the anabolic effects. (Note that Clen's fat burning properties are linked to beta 2 receptor activity.)

Clen is widely used in the cattle industry becuase it leans out the cattle (beta 2) while increasing muscle mass (beta 3). There is a dramatic affect on cattle becuase they have a LOT of beta 3 receptors. Unfortunately, humans have a lot fewer beta 3 receptors, we have mainly beta 2, which do not react as strongly to clen. However, when your Beta 2's are saturated there is some thought that this can cause an upregulation of the Beta 3's. This is why it is significantly anabolic to cattle, and mildly anabolic at best in humans.

 

[mantus]

I think this is a major misconception. Clen is commonly used post cycle when you are in a catabolic state, however this does not mean that it in any way reduces cortisol levels.

Clenbuterol is a beta agonist, with specific affect and affinity to Beta 3 receptors. These beta-3 receptors increases insulin secretion and sensitivity, causing more glucose and amino acids to be transported into skeletal muscle thus causing the anabolic effects. (Note that Clen's fat burning properties are linked to beta 2 receptor activity.)

Clen is widely used in the cattle industry becuase it leans out the cattle (beta 2) while increasing muscle mass (beta 3). There is a dramatic affect on cattle becuase they have a LOT of beta 3 receptors. Unfortunately, humans have a lot fewer beta 3 receptors, we have mainly beta 2, which do not react as strongly to clen. However, when your Beta 2's are saturated there is some thought that this can cause an upregulation of the Beta 3's. This is why it is significantly anabolic to cattle, and mildly anabolic at best in humans.

Clen is one of those drugs that works great in animals but failed to do so in humans,which is why i never liked it,but alot do like it so i just keep my mouth shut. I always thought it was all hype but i can't say for sure because i don't have much experience with it

 

[Cman34677]

AAS will block cortisol receptors....in very basic terms it works like this....when you have an excess of hormones, and you body doesn't have enough receptors for it all, the hormones will start filling the cortisol receptors instead, causing an anti-catabolic property...


I think that the best OTC pct supplement is PS, phosphatidylserine, which lowers cortisol by about 40%.... I won't run pct without it....but you have to look around, because its hard to find and expensive, luckily I've found a great bulk powder place that carries it...


1g of PS per day is a good dose...and you can definitely tell the difference in the way you feel and the amount of gains you keep.....

Cman

 

[preist943]

phosphatidylserine is the best coristol blocker out there .I have found about 600mg works fine for me . 200mg caps taken 3x a day post cycle only

 

[mantus]

I can't think of the company right now but they have 550mg PS per tab. They are about 30min south of me and i've used their product before. I was getting bad cramps,maybe using too much but i'm not sure. It happened after a few days of use. They are a popular company but i just don't have time to look up the name right now...........Cman thanks for explaining the cort thing. I never heard it explained like that but why only cort receptors and no other ones like Estrogen........ Prosource makes it,i knew someone on this board mentioned it

 

[Count Trapula]

Where did you order those from? I've used DPS and they charge about $23 for 60 100mg caps.

phosphatidylserine is the best coristol blocker out there .I have found about 600mg works fine for me . 200mg caps taken 3x a day post cycle only

 

[Cman34677]

you guys should find a bulk powder place to buy your ps....next time I'm on I'll post where I get mine, since ps is so damn expensive...


and here's a bit of knowledge that is very important about PS.....the ps that I get is 50% ps, so I have to take 2 grams everyday to get 1 gram of ps...so if you have a place that sells bulk PS powder and you buy 300 grams, but its only 40% PS, then you only have 120 grams of actual PS, so you have to change your daily intake to accomidate it.....

the normal range for effective cortisol blocking dosage is between 700-1200mg/ed....

I take 1000mg and am fine, but some people complain of their joints aching some from higher doses, which is a result of lower cortisol

 

[MikeS]

I think clen AND ephedra have some cortisol blocking effects, as they mimick
nonepinephrine. Not an anabolic effect but the end result is same.

AAS is certainly anabolic. AND is well known for blocking cortisol receptors-one of its actions outside the cell.
AAS increases protein metabolism inside the cell (cell androgen receptor
->RNA->DNA->mitochrondria) and raises nitrogen balance-this is its primary anabolic function.